SBR Utopia ---- Permanently OPEN!! (Page 30)

Originally posted by Asalzwed

Do you think you can make that statement completely confident that the potential gains made from giving a sport 100% focus are less than it would be if you gave it a little less focus and maintained low frequency in the others?

Oh and again, I am just curious. Not trying to be a pest. 

There are so many ins and outs of maximizing tri training that I can't wrap my head around!

Originally posted by Fred D

3200 Tri team swim in the books.

Snowing (of course) here as well.

Anyone else training?

Originally posted by axteraa

6 x 4' @ 285w on the trainer this morning for me and a 45 min run at lunch if I can get away from work.

Originally posted by TankBoyWell, it is only my N+1, but I have also experienced the crossover from one to another. But I think you may have hit the nail on the head when you threw in the age thing, Fred. My experience has come from the cross-over in swimming to running. Two years ago when I could not run for almost an entire summer due to injury I a) substituted walks of the same time duration for every run I would have otherwise had on my schedule (maintaining time on feet) and b) added a lot more focus, high intensity swimming. When I was finally able to come back to running it was actually as good if not better than ever. Now granted I have a lot of years of running in my legs, so that obviously helps tremendously, but as for building the engine high intensity swimming intervals seemed to do it. It is a gross overgeneralization, but still it seems that from an engine standpoint 100y/m in the pool should have roughly the same aerobic load as a 400 on the track. And I don't know about you, but I can do a lot more 100s in the pool than 400s on the track these days. So, do I think swimming 20x100 is a substitute for 20x400 on the track? No way. But I also won't survive doing a lot of 20x400s anymore, so it is the next best thing. My fast running has gotten much more targeted and strategic - I don't do it to build the engine, I do it more now strictly for the neuromuscular maintenance - just so the old dogs still know how to go fast when they need to.And I have a progression run on the books for tomorrow - my favorite!

Originally posted by axteraa

6 x 4' @ 285w on the trainer this morning for me and a 45 min run at lunch if I can get away from work.

Originally posted by BrotherTri You're becoming a beast Arend. Nice job and that swim yesterday is tempting.

Originally posted by axteraa

That swim yesterday wrecked me.  By the time I got to the end of the 25s fast I was completely done - it usually takes me more than 3000 to get to that point.

Originally posted by brigby1

That looks fun.

Originally posted by Fred D

3200 Tri team swim in the books.

Snowing (of course) here as well.

Anyone else training?

Originally posted by spudone

I think you're looking at general aerobic fitness versus sport-specific.  There is some crossover.  But if your swim technique sucks, or your legs aren't adapted to running impact, you can have a massive aerobic base and still fail on those.  Some of that applies to cycling too although it's harder to get it wrong.  My opinion on that is probably a bit biased.

Originally posted by brigby1

Meant to add earlier that what you're saying is similar to what I've seen. Both in experience and reading about. There is some cross-over. How much can vary. The more advanced someone is, the less the other sports will help. Neither swimming or running has helped my biking power in any way I can tell. Maybe in some support and position conditioning, but not in power production. The bike is also where I'm most developed. In running, my midsection is holding much better now with the improved swim conditioning. I have noticed that progress over the last few years at various times. My sister did notice her running improved after she started swimming, however. She's much less developed than I am at any of these though. Masters coach noted that I was aerobically strong early on, but needed the work in swimming to get better.

Kicking has seen practically no cross-over. Power is there from bike & running. Was a fairly ambidextrous soccer player, could drive the ball near 70 yds with either foot. It's only become better by doing kick sets.

Originally posted by BrotherTri

"You would think I am doing a Ironman this year."

Originally posted by BrotherTri

I don't know how to answer that question. I am not sure I really understand the question. This is what I will say. There are a few ways I know or do to maintain all three disciplines in the triathlon sport. Provided you are well based in fitness, are not trying to build or in a time crunched. Actually time off via complete or active recovery type is very good for the body. One way is alternate focus from week to week or every other week per discipline. You still do all three just the alternate one is done with more focus via intensity or volume. Remember the real trick in tri racing is peaking in all three disciplants at the same time.

Originally posted by TankBoy IMMT still has foundation slots.

Originally posted by brigby1

I get that puzzled look at times regarding the amount of training.

Also like how Rusty switched in km for the last run session even though he seems to be a miles guy normally.

Originally posted by BrotherTri I ran so now 50 days of straight running. All outside to boot. I am really starting to see some real benefits from this continuous running. I am still swimming and biking and just finished 3 high volume week, well for this time of the year. You would think I am doing a Ironman this year.

Originally posted by TankBoy ha - ha - well, *technically* I am a TIME guy when it comes to 95% of my running. But whenever I run for distance it is almost always in Kilometers, probably because distance-prescribed running is always speed intervals, and most often done on the track (most recent workout notwithstanding). Could also be the negative positive influence of all the Canadians I suppose?

Originally posted by TankBoy Nice work in the pool Fred - that is going to make your bike even better. ;^) Arend I had to check your swim out from yesterday. That is ridiculous. I think I could make the first ten 100s. I think. I had a short 5k progression run this morning: 15 minute warm up w/ dynamic & ballistic stretching 20 minutes easy running up through base zone followed by: 1K @ endurance effort 2K @ steady state effort 1K @ tempo effort 1K wide open Then 10 minutes of warm down. These progression runs typically build through my block - will probably have another 5k, then an 8k, and at some point reach a 10k progression. The end kilometers are always murderous and literally feel like you are turning yourself inside out. However If I had to choose a single workout that left me race ready both physically and mentally, it would be progressions. I hate them, but they are awesome.

Originally posted by Asalzwed

A ton of my work is in metric and I do quite a  bit of work on the track but I still have to convert to min/mile to really grasp a pace. I can't help it. 

I am racing a 15K this weekend and I am hoping they will have mile markers. How selfish!

Originally posted by Asalzwed

And by progression run you mean that you just steadily increase the pace as you go but that you don't actually take any rest between, correct?

ALSO, yeah I BET the end is murderous! I can't imagine running wide open at the end of a workout. Yowza!

Originally posted by Asalzwed

I am racing a 15K this weekend and I am hoping they will have mile markers. How selfish!

Originally posted by TankBoy Yep, no recovery at all you just transition to the higher effort at the end of each interval. Mentally it is really tough simply because "normal" intervals condition you to getting a recovery at the end of each interval - you never have to actually pick up the effort. Progressions get you really good at precisely feathering your effort and easing steadily through your zones as you go so that you actually use your whole range. If you overshoot the earlier ones it is disastrous in the end.

Originally posted by TankBoy Cool - can't wait to hear how it goes. I am racing a trail HM this weekend, And Arend has a HM as well. Anybody else got races coming up?