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 2009-01-06 9:57 AM in reply to: #1857242 |
Champion  6962      Atlanta, Ga |  Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULLComment about Bike Trainers: Remember that things are different on a bike trainer than on the road. The size of the flywheel will determine how close to "real world" the feel is. But there are some differences in speed and HR that one must take into account. Speed: You speed on a trainer will be about 3-4 mph slower on the trainer than on the road. So if you are clipping along at 17 mph on the trainer that equals to about 20 mph on the road. That is a good rule of thumb for trainer mileage. So, for me, if I have an hour trainer session, I log 17 miles. I have verified this with my PT recently because my polar doesn't read the rear wheel (same problem some of you have). Heart Rate: Your HR will be approximately 10 bpm lower on the trainer than out on the road. That is because of the flywheel, lack of ventilation and increased pedaling. You have a couple of options which will make you smarter on the trainer. You shift your HR zones down by about 10 beats and use those. Also, pay attention to your RPE (Rated Percieved Exersion) when you're on the road at a particular HR. I bet that if you get to the same RPE on the trainer you will be about 10 beats below your road HR. Trainer Time vs Road Time: This one is contraversial and you'll get lots of opinions. So, my opinion is that it's about 3/4 the time if you're on the trainer for steady rides. Note the steady part of that sentence. If you have an interval workout, you don't shorten it. But if you have, lets say, a 2 hr road ride and you are doing it on your trainer, I would recommend not going over 1.5 hrs. You are constantly pedaling on a trainer which you are not doing on the road. You also always have pressure unlike on the road. Hope that helps! |
| 2009-01-06 4:34 PM in reply to: #1887686 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: nutrition Steve Mark - 2009-01-05 5:30 PM I eat about 6 times a day on a diet my nutritionist setup: Breakfast: either cereal+milk or egg+toast (7g protien, 15g carb's) All the fruit and vegie's I want, anytime. I also take B complex, C and D in the morning as well as 1-2 "doses" of FRS during the day, and 1-3 cups of green tea. On race day I'll have cereal and milk for breakfast and so far it's been GU gel's and GU20 for hydration. Afterward (and after a hard workout) I'll have Cytomax recovery or a bar (in 1:4 protein:carbs ratio). Usually after training I'll have a glass of chocolate milk, after 1.5 hours of weights I'll have 2 glasses. Water during a 1-hour workout, GU20 if more than 1 hour. Caffeine works miracles on my performance/endurance. I've found that nutrition is key to weight loss: you can eat all you want if you exercise like crazy and still get nowhere. All-protein diets don't work long-term and can mess you up. Best bet is to visit a nutritionist and get a personalized plan, it is not that expensive (mine was about $140 for the first visit and $40 for a follow-up) and I don't have to count calories, just types of food. Steve, Your nutrition looks good! What do you think of the FRS? One of my training partners likes it a lot. I also agree that caffeine, in moderation, helps me tons. Thanks, Tony |
| 2009-01-06 4:41 PM in reply to: #1887718 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: nutrition swise - 2009-01-05 5:45 PM tribesman - 2009-01-04 9:38 PM I know we are all busy but still need to eat correctly (most of the time) so... -What are some things we can do to ensure we are getting what we need? -What are some time saving measures that help with food prep? -Any good snacks out there that are fairly inexpensive, portable, and good for us? Tony 1) I guess the thing I need to be more mindful of is the crap that comes into my house via husband and kids. I don't often want what they like to eat - but I do occasionally find myself grabbing a couple oreos. 2) We try (TRY) to plan out meals when we grocery shop - so that we know what we are having during the week and are less inclined to just go to Waffle House b/c can't decide what to cook. 3) I go to Kroger and buy the individual bars from the organic food / health food section. Many aren't organic but I feel somewhat more secure in buying from this area of the store. Plus, by purchasing individually I can sample before I get 6-10 of the same thing. Kroger is great about putting these on sale (probably b/c there are only a handful of us that buy 'em) so I don't buy it unless on sale. and if something I really like gets super cheap I stock up. Aside from that I also like the South Beach cereal bars which have a decent amount of protein in them. Sandy, 1. I think that was one of the best things I did years ago...ensuring the "crap" stays out of the house. It is difficult at times but it it is not present, you cannot consume it! 2. Planning is key when shopping. I make out my list and decide ahead of time what I am going to purchase (I have been eating a lot of wheat pasta with turkey meat after hard or longer sessions...wow it is good! That's just 3 items= pasta, sauce, turkey meat) 3. I also try and shop from the organic sections. I like the sports bars but I noticed I was eating 3-4 a day for a while. Although I was getting calories, I found this to be NOT the best way to get them. I stick to one per day now and feel better. Other ways to eat healthy snacks could be purchasing good granola and dividing the bag into smaller sandwich bags. This way you have easy "on the go" snack too. If you have a 'fridge at work, etc...you can also store yogurt and nutritional drinks that are basically no hastle. Veggies and fruits are other easy snacks. Tony |
