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2009-07-28 5:19 PM
in reply to: #2115456

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread

Wow.  I see that everyone is still arguing/complaining about that dastardly dangerous bike course.  A few things:

1)  Andysrc:  The reason why I got upset that I had yelled at a TNTer is because it was a fellow TNTer.  I am also a TNTer. :-D  So I was basically yelling at a teammate (one I had never met - TNT is so big), which is not kewl at all!  Like I said though, TNT for this race was huge. They could not drag people and make them go to all of the meetings/trainings they provide.  And frankly, I agree with John Korff (RD) that it is not so much a TNT issue as a beginner tri person issue.  TNT does an excellent job of educating its people as to race etiquette, etc.  I raced my first race with them and knew all of the bike safety rules. They were almost always pointing out bike safety almost every training.  I mean often, even before we would go out on a ride, we had to listen to another lecture about bike safety and biking in a group, etc.  The TNT coaches are fantastic and really care about the safety of their athletes.  However, like I said - that is for people who actually go to all of the trainings.  Like with any team, training with TNT is a time investment. They train all week with a very specific detailed training schedule.  However, they cannot drag people from their homes and make them go to the trainings and attend the information meetings.  If I go to an open water swim training and 150 people are there and I know that there are 400 people in TNT for the NYC Tri, then that translates into 250 people missing a training right before the NYC Tri!

But it is just not kewl to yell at your teammates.

Please stop bashing TNT. TNT does an excellent job of training, educating, sending out loads of materials, etc.  Perhaps you can say - those with TNT who care not to actually train, attend the education sessions, etc. are causing problems.  TNT is an excellent team with excellent coaches, but like any team, not everyone goes to the team sessions.  I could join any of the New York City teams - like Team Lipstick, etc. - and not go to their trainings, and then on Sunday, wear Team Lipstick's colors and totally not comply with USAT rules because I did not go to the trainings provided all week by Team Lipstick.  It would be unfair to say - look at Team Lipstick - their people are clogging up the road and causing crashes.  While there are plenty of folks on Team Lipstick not clogging up the road and causing crashes, including some of their beginners who were diligent, invested their time and attended the trainings.

I think it is easy to bash TNT because there were SOOOO many this year and I think it is the largest NYC Tri team they have ever had.  So ya - you saw purple and said - okay yea - it's TNT.  But let me tell you there were more than purple people clogging up the Henry Hudson.  There were many newbies doing so - not just some of the TNT newbies.

2)  I agree that this is not a race for newbies.  I started triathlon just this year (started training in November 2008).  NYC Tri was my third this year.  I am so grateful for that!  The logistics ARE complicated!  When I told my triathlete friends at my church that I wanted to start doing triathlon and wanted to do the NYC Tri, they strongly encouraged me to NOT do the NYC Tri as my first tri.  And although they were not personally with TNT, they encouraged me to join TNT so that I would get training and know how to race.  TNT provides excellent training all week long by excellent coaches, but again, I went to almost everything offered.  I read the USAT guide.  I came on here and started hanging out with you folks and read the boards.  My first race was, thank God, on the California wide open roads.  NYC Tri is a fast, hot (and fun) race.  But the logistics are very cramped - just the two transition areas alone - and the bike back into them - and the narrow roads - and the combination of the fast and slow bikers near killing each other.. well ya.  I am really grateful I listened to my church tri friends last year.  I do not think it is much of a newbie race.  But then what is a newbie race?

I passed two crashes and one of my TNT friends (experienced) crashed because, she said, it looked like a fast biker trying to pass her skidded on the wet painted portions of the highway.  Thankfully, she was "okay" - as in she could get back on the bike despite road rash.  She said the guy who plowed into her did not make out so well.  Poor guy. :-(

So here we have a large number of beginner bikers on a wet road, not accustomed to USAT rules, on a congested logistically 'interesting' course.  I am so grateful to God that I finished well! And I really really really enjoyed myself and had a blast and ended up praying a lot for people I passed who crashed.  I already am thinking about how to improve my time for next year on this course!  Great fun fast ride! 

Maybe we can reflect on just how much fun we had.  Like, can I start something - what was your favorite part of the race?  (Mine actually was the bike.. even though I got stuck behind a lot of slow people - biking on the Henry Hudson was gorgeous!)

dbw27









Edited by dbw27 2009-07-28 5:23 PM


2009-07-28 6:03 PM
in reply to: #2115456

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
Random question - I really want one of the shiny NYC 2009 tri-tops that were on sale at the expo and the finish, does anyone know if you can still buy them?
2009-07-28 6:15 PM
in reply to: #2313707


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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
dbw27 - 2009-07-28 5:19 PM

Wow.  I see that everyone is still arguing/complaining about that dastardly dangerous bike course.  A few things:

