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2013-07-30 1:38 PM

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Subject: TBTF
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-07-30/jpmorgan-7-billion-fines-j...

JPM has been fined over $7B over the last few years. But hey I'm sure their business is totally legit.

Date: April 2011

Amount: $56 million

Behavior: JPMorgan was one of several banks called out in a class-action lawsuit for overcharging or wrongfully foreclosing on active-duty military personnel. The company apologized, paid out $27 million in cash, cut interest rates on home loans and returned houses that were wrongfully foreclosed upon.
adual shift to inflation from deflation

Date: June 2011

Amount: $153.6 million

Behavior: The Securities and Exchange Commission sued JPMorgan for misleading buyers by allegedly failing to inform investors that a hedge fund assisted in picking and betting against securities in a collateralized debt obligation JPMorgan had sold in 2007. JPMorgan paid $153.6 million to settle the charges without admitting or denying the allegations.

Date: July 2011

Amount: $229 Million

Behavior: In response to a suit by federal and state authorities, JPMorgan settled allegations that it rigged the bidding process for reinvesting bond transactions that affected 31 state governments. The bank paid $229 million to settle the charges without admitting or denying the allegations.

Date: August 2011

Amount: $88.3 Million

Behavior: Talk about shady dealings. The Treasury Department alleged the banking giant violated sanction orders by conducting transactions with people or entities tied to Iran, Sudan, Cuba, and Liberia. JPMorgan Chase settled the charges and violations by paying $88.3 million civil penalty.

Date: February 2012

Amount: $5.29 Billion

Behavior: JPMorgan and four other major mortgage servicers agreed to pay a combined $25 billion to settle charges with state attorneys general, the Justice Department, and the Department of Housing and Urban Development relating to what Washington Attorney General Rob McKenna called years of “shoddy loan servicing, illegal robo-signing, and faulty foreclosure processing.” JPMorgan Chase’s share of the settlement came to $5.29 billion.

Date: February 2012

Amount: $110 million

Behavior: Along with Bank of America and a few smaller lenders, JPMorgan settled consumer litigation that claimed the banks processed checks by size—rather than by chronological order—so they could charge unwarranted overdraft fees.

Date: March 2012

Amount: $150 million

Behavior: After being sued by pension funds and investors for investing their funds in a risky structured investment vehicle that failed at the height of the global financial crisis in 2008, JPMorgan settled the suit without admitting wrongdoing.

Date: November 2012

Amount: $296.9 million

Behavior: The Securities and Exchange Commission charged JPMorgan with misleading investors about the quality of mortgages that underlay mortgage-backed securities it sold. The bank settled the charges without admitting or denying guilt.

Date: January 2013

Amount: Unclear

Behavior: Ten banks, including JPMorgan Chase, agreed to an $8.5 billion settlement with the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency and the Federal Reserve over “robo-signing” and other alleged abuses of the foreclosure process. The banks were to pay $3.3 billion to harmed borrowers and provide a combined of $5.2 billion in assistance in the form of principal reductions or mortgage modifications. JPMorgan Chase didn’t disclose its share of the settlement.

Date: March 2013

Amount: $100 million

Behavior: JPMorgan Chase agreed to return $546 million to former customers of MF Global Holdings, the investment firm run by former New Jersey governor Jon Corzine that collapsed in 2011. While it did not admit wrongdoing, JPMorgan had been threatened with a lawsuit if it didn’t return the cash that had been transferred from MF Global during the firm’s chaotic final days.

* * *

Today we can add the following:

Date: July 2013

Amount: $410 million

Behavior: FERC accuses JPM of manipulating energy prices. JPM "admitted the facts" it was charged with, but "neither admitted nor denied the violations." Instead of being shut down like Enron for engaging in essentially the same activity if to a more modest degree, JPM is fined $410 million or 0.4% of its annual projected revenue of just under $100 billion.


2013-07-30 4:48 PM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF

WoW!  Surprised

And nobody goes to jail, get's fired or loses out on a bonus check.

2013-07-30 5:53 PM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
2013-07-30 6:30 PM
in reply to: tuwood

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Subject: RE: TBTF

Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.

 

I see what you did there. Wink

2013-07-30 8:17 PM
in reply to: tuwood

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by tuwood

Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.


The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.
2013-07-30 8:41 PM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF

Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.

I genuinely wonder what the solution for crap like this is.  I'm seriously wondering if the DoJ needs to be split out from under the President.  Put in place a whole new body (call it the 4th branch of government) that gives the AG from each state an equal vote to pursue legal action on behalf of the federal government.  It's blatantly obvious that nobody in power from either party will ever be held legally accountable when they break the law.

It's so frustrating.



2013-07-30 8:43 PM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF

Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.

I have always been unaffiliated, but I finally registered Libertarian. I'll never vote for another (R) or (D) again.