| 2009-01-06 4:50 PM in reply to: #1888180 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL natebs - 2009-01-05 9:05 PM Had a good workout weekend, one day of biking and one of running, taking today off. Just so you all know when you are looking at my logs the biking is all done on a trainer and running on a treadmill. This will proably continue untill April. We are in the snow belt here in Barrie and have had close to 4 feet of snow fall so far this year. I dislike running in the cold so I will wait till its above 5c and the ice and snow is gone. On my bike trainer I dont record the milage, it is not the same as when I ride outdoors so I just ignore it and use my heart rate. I know outdoors I can ride 30 - 32 km per hr on average (upto 34km in races) but on the setup downstairs I cant maintain that speed for more then 30 seconds. If i losen the setup the bike doesn`t ride properly. Nate, I don't blame you for training indoors for now. Re the treadmill, I try and keep it at 1% incline to help simulate the outdoors. Dan/Marvarnett's post re indoor training was a good one too. Thanks, Tony |
| 2009-01-06 4:56 PM in reply to: #1888664 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: nutrition thread afrutoz - 2009-01-06 6:16 AM Re: nutrition thread So the last two days are a tiny bit better but waay bad compared to where I need to be. I am making better choices but still have family in the house (left over from holidays and my family are partiers who drink and eat waay bad food) They leave tonight so I think it will get better. I am going to Obama's inaug ball and have a skinny black dress I have to fit into so i am extra motivated to get it together the next two weeks. i find when i have short term targets like a party or something it helps me eat better. Same with tri. When I have an uncoming race as target it helps me keep focused on the training. Funny story about zone 1 run. I went for an hour and half z1 run sunday. My 75 year old dad went with me. He WALKED while I jogged next to him. That is how slow my Z1 run is...Or maybe it just shows that my 75 year old dad (who is big partier and eats terribly but who was avid athlete all his life) is one heck of a fast walker! Alison, They say house guests and fish left out are about the same after 2 days...they both stink!  I just completely cleaned out my fridge and eliminated ALL of the bad leftovers, including good desserts  It had to be done as my post Ironman/winter weight is starting to settle. I agree that having your sights on a goal helps, especially with nutrition. To borrow a thought from Stephen Covey, I "Begin With the End in Mind" (https://www.stephencovey.com/7habits/7habits-habit1.php) My sights are set on the Spring-Fall race season, so I am making positive choices NOW inorder to prep my body for hard-core racing THEN. Re your z1 run, you sound like you are on track. Remember, it is base building time.  |
| 2009-01-06 4:56 PM in reply to: #1888664 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: nutrition thread afrutoz - 2009-01-06 6:16 AM Re: nutrition thread So the last two days are a tiny bit better but waay bad compared to where I need to be. I am making better choices but still have family in the house (left over from holidays and my family are partiers who drink and eat waay bad food) They leave tonight so I think it will get better. I am going to Obama's inaug ball and have a skinny black dress I have to fit into so i am extra motivated to get it together the next two weeks. i find when i have short term targets like a party or something it helps me eat better. Same with tri. When I have an uncoming race as target it helps me keep focused on the training. Funny story about zone 1 run. I went for an hour and half z1 run sunday. My 75 year old dad went with me. He WALKED while I jogged next to him. That is how slow my Z1 run is...Or maybe it just shows that my 75 year old dad (who is big partier and eats terribly but who was avid athlete all his life) is one heck of a fast walker! Alison, They say house guests and fish left out too long are about the same after 2 days...they both stink! I just completely cleaned out my fridge and eliminated ALL of the bad leftovers, including good desserts It had to be done as my post Ironman/winter weight is starting to settle. I agree that having your sights on a goal helps, especially with nutrition. To borrow a thought from Stephen Covey, I "Begin With the End in Mind" (https://www.stephencovey.com/7habits/7habits-habit1.php) My sights are set on the Spring-Fall race season, so I am making positive choices NOW inorder to prep my body for hard-core racing THEN. Re your z1 run, you sound like you are on track. Remember, it is base building time. Training hard and safe (and trying to eat correctly!), Tony Edited by tribesman 2009-01-06 4:57 PM |
