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2009-09-09 9:21 AM
in reply to: #2393450

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2009-09-09 9:30 AM
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2009-09-09 9:33 AM
in reply to: #2396371

Champion
11989
500050001000500100100100100252525
Philly 'burbs
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
D.Z. - 2009-09-09 10:19 AM
Spokes - 2009-09-09 10:16 AM Next time, I'm voting Libertarian. That party is wacked too, but at least I won't be supporting the status quo.

Obama would be doing a LOT better if they stuck to 2 or 3 things rather than firing the policy shotgun in a zillion directions and doing nothing but scaring the geese, so to speak.

Camile Paglia pretty much hit it on the head on how I feel about the entire political mess we are in right now.

Neither party understands what a diverse and complex country this is... they simply want to impose their viewpoint on everyone else... instead of leaving people the hell alone Jefferson style.
I likely won't be voting libertarian, but I love your decision to vote 3rd party. Eventually, enough people will do and they will actually make a difference. Either the two existing parties will differentiate themselves a bit, or a 3rd party will really happen. Good for you Spokes - welcome to my side of the fence.


The more votes third (or fourth) parties get the more attention they get and the more "real" they become to the average voter. People sometime tell me I'm wasting my vote when I vote third party since the third party candidate has zero chance of winning. I see it as a way to raise consciousness.
2009-09-09 9:38 AM
in reply to: #2393450

Extreme Veteran
660
5001002525
Texas
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
My daughter watched it in her pre-k class yesterday and was scarred for life.  Being told to work hard and that an education is important....oh the horror!  I might have to get her counseling!

Just kidding.  I thought the speech was great.  She is almost 5 years old and I asked her about the speech after school.  She said she remembered that Obama said his parents didn't have a lot of money and he had to work hard. 
2009-09-09 9:41 AM
in reply to: #2393450

Expert
703
500100100
Colorado Springs
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
Welcome to the Libertarian Party, Spokes!  If all the people who claim to be "libertarians" voted that way, at worst, a clear message would be sent to the ruling elites of both "major" parties that we the people are sick of the status quo.
2009-09-09 9:59 AM
in reply to: #2394206

Extreme Veteran
785
500100100252525
Indiana
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
Sounds like the left had issues when the elder Bush did the same thing. I know, it's shocking that both sides are great at playing politics


Amen to that!!!


2009-09-09 10:16 AM
in reply to: #2396365

Master
2006
2000
Portland, ME
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
Spokes - 2009-09-09 9:16 AM
PennState - 2009-09-07 3:00 PM I have no problems with Obama's speech to the kids. I think he is doing a terrible job as president, but he was elected by a clear majority and I will respect him and the office for hopefully no more than 3.5 more years. Obama deserves my respect, even though I don't agree with much if any of his policy. *I* think the hysterical protests against his speech almost make me want to support the guy. Definitely brings back memories of the last president who I thought did a rather poor job as well...when the extremism of the attacks on Bush got worse... I was more drawn to support him. Attraction by being pushed away by opposing extremists. I won't watch the speech, or wed speech...not even interested, but as president *I* feel as though he is allowed to speak to school kids. I wish he was given more respect, and more civility...but truth be told I wished this for Bush much more so.


x2

The only reason McCain's not sitting in the Oval Office now was his VP choice, which showed a terrible lack of judgment.

BTW, I voted for Obama because I viewed him as the (somewhat) lesser of two evils.

In truth, there is very little difference between either party. They are run by lobbyists and corporations who play the game of ripping off the American taxpayer and people.

Next time, I'm voting Libertarian. That party is wacked too, but at least I won't be supporting the status quo.

Obama would be doing a LOT better if they stuck to 2 or 3 things rather than firing the policy shotgun in a zillion directions and doing nothing but scaring the geese, so to speak.

Camile Paglia pretty much hit it on the head on how I feel about the entire political mess we are in right now.

Neither party understands what a diverse and complex country this is... they simply want to impose their viewpoint on everyone else... instead of leaving people the hell alone Jefferson style.


Actually, Palin pulled McCain out from a very uninspiring campaign to leading Obama in the polls. Putting Palin on the ticket was  The Economic collapse and McCain percived failure to appropriately handle it with any sort of confidence was his downfall.

