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2014-09-03 3:16 PM
in reply to: jmk-brooklyn

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by dmbfan4life20
Originally posted by crusevegas

I wonder what the outrage would be and the media attention would be if instead of it being an old white guy getting killed by a police officer it was a young black child who was about to go to college?

The cop made a mistake, the cyclists and his family are the only one's paying the price and burdened with the results of the poor judgement of this officer actions.  

I think you are right in saying the cop made a mistake. After all, the cop is human, we all make mistakes. I think its wrong to assume the cyclist and his family are the only ones paying the price and being burdened with the results. Do you know the Officer? Do you know how he feels? Have you ever killed anyone before? I am sure the Officer is under a tremendous amount of grief, stress, regret and full of other emotions. He will have to live with this incident for the rest of his life and so will his family. All the attention, scrutiny and emotional baggage that comes with it. Just because he is a cop does not mean he is a cyborg, he is human and has feelings too and wears that badge 8hrs a day just like other people wear suits and ties to work. To think that because he has a badge and a gun he wont be paying the price for this incident is flat out wrong. I bet not a day will go by for the rest of his life where he won't think about this incident and I for sure would never want to carry around that burden.
I hate this argument, and you hear it all the time whenever a driver runs over a cyclist and escapes punishment, whether they're LE or not. Whatever remorse, stress, or whatever other burden the officer is feeling, it's nothing compared to what the family is going through and will continue to go through for the rest of their lives. That he feels remorse that his irresponsible action killed someone just means that he's not a soulless zombie. It should not exempt him from being punished for it. This isn't a case where a cop who feared for his life accidentally shot a kid with a toy gun in a split-second decision. This is a guy who did something that common sense says is a stupid idea--namely not looking where you're going while you're driving and killed someone. That he feels sorry for his actions is nice, but I doubt it's much of a comfort to the family of the innocent person he killed.

Courts are historically easy on people who kill other people with no intention to do so.  I get your point, but I'm on the side of the courts in these cases.....I don't care if it's LE or not either. I don't think prison is needed for those who kill accidently, or with no criminal intent.

Even if the Officer in this case is charged, it is MOST unlikely that he would ever see the inside of a jail cell, and that has nothing to do with him being a Police Officer.

You might as well get used to the idea, because it's not going to change any time soon. 

Don't get me wrong--I'm not saying he should go to prison. I'm just saying that I hate the "he'll have to live with the pain of what he did for the rest of his life" argument as if it somehow changes the outcome of his poor decison.

Well, the fact is, NOTHING changes the outcome of a poor decision.....but some poor decisions can have a profound affect on a person's life from what I have witnessed.  Some of those are much worse than a court can apply.



2014-09-03 3:22 PM
in reply to: dmbfan4life20

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing

Originally posted by dmbfan4life20
Originally posted by ChrisM

Sorry, this is more than a tragic mistake.  If you or I were texting while driving (I know it was on the MDC = functional equivalent of texting = taking your eyes off the road to write) we would be in jail for negligent homicide.  I'll leave the texts out but he was also in fact texting his wife in the 4-5 minutes prior to killing Mr. Olin.  There is NO reason that the officer could not have pulled over to respond on the MDC. 

So, as long as an officer of the law is doing it "within the course of his job," he is free to run over whomever he comes upon while writing on the MDC?  And it's just a tragic mistake with no legal consequence.

That does not sit well with me.  I have personally signed the petition to the DA to file formal charges.  Not sure it'll go anywhere.  Probably not.  But it's the right thing.

ETA - here is the DA's report

DA report on Olin

https://pvcycling.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/declining_prosecution.pdf

 

 

Just curious, do you know how many people have signed the petition??

I tried posting but was on a train.  Here's the link, just over 73,500 signatures as of now (sorry, the url link button isn't working)

http://www.change.org/p/l-a-county-sheriff-s-department-district-attorney-prosecute-deputy-andrew-wood-for-texting-while-on-duty-and-causing-the-death-of-attorney-milton-olin-jr

This is fairly local for me, and I and a number of folks I know have ridden here, so it's a little personal as well. HUGE bike lane

2014-09-03 3:25 PM
in reply to: jmk-brooklyn

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by dmbfan4life20
Originally posted by crusevegas

I wonder what the outrage would be and the media attention would be if instead of it being an old white guy getting killed by a police officer it was a young black child who was about to go to college?