| 2009-01-06 10:04 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL Let's discuss recovery nutrition. I mentioned that I like to use Endurox R4 ( http://www.accelsport.com/product-info/EnduroxR4.html). I have used it for a few years and have had good results. It works, I like the 4:1 ratio of carbs to protein, and it actually tastes good. I will typically use it after either a hard session like speed work, or a long session. I consider long over 1 hour run or 1.5-2 hour bike. I have not tried their Restore product but will likely soon. I have also mentioned chocolate milk. Studies have shown that it is a good recovery drink post exercise. Another option is Ensure or Boost. I have tested all of these and they work pretty well in a pinch. -What are you all using? -What works or doesn't work for you? Tony |
| 2009-01-07 9:11 AM in reply to: #1857242 |
Veteran 132 Newnan, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL regarding recovery drink - I need to basically go grocery shopping for my work fridge b/c the past few weeks I have been either going straight to work from the gym, to the gym at lunch or after work. Final base training questions -- during my week runs I don't always have time for more than 30-45 minutes. Am I getting the benefits of staying in zone one if only running for 30-40 minutes? |
| 2009-01-07 10:01 AM in reply to: #1891757 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL swise - 2009-01-07 10:11 AM regarding recovery drink - I need to basically go grocery shopping for my work fridge b/c the past few weeks I have been either going straight to work from the gym, to the gym at lunch or after work. Final base training questions -- during my week runs I don't always have time for more than 30-45 minutes. Am I getting the benefits of staying in zone one if only running for 30-40 minutes? Sandy, I try and keep my work (and home) fridge stocked with my yogart, Boost, fruit, etc...so I always have something on hand and in case I forget snacks. In reference to recovery, I use my Endurox 4 and consume it within 15-20 minutes post-training. By this I mean I have it in me before the 20 minutes are up. Then, I eat my recovery meal within one hour of finishing my training. There is this "golden hour" where our bodies are screaming for nutrients and nutrition for recovery. As time passes and we get outside of that window, recovery becomes more difficult. In regards to your base question, yes, you are still getting benefits from the 30-40 minute z1 runs. You are still establishing and building up your base with the shorter runs. Now is a great time for these runs. I also use them to enjoy the scenary around me that I might otherwise miss during the summer I have these runs as a part of my training plan because they work! Great question! Tony Edited by tribesman 2009-01-07 10:04 AM |
| 2009-01-07 12:11 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
Member 68 Georgia Tech | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL Hey everybody sorry I've been gone I was on a cruise with my family the last 10 days but am now back! Hope everybody had a good new year! For recovery drinks, I've used Recoverite and am currently using a recovery drink from Infinit because they had a 35% off rate for a little while. But I will usually only take those when I am in a rush to go somewhere and don't have time to make something for myself. I love chocolate milk and fruit afterwards. I think this week I will be buying a blender to make some delicous fruit smoothies. |
| 2009-01-07 1:20 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
Regular 76 Los Angeles, CA | Subject: Training Computer Comparison I created a comparison of different training computer setups to help me figure things out. All questions, comments and suggestions welcome! Hope you find it helpful. |
| 2009-01-07 4:40 PM in reply to: #1892405 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL theiframe - 2009-01-07 1:11 PM Hey everybody sorry I've been gone I was on a cruise with my family the last 10 days but am now back! Hope everybody had a good new year! For recovery drinks, I've used Recoverite and am currently using a recovery drink from Infinit because they had a 35% off rate for a little while. But I will usually only take those when I am in a rush to go somewhere and don't have time to make something for myself. I love chocolate milk and fruit afterwards. I think this week I will be buying a blender to make some delicous fruit smoothies. Ian, Welcome back! Hope you all had a great time. So what do you think of Recoverite? I actually use Infinit ( http://www.infinitnutrition.com/) for all of my training and like it. This is the training not recovery mix I am refering to here. I find an all liquid nutrition plan works well for me, especially for the half and Ironman races and training. Oh, and feel free to share some good smoothie recipes Tony Edited by tribesman 2009-01-07 4:40 PM |
