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2013-02-01 8:21 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

OK, I thought I was the most injury prone person, but you give me a good run for my money.  That is why I don't wear heals anymore, I would constantly be spraining my ankle ... or breaking.  However, I can do that in flats too, just not nearly as often.

I hope you feel better soon ... are you tossing the heels?  You have terrible ankles like I do .. get rid of them.



2013-02-01 8:33 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
jarvy01 - 2013-02-01 7:51 AM

That's a very interesting discussion on different types of athletes.  Since I am a fragile aerobic athlete, it seems as if my chances of getting faster are looking pretty grim (jk ).  I find the concept of reverse periodization to be interesting.  

Thank you all for the hydration setup suggestions.  I'm thinking of going with speedfil a2 & some sort of rear setup.  This is starting to get expensive, and it's annoying.  

Is it normal to be uncomfortable in the aero position on the trainer?  It feels really miserable.  My saddle is still really stiff, but it's going to take some time to break it in.  I may just swap saddles with my road bike.  Identical but the road saddle is a year old.  I can't last long in aero on the trainer because my saddle area gets so uncomfortable.  

As to the expense....... Welcome to triathlon.  LOL.

 

Yes it's normal at first.  How does it feel on the road?  If you start creeping up on IMMT and are still uncomfortable you may need to look at a new fit.  Booo, I know.  If you want to swap out identical saddles, go for it.  Just make sure the new saddle is mounted in the exact same place as the old.  Hopefully your fitter gave you a list of measurements so you can double check.

2013-02-01 8:39 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
uhcoog - 2013-02-01 9:33 AM
jarvy01 - 2013-02-01 7:51 AM

That's a very interesting discussion on different types of athletes.  Since I am a fragile aerobic athlete, it seems as if my chances of getting faster are looking pretty grim (jk ).  I find the concept of reverse periodization to be interesting.  

Thank you all for the hydration setup suggestions.  I'm thinking of going with speedfil a2 & some sort of rear setup.  This is starting to get expensive, and it's annoying.  

Is it normal to be uncomfortable in the aero position on the trainer?  It feels really miserable.  My saddle is still really stiff, but it's going to take some time to break it in.  I may just swap saddles with my road bike.  Identical but the road saddle is a year old.  I can't last long in aero on the trainer because my saddle area gets so uncomfortable.  

As to the expense....... Welcome to triathlon.  LOL.

 

Yes it's normal at first.  How does it feel on the road?  If you start creeping up on IMMT and are still uncomfortable you may need to look at a new fit.  Booo, I know.  If you want to swap out identical saddles, go for it.  Just make sure the new saddle is mounted in the exact same place as the old.  Hopefully your fitter gave you a list of measurements so you can double check.

There's also very little reason to ride in the aero position on the trainer.  You'll have plenty of time to ride aero on the road come spring.  Because the trainer doesn't move and its at weird angles because of risers it can be particularly uncomfortable. Don't worry about it and sit up during the winter months.

2013-02-01 8:40 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
DDVMM - 2013-02-01 9:06 AM

kaburns1214 - 2013-02-01 7:42 AM Morning everyone.  I had an interesting day yesterday -- I was in federal court in White Plains today wearing fairly high heels (y'all totally already know where this is going).  The floors are marble and nicely waxed.  I took a bad step, my ankle caved and I completedly wiped out, twisted my right knee and then landed on it (I had bags in my hands so I broke my fall with my knee and knee alone).  By the time I got home from White Plains my knee was the size of a small melon. Knee is not happy.  Think I just have swelling and a nesty bruise but it doesn't really want to bend at the moment. 

 

Kelly!! NOOOO! I agree with Jen - get it checked out just to be sure!! And throw away the heels!

But the heels are super cute -- Kate Spade, cobalt blue patten leather. 

2013-02-01 9:03 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

Finally got everything logged in for Janaury:

 

January's totals:
Bike:33h 12m 14s  - 530.67 Mi
Run:14h 16m 45s  - 95.33 Mi
Swim:8h 04m 51s  - 29100 Yd
Strength:1h 00m
Massage:1h 00m

 

2013-02-01 9:06 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

Oh, Kate Spade - nice! Sorry to hear about your fall, hope your knee feels better soon.

