General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Overtraining? Rss Feed  
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2004-03-12 6:56 AM

New user
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Edinburgh
Subject: Overtraining?
I'm hoping someone can give me some swim training advice. I was a competitive club swimmer up until I was 14, when I decided I'd had enough. Aside from a few triathlons when I was 17/18, I've not really done any swimming since (I'm 24 now). About 6 months ago I broke my back in a kiting accident and have been swimming for the last 3 months both to try to strengthen my back and just to get fit and back into swimming again.

Swimming was going really well until about a month ago. I had been improving quickly and was pretty happy swimming 2.5km in a session, 3 times a week. I had been feeling (relatively) strong and fit and was really enjoying swimming again. I swam a 3.2km session, including a 2km solid swim, then soon after went training with my local tri club. Although the session was short, it was mostly pull sets with paddles, which I hadn't been used to using.

The following week my swimming was terrible, and still is - my upper arms and shoulders felt sore after just a couple of hundred metres and I tired pretty quickly. I tried easier sessions but it didn't help. A total rest for a week helped a little then I went back to just 2 easy sessions a week and I'm back with sore arms and get tired very quickly. Right now I'm pretty wasted after swimming a 400m warm up!

Does anyone know what's gone wrong? Does this sound like overtraining? Could it be anything else? Any advice for what I can do? I also started getting back onto my bike about a month ago, would this have any impact on my swimming?

It is incredibly frustrating to be going so well and just have it crumble like that. Very annoying.

Thanks a lot for any help,

Mark Somerville


2004-03-12 8:24 AM
in reply to: #12021

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Subject: RE: Overtraining?
I'm no expert Mark, but I'm going out on a limb and saying that I think your body is telling you it's not ready for what you are doing. They key to that is the fact that you are recovering from a serious injury. You may think you feel recovered, but your system is trying to protect itself here. I was involved in a motorcycle accident 3-1/2 years ago. I sustained the following injuries: broken collarbone, 3 cracked ribs, cracked pelvic bone, severely dislocated and broken thumb that nearly had to be detached and surgically put back into position (it's still not perfect). Physically I felt I was "healed" after 2 months or so, but my wife will tell you that this accident affected me both physically and emotionally for over a year.

I'd go slow, listen to your body talking back to you, and realize that it may mean a long slow healing and rebuilding process. Fortunately you have age on your side. I'm 55 and things heal a lot more slowly now.

Max
2004-03-12 9:40 AM
in reply to: #12021

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Subject: RE: Overtraining?

Hey Mark,

You're already doing something right here.  You are paying attention to the fact that your body feels different and you are trying to figure out why and how to fix it.   Like Max says, your back injury may be part of the problem.  Iinjuries take time to heal.  Moreover, the rest of the body became deconditioned while you were recuperating.   You need time to adapt to an exercise regimen again.   Full-blown overtraining where the body is cannibalizing itself is probably not what you have.   Fatigue from not fully recovering from a couple of really hard workouts seems plausible.  It sounds like you bumped the intensity and the distance in the last few workouts.   The usual advice here is to take a day off until your body feels pretty normal, then resume at a lower intensity to make sure that swimming feels good again.  You say you are already doing this.  Give it some time.  You might want to check your temperature.  You could have picked up a bug (mononucleosis is the disease you want to be aware of here).

Some other things to watch out for. 

1)  Aggravating the back injury.  You know where that hurts.  Back injuries are nothing to fool around with.  Get good medical advice if your back hurts or you feel some tingling or numbness in the extremities. 

2)  Working out too hard too often.  You need a hard workout once or twice a week and it will result in some general achiness.  When done just right, it is a good achiness.  It feels more like a warmth or glow that actually feels good.   If you do too much, you are going to feel so sore so that it affects your sleep and makes you look funny when you walk (more a problem for runners actually.)  You need to make up for the hard days with some easy days to give the body time to adapt to the increased stress.