| 2009-01-07 8:22 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
Veteran 334 | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL I use endurox 4 as well for recovery. I took 2 weeks off taking this in December and noticed a hugh different in the way I felt the next day On the bike I drink Infinit as well, I have not order the run version yet but I will be, as Im impressed with this product. |
after a workout. I was surprised at how much better I feel after taking the drink
. I will continue with this one as I know it works well with me. | 2009-01-07 9:33 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
Member 68 Georgia Tech | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL I as well noticed during my vacation how much I appreciate good recovery drinks. When I went running, down in the Carribean(spelling?), it was hot and my legs felt tired later in the day. I'm sure a lot of it had to do with the significant change in temperature too. I like the Recoverite and I like Infinit as well. I haven't used any of their stuff to use during workouts. I think I'll probably just end up looking around and seeing what is cheaper. It's really cool how you can customize stuff at Infinit as well. Edited by theiframe 2009-01-07 9:57 PM |
| 2009-01-08 7:27 AM in reply to: #1857242 |
Champion 6962 Atlanta, Ga | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL Hope Tony doesn't mind, but I see that many of you are using Infinit. If you use the code "concepts" you get 10% off. I tried it last season and love it. My last IM was all liquid. It is a great product IMHO. |
| 2009-01-08 8:37 AM in reply to: #1892640 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: Training Computer Comparison Steve Mark - 2009-01-07 2:20 PM I created a comparison of different training computer setups to help me figure things out. All questions, comments and suggestions welcome! Hope you find it helpful. Thanks Steve and nice chart! I actually use the first one you list, the Polar 625. I love the footpod, cadence, and speed sensor. It is water proof too so I can swim with it and all my data is on one device. Tony |
| 2009-01-08 8:40 AM in reply to: #1893842 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL theiframe - 2009-01-07 10:33 PM I as well noticed during my vacation how much I appreciate good recovery drinks. When I went running, down in the Carribean(spelling?), it was hot and my legs felt tired later in the day. I'm sure a lot of it had to do with the significant change in temperature too. I like the Recoverite and I like Infinit as well. I haven't used any of their stuff to use during workouts. I think I'll probably just end up looking around and seeing what is cheaper. It's really cool how you can customize stuff at Infinit as well. Ian, I like the way Infinit is customizable too. My mixes are a little different for run and bike so I have two large bags of it. I also use different flavors so my tastebuds, GI (and brain) have a little change of pace! It find it is easy to drink warm too, unlike some other products. Tony |
| 2009-01-08 8:41 AM in reply to: #1894282 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL Marvarnett - 2009-01-08 8:27 AM Hope Tony doesn't mind, but I see that many of you are using Infinit. If you use the code "concepts" you get 10% off. I tried it last season and love it. My last IM was all liquid. It is a great product IMHO. Thanks Dan and I was going to confirm that code with you. It's time for me to order again! My last HIM and IM were both all Infinit and it worked pretty well. Tony |
| 2009-01-08 9:15 AM in reply to: #1894466 |
Regular 76 Los Angeles, CA | Subject: RE: Training Computer Comparison tribesman - 2009-01-08 6:37 AM Steve Mark - 2009-01-07 2:20 PM Thanks Steve and nice chart! I actually use the first one you list, the Polar 625. I love the footpod, cadence, and speed sensor. It is water proof too so I can swim with it and all my data is on one device. TonyI created a comparison of different training computer setups to help me figure things out. All questions, comments and suggestions welcome! Hope you find it helpful.
Thanks Tony! I have the S625 also and like it, just wish it had GPS. Still trying to get a good calibration on the foot pod though. The problem I really have is that I'm doinig some bike training indoors and in the evenings now and I want to track mileage. I found a V3 on eBay for $125 - it's shipping out today. I was surprised at how much the Suunto does - I want to explore that further, but I also would rather spend $700 on other things. |
| 2009-01-08 12:53 PM in reply to: #1894559 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: Training Computer Comparison Steve Mark - 2009-01-08 10:15 AM tribesman - 2009-01-08 6:37 AM Steve Mark - 2009-01-07 2:20 PM Thanks Steve and nice chart! I actually use the first one you list, the Polar 625. I love the footpod, cadence, and speed sensor. It is water proof too so I can swim with it and all my data is on one device. TonyI created a comparison of different training computer setups to help me figure things out. All questions, comments and suggestions welcome! Hope you find it helpful.
