Slornow and Wannabefaster's Winter Group version 3-CLOSED (Page 8)

Just went out for a walk/run today for the first time since the 18th; Christmas shopping and other committments wiped out any chance of doing something sooner. I'm CCing the information below directly from the comments in my training log because I wanted to get some input on the matter.

There's a few reasons why I'm doing a couple HMs next year.

1) I will not be prepared for a HIM until the first quarter of 2015 at the absolute earliest, since the bike program I'm following has me set to do my first half century the first week of January 2015. Rather than wait for the bike to catch up, I'm using HM as training sticks to measure where I'm at in a racing situation.

In my opinion, in order to be able to do the swimming, cycling, and running required for a triathlon of any distance, you have to have the capacity to do each of them individually at the distance in question.

2) Triathlons don't occur during the winter; 5k/10k/HM/15k/Marathons do. It's a good way to keep yourself in decent shape during the offeseason for the upcoming triathlon season.

3) with the way my brain works, I have to constantly have objectives sitting in front of me to pursue. If I did only triathlons, it would be EXTREMELY easy for me to slack off during the off-season since it's maintenance mode and there's nothing to pursue with races. However, if I've got cycling races or road races during that time, it keeps me in training mode and doesn't let slothfulness take over.

4) I may or may not be jealous of two people that each did an event this last thanksgiving; one did the Atlanta half marathon in 2:20, the other did the Turkey Trot 5k in 29". Jealousy can be a great motivator if it doesn't consume you.

I think that this far out that if you broke it again that it would just be a random coincidence that you broke the same bone rather than a break from residual weakness. Of course I am not an orthpod but I think that is pretty sound medical advice.

new pain and new shoes? probably not a coincidence.

Why did you change from your old shoes?

They were not running shoes and had been heavily worn by that point. I had started running in the other paur but ended up needing new shoes; my feet were screaming at me while in them and the pain was gone immediately upon thr removal of the shoes. It's more of a gradual pain that slowly gors away now.

It makes me wonder if it's more from use than from the shoes in this case.

For me, the race sounded cool and so I wanted to do it! Plus I am thinking it's a good mileage to be training for to carry me in the tri-training too.

(covered bridge half marathon in Vermont in June)

Suzy- wow, I hope you and Paul heal quickly and you are OK!!!

Edited by el penguino 2013-12-27 5:57 PM

Oh my, Suzy! So glad you and Paul are "okay". Hope recovery for both of you is as quick and comfortable as possible.

Stuart, good to see you getting back into it.

Jason, never got to tell you how bummed I was to see the travel plans not happen for you guys.

Hey, hey, Rene! Good to see you back in action here!

The holidays were great. Christmas Day was full of family, food, and fun.

I'm training for my 2nd full marathon happening in April of 2014. I've decided to do it to help keep me moving through the holiday festivities to avoid the usual 10 pound gain, and improve on my 1st time.

Today was the first time in the hills for some MTB action in a while. Took a fall in some rocks trying to mount. Being a shorty cake, my shorts always snag on my bike seat. Lost my balance, couldn't unclip in time and fell over. I was able to turn so that I'd land on my back instead of my side (didn't want all the weight of the bike and my body mashing my arm into the rocks), but my left elbow lost a nice little chunk of flesh.

I can take pain, but the sight of blood makes me weak in the knees. Tried to walk towards the doctor in our group to have him look at it, took a look at it to see blood pouring out of it and nearly passed out, lol!

What a way to kick off the Xterra training season! Kept riding, but lost my cajones for the descents after that. Oh well, back at it next weekend!

Edited by Blanda 2013-12-28 12:52 AM

Suzy, so awful to read about Paul's injury. I hope there's nothing serious with you after such a rough year last year.

Mike, good to see another familiar face again. How's your training going lately?

Catwoman, to answer your question, the HM is quickly becoming my favorite running distance. I am looking at a HIM as well, because I really enjoyed doing a full last year, but I want a little less time training and more time with my family this year.

