General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Should I stick to the marathon plan? Rss Feed  
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2008-10-05 4:04 PM

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Subject: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

Okay, so I have 9 more long runs left before my first full marathon. I am following a local USAFit marathon training program. I think it's not as intense as other marathon programs out there, but I'm not sure since I haven't really taken the time to compare them. I'm not supposed to share the training programs outside of the USAFit group, so I won't share all the details.

Here's my question. Should I follow the plan or should I increase my mileage because I feel I need to do more running to help myself? I am trying to build my endurance and speed. When I say speed, I obviously would like to increase my pace, but I think if I build up my strength and endurance by running more miles, my pace would probably pick up by default.

Anyway, just ran 15 miles yesterday and this week's planned runs are: 2 miles, 3 miles tempo, 3 miles tempo and then 10 mile long run. Next week's planned runs are: speed work, 3 miles and 4 miles temp and then 10 mile long run.

This is the plan for the next two weeks and I'm in a slower pace group (12 min mile group).

I'm just wondering if I should include another day of running or if I shouldn't then I suppose I could do some cross training on the "non-run" days. Do most of you follow the plans to a "t" or do you add extra training?

 



2008-10-05 4:09 PM
in reply to: #1719399

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

Not a whole lot of improvement you can make in the final two weeks, so I would consider the hay to be in the barn and go with the rest of the plan as written.

Other than that, not enough information to assess the plan. What were your longer runs, how many (if any) longer than 20?

2008-10-05 4:28 PM
in reply to: #1719410

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?
the bear - 2008-10-05 2:09 PM

Not a whole lot of improvement you can make in the final two weeks, so I would consider the hay to be in the barn and go with the rest of the plan as written.

Other than that, not enough information to assess the plan. What were your longer runs, how many (if any) longer than 20?

 

Not to disagree with Mr. The Bear, but I read your post to mean that you have about 2 MONTHS before your event with nine long runs (probably on Saturdays) and a taper week still before your event.  I know little of the FIT program, but if there vision is "event completion" the plan may never challenge you enough to get to your hoped for level of fitness. 

also - not sure if I read anywhere about you exploring these questions with your FIT coach.  Would be curious about their reaction.

2008-10-05 4:31 PM
in reply to: #1719410

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?
the bear - 2008-10-05 4:09 PM

Not a whole lot of improvement you can make in the final two weeks, so I would consider the hay to be in the barn and go with the rest of the plan as written.

Other than that, not enough information to assess the plan. What were your longer runs, how many (if any) longer than 20?

I still have 9 more weeks....do you think 7 weeks is not enough time (going with your original statement of 2 weeks isn't enough time.

I would print out the schedule if I could, but I'm trying to honor the code of not sharing the USAFit training plan (not that I think it's that big of a deal anyway).

There are 9 more weeks left of long runs, they are as follows:

  1. 10 miles
  2. 10 miles
  3. 18 miles
  4. 10 miles
  5. 15 miles
  6. 10 miles
  7. 21 miles
  8. 8 miles
  9. 6 miles
  10. no long run on Saturday before Sunday marathon

I'm not thinking I'm going to perform a miracle. I was just wondering if the plan was too limiting because it's based on a slower pace. Actually they have us running minutes and we've changed it....for example, there is a 20 minute run this week...um, that's not enough time and so our coach made us change it to a 5K run (if we went with 20 minutes at a 12 mile pace, that would be less than 2 miles!!). So going on that principle, I'm just wondering if I do more than the plan says if that would result in more positive changes or would that incur injuries...that was the gist of my question.

Sorry I wasn't more clear. I think I just made it clearer to myself.

2008-10-05 4:41 PM
in reply to: #1719439

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?
Revbigdog - 2008-10-05 4:28 PM
the bear - 2008-10-05 2:09 PM

Not a whole lot of improvement you can make in the final two weeks, so I would consider the hay to be in the barn and go with the rest of the plan as written.

Other than that, not enough information to assess the plan. What were your longer runs, how many (if any) longer than 20?

 

Not to disagree with Mr. The Bear, but I read your post to mean that you have about 2 MONTHS before your event with nine long runs (probably on Saturdays) and a taper week still before your event.  I know little of the FIT program, but if there vision is "event completion" the plan may never challenge you enough to get to your hoped for level of fitness. 

also - not sure if I read anywhere about you exploring these questions with your FIT coach.  Would be curious about their reaction.

I think their vision is "event completion" for some pace groups. We are divided into 4 groups and the other groups are "challenged" more....the faster paced groups have long runs and longer weekly training sessions etc.