Jen - I cannot ride in aero on the trainer. I don't know what it is, but it's very uncomfortable so I just don't do it.

My new saddle cannot get here soon enough! That racing version of adamo is so hard, it's killing me!

On another note - our new president and CEO is here today. What a speaker, very dynamic. Great meeting, very positive look into where we are headed. He's been with the company for 20 years, so not new. He's extremely personable, I can't say enough good thing about him.

We also have a new VP in charge of our building. Replacing the prior person (remember the "stress" last year, investigation...) and she's fabulous too.



2013-02-01 9:20 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
kaburns1214 - 2013-02-01 10:03 AM

Finally got everything logged in for Janaury:

 

January's totals:
Bike:33h 12m 14s  - 530.67 Mi
Run:14h 16m 45s  - 95.33 Mi
Swim:8h 04m 51s  - 29100 Yd
Strength:1h 00m
Massage:1h 00m

I'm pretty happy with my January especially since I'm not doing one of my A races until the end of June.

January's totals:
Bike:23h 25m  - 403.79 Mi
Run:13h 02m 27s  - 83.5 Mi
Swim:5h 29m 55s  - 15400 Yd
Strength:55m
Core Training:6h 55m
2013-02-01 9:35 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
Bike:21h 41m 05s  - 373.27 Mi
Run:14h 00m 48s  - 92.59 Mi
Swim:4h 57m 08s  - 16000 M
Strength:2h 50m
2013-02-01 9:40 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

Man, I feel like a slacker...

Bike:23h 23m 57s  - 340.46 Mi
Run:8h 26m 13s  - 59.24 Mi
Swim:8h 02m 49s  - 22325 Yd
Strength:1h 00m

 

2013-02-01 9:47 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
As you would tell me ... do you want to race this season or wear heels and watch others?
2013-02-01 9:52 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

carrie639 - 2013-02-01 9:47 AM As you would tell me ... do you want to race this season or wear heels and watch others?

 

LOL!!!!



2013-02-01 10:03 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

You do have to adjust the seat in aero, but I would not be able to not ride aero for this long.  It would kill my back and hands to ride a road bike all winter.

Karen - what seat are you getting?

2013-02-01 10:04 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

Question for the tech-gadget folks:  I use a Garmin Speed & Cadence sensor on my trainer setup in the basement for speed, cadence and distance.  The trainer is a new Kurt Kenetics fluid trainer and it appears to work pretty good, but for some reason I just cannot get the speed and distances up to where they would be if I was out on the roads using the Garmin GPS for speed & distance.  Over a 3 hour spin, it can be off as much as 12+ miles. 

Is the trainer "harder" than the real road? 

Is there a calibration for the GSC-10 that I haven't seen? 

There's no impact from the magnet placement on the spokes relative to speed as long as the sensor picks out the input, right? (it's based off rpm's).  Cadence seems okay.

It's not critical in my training, just seems so odd that there is a large discrepency between my perceived trainer effort and riding on the roads.  I know I live in a very hilly area and can coast, fly down them for miles, but I still have to ride back up them to get home.  The net ride data for a 3 hour duration should be somewhat closer - I think.  I guess the reality will show when I get back outside and the regular routes are either easier this Spring, or I realize that I am getting old...

2013-02-01 11:07 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

I'm not posting my totals for this month because they're sad.  Fatigue over New Year's weekend, bronchitis, and endoscopy took a lot out of me.  I hope Feb. is better!!!  

Nice job, folks! 

We got an offer on our house today.  It was low, so we counter offered.  We'll see where that takes us......fingers crossed!

2013-02-01 11:08 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
uhcoog - 2013-02-01 10:52 AM

carrie639 - 2013-02-01 9:47 AM As you would tell me ... do you want to race this season or wear heels and watch others?

 

LOL!!!!

Oh, snap!  

