General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Endurance Speed v Speed Skills? Rss Feed  
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2008-05-12 4:09 PM

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Subject: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?
A little confused... are they the same thing?


2008-05-12 4:24 PM
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Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?
Maybe if you can provide a context we might be able to tell...
2008-05-12 4:26 PM
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Coach
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Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?

^^^^ what he said cuz I am confused as well

2008-05-12 5:51 PM
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Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?

Sorry for any confusion caused.

 In Joe Friel's "The Triathlete's Training Bible"  He talks about working on Speed Skills, i.e.: for swimming high elbows etc...

I also have the "Workouts in a binder" a book about swim workouts for triathlete's.  In there there is a section called Endurance Speed.  The workouts seam to be all at T-pace (your own time trial pace) or fast etc...

Basically I'm looking for some guidence on improving my swimming speed skills (technique) or better said some workouts that will help improve this...

2008-05-12 5:54 PM
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Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?

The WIB "endurance speed" are workouts specifically geared towards increasing your ability to hold pace (or more so to get used to holding pace) for longer periods, not for working on your stroke which is what the Friel workout sounds like.

Edit: In my non-fish opinion the best way to work on speed in the water is short fast sets with low rest intervals.  Short enough distance that you can always maintain good form, but short enough rest that you still get a solid workout.  My swim coach said that one of her favorite workouts is 40 x 25 maintaining the same speed and stroke count.  She said that if even SHE can make it into the 30+ range and keep it consistent that she is having a great session.



Edited by Daremo 2008-05-12 5:56 PM
2008-05-12 6:13 PM
in reply to: #1397543

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Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?
At which training phase would you introduce the non-fish workouts?


2008-05-12 6:23 PM
in reply to: #1397543

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Folsom, CA (Sacramento Area)
Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?
Based on your last two swim workouts..... right now is a good time.

Your avg times in 200's are fairly consistant so I would do 50's. Try something like 10 X 50 with 10 sec rest. If you find yourself slowing down too much after the fifth 50, take 1 minute rest and then finish the drill. a set of 20 is not out of the question either.

I usually do 1 speed workout and 1 distance workout per week, so I would suggest to mix it in a proportional manner

hope this helps
2008-05-12 6:33 PM
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Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?
Cheers for that.   I was thinking of adding such a workout once a week (I swim 3-4x a week).  My first Tri race isn't until October/November time ish (heading into winter down here).
2008-05-12 8:36 PM
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Coach
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Subject: RE: Endurance Speed v Speed Skills?

Drills and speed sets are different. Drills (technique) are meant to help you work on certain aspects of your stroke, usually in one or two aspects and by doing different specific drills it will allow you to put together a better stroke as a whole. It is better if you have someone analyze your stroke so he/she can provide specific feedback as to what drills will help you the most. Speed sets are meant to help you work at a particular high intensity (LT, VO2 max, etc) to help you increase your endurance at such intensity.

All athletes should devote some time improving/refining technique but some will benefit more by focusing on technique 1st rather than endurance while others just lack more endurance. To figure that out you can do some Time trials if you haven't done so yet. Do a 100, 500 all out on one day and a 1-1.5K all out a few days later and compare your splits. If your avg per 100 (yds) is slower than 1:30 min you need to work on technique 1st and foremost. If you can post a fast split at 100 but your pace falls at 500 and 1.5K then you need to focus more on endurance.

IMO some of the best endurance/speed sets for triathletes are something like this: 5-15x200 @ T pace minus 5 sec (R:10-20) or 3-6 x 500 @ T pace minus 2-3 sec (R:20-25)

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