I'm torn on Johnson. I agree with him on pretty much everything... but under the GOP, he will not acomplish a thing. The TEA party was assimilated, and I do not see the Libertarians taking over the GOP. I have no interest at all in a "rebranded" GOP with Johson as a figure head.

2013-07-30 8:46 PM
in reply to: tuwood

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by tuwood

Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.

I genuinely wonder what the solution for crap like this is.  I'm seriously wondering if the DoJ needs to be split out from under the President.  Put in place a whole new body (call it the 4th branch of government) that gives the AG from each state an equal vote to pursue legal action on behalf of the federal government.  It's blatantly obvious that nobody in power from either party will ever be held legally accountable when they break the law.

It's so frustrating.

Obama got elected on the financial meltdown, and then promptly filled his cabinet with Wall Street... ya, that should get the job done. Undecided

2013-07-30 9:29 PM
in reply to: powerman

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.

I have always been unaffiliated, but I finally registered Libertarian. I'll never vote for another (R) or (D) again.

I'm torn on Johnson. I agree with him on pretty much everything... but under the GOP, he will not acomplish a thing. The TEA party was assimilated, and I do not see the Libertarians taking over the GOP. I have no interest at all in a "rebranded" GOP with Johson as a figure head.

I've always been a registered Republican and I feel much the same way.  I've thought about registering Libertarian but the real elections here in Nebraska are in the primaries.  So if I was registered Libertarian I wouldn't get to vote out the worser (is that a word) Republicans.

I won't say I'll never vote R again, because I am intrigued by Both Rand Paul and Ted Cruz.  Yes they are R's but I'd say they're more Libertarian than Republican.  If they somehow managed to get through the primaries (I know, I can dream) then I feel they'd be very strong contenders to win and enact some change (how ever small it may be).

2013-07-30 9:41 PM
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Subject: RE: TBTF

They were fined $7B over the last few years?  Where did that money go?  If you need to ask why nobody is in jail or fired when that much money is being funneled out then you haven't been watching the "war on drugs" the last 2 decades.    Geez....if I could find some folks to rake that much money from every few years I'd make sure they stayed propped up too.  Laughing



Edited by Left Brain 2013-07-30 9:42 PM
2013-07-30 9:47 PM
in reply to: powerman

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.

I have always been unaffiliated, but I finally registered Libertarian. I'll never vote for another (R) or (D) again.

I'm torn on Johnson. I agree with him on pretty much everything... but under the GOP, he will not acomplish a thing. The TEA party was assimilated, and I do not see the Libertarians taking over the GOP. I have no interest at all in a "rebranded" GOP with Johson as a figure head.

I just switched from Independent to Librarian also. 

I feel the same way about the D&R,,,,, imo one wants to run towards Socialism/Communism the other is content with walking that direction.

Which reminds me of an old joke about the young bull and the old bull,,,,,, but I prolly shouldn't tell that here. 



2013-07-30 10:01 PM
in reply to: tuwood

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by tuwood
Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.

I have always been unaffiliated, but I finally registered Libertarian. I'll never vote for another (R) or (D) again.

I'm torn on Johnson. I agree with him on pretty much everything... but under the GOP, he will not acomplish a thing. The TEA party was assimilated, and I do not see the Libertarians taking over the GOP. I have no interest at all in a "rebranded" GOP with Johson as a figure head.

I've always been a registered Republican and I feel much the same way.  I've thought about registering Libertarian but the real elections here in Nebraska are in the primaries.  So if I was registered Libertarian I wouldn't get to vote out the worser (is that a word) Republicans.

I won't say I'll never vote R again, because I am intrigued by Both Rand Paul and Ted Cruz.  Yes they are R's but I'd say they're more Libertarian than Republican.  If they somehow managed to get through the primaries (I know, I can dream) then I feel they'd be very strong contenders to win and enact some change (how ever small it may be).

The President isn't going to fix anything, and any figure head the party puts up...is put there for that very reason.

It's the Legislature that needs to be fixed. And I do not see the Libertarian party taking over the Legislature. I don't see libertarian minded (R)s taking it over either. We need a much bigger melt down than what we have had for that to happen.... Fortunately, we are well on our way for that.

Ron, Rand and Gary are all Libertarians using the (R) to get elected. They are not going to change the GOP, and for them to accomplish anything, they need 250 more next to them. In the mean time, name recognition and money keeps the incumbent in office even though most Americans say they want term limits... yet every election they do not limit terms... complete silliness.

2013-07-31 8:43 AM
in reply to: powerman

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by tuwood
Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by tuwood Sounds legit to me.  I can't believe Bush would let this happen.
The amount of money involved in this is why no D/R is ever going to upset the apple cart.

I have always been unaffiliated, but I finally registered Libertarian. I'll never vote for another (R) or (D) again.

