General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others) Rss Feed  
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2010-09-15 12:26 PM

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Subject: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
Basically choosing between the Cervelo P1 and the QR Seduza and Felt B16.  From my LBS, the Seduza is the same price as P1, and the B16 a little more.

All fit me just fine, but I think I'm trying to gauge if it's worth going carbon or not (note:  Cervelo P2 is out of price range). 

Background:
-- Did triathlons in the past, getting back into them now.  Did IM distance on Cervelo P3SL (not carbon).
-- Probably doing nothing more than Oly (maybe in a few years I'd consider something more...don't think so though).

Never rode on carbon bike, and from what I hear the gains will be minimal as far as speed goes.  Will it be a more comfortable ride though?  I think I might like that, but since I'm doing shorter distances, not sure if it's too necessary. 

I'm also a little worried about breaking carbon.  In a few years I don't have to worry about some small crack propagating.  Or the frame getting soft.  I don't want to worry about mounting it in the transition area just right.  Are these fears worth having about carbon?  Rather not having the bike snap on me one day.

Anyway, thoughts?  Will I regret not getting carbon or will I <3 the Cervelo?


2010-09-15 12:45 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
Carbon may be a more comfortable ride; then again it might offer a more harsh ride.  Ride quality due to the frame is more due to the frame design as opposed to the frame material.  Tire selection and pressure will typically make more difference in how a bike feels than what material is used for its construction.

However, I wouldn't worry about breaking a carbon frame anymore than an alloy frame or it going soft on you.  The frame will likely (unless it is crashed) last for years; likely longer than the time it will take to develop new bikeitis.

Shane
2010-09-15 12:55 PM
in reply to: #3100244


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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
First, it is a myth that carbon bikes made this day and age are fragile, get soft or will crack and fail in a few years. If you get a carbon frame bike from a quality manufacture like the ones you mentioned there will be no issue. Cervelo has a life time warranty on their all their frames. There is a chance that an AL frame may crack from fatigue as well.

Second myth is that carbon always rides more comfortably then AL frame. It depends on the design of the carbon bike frame whether it is more comfortable then an Alum frame. Some carbon frames are as stiff as can be. The Cervelo P3 carbon is one of those bikes.

A Cervelo P1 is a well designed AL TRI bike and is a good value for the money. I am sure the others bikes are as well.

Edited by browncd 2010-09-15 12:56 PM
2010-09-15 12:55 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
I can tell you from experience that you should get the carbon. Last year I bought a Cervelo S1 aluminum. I rode it and loved it. The owner of the bike shop tried to get me to test a P2 at the time and I refused. This year I took him up on his offer to ride a P2. I bought it 2 days later and sold my S1. It will not make you faster. It will make you more comfortable. I can't believe the difference in ride quality between the two bikes. I used my wheels and tires on both bikes so this is not a factor in my decision.

Kevin  


Edited by chevy57 2010-09-15 12:58 PM
2010-09-15 1:27 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)

Don't forget that the components on each set-up make a huuuge difference in price and performance.

2010-09-15 1:57 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
jbjboc - 2010-09-15 3:27 PM

Don't forget that the components on each set-up make a huuuge difference in price



Definitely.

and performance.


I would suggest than any performance gain between 105/Ultegra/Dura Ace (or similar with SRAM or Campy) offer marginal performance improvements at best.

Shane



2010-09-15 2:03 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
Interesting.  

One other thing I liked about Cervelo vs for instance the Felt is that the saddle, aerobars, wheels etc, seemed superior because Felt's is Felt brand.  Are Felt brand components so bad that I'll want to change them?  Or is it still very usable?  It's just hard to tell being that Felt uses its own brand. 
2010-09-15 2:10 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
To the OP, there is some good, and some very bad advice floating around here.

I've been on both bikes you are looking at (the cevelo and QR), along with a whole host of other alum and carbon tri and road bikes.

I've been on great and terrible quality rides on both materials.

anyone that tells you that carbon or alum rides better/worse, i would instantly be very weary of what they say after that.

The two most comfortable bikes i have ever been on ride quality wise were alum.
The single stiffest frame was carbon.

You cant go wrong with either of those two bikes, but personally i would pick the cervelo.
I went from a QR frame (same as the seduza) to a P2sl (now the P1), and was faster right away.

but, again, they are both good bikes. get the one you like best and like the looks of.
2010-09-15 5:07 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
newbz - 2010-09-15 12:10 PM .... I went from a QR frame (same as the seduza) to a P2sl (now the P1), and was faster right away....



Interesting; What (do you think) made the Cervelo faster than the QR for you?  Not the aerodynamics of the bike- they're similar enough.  body position and comfort?
2010-09-15 5:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
a mix of body position and bike frame.

look at the two side by side, the P1 is paper thin compared to the QR.