1)  Andysrc:  The reason why I got upset that I had yelled at a TNTer is because it was a fellow TNTer.  I am also a TNTer. :-D  So I was basically yelling at a teammate (one I had never met - TNT is so big), which is not kewl at all!  Like I said though, TNT for this race was huge. They could not drag people and make them go to all of the meetings/trainings they provide.  And frankly, I agree with John Korff (RD) that it is not so much a TNT issue as a beginner tri person issue.  TNT does an excellent job of educating its people as to race etiquette, etc.  I raced my first race with them and knew all of the bike safety rules. They were almost always pointing out bike safety almost every training.  I mean often, even before we would go out on a ride, we had to listen to another lecture about bike safety and biking in a group, etc.  The TNT coaches are fantastic and really care about the safety of their athletes.  However, like I said - that is for people who actually go to all of the trainings.  Like with any team, training with TNT is a time investment. They train all week with a very specific detailed training schedule.  However, they cannot drag people from their homes and make them go to the trainings and attend the information meetings.  If I go to an open water swim training and 150 people are there and I know that there are 400 people in TNT for the NYC Tri, then that translates into 250 people missing a training right before the NYC Tri!

But it is just not kewl to yell at your teammates.

Please stop bashing TNT. TNT does an excellent job of training, educating, sending out loads of materials, etc. 



I wasn't trying to bash TNT, I'm sorry I gave you that impression.  I saw plenty of people in purple following the rules and being responsible racers.  My point, and I probably didn't explain this very well, was this:  you felt bad for yelling at a teammate to follow the rules.  Rules that were put in place for safety.  I don't care if it was TNT or Joe's Triathlon and Beer Drinking Team.  People should follow the rules.  I think I would be particularly interested in making sure my teammates followed the rules because I wouldn't want them to give my team a bad name.

An outsider might be irritated by the attitude of "I'll yell at some random racer to follow the rules, but if it's someone on TNT I'll let it slide because we're teammates."  Especially if there are 400 members of that team  (it makes the lone racer feel like they're really up against it).  I understand you wanted to be supportive, but you gave the impression that you thought it was ok if someone from TNT broke the rules - but maybe you just meant you would have been nicer about asking them to move to the right.

I don't think you need to attend several lectures or clinics to follow the rules.  Just do what you (and I) did - read the darn rules before you sign up!  I don't think it's TNT's responsibility to make people do that.  It is the racer's responsibility.

So like I said, I don't blame TNT for any of the problems, I blame people who didn't read and understand the rules - TNT or not.

But to reflect on something positive... my favorite part of the race was biking in from the last turnaround.  I was most worried about the bike and swim so I knew at that point I was going to finish and I was feeling good!
2009-07-28 6:16 PM
in reply to: #2313707

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
dbw27 - 2009-07-28 6:19 PM

Maybe we can reflect on just how much fun we had.  Like, can I start something - what was your favorite part of the race?  (Mine actually was the bike.. even though I got stuck behind a lot of slow people - biking on the Henry Hudson was gorgeous!)

dbw27



Best request i have read yet,

I was inspired everytime i passed or was passed by a Para-Triathlete, on their tandoms, the girl peddaling her butt off with one prosthetic, to the wheel chair athlete that blew by me on the run, that i had to yell out to the runners in front that did not see him to clear his way. The guys and gals that handle these incredible athletes for the sake of watching their athlete complete something soo very very impressive. That to me kept me moving forward, kept the adreneline flowing and my feet moving. It is a sight and experience i will not soon forget, gratefully to have been a part of...


edited to only clean up blank space



Edited by Rudedog55 2009-07-28 6:18 PM
2009-07-28 7:28 PM
in reply to: #2115456

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
My favorite part was watching my volunteers cheering their a$$es off even though it was humid and they'd been standing in the same spot since 7am. Did anyone notice Morgan? She was the thin brunette in the NYC tri top about halfway down the long descent at the north end of the park. She was jumping up and down, ringing her cowbell, waving her flag and cheering for every single person that passed. She started with Greg Bennett and didn't stop until the Dfl guy was out of sight. They shoulda given her a medal, too. She wasn't the only one, either. It isn't easy to put a smile on the face of someone who's at hour 3.5 of a tough race, but she and the rest of the volunteers somehow kept it up all day long.
2009-07-28 9:07 PM
in reply to: #2313786

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
philjlee - 2009-07-28 7:03 PM Random question - I really want one of the shiny NYC 2009 tri-tops that were on sale at the expo and the finish, does anyone know if you can still buy them?


They still had 2008 gear at the expo so I'm guessing they will be selling the 2009 gear after as well, maybe on the web site? If you email them I'm sure they will help you, they are incredibly responsive.


2009-07-28 9:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
I saw Morgan! I agree. She deserves a medal.  I couldn't believe a volunteer could be so enthusiastic - at least not since the rather drunk Cal-Poly volunteers at Wildflower in May (boy were THEY enthusiastic.)

Morgan was inspiring - she was like the energizer bunny with a flag. :-D

Anyway, yes the volunteers (except for the ones handing out food at the end) were so encouraging - it was fantastic!  :-D

They make me want to volunteer - maybe for Toughman this year.

dbw27
2009-07-29 7:02 AM
in reply to: #2314162

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
Seconded - the volunteers must have been nearly as tired as the competitors after jumping up and down for five hours! (I can just imagine volunteering and then finding the next day that my arms were sore from ringing a bell all day.)

