Stage 15 *spoilers* (Page 2)

I was under the impression that you stop for the yellow jersey and don't attack on a mechanical issue to take over the tour. Then again we are talking about AC here. I think he was getting a little scared that Andy was going to match any accelration he can put together so I am sure he saw that as his chance to win the tour. I hope AS can come back but it will be hard.

Apparently the favored status of the yellow jersey is no more.

I can think of at least 3 times in the past decade where racers specifically refused to attack the yellow jersey after a crash or mechanical. This time we see the #2 rider attack as the yellow jersey comes to a stop in front of him.

Watching AC get booed at the yellow jersey ceremony seemed to sum it up. How does anyone flash a victory sign (the pistol in this case) as half the crowd is booing you?

After reading several notes on all of this (hear and elsewhere) I know feel even more vindicated in my dislike of AC.  It does seem there are several historical references of waiting for the yellow jersey.  Definitely some sportsmanship lost today.  What is everyone's thoughts on 3/4 DM and SS going along with it? Aren't they also at fault for going with AC like they did?

Well, first off...chapeau to TV...gutsy ride.

This year's Tour just keeps laying down the drama, huh!!!

I'm really torn on AC attacking. I would actually prefer to see Andy in yellow in Paris, but this is a really tough call. With Menchov and Sanchez there does AC have the influence to get everyone to wait, or does he wait on his own? Did he realize what was going on? It's just a really hard one for me to come down on one side or the other. Was it actually Andy's fault, rider error as opposed to true mechanical? You can see him shifting just as he loses the chain. But I doubt AC knew it,  if this was the case.

I think a truly confident Contador would have waited.

They definitely deserve some of the blame, but they also aren't the ones gaining yellow today. As the defending champion, if AC had slowed, it is likely that DM and SS would have stopped as well. The defending champion is seen as the leader on the road, much like the yellow jersey, and is generally given respect as such.

In recent examples, it was Ulrich or Armstrong that slowed the group when a major contender went down.

I understand everything about waiting and sportsmanship etc etc.,...but that doesn't make it right.

Maybe the etiquette should change.

Is the Tour really about who is the better cyclist?

Seems to me there are many many things beyond who is the best cyclist that go into a victory.
Team
Equipment
Tactics....etc etc

Schleck had no teammates there to give him a bike...that's a HUGE part of this equation. Team strength is paramount in the Tour...no one can win without a good team...except maybe Lemond ; )

You can say whatever you want about AC and sportsmanship...but this is a race. So there is NO WAY someone can say what he did was wrong. The point is to win the race...not make friends *( although that can be argued in cycling as being an a$$  can cost you if everyone gangs up on you later in the race or in other races. ) AC obviously just wants to win. He proved that last year by throwing team orders out the window and he proved it today....

Also, it has to absolutely tell you that AC is scared of Schleck. If he thought he had Schleck handled, no way he takes off like that.

Edited by Fastyellow 2010-07-19 12:50 PM

So many rules.....(unwritten).

Either it's a gentleman's sport.....or it isn't.  I thought it was.

It'll be interesting to see what the commentators have to say, when I watch the replay, tonight.  If AC was boo'd at the podium, that ought to tell you what the true fans think of his actions.

I'm not surprised he didn't wait.......not in the least.

If it was considered acceptable to attack in that situation, wou;dn't Contador have simply said that was what he did? Instead, he told reporters that he didn't know that Schleck  had a problem. Nevermind the fact that Schleck came to a complete stop in front of him, or that he would have heard over his radio less than a minute later that Schleck was having issues.


The fact he wouldn't say that it was a race and attacking while the yellow jersey had mechanical was okay means, in my opinion, that he knows that is wasn't. Instead we get a hald baked excuse about not knowing.

I NEED TO QUIT MY JOB SO I CAN WATCH THE TDF!

That said.... I saw this ^^^, and went to read the cycling blogs. So I know the results, if not the event leading up to them.

I'll wait until I watch it to comment more, but I'm thinking there will be no "Dolphin Vacation" this year:

I understand this, but I really start paying attention to the TdF when Ullrich stopped for Armstrong in 2003.  I don't know if it helped determine who was the better cyclist, but it was one of the coolest things I had ever seen in sport.

IMO, you can't use the excuse that "Part of being a champion is picking the right equip.".  They're both riding the same bike.

Cavendish did the "throat cut" hand signal IMMEDIATELY after Farrar abandoned.  He surely got a radio transmission, telling him (for him to act in that manner....which was fine).

AC knew (Andy had a mechanical).  He couldn't NOT know.

Edited by nc452010 2010-07-19 1:36 PM

I'm not an AC fan, I actually really want AS to win (actually REALLY wanted good ol'Cuddles but that's not to be) but when a "mechanical" occurs and is the fault of the rider (like dropping your chain on a shift) it is NOT the etiquette to wait for them. Crashing into fans that jump in front of your opponent (Uhlrich/LA), flats, things not due to the riders fault you do wait for.

Besides, Menchov and Sanchez were waiting for no one and they are only 2 minutes back and Menchov CAN time trial. Besides, AC did not take all that time out of him on the dropped chain, he also took about half of that with his much better descending skills.

I would LOVE to see AS come back but I do not blame AC at all (but I still hate his whole pistolero thing--did he do it at the end? I had to leave before the very finish).

I would have gained A LOT of respect for AC if he had waited, but I did not loose any for him when he didn't.