Many people report that the morning heart rate is the thing that they can monitor to detect oncoming fatigue.  For me, that is not effective.  I find that other things affect the morning heart rate (like knowing a stressful presentation is coming up) more than the fatigue effect.  I use a little stress test. I run up one flight of stairs to my office every day.  On a normal day, the heart rate rises so little I hardly notice. If  I am due for a rest day, I can feel my heart pound for a minute at the top of the stairs.  I know how if feels from experience not from any particular BPM.

Keep your swimming going.  You'll be glad you worked through this.

TW 

2004-03-12 10:53 AM
in reply to: #12036

New user
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Edinburgh
Subject: RE: Overtraining?
Hi Max, thanks for replying.

That could well be all it is. What's confusing/annoying me is that I was swimming really well about a month ago. I wouldn't have thought that things could be getting worse the more my back improves. I too am no expert though, and this could well be the case. Perhaps it is a combination of that and getting back on my bike too.

Any other thoughts?
2004-03-12 11:11 AM
in reply to: #12021

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Master
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Subject: RE: Overtraining?
I was a victim of overtraining last year, and what happened was that I didn't build a base properly prior to doing intense workouts. It sounds like you were building your base doing longer and slower workouts when things were going well in the pool. If you weren't adding the extra bike workouts then, your body probably was happily adapting to the amount of stress involved. Paddle workouts are very intense!! They increase the force and work level, and from my understanding are not recommended unless you have a very solid base training level intact. If you were adding biking on top of this, and you are recovering from an injury, your body may be telling you to rest more.
I found that right before my body crashed, I was feeling wonderful! I had so much energy to devote to workouts! I didn't realize my adrenal glands were overproducing cortisol (gives you energy and the "push" you need for workouts) before they crashed and were underproducing (giving me muscle weakness, fatigue and frustrating workouts). Your adrenals may be stressed already from your accident and recovery, so try to give them a break. Mine were stressed because I have allergies. I found that reading info about adrenal stress and fatigue on the internet to be helpful, if that is what you think might be happpening to you.
Best of luck through this frustrating time....
Jen
2004-03-12 11:21 AM
in reply to: #12021

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Subject: RE: Overtraining?
Are you feeling the same tiredness after other things like running or cycling? Is it a general lethargy throughout the day, even though you're not exercising? If not, I doubt very much that it's over-training. If you leave a workout feeling excited about getting to do it again the next day, that's what you want to shoot for. There's no better gauge than to listen to your body's signals. If it's just swimming that is the problem, do a workout that you can complete without feeling run down, no matter how short it is and don't increase the time or intensity until your body feels like it can handle it. Trying to push through pain barriers sounds heroic, but usually ends up giving you bad results.

My main exercise philosophy is "If you feel like you could keep going when you quit for the day, you probably did just the right amount."

Max


2004-03-12 11:53 AM
in reply to: #12066

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Subject: RE: Overtraining?
keepitup - 2004-03-12 10:11 AM
  • ..It sounds like you were building your base doing longer and slower workouts when things were going well in the pool.

  • ..I had so much energy to devote to workouts! I didn't realize my adrenal glands were overproducing cortisol (gives you energy and the "push" you need for workouts) before they crashed and were underproducing (giving me muscle weakness, fatigue and frustrating workouts). Your adrenals may be stressed...

  • ..Mine were stressed because I have allergies. I found that reading info about adrenal stress and fatigue on the internet to be helpful, if that is what you think might be happpening to you.


  • I too have been going through similar with my workouts. This is very interesting to read about the adrenal glands as it never occured to me that this could be a cause for my rapid fatigue in the water. I will do some checking on the internet on this. Meanwhile, if you have any additional information or links to website, could you post it here?

    Peter
    2004-03-12 11:58 AM
    in reply to: #12066

    New user
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    Edinburgh
    Subject: RE: Overtraining?
    Hi TW.

    tech_geezer - 2004-03-12 2:40 PM

    Fatigue from not fully recovering from a couple of really hard workouts seems plausible.  It sounds like you bumped the intensity and the distance in the last few workouts.   The usual advice here is to take a day off until your body feels pretty normal, then resume at a lower intensity to make sure that swimming feels good again.  You say you are already doing this.  Give it some time.