I'm torn on Johnson. I agree with him on pretty much everything... but under the GOP, he will not acomplish a thing. The TEA party was assimilated, and I do not see the Libertarians taking over the GOP. I have no interest at all in a "rebranded" GOP with Johson as a figure head.

I've always been a registered Republican and I feel much the same way.  I've thought about registering Libertarian but the real elections here in Nebraska are in the primaries.  So if I was registered Libertarian I wouldn't get to vote out the worser (is that a word) Republicans.

I won't say I'll never vote R again, because I am intrigued by Both Rand Paul and Ted Cruz.  Yes they are R's but I'd say they're more Libertarian than Republican.  If they somehow managed to get through the primaries (I know, I can dream) then I feel they'd be very strong contenders to win and enact some change (how ever small it may be).

The President isn't going to fix anything, and any figure head the party puts up...is put there for that very reason.

It's the Legislature that needs to be fixed. And I do not see the Libertarian party taking over the Legislature. I don't see libertarian minded (R)s taking it over either. We need a much bigger melt down than what we have had for that to happen.... Fortunately, we are well on our way for that.

Ron, Rand and Gary are all Libertarians using the (R) to get elected. They are not going to change the GOP, and for them to accomplish anything, they need 250 more next to them. In the mean time, name recognition and money keeps the incumbent in office even though most Americans say they want term limits... yet every election they do not limit terms... complete silliness.




I actually thought Ron Paul might be able to affect some change, but merely with his veto pen. He's shown in his career that he's okay with going against the grain. He's not running anymore, so it doesn't matter now. I don't think that Rand is cut quite fromt he same cloth, but I could be wrong.

In case you wondered, why yes they are too big to prosecute too.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/06/eric-holder-banks-too-big_...

"I am concerned that the size of some of these institutions becomes so large that it does become difficult for us to prosecute them when we are hit with indications that if you do prosecute, if you do bring a criminal charge, it will have a negative impact on the national economy, perhaps even the world economy," Holder said, according to The Hill. "And I think that is a function of the fact that some of these institutions have become too large."

2013-07-31 8:55 AM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF

Originally posted by JoshR  I actually thought Ron Paul might be able to affect some change, but merely with his veto pen. He's shown in his career that he's okay with going against the grain. He's not running anymore, so it doesn't matter now. I don't think that Rand is cut quite fromt he same cloth, but I could be wrong. In case you wondered, why yes they are too big to prosecute too. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/06/eric-holder-banks-too-big_...
"I am concerned that the size of some of these institutions becomes so large that it does become difficult for us to prosecute them when we are hit with indications that if you do prosecute, if you do bring a criminal charge, it will have a negative impact on the national economy, perhaps even the world economy," Holder said, according to The Hill. "And I think that is a function of the fact that some of these institutions have become too large."

I'm sorry, but that is complete rubbish. The Feds prosecuted J.P. Morgan and Rockefeller for God's sake! We broke up Ma Bell. We need to break up big oil. We need to break up big finance. And I'm sorry, but when you fill your cabinet with Chase, Morgan and Citi Corp, and then your AG says publicly they are too afraid to prosecute.... what's wrong with that picture?????

2013-07-31 9:12 AM
in reply to: powerman

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by JoshR  I actually thought Ron Paul might be able to affect some change, but merely with his veto pen. He's shown in his career that he's okay with going against the grain. He's not running anymore, so it doesn't matter now. I don't think that Rand is cut quite fromt he same cloth, but I could be wrong. In case you wondered, why yes they are too big to prosecute too. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/06/eric-holder-banks-too-big_...
"I am concerned that the size of some of these institutions becomes so large that it does become difficult for us to prosecute them when we are hit with indications that if you do prosecute, if you do bring a criminal charge, it will have a negative impact on the national economy, perhaps even the world economy," Holder said, according to The Hill. "And I think that is a function of the fact that some of these institutions have become too large."

I'm sorry, but that is complete rubbish. The Feds prosecuted J.P. Morgan and Rockefeller for God's sake! We broke up Ma Bell. We need to break up big oil. We need to break up big finance. And I'm sorry, but when you fill your cabinet with Chase, Morgan and Citi Corp, and then your AG says publicly they are too afraid to prosecute.... what's wrong with that picture?????




It's never going to happen. Just look at all of the financial power positions around the globe. Almost every major Fed is run by a GS or JPM guy. They are all in control of the massive pumping that's been going on for the last few years. It won't change until we actually let one of them fail when they do go down.
2013-07-31 9:41 AM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by JoshR
Originally posted by powerman

Originally posted by JoshR  I actually thought Ron Paul might be able to affect some change, but merely with his veto pen. He's shown in his career that he's okay with going against the grain. He's not running anymore, so it doesn't matter now. I don't think that Rand is cut quite fromt he same cloth, but I could be wrong. In case you wondered, why yes they are too big to prosecute too. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/06/eric-holder-banks-too-big_...
"I am concerned that the size of some of these institutions becomes so large that it does become difficult for us to prosecute them when we are hit with indications that if you do prosecute, if you do bring a criminal charge, it will have a negative impact on the national economy, perhaps even the world economy," Holder said, according to The Hill. "And I think that is a function of the fact that some of these institutions have become too large."