Thanks Tony! I have the S625 also and like it, just wish it had GPS. Still trying to get a good calibration on the foot pod though. The problem I really have is that I'm doinig some bike training indoors and in the evenings now and I want to track mileage. I found a V3 on eBay for $125 - it's shipping out today. I was surprised at how much the Suunto does - I want to explore that further, but I also would rather spend $700 on other things. Yes, GPS would be a nice function! I too want to track mileage indoors and am simply estimating. Thanks, Tony |
| 2009-01-08 3:49 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
Regular 76 Los Angeles, CA | Subject: Twice-a-Day Workouts I'm now following a training plan and for the first time doing twice-a-day workouts. Wow - these are tough! Anyone else (besides Tony) doing these? I'm finding that I'm absolutely starving after the second workout, so I have to really nail down my nutrition. I'm also feeling pretty rickety - but the weight is just falling off! Anyone else going through this too? |
| 2009-01-08 4:50 PM in reply to: #1895789 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: Twice-a-Day Workouts Steve Mark - 2009-01-08 4:49 PM I'm now following a training plan and for the first time doing twice-a-day workouts. Wow - these are tough! Anyone else (besides Tony) doing these? I'm finding that I'm absolutely starving after the second workout, so I have to really nail down my nutrition. I'm also feeling pretty rickety - but the weight is just falling off! Anyone else going through this too? Steve, Yes, 2-a-days can be rough but effective if done correctly. I found that getting enough and the right mix of carbs and protein with limited sugar intake works best for me. You too will find your nutritional balance with trial and error. Let me know of any specific questions outside of what we all have discussed. I too would like to see what training plan everyone is using or is PLANNING to use for 2009. Thanks, Tony |
| 2009-01-08 4:58 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: nutrition book Hello Team, I thought I would toss another nutrition resource your way. I received this as a Christmas gift and am just diving into it. It seems great and I have only heard wonderful things about it. There is a tri-specific section too. http://www.amazon.com/Sports-Nutrition-Endurance-Athletes-Monique/d... Has anyone read this one? Also, the last article in this months "Triathlete Magazine" ( http://www.triathletemag.com) has an entertaining article on Sports Nutrition. It is written by Scott Tinley ( http://www.scotttinley.com/) an ex pro triathlete from "back in the day". I generally enjoy his writings... Tony Edited by tribesman 2009-01-08 9:48 PM |
| 2009-01-08 9:51 PM in reply to: #1893657 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: RE: tribesman's group - FULL natebs - 2009-01-07 9:22 PM I use endurox 4 as well for recovery. I took 2 weeks off taking this in December and noticed a hugh different in the way I felt the next day On the bike I drink Infinit as well, I have not order the run version yet but I will be, as Im impressed with this product. I think Endurox 4 is the best overall for me, hands down. I too am impressed with Infinit. I have actually spoke to Michael, the president of the company, and he is a straight-forward, nice, honest guy. Tony Edited by tribesman 2009-01-08 9:51 PM |
| 2009-01-09 3:24 PM in reply to: #1857242 |
| Expert 671 Atlanta, GA | Subject: Topic of the Week - Mental training Hello Team, I hope everyone is having a great Friday and ready for the weekend! We have discussed base training, goals, and nutrition, along with several other great topics and questions. What if we discuss the MENTAL aspects of training and racing, including attitude, commitment, and anything else you all would like to discuss. Keep in mind that this is a topic I am tossing out as a general topic of the week. We can still discuss other items. I picked up "The Triathlete's Guide To Mental Training" as I started to train for my first Ironman and got a lot out of it. I still refer back to it. http://www.amazon.com/Triathletes-Mental-Training-Ultrafit-Multispo... So food for thought... - Should we really worry about the mental aspects of training and racing? - How important is it? - How do we stay motivated to train, especially over the winter? As always, I am interested in your thoughts and look forward to GREAT conversations! Thanks and have a great weekend. Train smart. Tony |
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