I do wish that some of the spectators who were on 72nd St could have headed over to Harlem Hill instead though, that would've made that bit a lot easier. I tried to thank as many people as I could but there were so many that it was hard. It's not every day I get to high-five a policewoman!
2009-07-29 8:42 AM
in reply to: #2115456

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
I do want to add that for those of you who had to stay in a hotel for the race and will be doing this race again, that The Milburn is a GREAT hotel to stay in. Its on 76th and Broadway, making it extremely close to transition. They even have a 25 meter 3 lane pool a block away that you can have free access to.

http://www.milburnhotel.com/
2009-07-30 7:16 AM
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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
vrljc - 2009-07-29 8:42 AM

I do want to add that for those of you who had to stay in a hotel for the race and will be doing this race again, that The Milburn is a GREAT hotel to stay in. Its on 76th and Broadway, making it extremely close to transition. They even have a 25 meter 3 lane pool a block away that you can have free access to.

http://www.milburnhotel.com/



wow cool... thanks Jon.. maybe for next year ..
2009-07-30 9:21 PM
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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
Hi!

I notice in the email that John Korff (RD) sent out today that next year, due to feedback, they plan:

Ride on the right or go home in a sag wagon!

:-)

GREAT!  He listened!  It was like a war zone out there.  (I still had a blast and am already thinking about how to improve for next year.)

dbw27


2009-07-31 9:34 AM
in reply to: #2311689

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread

Hi - I have to agree that my first impressions were great and it is only now that I reflect on everyone's posts that I start to question it a bit. This is my second time doing NYC and it is the only tri that I have ever done. I think I changed my mental outlook a  bit once the rain came down on my way to transitions. Knowing NYC I knew there would be standing water and I should expect problems out on the course. I only really got stuck behind a slow group for the last 2 miles on the return. I took it as a sign to just relax and not try to force the pass. I maybe could have knocked a minute off, but did you see how many people were broken down all over the course. No pass is worth a crash. I think it helped me on my run to cool down a bit towards the end of the bike.

I love the race because I love NYC. I had to leave my vacaction near Lake Placid to drive down on Saturday to check in. I drove back up Sunday after the race and just got back today. I moved my vacation only to find the race day had changed from last year. I wouldn't do that again as I missed out on the underwear run and the chance to meet others from this group.

I did do well and knocked 10 min off my time from last year.(Overall: 2:42:36, Swim: 22:52, Bike: 1:21:49, Run: 48:25)  My fear is that I am switching to the 45 group next year. If this means that I am going to go late and have more issues then I may have to reconsider doing the event only because of this and most of the people I do the even will still be in 40-44.

HOTEL: I stayed in the Lucerne on 79th and it was great. Easy walk to transition and back from the park.
http://www.thelucernehotel.com/

2009-07-31 5:08 PM
in reply to: #2319233

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
irsuss -- normally people stay on the right and pass nicely on the left.  Case in point, I spoke to a good friend at work yesterday who has historically done many many tris all over the world really (even in england) but has never done the NYC Tri.  When I told him how many crashes I passed, he said that in all of his tri life he had never seen anything like that - that indeed he had never even seen a crash with people bleeding, etc.

So, that is why people are saying what they are saying about the bike course.  The NYC Tri bike course was pretty unruly.

But I still had fun!! :-D

I decided something like you - "well, I'm stuck behind these slow people - matter as well drink some water."

:-D

dbw27
2009-08-03 5:25 PM
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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
Thanks.. we can always follow Rollerball Rules... Bet on Jonathan E.
Rollerball
2010-04-22 10:17 AM
in reply to: #2325210

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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
How gross is the water? Is it not dangerous?
2010-04-22 11:44 AM
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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
If you mean the water quality, no, it’s not dangerous. The Race Director for the NYC Tri could never, in a million years, get liability insurance if the water wasn’t safe to swim in, and he would never put on an event of this size without lots and lots of liability insurance coverage.

There are swimming events in the Hudson throughout the year—NYC Tri isn’t the only one.

The bottom is a little mucky, and there can be debris just like in any other OWS, but the water itself is fine.


2010-04-22 12:23 PM
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Subject: RE: Nautica New York City Triathlon : Official Thread
I raced last year.  Water wasn't bad.  It's salty due to the tides.  There's jetsam and flotsam (bits of driftwood, leaves), but I personally did not see trash or anything like that.  Read the previous posts -- lots of experienced racers warn everyone not to try and stand up when they get the pontoons at the end of the swim -- the silt at the bottom of the river at that point is black and gooey, and stays on your feet -- not comfortable and kinda gross.  When you get to the pontoons, there are a bunch of very helpful volunteers who grab your arms and help you out of the water (without you needing to stand up).

I have heard of some issues with algae in the past, but did not experience it myself last year.

If you're very worried about the water, I would suggest you go out on a kayak one of these weekdends -- there are free kayaks available along the River (google it); you could take one out and survey conditions for yourself.

Personally, I get fairly easily grossed out by dirty water, but I'd say the Hudson wasn't bad at all.  I've raced in worst (Raritan Bay -- Staten Island race).

I am set to race again this year.  I assume you're racing?  Good luck!

E.
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