Joe the Plumber (Page 4)

Let's all take a moment to stop and look at the big picture here.  Does anyone know how many Americans depend on government-financed programs?  The last time I checked, it was 100%.  That's right, EVERYONE, regardless of income. 

Tax money isn't just being handed out to lazy people that don't want to work for a living.

I don't know about you, but I certainly enjoy the benefits the government has provided me.  How many of you or someone that you care about recieved federal funding for college?  Gotten a flu shot from the health department?  Visited an elderly relative in an assisted living facitlity?  Recieved a Social Security check?  Served in the military?

THIS is how your money is being spent... it's not being forked over to a bunch of lazy bums that would rather sit on their butt than work.

 I would say approaching one of the most challenging life problems with no solution is naive to think that it will magically solve itself.  So the world I see if we cut all social programs. Some people currently on the program will be able to survive and live, maybe even have some success.. I personally think a small percentage of these individuals shouldn't be on the programs today... if so we should look at fixing the current system.. I think some people will turn to crime to further fund there life.. sounds like a great solution .. except who then funds the increase police force, prison system etc if the rich shouldn't pay anything to the poor? I am coming from a 3rd world perspective , where I have lived in a country where life is not respected and crime is common place.. trust me.. you don't want that lifestyle here.. and the third group will be unable to get decent medical care (or if they do we pay for it with higher insurance premiums), proper nutrition, safe house.. leading to a larger level of poverty in the poor and increased medical costs for you and I.. but no worries because there will be a bum on every street corner allowing for the donation optional program to flourish and the sick people relying on Medicare and other programs can find an early exit and relieve us of having to deal/pay for them

I hear France is nice.

OK.. seriously....

Just because someone is on welfare, doesn't make them lazy.  And you know it.

Like I said above.  Yes, there are people that take advantage of the system, but that doesn't mean we should deny it to those that don't.

I would like to thank all the tax payers for my family for when I was little I went to head start (government program) which helped my mother with expenses of child care, some assistance from the Government. 

I am the first in my family to earn a college degree on my mothers side.  My grandfather had an eighth grade education and my grandmother and mother a high school education.   

Sometimes a little help when things are rough makes the whole difference.

You completely missed my point.

 I dont have a solution because there shouldnt be one.  The problem is that life sucks sometimes and people dont have stuff.  We, as people and the government, have absolutely no business in telling people to hand over money for the sake of giving it to someone else.  You can say it is a more humane thing to do (and I would agree) but I dont want to live in a world with a Robin Hood style of government. 

"We need to get rid of special interest money in Washington. To do this all elections need to be financed by the Gov't and each candidate gets the same amount and is held accountable for the spending of that money, any extra is returned. We need to put an end to getting elected because I outspent the other guy. "

Back on the subject of Joe:

factchek sez:

Update Oct. 16: ABC News reported the morning after the debate that Wurzelbacher admitted to a reporter that he won't actually make enough from his new plumbing business to pay Obama's higher tax rates. ABC said his admission "would seem to indicate that he would be eligible for an Obama tax cut."

Agreed 100% that people don't have a right to stuff.. but they do have a right to life and it is a governments responsibility to provide the best living environment for its people, all people rich and poor.. you cannot just have the poor people die off .. because of this right of life, there will always have to be taxes on the wealthier (meaning someone who has more than 0, not the millionaires) to create a livable society. A system based purely on donations cannot create that environment.. IMHO primarily due too greed.. exhibit A of that is our current economic environment..

Just to clear things up....I don't think we should soley rely on charity.  I understand why we pay taxes and am grateful for all of the wonderful things I have access to because of it.

I just don't think the wealthy should be taxed more just because they have more money.  Instead, government needs to stop being so wasteful with the money they already are getting from the tax payers.  Set bugets and stick to them.  Make cut-backs.  Same stuff we've all ready seen posted in this forum today...

 He should be happy then. It doesn't make the tax increase to "spread the wealth" go away though does it? I just wish our elected officials would concentrate on solving the problem. I guess it is a lot easier to argue about who about who's turn it is to pay for a problem than to actually correct the problem.

BIGNEW - 2008-10-16 2:35 PM

LJR - 2008-10-16 3:23 PM

AddysDaddy - 2008-10-16 11:59 AM I would like to thank all the tax payers for my family for when I was little I went to head start (government program) which helped my mother with expenses of child care, some assistance from the Government.

 

I am the first in my family to earn a college degree on my mothers side. My grandfather had an eighth grade education and my grandmother and mother a high school education.

Sometimes a little help when things are rough makes the whole difference.

Similar situation here. My dad grew up with welfare help, had an 8th grade education, and then dropped out of school and went to work to help out his family (yeah, I know.... cry me a freakin' river!). He ended up spending 35+ years as a tool & dye maker. I'm the only one in my family (including sisters, cousins, grandparents, parents, etc.) to have a college education, which I achieved later in life. We are most definitely "hicks from the sticks". Without the government help back in the 40's & 50's, there's a pretty high probability I wouldn't be here today, which could be viewed as a good thing to some of you reading my posts.

Good for your dad for doing what was necessary to help his family. Chances are you would still be here, for me to get quotes from, without the governments help. Not to mention you are talking about 2 different eras. The 40's/50's and today.

I took it as an improved opportunity to be successful and a productive TAX paying individual.

My family is doing well without any assistance and I woul work very hard not to take any money.  But if I HAD to I would and do whatever it took to chane my circumstances.

You are I are talking about two completely different things .. I am talking about a right to life wrt abolishing all social programs.. personally I think the bigger issue would be to correct programs to eliminate waste and people who shouldn't be on the program from using it. Do you really believe that all people using government assistance living in a huge apartment with 2 TVs and a nice car.. if so I would say you have a warped sense of reality .. there are all kinds.. and what you describe is someone that I feel should not necessarily receiving welfare... the previous discussion revolved around removing all taxes.. whihc IMHO would result in a poorer poor class, more in line with a 3rd world living environment which would impact the overall quality of life of all Americans, rich and poor. The government has a responsibility to maintain a quality of life in this country.

I want a flat tax on income. Equal commitment but not equal giving. We all pay, oh, I don't know, say %10? No loopholes, no special categories, no elaborate tax codes. You earn a  dollar you give Uncle Same 10 cents. Period.

 No, I chose to make it a reality. Intellect plays a part in it, but does not excuse anyone unless they are mentally challenged. Two of the most intelligent people I know are also two of the laziest people that I have ever come across in my life. One of them is in prison and the other one barely gets by.