Just my opinion.

Cannot wait to hear what Lance has to say about this one

He didn't do it at the finish, but he did do it while being booed by half the crowd during the yellow jersey ceremony.

Some I've read:

Vaughters: (Twitter)
Hmmmm... Not sure what happened there, couldn't see from the car, but I hope no one attacked while there was a mechanical...

Kloden: (Twitter)
Bad luck for @andy_schleck He had technical problems. Was'nt à nice Move from Alberto on this moment. But this is cycling now :-(
it reminds you of the Stage 3. Saxo has also pool on the cobblestones as the fall at position 10 was :-(

Cadel Evans: (Twitter)
Tough #TdF stage: Mad fast start. Ale 3rd from the break. ASchleck had a very untimely mechanical-know how it feels ('09 Vuelta).

---

Cyclingnews interview with Riis: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/riis-preaches-calm-in-aftermath-of-...
Riis shrugged again. “I would have hoped he would have waited, and I think I would have waited... I think he did wait at the beginning but then it was a while before Andy was on the bike again.
“I don’t know. Was it possible for Contador to wait in that situation, with [Samuel] Sanchez [Euskaltel] and [Denis] Menchov [Rabobank] attacking? He has to follow those guys, for sure. He might not need to pull [with them] or attack, but he has to follow those guys.

.... [Riis] then suggested that Thursday’s stage, which finishes at the summit of the Tourmalet, would be the important one. “I think the Tourmalet in a few days is going to be decisive. If you attack tomorrow, you can be chased down.”

---

Craig Lewis (Versus Commentator):
http://www.versus.com/blogs/the-experts-opinion/stage-changes-gears...
While Andy was struck with a mechanical issue, Contador's move to claim the lead will no doubt be seen as disrespectful. It is an unwritten rule that when the yellow jersey crashes or has a mechanical problem, the riders neutralize the race until the issue is resolved. For some reason that did not happen in stage 15.
On the other hand, maybe a gentlemen's agreement had just been made between Schleck and Contador to not attack each other anymore on the Port de Bales, and Schleck violated that.....

---

Phil Liggett (Versus Commentator)
http://www.versus.com/blogs/2010-tour-de-france-and-cycling-events/...
"Never lose sight that the Tour de France is a professional sport and these athletes take part to win. Contador did nothing wrong."

My Race Log

Hm. I interpreted Cav's throat slash as a signal that CAV was toast. I had not interpreted it as having to anything to do with Farrar.

Well, no matter what, this Tour has been soooo AMAZING this year!

Yeah, the more I think about it, AC's move definitely leaves a bad taste in my mouth. I guess he should have at least tried to get Menchov and Sanchez to wait (although I wonder if they would have?).

Oh well, hopefully it inspires AS to really turn it on tomorrow and esp Thursday!

You know who the real loser today is: Poor Voeckler! The guy took an amazing win and no one evens talks at all about it. Totally forgotten in all this mess!


Edited by Karl Hungus 2010-07-19 2:07 PM

Lance Armstrong, other Tour riders, react to Port de Balès chain debate
http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/lance-armstrong-other-t...

LA isn't saying much.....

I don't think he could say much since he didn't see it all happen, and doesn't appear to have seen the images yet. If he jumped on one or the others side without seeing it, then he'd get ripped too. 

I was *sure* that L'Equipe would have Voeckler's face plastered all over its website. But no.... It's Contador in Yellow.
And under the picture of Contador, the caption reads:
"The Spaniard took power by taking advantage of a mechanical problem Andy Schleck at the end of a stage won by Thomas Voeckler."

And when you click the link, most of the article is about Contador/Schleck. There's a paragraph at the bottom about Voeckler.

http://www.lequipe.fr/

Great chain debate: Contador inherits yellow jersey
http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/great-chain-debate-cont...

To wait or not to wait — that was never the question when race leader Andy Schleck (Saxo Bank) dropped his chain on the Port de Balès in Monday’s wild ride over the Pyrénées.

Chivalry was not an option when the brutal attacks came 3km from the Balès summit in the heat of the battle in the final week of the Tour de France. Schleck dropped his chain and no one waited for him. There was no wave of the hands to slow the pace, no discussion among the attackers to wait for the yellow jersey.

.....

Whether or not Contador should have slowed the race for Schleck will fuel debate for the remainder of this Tour. Crashes, mechanical problems and punctures are part of any race, and there are no carved-in-stone rules on when riders should wait or simply let the race unfold.

......

Oh NOOO! That's criminal! Even L'Equipe abondons the French win for the tabloid story! Poor Thomas!

I was curious to know what the Spanish newspapers had to say about this, so I googled Madrid newspapers and selected one at random.
Here's the photo on the homepage:




But there is a debate going on at the Spanish newspaper too, and it includes a poll that asks if Contador should have waited for Schleck. The results so far:
20% - Yes
71% - No
9% - Unclear

http://www.elpais.com/global/

Well gee. I should have just waited for Velonews to summarize the results:

Polls: Spaniards support Contador’s attack (VeloNews.com readers do not)

There is a short article summarizing the Spanish polls --- and YOU can vote your opinion, too.

http://velonews.competitor.com/2010/07/news/polls-spaniards-support...

(Note: I haven't voted yet. I still haven't seen today's stage.)

I haven't seen any interviews with either Menchov or S. Sanchez about this. It would be interesting to hear their comments.....