    Sounds pretty reasonable. I've had a few weeks of trying to swim through it with easy sessions, but things aren't improving.

    Jen - sounds like a similar sort of thing to me, a lot of what you said makes sense to me. I had been swimming really well before things went so wrong. How long did it take for your body to sort itself out?

    My current thinking is to have a full week or two off swimming (I'm wanting to get fit, but not hurting myself is the priority!) while still biking and take things from there. Hopefully that'll give my muscles plenty of time to sort themselves out and I can still maintain some degree of fitness on the bike.

    Does this sounds like a sensible plan?

    Max - seems to only really be swimming, I'm certainly not tired during the day or anything like that.

    Thanks for the help everyone, it's appreciated.
    2004-03-12 12:47 PM
    in reply to: #12021

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    Master
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    Subject: RE: Overtraining?
    Mark,I agree with everyone about listening to your body. It sounds like its telling you something. But it can be frustrating when you're doing so well and then you seem to not just stall but go backwards. It sounds like your body is telling you to take it easy. You might be just trying too hard. Give it a rest for about one week and see how it goes. I recorded my fasted 800 m ever AFTER I took three days off. So hang in there. Plateaus can be reached but you have to get to the top of them to reach them if you know what I mean. Ovetta.
    2004-03-12 1:35 PM
    in reply to: #12094

    New user
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    Edinburgh
    Subject: RE: Overtraining?
    I'm starting to think at least one week of rest is what I need.

    Do you guys think I should stop all training for a while, or just swimming?
    2004-03-12 1:56 PM
    in reply to: #12021

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    Master
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    Subject: RE: Overtraining?
    It depends on how your body feels. But it's good to take a rest week from all training once in a while!


    2004-03-12 3:30 PM
    in reply to: #12021

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    Master
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    Subject: RE: Overtraining?
    Mark,

    I had to take about a month off of training entirely, but I was letting the overtraining go on way too long (about 5 months in fact). This sounds corny, but I knew I could get back to it when my motivation came back. When I was tired/burned out I couldn't care less about training or fathom the thought of working hard. I hope this feeling hasn't happened to you. It's a learning process, that's for sure!

    Peter,
    I would recommend checking out www.adrenalfatigue.org as a link. It is a sort of advertisement for a book, but it had some interesting information.

    Hope this helps,
    Jen
    2004-03-12 4:02 PM
    in reply to: #12021

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    Subject: RE: Overtraining?
    there is some great advice and info on this thread. i'll add my own little thought on it. i can relate so well with that feeling of progression followed by an immediate collapse. my inexperience led me astray into that dreaded OT. or at least i think. it's hard to tell or gauge because it's individual. but i started enthusiastically to train after recuperating from surgery and enjoying the quick progress i didn't listen to my body. i worked through pain and fatigue, but stiil achieving goals until it all crumbled. i noticed in my swimming first; couldn't make the distance, couldn't keep straight. then my running; same thing, couldn't make the distance or sustain the speed. i took off for several weeks, but it was very hard. one key thing to look at is your enthusiasm level, if it declines, you definetly need a rest. it doesn't sound like you've reached that stage, you're lucky! fortunately you're young and you are listening to your body. i cant' tell you if what you got is the beginning of OT i'm not qualified, but i thought i should share what i experienced it sounded so familiar. cheers mark, hang in there, and i hope you get through it. i'm sure you will. russell.
    2004-03-14 6:29 PM
    in reply to: #12021

    New user
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    Edinburgh
    Subject: RE: Overtraining?
    My general motivation is still pretty high, which sounds like a positive sign. Seems like I've under-estimated how much my injury and surgery has taken out of me and have just got back to it too hard too soon.

    Resting isn't the sort of thing I find easy, but I think I might even take a couple of weeks off. I'm not exactly at peak fitness and I really want to let my body sort itself out before I get back to it.

    I really appreciate the replies and personal experiences, they've definitely helped me get my head round what's happening and have given me confidence that these things do sort themselves out.

    Mark
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