More guns... I mean control (Page 3)

Is there a huge trend of CCW holders stopping crime? Maybe I just haven't been seeing the stories in the paper about it.

Those stories usually don't make the news but if you look for them, pretty easy to find.

The only time the main stream media will make a big deal of them is when and if your scenario of innocent by-standers are injured.

ETA Here is an example of what I am referring to.

Is there a huge trend of CCW holders causing crime? Maybe I just haven't been seeing the stories in the paper about it.

Aarondb4 - 2012-12-14 10:39 AM

jmk-brooklyn - 2012-12-14 9:33 AM

bradleyd3 - 2012-12-14 10:21 AM

jmk-brooklyn - 2012-12-14 10:14 AM Take it easy. Turning this into Democrat vs Republican or "my kind of people vs your kind of people" is no way to have a civilized, intelligent debate, and is a good way to get the thread pulled.

A civilized, intelligent debate.....on CoJ???? Where have you been. Posting links isn't any of that. The Doc asked for sources, so in a quick google search, I found incidents where a CCW holder defused a situation by using force.

I liked to the wrong post. I was referring to the one below-- both yours and the one you quoted. QUOTE]bradleyd3 - 2012-12-14 10:11 AM

Aarondb4 - 2012-12-14 10:07 AM

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/07/mass-shootings-map

Anybody else notice that the killings on the map seem to be concentrated in blue states?

Solution, no guns for democrats!

Are you a citizen - yes Have you been convicted of a felony - no Can I run a background check - yes All clear....here's your gun. Wait...one last question - Democrat or Rebulican? Dem.....Why? Ohhh....sorry....no gun for you.

Perhaps you are not familiar with the sarc font. It indicates sarcasm or a joke. 

Cuz the papers are all owned by the Liberals...

http://www.newser.com/story/159029/man-accidentally-shoots-son-outside-gun-store.html

I doubt the man will be charged with "causing crime" - it is tragic and accidental. I don't know if he is CCW carrier. But the issue is not whether they are "causing crime". It is whether there is harm done.  

Even if there were an effective mental evaluation that could be implemented many people become mentally insane due to various things.  I know many workplace shootings are jealous husbands coming in to kill their wife and then take out a few more. 

I totally agree with you that there are accidents that happen and I'm sure if we googled long enough we could find an incident that matches your theory about a CCW holder hitting an innocent bystander.
I remember reading one a few months back of a CCW carrier adjusting his gun inside his waist band and it went off shooting himself in the femeral artery sitting in the minivan at the grocery store with the kids waiting for his wife to come out.  He bled out right in front of his kids.

The other side of it is that there are also people who are saved by having a CCW.  So if we 100% eliminated CCW for example we could eliminate the "accidents" but we would then have more deaths of people not being able to protect themselves.  I don't know what the numbers are on either side of it, but the point is there are pro's and con's to both sides of the discussion and each individual gets to decide which side of the fence they're more comfortable with.

CCW is WAY up, and the numbers are growing.

Violent crime is WAY down.  I have no idea if there is a correlation or not.....but it is what it is.

As Rooster Cogburn so eloquently said......"Fill your hands you SOB!!!"

I thought the discussion was about innocent by-standers being injured when CCW holders where interjecting themselves in an effort to subdue a bad guy committing a crime?

That didn't go anywhere......had to regroup and try again.

The problem you keep dancing around, and love to continually bring up, is that just the mere fact someone has a gun, is putting others at risk.

First... you are not getting rid of guns. Get over it, move on, next!

Second... there are risks in life. Always have been, always will be. Get over it. I take a risk getting in a car. I take a risk having surgery. I take a risk getting on a plane. I take a risk eating meat.

In any given day I run the "possibility" of dying at the hands of another by hundreds if not thousands of ways... regardless of how small the "possibility" is. I also have the risk of "possibly" killing myself through mistake by perhaps hundreds of ways... no matter how small that "possibility" is. And yes, just the mere fact that I have a gun at home opens me to a "possibility" that I might go home and shoot myself accidentally.... SO WHAT!

What is the PROBABILITY of any of those things happening, and what risks am I willing to take on? Feel free to oganize your own risk managment in your life. I will do the same in mine. But please stop throwing out endless "possibilities" when the fact is real life events are miniscule, and there are plenty other higher priorities that can be adressed.

My daughter works with children at the high school level that have basically this last chance to help improve themselves before going to jail.  She and her co-workers and high level staff have a lot of training on mental health, yet they still lost one of their co-workers how took his own life with a gun and with all the training, nobody saw it coming.  He was happy at work and around friends and showed no signs of any problems with mental health.  He left work on a Friday evening and was found the following day.  The signs are not always there. 

Do I agree that mental health is a big problem in the United States, yes, as my wife is a nurse and was working in the Mental Health field.  I don't know the fix, but I see a large percentage of her mental health patients as previous drug related problems also.  And that is very apparent in my youngest daughter's work also.  I won't even go into my older daughter's kindergarten class and how much drugs is a large part of that issue also.

I haven't read thru all of this thread but I'll throw my 2 cents in on the topic.  I don't own any guns, but was raised with them since I was a child.  My brother and I had a .22 rifle (a cutdown cricket) that we shot at the range when I was in 1st grade and my brother was in 3rd.  

There was a skewed news program (Dateline or 20/20) that hid a gun in a dresser.  Then then hired college kids to "accidentally" find it.  These college kids were terrified of it and didn't know what to do.  I was taught that the first thing you do is to check if it is loaded, even if somebody tells you it is unloaded.  People have had the idea that "Guns are Dangerous" drilled into their brains to the point that they believe it, then they have kids and tell them the same thing to perpetuate it.  

The latest shooting in CN is unfortunate, it will reinvigorate the the anti-gun advocates.  If there aren't any guns, a nutjob who has already decided to do this will just resort to a different weapon.  Google "School knife attack China"  each of those incidents (and there are several) had similar numbers of fatalities and casualties as the gun associated ones.  Will knives be the next controlled weapon?

Hey....look around....we've decided, as a community, to let the gun debate go for a bit, in light of today.  I realize you probably didn't see it......so now you know.

I'm afraid unfortunate won't cover this.....truly.  How can any parent look at what happened in NewTown, CT. today and call it "unfortunate".  I would be lost.

I don't believe anyone died in the knife attack on children in China although 22 were injured.  Have any of the children died of their injuries?  I can't find any information on this.

Interesting to have these two incidents happen back to back; it seems to show how similar things are all over the world.