2010-09-16 5:15 AM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)

trinado - 2010-09-15 3:03 PM Interesting.  

One other thing I liked about Cervelo vs for instance the Felt is that the saddle, aerobars, wheels etc, seemed superior because Felt's is Felt brand.  Are Felt brand components so bad that I'll want to change them?  Or is it still very usable?  It's just hard to tell being that Felt uses its own brand. 

You want to check with the shop and see how they handle swapping out parts when they do the fit.  Most shops will swap out vision bars or other brands because they can still sell them.  Stuff that has a bike brand on them is very hard for them to resell or reuse, so they might not give you a credit for that stuff. 



2010-09-16 7:50 AM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
For what it's worth...I went through the new bicycle purchase process. I was down to the P1 and the Seduza. Rode them both, before I went in I was really leaning towards the NAME Cervelo. I just personally associate Cervelo with bicycle more than QR. I ended up purchasing the 2010 QR Seduza because the test ride I took on them (over some not to great roads through an appartment complex by the bike shop, I was able to open it up a little) was a lot more comfortable, for me, on the QR. Their bike fitter (Vern) said I fit the QR better with my long legs and torso (I'm only 5'11" but I ride a L).

I've only ridden the bike a couple of times since getting it two weeks ago because I am training for a half-marathon right now. So I only ride it for XT. But, I am very pleased with my purchase (and 20% off year end sale made it even better).

Also, for what it's worth, Vern mentioned that Cervelo will be dropping the price of their P2 next year to compete in the entry level carbon market. Whether that means they are lowering the price on the same bike or lowing the components I don't know, but take it for what its worth.
2010-09-16 8:37 AM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
chevy57 - 2010-09-15 12:55 PM I can tell you from experience that you should get the carbon. Last year I bought a Cervelo S1 aluminum. I rode it and loved it. The owner of the bike shop tried to get me to test a P2 at the time and I refused. This year I took him up on his offer to ride a P2. I bought it 2 days later and sold my S1. It will not make you faster. It will make you more comfortable. I can't believe the difference in ride quality between the two bikes. I used my wheels and tires on both bikes so this is not a factor in my decision.

Kevin  


Sorry, but I had to point out that you are comparing the comfort of an aluminum road bike to that of a carbon tri bike. The difference in frame geometry is likely what made the difference in comfort, not the frame material.

To the OP, I have a P2sl (P1) and absolutely love it. That being said I do get the urge to buy a brand new carbon bike all the time. Mostly because the newer carbon biker usually look cooler than my bright yellow Cervelo. Luckily I have a smart wife who constantly reminds me that I can neither afford, nor do I need a new bike.
2010-09-16 8:45 AM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
shoverbj - 2010-09-16 8:50 AM For what it's worth...I went through the new bicycle purchase process. I was down to the P1 and the Seduza. Rode them both, before I went in I was really leaning towards the NAME Cervelo. I just personally associate Cervelo with bicycle more than QR. I ended up purchasing the 2010 QR Seduza because the test ride I took on them (over some not to great roads through an appartment complex by the bike shop, I was able to open it up a little) was a lot more comfortable, for me, on the QR. Their bike fitter (Vern) said I fit the QR better with my long legs and torso (I'm only 5'11" but I ride a L).

I've only ridden the bike a couple of times since getting it two weeks ago because I am training for a half-marathon right now. So I only ride it for XT. But, I am very pleased with my purchase (and 20% off year end sale made it even better).

Also, for what it's worth, Vern mentioned that Cervelo will be dropping the price of their P2 next year to compete in the entry level carbon market. Whether that means they are lowering the price on the same bike or lowing the components I don't know, but take it for what its worth.



I got the Roo too. Love it! Nobody had a P1 in my size around here anyway. I need to post some pjorn sooner or later.
2010-09-16 9:02 AM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
Go ride them. Pick the one you like the best. The ride quality is what's important, not the material, necessarily.

ETA: And it's carbon, not glass. If it can be made to handle mountain biking, it can be made to handle you putting it on the trainer or jumping on it in T1.

Edited by mmrocker13 2010-09-16 9:03 AM
2010-09-16 11:12 AM
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Subject: RE: Getting tri bike...carbon or no carbon (Cervelo P1 vs others)
I'll go on record as someone who used to ride a P2, crahsed and totalled it, and now ride a P1 (all components came over from the P2 except rear derailleur) and I cannot tell the difference.  I'm way faster on the P1, but that has nothing to do with the bike and everything to do with the engine.

I can tell you that the P1 with race tires/tubes (low crr) is WAY more comfortable than the P2 on stock tires/tubes. 


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