My coach is more of a contemporary. She's only done one marathon, which is nothing to sneeze at, but the other coaches have at least 10 years or more experience and no, I have not asked them yet what they think. Just thought I would ask the venerated athletes here on BT first!

 

2008-10-05 4:53 PM
in reply to: #1719399

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

Yeah, I read it three times and still read it wrong. Sorry about that.

What are your marathon goals? Do you consider the paces and the schedule to be challenging or not?



2008-10-05 4:56 PM
in reply to: #1719466

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?
If you have picked a plan, then usually it is best to stick with it.  You still have the brunt of the plan to go with 9 more weeks.  If you feel that it is too "easy" then perhaps you can lengthen some of the runs. 2 and 3 mile runs in a marathon build seem quite short to me, but I did not create the plan, so I cannot really criticize it.
2008-10-05 5:04 PM
in reply to: #1719399

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

I think the FIT plan is designed to help the non-runner complete their first full marathon. Having said that, they accommodate a huge range of runners from 8 min milers to 12 min and longer.

As I said before, the training plan for the other groups (those who are faster, which there are many) is more rigorous. Do I think I could go harder? Sure. Will I get injured? That's my concern. But I guess since I have 9 more weeks I can go for it and see what happens. I'm a smart gal and I know when I've had enough.

At this moment, the goal is to finish, but like all anal retentive athletes, I would like to do better than I am now. At this rate, I see myself finishing around 13 min pace (if I don't make any more improvements). I would really prefer to finish under 5 hours...that would be my dream...which makes my pace around 11:30 min I think? Having said that, I don't think it's impossible to make those improvements before marathon day. Might be hard(read:ambitious) , but not impossible.

 



Edited by zeefraugtries 2008-10-05 5:06 PM
2008-10-05 10:50 PM
in reply to: #1719399

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

Without seeing the whole plan it's difficult to comment. However, it seems like the runs during the week should be longer and one tempo/speed a week should be sufficient. One of the keys to running a decent marathon is getting in good overall mileage, not just the long runs. If it were me I'd be thinking more about bumping those midweek runs into the 5-6 mile range and keep the weekend longs the same. If you do that be sure to keep the pace easy except for one day. Trying to run too much fast or more intense stuff can lead to injury and/or it can be difficult to recover for the next run.

Since this is your first marathon and I assume you've paid something for the coaching, it would probably be best to stick with the plan. Use the experience as a base for your next marathon.

2008-10-05 11:48 PM
in reply to: #1719399

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

I think you should stick to your plan, finish it up well, and if anything, be conservative with adding miles this time around. You certainly can, given 9 weeks of training, but for a significant boost in performance, you will need to boost your mileage over a longer and more sustained period to avoid injury (which is often the single biggest limiting factor for long-term marathon performance.)

For the next go-around, if you can work up to marathon plans of 45, or 55, or possibly even 70 miles per week, you will experience a significant increase in all race distance performances if you're on a plan - recommended ones for those intending to maximize their run performance are Pete Pfitzinger's "Advanced Marathoning" book, which is probably the most vaunted and tested of the advanced plans out there.  These are 18-24 week plans in general aimed at strong marathon performance, but still reasonable enough for serious nonelites to successfully complete.

 I would exercise caution in ramping up fast now - the last 2 months before race day are ripe times for injury since you may feel so strong that you can run longer, faster, and farther than your plan suggests, but you are likely inadequately prepared without the proper base training to dive right in (unless you're lucky). As stated, avoiding injury is of paramount importance in the 8 weeks before race day where you are hitting maximal distance and speeds.

 

2008-10-06 8:58 AM
in reply to: #1719399

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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

Thanks for the advice. I don't intend on ramping up too much. I do want to challenge myself just a bit more if it will help. I don't have aspirations of being too much faster in finishing, but I most definitely want to have enough "padding" of time so I don't end up being pulled off the course should race fatigue set in or something. I'm just worried that I don't have enough speed to sustain me the entire 26.2 miles.

But I need to think positive.



2008-10-07 9:02 AM
in reply to: #1719399


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Subject: RE: Should I stick to the marathon plan?

I have trained with Usafit (last year for a marathon and this year half marathon) and our week day runs were a lot longer than yours.  We were doing 4 to 6 miles during the week.  The schedule is 3 weekday runs and a cross training day and then the long weekend run. 

I advise to discuss you questions/concerns with other coaches and see what they say about how to reach your goals.  The point of this first marathon is to get through it feeling good and uninjured.  I think that is more important than setting a particular time goal. 

If you increase your distance, I recommend doing it on your week day runs (I wouldn't add more runs, but just increase the ones you do) but stay on the schedule for the long runs.  Those are the ones that really take a toll on the body.

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