I finally got back out today and ran an easy 5k on a local XC course. Enjoyed the change of pace from my usual haunts, although the hills were tough after six weeks of slacking.

Suzy-

Very sorry to hear about your accident! I was back to work yesterday after being off for surgery and holiday and wasn’t able to log in here at all until this morning. I spend a fair amount of time on snow machines in the winter and there is always that question…I’ve had people come around a trail bend at 70+ miles per hour on the wrong side of a trail and so far I’ve been very fortunate. Thinking about you and Paul and hoping for a speedy recovery for both of you.

Catwoman-

While I don’t have anything specific scheduled yet, I would say it is likely that I will do another half marathon at some point this summer and potentially a full marathon after my main triathlon for the year. These events for me are less about my training or performance and more about doing something with my wife. She recently (about 3 years ago) started running and is actually who got me started back up again after 20+ years. So, I’ll run a few events with her just to keep her excited about doing it.

All-

Well, per Jason’s thoughts I dove off the deep end! I signed up for an HIM! I will be training for the MiTi HIM at the end of August. (Yes I know MiTi is not an actual HIM, just iron distance) I know Jason had said to schedule one as late as possible but this race’s start and finish are less than three miles from my doorstep! That takes a lot of logistical issues out of it. It seems crazy to me to think about doing this before I have swum a lap in the pool but I do subscribe to Jason’s theory that fear of failure is a great motivator.

As for training, I start my swim lessons next week so we’ll see how that goes. I did hop on my bike on the trainer last night and just spun easy for about 20 minutes. Mostly just wanted to see what the knee felt like. So far feels great this morning! Sometime today I will spend some time trying to get my trainer/HRM/ANT+ stick thing, which I haven’t messed with yet at all, set up so I can start doing some more meaningful workouts starting next week.

Regarding swimming resources, I don’t know who recommended it but I know Stuart seemed to feel like the swim smooth site was a solid resource so I’ll likely check that out sometime this weekend.

I get my stitches out on Monday and will have a better feel from the Doc what my next steps are. He had a pretty specific plan for reintegrating running into my training slowly and had talked about “Visco-Supplementation” (Sp?) shots for my knee as part of my training process. Anyone done that or have any thoughts on the process for someone with a slightly arthritic knee with a degenerating meniscus?

I hope everyone has a great weekend and as I have said, I really do appreciate all the feedback and the input from this group.

Chris

P.S. Sorry so long winded…I don’t know how all my posts end up so long!!

This will be short as I'm posting from the car. Chris, my orthopedic surgeon is not a fan of the injections. I asked about them prior to surgery. His response was that they are a last resort before knee replacement. However, that Is just his opinion. There are a lot of people who have had a lot of success with the the shots.
My biggest concern is why you would need shots to train. It is my opinion having made a lot of mistakes last year during knee surgery recovery that you don't want anything that will mask pain.

Sorry if that came across wrong. It wasn't my intent. Last year was a hard year of recovery and I'm a bit cautious. Hopefully your recovery will be easier than mine was.

No, didn't come across wrong at all I totally understand where you are coming from. I agree about masking the pain. My understanding, maybe Jason can correct me if I'm wrong, was that the visco-supplementation was not for pain but that it added some synthetic cushion in the knee to enhance the remaining cartilage. The cortisone shots, I think, are for the pain and that is not what he was talking about.

Than again, I could be totally wrong as well...

Ran with the Triple 8 group this morning...meet at 8th Street fountain at 8:00 for 8 miles. The knee felt surprisingly good. I spent some time last night in an Epsom salt/baking soda/apple cider vinegar bath last night at the urging of my massage therapist/polarity therapist/reiki/alternative therapy aunt. This morning, I felt surprisingly good considering that I've been walking around with achy bits all week. Going to foam roll and focus on those tweaky bits in a few minutes.

Chris...while I realize the recent knee surgery changes things a bit, just for some perspective, I started swimming laps for the first time ever last March (I hadn't even been in a pool since sometime around 1987 when I was a teenager), and did a half iron distance race this past September. Granted, my swim was a current aided swim, but I was still able to swim 1.2+ miles without the current nonetheless. I'm certainly not fast, but I made it. In addition, I found that the swimming really seemed to help my run.

