Mad Manatees 2015.3 CLOSED (or Poptarts? Pet pics?) (Page 45)

I had an interesting thing happen today actually.  Last week, similar workout, same time of day, a little warmer, almost totally flat course.  I was drifting into zone 5 on the zone 4 interval.  I suspect dehydration, and slowed down some successfully.  Today: I couldn't get my HR up into the correct zone.  Same time of day, a little cooler, carried water for first hour, rolling course.  Most of zone 2 intervals I was right on the cusp of zone 1/2; zone 3 intervals I was high zone 2, and zone 4--barely got there (although at this point we were running mostly downhill, so that one doesn't surprise me).  Thoughts?

Said it before, I'll say it again, I love this group!

If I start at x:xx in zone 3, as I get more fit, I can now run x:xx in zone 2.  I have to run y:yy to get into zone 3 now.  

**and I don't think that this ^^^ is what was happening in my run earlier--can't change that much in 1 week!

I would say so. But time on your feet is almost a discredit to the adaptations a 40' easy run provide. I imagine you are saying that as a general term (I think I have used it to.) So yeah. 

And then of course you have to see the overall training stress of having done run #1 earlier in the day.

Interestingly, when I was in Chas-town last weekend my HR was crazy low. However my "feels like" was maxed out, I couldn't have pushed any more because the muggy was pushing back.

wuss.

No, just kidding. That is interesting. I would not think this would be the case. However, I have not used one so everything from me here is speculation and things I have read. 

That's a really helpful article.  Thanks!

That was sorta like mine today.  Didn't feel maxed, but pushing somewhat.  Not super humid/muggy though.

And I am in that fun part of the training plan where I am hungry all the time and want to gnaw on my own arm.

It's a combination of a few things. Dropping the aerobic part low enough to not add any aerobic stress is likely several minutes/mi below an easy run pace. This Ryan Hall running 9+ min/mi, for example. Then there is load bearing nature of running. Need to be doing a number of miles fairly comfortably before there is little to no contribution to that. I don't have a good number for that, but generally age groupers aren't going to do enough. The bike doesn't have this part so much, so if the intensity is down enough, then 40' there could well be a recovery ride. I've done longer.

It's still possible to go easy and feel better than when you started. There can be some recovery effects going on for some aspects, but that's in addition to building some stress in others. I consider it recovery when that is the only purpose to the workout. When no additional aerobic stress or time on feet stress is added.

A good thing about HR is that it takes everything into account.

A bad thing about HR is that it takes everything into account. 

As you get more fit, the pace at a given HR will be faster even though HR will stay about the same in achieving the desired intensity.

As one gets used to working out at all, this person might see their HR change some. Part of that is just inexperience in training, another is just going hard and getting the body firing like that.

It does take some practice in learning how to absorb the lag of HR, which is one of the issues in using it, but that doesn't mean it's of no use. Just something to learn.

Is it me or is THIS article completely useless? When I saw it I thought it would give me some insight as to whether i should be trying to change my T-Rex arms. Instead it tells me not to have them behind my back or on top of my head. Well no chit.  People actually get paid to do this research?! How about looking at the various ways runners NATURALLY carry their arms?!

That usually equates to equal parts desire to gnaw and desire to sleep for me.  SO much fun.

Oh, yes forgot about that part.  In the corridor outside my office are 10 or so 'comfy' chairs for students to sit on while waiting for labs to open.  I was thinking  on the way in this morning that I could drag two into my office and put them together for a little sofa and have a nap.... 

Wooop woooooop, got my first restitution check! It was for 50 instead of the minimum 20 too. 49 months to go

Ooh, fun!  Whatcha gonna do with it?

I think that the most important thing is to have a plan.  The plan should be simple/uncomplicated.

My plan

• Swim (likely in wetsuit) in bra and tri shorts
• T1- Add bike jersey on bike (will be in 50s to start)
• Bike: Two EFS liquid shot bottles in jersey pockets, three Clif Shot Bloks (cut in half) in Bento, one serving EFS in each of two bottles
• One Shot Blok every 20 minutes. Fill BTA before aid station add 1/2 EFS, drop bottle, get new bottle at aid station. 
• Plan B - extra flask of EFS in special needs in case I drop one, extra gel taped under saddle (SN bag will contain extra tube, CO2, EFS)
• T2 - remove jersey, lube liberally, add tri top, run.
• Run - drink 1+ cup of fluid at each aid station and 1 Gu-type gel every 45 minutes starting at the first aid station.  Stick with this at least the first two laps. Add Coke sooner rather than later.  Consume what you can tolerate on the final lap.
• Finish with both arms up and a smile on my face. 

I tend to hold my breath a sec when Greenfield's name comes up, but it might be ok here. The limiter part is ok, but make sure you use it as a limiter and not an average. The earlier post seemed like the latter. Think I see on your page where your various zones are? When you have a range like this to be in you might be better keeping it down some off of that upper end. More so because this is supposed to be easy work, so don't test the upper end so much. Save it for the harder days. And by keeping it "aerobic" you mean a more basic aerobic level? Zones 1-5 are all actually aerobic. The top of Z5 is your VO2max, which is the upper limit of aerobic processing. There aren't really adaptations that come specifically in Z2. There is a table linked earlier (Mary also quoted this) that shows this. It's more about benefits that come with more time just doing the activity. And to spend more time the intensity has to come down. And strange as it may sound, keeping this down can also help to give more time to absorb the work on the harder days, provided one doesn't overdo it. The harder days are the ones you want to push more, though you may want to note if easier effort days are feeling easier than they have been.

And back to the hard work, you do want to pay attention to just how hard you're going. Up to about threshold things stay similar, but increase in the amount of adaptation per time spent. But past threshold things change. See that Table 2 again. There are a lot of things in the list, so just look at Threshold development and VO2max. From Z1 to Z5, but note particularly at Z4 to Z5. Note the number of checkmarks.

This is all good stuff.

Ben Greenfield does give out good info.  You just have to watch out for his hard left turns into crazyland.

Interesting.  When it's hot and humid out, my HR is crazy high. 

I'm sure the low HR was my bodies reaction to "hey check out all this oxygen!" and "hey, it's flat!", but I did expect it to be higher based on percieved exertion.

I forgot that you live at altitude.  You must have been crazy fast!