I love my gas guzzling V8 truck (Page 3)

It's not about winning.  I have no issue with you expressing your opinion.  However you cannot state a "fact" like that and not expect to be asked to back it up.  I think that's fair.

Its evolved a long ways from this photo, but I've always loved the "aero oxymoron".

http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/photos/show-album.asp?albumid=8330&photoid=67715

Kristen, I know of some good offroading areas that you can take a stock cherokee and have a blast.

Just becuase a truck is heavier and less "maneuverable" does not mean it will get in more accidents.  Most people who drive larger vehicles realize this and leave more room, brake sooner, accelerate slower etc...

You statement is pure conjecture. I'm just asking you to back up your assertion that large vehicles get into more accidents than smaller ones.  Otherwise it's just opinion.

I'm not the one who made the statement.  You did.  It's not up to me to prove your argument.

So you are saying that the ONLY factor is braking is mass?  That's incorrect.

Here is a chart I found in about 5 seconds of searching...

The colt (the lightest of all the cars) had the worst stopping distance... Also notice the Lincoln (larger than the Nissan) has better stopping distance.

---edited to remove snippyness---

 is that the AEV kit I'm always drolling over when i'm in the bathroom at work work reading my quadratec catalog?

 I'm on my third wrangler right now

OK fair enough...

I'm not going to argue that a BMW is going to stop slower than a truck.  I'm just saying there is a LOT more to it than mass. 

Where?

Nope, its a scrambler.  Thats how it looked when I first got it.  Its come a long ways from there.  It was a bit of a basket case.  Its riding a lot lower now, but its way more flexible.

I've seen some of the aev brute stuff in person and its nice.

Wow - I guess I'm not surprised by all the drama in here.

For the record, I love my big SUV and I have it primarily to tow my beloved boat, which gets less than 1 mile per gallon when we're really hauling azz.

I am currently shopping for a lightly used Suburban built on their 3/4 ton platform as a tow vehicle upgrade.

I had a project about a year ago on discussing the the safety "advantages" of SUVs and large vehicles. Basically, SUVs and large vehicle owners, like the OP, have the mentality that they ARE going to get into an accident and it is inevitable, thusly, they are buying into an automobile that emphasizes what's called passive safety - the idea of protecting the driver and occupants upon an accident - not preventing it.

Smaller cars convey the idea of active safety, focusing on not getting into an accident in the first place. Being more agile, being able to brake harder, having more control in sketchy situations, etc. It's all deeper than how I'm simplifying it, but basically - why prepare yourself for an accident when you can avoid it? Not all crashes are avoidable, but many are preventable.

But I've been in this world long enough that it is very hard, if not impossible, to convince others to try and see things in another light, and am not trying to force anything on anyone, including the OP. I've given up on that a very long time ago. Just for the record, I do not own a car of my own, commute by bicycle, and recently got a motorbike. If I could only have one of the two, it would easily be the bicycle. I guess I sound like a monumental hippie now, but I've been a motorsport enthusiast for a long time, and if I had to chug gas like it was going out of style like an SUV, I would happily take a modern GTO with the six litre.

edit: I forgot to mention that I acknowledge the convenience of large vehicles for towing and off roading, though

I'm not sure how big the drivers are would affect vehicle safety, unless they are so fat/tall/muscular that braking performance is adversely affected. But, thinking about it, if a really large dude is driving and the vehicle's suspension can't compensate, it could contribute to rollover accidents.

Also, how do you know how big the OP is?

I think that is a rather broad and generalized statement.  My big truck handles 10x times better than some of the eco-boxes I have driven as rental cars.

I did not buy my truck with the mentality you said above.  However I did make sure I bought a safe vehicle in the event something did happen.  If you are not thinking about the possibility of a wreck then you are being shortsighted.

This assumption requires something that isn't always true... that the driver knows how to drive, and that the driver is always situationaly aware.  Does joe-blow driver know how to accelerate through a high speed swerve?  Even if he does, will that be his instinct reaction?  Probably not.  Chances are he will lock the brakes and skid, at which point his fancy handling car is worthless.  The thing about accidents, is that they are preventable, but how many people have the reaction time to make a difference.

IMHO,  if you really want to be a safer driver, go to a driving school that includes track time and actually learn how to handle a car

Well done.

You've placed safety high on your list of priorities, and to me, it seemed that safety was defined by you as holding up well in the event of a crash, not the prevention of one. If that's the case or not, it's not a big deal, as I'm not trying to change the way you see things. I will admit though I'm not in the know of trucks, and I know Toyota has had a performance version of their Tundra out at one time, so your truck may be a better performer than most SUVs. It sounds like your vehicle is more stable and balanced than an SUV, so I have no statements to make. I agree with you on not thinking about wrecking is a bad idea, but on the other hand, focusing too much on wrecking can be just as shortsighted as well.

You speak the truth about driver skill - I wish an HPDE or something of the sort would be mandatory for drivers, but I know that won't be the case, if ever, for the US. That said, I'm not trying to make a blanket statement that all SUV drivers are bad and all small car drivers are always safer drivers. Drivers in both camps are all over the place. But when you take that average inattentive driver who's going to lock up the front at the first sign of trouble and throw him into either camp, I'd rather see a coupe or family sedan sliding into me than a three ton Escalade.

edit: I think that last line brings me to some closure - in the end, I'm not in here to make up anyone's mind about what car to drive, and I guess I really don't care, as long as you don't somehow involve me in it. (ie crashing into me, being an idiot around me, or driving an H2, now that's no good) That said, it was nice discussing with you guys, but since I'm not here to argue, disrespect anyone, or get chummy about SUVs and large vehicles (not drivers ), I'll take my leave.

FWIW, my suburban was nimble enough to avoid getting t-boned today.  She didn't even look back.  The funny thing is, I immediately thought of this thread. 

And since this is a tri forum, I was on my way to swim.