2013-02-01 11:09 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
cobratodd - 2013-02-01 11:04 AM

Question for the tech-gadget folks:  I use a Garmin Speed & Cadence sensor on my trainer setup in the basement for speed, cadence and distance.  The trainer is a new Kurt Kenetics fluid trainer and it appears to work pretty good, but for some reason I just cannot get the speed and distances up to where they would be if I was out on the roads using the Garmin GPS for speed & distance.  Over a 3 hour spin, it can be off as much as 12+ miles. 

Is the trainer "harder" than the real road? 

Is there a calibration for the GSC-10 that I haven't seen? 

There's no impact from the magnet placement on the spokes relative to speed as long as the sensor picks out the input, right? (it's based off rpm's).  Cadence seems okay.

It's not critical in my training, just seems so odd that there is a large discrepency between my perceived trainer effort and riding on the roads.  I know I live in a very hilly area and can coast, fly down them for miles, but I still have to ride back up them to get home.  The net ride data for a 3 hour duration should be somewhat closer - I think.  I guess the reality will show when I get back outside and the regular routes are either easier this Spring, or I realize that I am getting old...

Shaun posted about this very topic a couple days ago.  I will try to find the post and bump it for you.



2013-02-01 11:12 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
CubeFarmGopher - 2013-01-29 7:07 AM

Kel wanted me to weigh in regarding bike trainers and fluctuations in speed over different types of trainers.

One of the reasons that I tell people to spend the extra money to get a fluid trainer versus a mag trainer is the reality of power output compared to outdoor.  A mag trainer renders a straight-line resistance curve while a fluid trainer renders a parabolic resistance curve.

The downside of that is when you go from riding a mag trainer to a fluid trainer, your speed will drop b/c you are used to pushing a set number of watts which, on the parabolic curve, relates to a lower speed output.  Don't worry about the speed output.  Just worry about the power you are putting out.  Just focus on the fact that your speed will increase over time and, with that increase, you are increasing your power output more than if you were using a mag trainer.

 

For the math geeks, here is the power formula:

y = 0.0115x3 - 0.0137x2 + 8.9788x
Where "y" is Power, and "x" is speed in MPH.

Source

I'm bumping this for Todd.  I know you aren't asking about mag vs. fluid, but you are questioning speed on trainer.  

2013-02-01 11:23 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
cobratodd - 2013-02-01 11:04 AM

Question for the tech-gadget folks:  I use a Garmin Speed & Cadence sensor on my trainer setup in the basement for speed, cadence and distance.  The trainer is a new Kurt Kenetics fluid trainer and it appears to work pretty good, but for some reason I just cannot get the speed and distances up to where they would be if I was out on the roads using the Garmin GPS for speed & distance.  Over a 3 hour spin, it can be off as much as 12+ miles. 

Is the trainer "harder" than the real road? 

Is there a calibration for the GSC-10 that I haven't seen? 

There's no impact from the magnet placement on the spokes relative to speed as long as the sensor picks out the input, right? (it's based off rpm's).  Cadence seems okay.

It's not critical in my training, just seems so odd that there is a large discrepency between my perceived trainer effort and riding on the roads.  I know I live in a very hilly area and can coast, fly down them for miles, but I still have to ride back up them to get home.  The net ride data for a 3 hour duration should be somewhat closer - I think.  I guess the reality will show when I get back outside and the regular routes are either easier this Spring, or I realize that I am getting old...

 

Couple of quick thoughts.

1.  Check the wheel diameter setting of the bike profile in your Garmin.  That is what the system uses to validated distance traveled based on counting the number of wheel rotations.  Even a small discrepancy will add up quickly over a 3 hour ride.

You can find wheel diameters on page 52 of this Garmin owner's manual.

 

2.  Speed on a trainer is a more direct function of the power you are putting out over time because it is not influenced by external factors like wind, elevation changes, road surfaces, etc.  Even if you ride a hill that is a parabolic arc, your downhill/uphill average would not be the same as flat road average due to the power function being a cubic change of velocity.  [the engineering geek in me just woke up ]  In order to double your speed, you have to increase your power output 8-fold to overcome air resistance on the same surface area.

That's just my quick thinking on the matter.  I'll think about it a bit more over the afternoon and chime in again later.