2009-09-09 10:33 AM
in reply to: #2396424

Master
2006
2000
Portland, ME
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
mrbbrad - 2009-09-09 9:33 AM
D.Z. - 2009-09-09 10:19 AM
Spokes - 2009-09-09 10:16 AM Next time, I'm voting Libertarian. That party is wacked too, but at least I won't be supporting the status quo.

Obama would be doing a LOT better if they stuck to 2 or 3 things rather than firing the policy shotgun in a zillion directions and doing nothing but scaring the geese, so to speak.

Camile Paglia pretty much hit it on the head on how I feel about the entire political mess we are in right now.

Neither party understands what a diverse and complex country this is... they simply want to impose their viewpoint on everyone else... instead of leaving people the hell alone Jefferson style.
I likely won't be voting libertarian, but I love your decision to vote 3rd party. Eventually, enough people will do and they will actually make a difference. Either the two existing parties will differentiate themselves a bit, or a 3rd party will really happen. Good for you Spokes - welcome to my side of the fence.


The more votes third (or fourth) parties get the more attention they get and the more "real" they become to the average voter. People sometime tell me I'm wasting my vote when I vote third party since the third party candidate has zero chance of winning. I see it as a way to raise consciousness.



Why not work for your local GOP or Dem party? You'd be surprised how much more influence in changing party policy you have volunteering from the inside then yelling from the outside.

For example, I am the GOP candidate recruiter for my city as well as the guy who is in charge of all the money. I am involved in picking 10 candidates for state office and I absolutely favor candidates that tend to agree with my brand of conservatism. Sure, I've attended 3rd party events like the State Libertarian Convention but just about any activist in the libertarian movement spends most of their activist time working for libertarian GOP candidates anyway. 

But my point is that it is incredibly easy to change the system from within at the grassroots level and impossible to change it from the outside.



2009-09-09 1:13 PM
in reply to: #2396365

Giver
18426
5000500050002000100010010010010025
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
Spokes - 2009-09-09 10:16 AM 

The only reason McCain's not sitting in the Oval Office now was his VP choice, which showed a terrible lack of judgment.



Or excellent judgement.

My theory is that the republicans, after the economy tanked, didn't want one of their guys in th ewhite house during the disaster. Better to let a dem flounder and not make any progress while the recession ran it's course. That way, after 3 years, they could say "look how f-ed up we are...we need change!

So...to tank the election, they nominated Palin for veep.
 
2009-09-09 2:25 PM
in reply to: #2393450

Master
2447
200010010010010025
White Oak, Texas
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
How does Obama's speech have anything to do with Palin?  McCain lost because he was a poor choice for President a great man but not a good choice and would not have gotten my vote with out Palin on the ticket.  But why do some of you feel the need to try to attack Palin even when the topic was a polite discussion on a good speech Obama gave?
2009-09-09 2:39 PM
in reply to: #2396614

Elite
4564
200020005002525
Boise
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
Jackemy - 2009-09-09 9:33 AM
mrbbrad - 2009-09-09 9:33 AM
D.Z. - 2009-09-09 10:19 AM
Spokes - 2009-09-09 10:16 AM Next time, I'm voting Libertarian. That party is wacked too, but at least I won't be supporting the status quo.

Obama would be doing a LOT better if they stuck to 2 or 3 things rather than firing the policy shotgun in a zillion directions and doing nothing but scaring the geese, so to speak.

Camile Paglia pretty much hit it on the head on how I feel about the entire political mess we are in right now.

Neither party understands what a diverse and complex country this is... they simply want to impose their viewpoint on everyone else... instead of leaving people the hell alone Jefferson style.
I likely won't be voting libertarian, but I love your decision to vote 3rd party. Eventually, enough people will do and they will actually make a difference. Either the two existing parties will differentiate themselves a bit, or a 3rd party will really happen. Good for you Spokes - welcome to my side of the fence.


The more votes third (or fourth) parties get the more attention they get and the more "real" they become to the average voter. People sometime tell me I'm wasting my vote when I vote third party since the third party candidate has zero chance of winning. I see it as a way to raise consciousness.