I'm sorry, but that is complete rubbish. The Feds prosecuted J.P. Morgan and Rockefeller for God's sake! We broke up Ma Bell. We need to break up big oil. We need to break up big finance. And I'm sorry, but when you fill your cabinet with Chase, Morgan and Citi Corp, and then your AG says publicly they are too afraid to prosecute.... what's wrong with that picture?????

It's never going to happen. Just look at all of the financial power positions around the globe. Almost every major Fed is run by a GS or JPM guy. They are all in control of the massive pumping that's been going on for the last few years. It won't change until we actually let one of them fail when they do go down.

A reset is coming. It's a house of cards.



2013-07-31 12:01 PM
in reply to: powerman

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by powerman

A reset is coming. It's a house of cards.




Like If we try a bail out on the 700+ trillion derivative market if it crashes.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevedenning/2013/01/08/five-years-afte...
2013-07-31 1:19 PM
in reply to: chirunner134

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by chirunner134

Originally posted by powerman

A reset is coming. It's a house of cards.




Like If we try a bail out on the 700+ trillion derivative market if it crashes.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevedenning/2013/01/08/five-years-afte...



That is what the Fed is supporting with QE, IMO.
2013-08-27 3:37 PM
in reply to: JoshR

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2013-08-28 7:13 AM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF

Originally posted by JoshR Looks like we can add another $6B to that. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-27/fhfa-said-to-seek-6-billio...

This crap makes me sick.  I have this hypothesis about the destructive effects of what I call the "everybody gets a trophy" mentality that's so prevalent in the US.  We raise our kids to "never fail" so it doesn't hurt their self esteem.  It also builds a sense of entitlement in our youth, that they deserve to be successful no matter how bad they suck.

Fast forward, and now this mentality is becoming more and more prevalent in our politics and in our country.  The economy and businesses can never lose, we HAVE to give them a trophy even when they suck.

Just like in sports, we learn and get better through adversity.  When you get your butt kicked in a game, you go back and work harder to get better.  The same goes with business, if you do something stupid and it hurts your business you learn from it and don't make that mistake again.  That mentality is lacking in today's business world because we can't have a company suffer, what about the "employees".

2013-08-28 9:10 AM
in reply to: tuwood

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by tuwood

Originally posted by JoshR Looks like we can add another $6B to that. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-08-27/fhfa-said-to-seek-6-billio...

This crap makes me sick.  I have this hypothesis about the destructive effects of what I call the "everybody gets a trophy" mentality that's so prevalent in the US.  We raise our kids to "never fail" so it doesn't hurt their self esteem.  It also builds a sense of entitlement in our youth, that they deserve to be successful no matter how bad they suck.

Fast forward, and now this mentality is becoming more and more prevalent in our politics and in our country.  The economy and businesses can never lose, we HAVE to give them a trophy even when they suck.

Just like in sports, we learn and get better through adversity.  When you get your butt kicked in a game, you go back and work harder to get better.  The same goes with business, if you do something stupid and it hurts your business you learn from it and don't make that mistake again.  That mentality is lacking in today's business world because we can't have a company suffer, what about the "employees".




My take is completely different. Wall St. is bribing DC so Wall St. can break the rules, make a few billion profit, then pay a small $100M fine while neither admitting nor denying guilt. Why wouldn't you take that deal?


2013-08-28 10:12 AM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF
2013-09-19 8:33 AM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Now we can add another $920M tot he running total for JPM and this time it even comes with an admission of guilt!

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-09-19/jpmorgan-chase-agrees-to-p...
2013-09-25 5:34 PM
in reply to: JoshR

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Subject: RE: TBTF
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-09-25/jpmorgan-mortgage-talks-sa...

Potential $11B settlement now just for JPM. This one is almost big enough to get their attention. I heard rumors the initial settlement number was $20B.
2013-09-26 3:16 AM
in reply to: tuwood

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Subject: RE: TBTF
Originally posted by tuwood

[This crap makes me sick.  I have this hypothesis about the destructive effects of what I call the "everybody gets a trophy" mentality that's so prevalent in the US.  We raise our kids to "never fail" so it doesn't hurt their self esteem.  It also builds a sense of entitlement in our youth, that they deserve to be successful no matter how bad they suck.



This has been a rant of mine since the '80s with "creative spelling" where teachers weren't allowed to deduct points for misspellings and incorrect usage.

Those kids grew up to initiate the no dodgeball, no score kept, everyone gets a trophy mindset.


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