Good morning all:

My best wishes to those recovering from injury. I've heard chocolate speeds recovery

I appreciate some input if people have time on sharing information on how they use lap split times. I'm trying to set up something that makes sense.

Cycling? What is a meaningful lap split on the trainer? Currently I have 30 min splits set up and can review speed and HR for each 30 min period and check for improvement. On the roads I had a 5km split for...er...ah...well... because that is what the default on the watch was. I do have a speed sensor on the bike and could use distance. Any advice?

What are others using that makes a lot of senses.



Nelson

Went out for a long run this morning. 16.4 miles @ 9:42 pace. One of those "don't try this at home kids" kind of runs. Training plan? What's that? Feeling pretty good. Maybe get in a 20 miler next weekend? And then start to taper. Starting 6 weeks out might not be the smartest thing but here goes nothing.

Chris,

Congratulations on signing up for the MiTi. I admit that I have been intrigued by the idea of doing a 70.3 here in the state and that looks like a good one. The guy I told you about, Kevin, is an ambassador for that race. There is a thread in the MI forum where there is discussion of the race and how it went. I think it is a little more "mom and pop" than a WTC race but I think they put a lot of effort in to having a great experience for everyone.

And, in my opinion, if you do the distance, you have done a half ironman. All that branding stuff doesn't mean too much to me.

As far as visco supplementation goes, I have no idea. I'll ask the next orthopod I run in to this week what they think about it.


Nelson,

I do what Randy does. On the trainer I have time-based intervals, trying to hit predetermined power numbers for specific times. You could do the same thing with trying to maintain a certain heart rate for a time interval as well. 'Distance' on the trainer is often a meaningless statistic. I put up distance numbers all of the time on the trainer (24 miles in an hour of riding) that are not reality based. I record them because the log asks for them, but I realize that I am unlikely to be hitting those numbers outdoors.

If you are outdoors, people will often have set courses of certain distances that they use as time trials to see if they can do the same course faster from week to week or season to season. This is where a distance based interval can be very useful but it can still be altered by weather conditions (heat and wind) or bike conditions (tire pressure, drive train condition) so you would still be interested in other data points.... If you did a certain distance 1 minute faster than you did it last week that is good but if your average heart rate is 15 beats higher than last week, did you really go faster on the same effort (showing fitness gains) or have you gotten tougher and able to go mentally push harder on the same fitness? This stuff can get really complicated sometimes

What I will say, and everyone will hear me repeat this over and over, consistency is the most important part of all of this. It is easy to get caught up in numbers (I do it all the time) but the true secret is having a plan and executing it over time. You may not notice a big difference from this week to next but I guarantee that if you stick with it and faithfully do the workouts that you will achieve gains over the long term. I run my recovery runs now at a harder pace than I used to run a 10K race. It happened with hundreds (and hundreds) of miles of consistently running.

Gregg,

Pretty stout run. You clearly have the fitness and mental fortitude to do this. Don't hurt yourself!

FWIW I don't have a power meter and used virtual power on Trainer Road through the winter last year. I found it extremely helpful to keep on track to hit my intervals. There are also a ton of plans to follow.
Oh and thanks for Iginla, he is fitting in quite nicely.

Beautiful day for a run around these parts. I did an easy 7 with the wife this morning and have my last 20 miler scheduled for tomorrow. I'm no expert but a 6 week taper seems a little excessive. I think my plan calls for a 2 week taper or "peak" as McMillan calls it.

Easy 7 for me this a.m.. Kind of being a bum and just hanging out this afternoon. 20 miler scheduled for tomorrow morning and then I have to go to a family ice skating party in the afternoon. I told the Mrs. I will attend but don't expect to see skates on these feet. I haven't skated since I was a teenager and don't want to chance a pulled muscle or worse. I think the pre-marathon paranoia is starting to set in.