Why not work for your local GOP or Dem party? You'd be surprised how much more influence in changing party policy you have volunteering from the inside then yelling from the outside.

For example, I am the GOP candidate recruiter for my city as well as the guy who is in charge of all the money. I am involved in picking 10 candidates for state office and I absolutely favor candidates that tend to agree with my brand of conservatism. Sure, I've attended 3rd party events like the State Libertarian Convention but just about any activist in the libertarian movement spends most of their activist time working for libertarian GOP candidates anyway. 

But my point is that it is incredibly easy to change the system from within at the grassroots level and impossible to change it from the outside.





And sometimes you just need to overthrow the current leadership (in this case through elections). Personally I believe that the 2 party system is a large factor in why our government stinks.


2009-09-10 10:04 AM
in reply to: #2397231

Expert
1743
100050010010025
Glen Burnie, Maryland
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
CBarnes - 2009-09-09 3:25 PM How does Obama's speech have anything to do with Palin?  McCain lost because he was a poor choice for President a great man but not a good choice and would not have gotten my vote with out Palin on the ticket.  But why do some of you feel the need to try to attack Palin even when the topic was a polite discussion on a good speech Obama gave?


Good point.

I also think that Legislators are bad choices for the Executive Branch. JFK was the last person to become president from the Congress and that's been almost 50 years ago. I'm not a fan of Obama at all but I think his problems aren't from his politics but from his lack of basic executive experience. He's never held an executive position and didn't even serve a full term in the US Senate.

Just my 2 cents.
2009-09-10 11:02 AM
in reply to: #2396614

Elite
3022
20001000
Preferably on my bike somewhere
Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
Jackemy - 2009-09-09 11:33 AM

mrbbrad - 2009-09-09 9:33 AM
D.Z. - 2009-09-09 10:19 AM
Spokes - 2009-09-09 10:16 AM Next time, I'm voting Libertarian. That party is wacked too, but at least I won't be supporting the status quo.

Obama would be doing a LOT better if they stuck to 2 or 3 things rather than firing the policy shotgun in a zillion directions and doing nothing but scaring the geese, so to speak.

Camile Paglia pretty much hit it on the head on how I feel about the entire political mess we are in right now.

Neither party understands what a diverse and complex country this is... they simply want to impose their viewpoint on everyone else... instead of leaving people the hell alone Jefferson style.
I likely won't be voting libertarian, but I love your decision to vote 3rd party. Eventually, enough people will do and they will actually make a difference. Either the two existing parties will differentiate themselves a bit, or a 3rd party will really happen. Good for you Spokes - welcome to my side of the fence.


The more votes third (or fourth) parties get the more attention they get and the more "real" they become to the average voter. People sometime tell me I'm wasting my vote when I vote third party since the third party candidate has zero chance of winning. I see it as a way to raise consciousness.



Why not work for your local GOP or Dem party? You'd be surprised how much more influence in changing party policy you have volunteering from the inside then yelling from the outside.

For example, I am the GOP candidate recruiter for my city as well as the guy who is in charge of all the money. I am involved in picking 10 candidates for state office and I absolutely favor candidates that tend to agree with my brand of conservatism. Sure, I've attended 3rd party events like the State Libertarian Convention but just about any activist in the libertarian movement spends most of their activist time working for libertarian GOP candidates anyway. 

But my point is that it is incredibly easy to change the system from within at the grassroots level and impossible to change it from the outside.





I plan to work for party, eventually. But that doesn't preclude me from being able to comment (and criticize) the current system.

Edited for clarity and because the original response may have come off as disrespectful when it wasn't meant to be.


Edited by D.Z. 2009-09-10 11:03 AM
2009-09-10 1:24 PM
in reply to: #2398827

Member
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Subject: RE: Obama's "controversial" speech. Take two...
I heard these points were taken out of the first draft after the Republicans complained.

- If you skin your knee or have trouble with your homework, just remember that it is Bush's fault
- Rich children should be taxed by poor children on the playground
- Good children report on parents who disagree with the president


The Republicans suggested this point be inserted instead.

- Children need to work extra hard to be prepared for the crushing debt the president plans to dump on them
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