2013-02-01 11:36 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
ah ha!!! okay, the wheel size could be the ticket!!!  Thanks!
2013-02-01 11:42 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
cobratodd - 2013-02-01 11:04 AM

Question for the tech-gadget folks:  I use a Garmin Speed & Cadence sensor on my trainer setup in the basement for speed, cadence and distance.  The trainer is a new Kurt Kenetics fluid trainer and it appears to work pretty good, but for some reason I just cannot get the speed and distances up to where they would be if I was out on the roads using the Garmin GPS for speed & distance.  Over a 3 hour spin, it can be off as much as 12+ miles. 

Is the trainer "harder" than the real road? 

Is there a calibration for the GSC-10 that I haven't seen? 

There's no impact from the magnet placement on the spokes relative to speed as long as the sensor picks out the input, right? (it's based off rpm's).  Cadence seems okay.

It's not critical in my training, just seems so odd that there is a large discrepency between my perceived trainer effort and riding on the roads.  I know I live in a very hilly area and can coast, fly down them for miles, but I still have to ride back up them to get home.  The net ride data for a 3 hour duration should be somewhat closer - I think.  I guess the reality will show when I get back outside and the regular routes are either easier this Spring, or I realize that I am getting old...

I use a KK road machine and it is awesome. Generally I've found my HR to be minus 15-20 BPM to the road for the same perceived while at the same time the speed is about 1-1.5 MPH slower. So for instance if I'm on the trainer and average 114 BPM and 18 MPH I'll hop on the road and that will become a 129-134 BPM and 19-19.5 MPH workout. Everybody is different but that should give you a good baseline. The other posts showing the higher wattage on the KK for a lower speed do a better job than I could describing it and the graph is excellent.

2013-02-01 11:49 AM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

Sorry I've been off the grid much of the last week - real life has gotten in the way.  Everyone has been so busy!  Kelly - hope your ankle and knee feel better soon.  Karen, congrats on your successful 30 days.  Scott - congrats on your run time - you're giving me something to shoot for.  Jen - even if the surgery and recovery have been difficult, what a relief to finally have a clear path to getting back to normal.  Doc Chris - glad to hear you weren't hurt.  Keep it 'tween the ditches! 

I did feel very virtuous this morning.  We had masters in the (heated) outdoor pool, and while we were going back and forth, it started snowing, hard!  It's an unusual sensation to turn your head to take a breath and have a big fat snowflake land on your tongue! 

I also looked at my totals for January, and realized I didn't bike at all.  That wasn't the plan; it just worked out that those were the days that something came up.  In another week or so, I'm switching from a swim-emphasis phase to a run-emphasis phase.  I can tell that focusing on the swim has really improved me, though.  As the weather starts to get better I'll probably do the bike workouts by bike-commuting to work.  Anyway, here are January's numbers.  Hopefully B, S, and Str will be better for February.

S:  28316.32 Yd - 10h 41m
R:  3h 49m
Str:  25m

Cheers, everyone.  Have a good weekend.



2013-02-01 1:40 PM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
Have 2.5 on the bike tomorrow.  Trying to decide if I go ride on the course or just my normal haunts to make sure I hit my metrics.  Hmmmmm.
2013-02-01 2:03 PM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED
I would ride the course as much as I could.
2013-02-01 2:14 PM
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Subject: RE: kaburns1214 Mentor Group 2013 (Year 3!) - CLOSED

uhcoog - 2013-02-01 2:40 PM Have 2.5 on the bike tomorrow.  Trying to decide if I go ride on the course or just my normal haunts to make sure I hit my metrics.  Hmmmmm.

There's no reason you can't hit your metrics on the IMTX course. 

2013-02-01 2:41 PM
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kaburns1214 - 2013-02-01 2:14 PM

uhcoog - 2013-02-01 2:40 PM Have 2.5 on the bike tomorrow.  Trying to decide if I go ride on the course or just my normal haunts to make sure I hit my metrics.  Hmmmmm.

There's no reason you can't hit your metrics on the IMTX course. 


Agreed.  More of a me issue.  I know the routes by me like the back of my hand, and they're boring as all hell so all I have to focus on is the workout. 
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