The cop made a mistake, the cyclists and his family are the only one's paying the price and burdened with the results of the poor judgement of this officer actions.  

I think you are right in saying the cop made a mistake. After all, the cop is human, we all make mistakes. I think its wrong to assume the cyclist and his family are the only ones paying the price and being burdened with the results. Do you know the Officer? Do you know how he feels? Have you ever killed anyone before? I am sure the Officer is under a tremendous amount of grief, stress, regret and full of other emotions. He will have to live with this incident for the rest of his life and so will his family. All the attention, scrutiny and emotional baggage that comes with it. Just because he is a cop does not mean he is a cyborg, he is human and has feelings too and wears that badge 8hrs a day just like other people wear suits and ties to work. To think that because he has a badge and a gun he wont be paying the price for this incident is flat out wrong. I bet not a day will go by for the rest of his life where he won't think about this incident and I for sure would never want to carry around that burden.
I hate this argument, and you hear it all the time whenever a driver runs over a cyclist and escapes punishment, whether they're LE or not. Whatever remorse, stress, or whatever other burden the officer is feeling, it's nothing compared to what the family is going through and will continue to go through for the rest of their lives. That he feels remorse that his irresponsible action killed someone just means that he's not a soulless zombie. It should not exempt him from being punished for it. This isn't a case where a cop who feared for his life accidentally shot a kid with a toy gun in a split-second decision. This is a guy who did something that common sense says is a stupid idea--namely not looking where you're going while you're driving and killed someone. That he feels sorry for his actions is nice, but I doubt it's much of a comfort to the family of the innocent person he killed.

Courts are historically easy on people who kill other people with no intention to do so.  I get your point, but I'm on the side of the courts in these cases.....I don't care if it's LE or not either. I don't think prison is needed for those who kill accidently, or with no criminal intent.

Even if the Officer in this case is charged, it is MOST unlikely that he would ever see the inside of a jail cell, and that has nothing to do with him being a Police Officer.

You might as well get used to the idea, because it's not going to change any time soon. 

Don't get me wrong--I'm not saying he should go to prison. I'm just saying that I hate the "he'll have to live with the pain of what he did for the rest of his life" argument as if it somehow changes the outcome of his poor decison.

This.   If convicted of vehicular manslaughter (which would be the likely charge) he would get probation I am sure.

 

2014-09-03 3:48 PM
in reply to: ChrisM

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing

Originally posted by ChrisM

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by dmbfan4life20
Originally posted by crusevegas

I wonder what the outrage would be and the media attention would be if instead of it being an old white guy getting killed by a police officer it was a young black child who was about to go to college?

The cop made a mistake, the cyclists and his family are the only one's paying the price and burdened with the results of the poor judgement of this officer actions.  

I think you are right in saying the cop made a mistake. After all, the cop is human, we all make mistakes. I think its wrong to assume the cyclist and his family are the only ones paying the price and being burdened with the results. Do you know the Officer? Do you know how he feels? Have you ever killed anyone before? I am sure the Officer is under a tremendous amount of grief, stress, regret and full of other emotions. He will have to live with this incident for the rest of his life and so will his family. All the attention, scrutiny and emotional baggage that comes with it. Just because he is a cop does not mean he is a cyborg, he is human and has feelings too and wears that badge 8hrs a day just like other people wear suits and ties to work. To think that because he has a badge and a gun he wont be paying the price for this incident is flat out wrong. I bet not a day will go by for the rest of his life where he won't think about this incident and I for sure would never want to carry around that burden.
I hate this argument, and you hear it all the time whenever a driver runs over a cyclist and escapes punishment, whether they're LE or not. Whatever remorse, stress, or whatever other burden the officer is feeling, it's nothing compared to what the family is going through and will continue to go through for the rest of their lives. That he feels remorse that his irresponsible action killed someone just means that he's not a soulless zombie. It should not exempt him from being punished for it. This isn't a case where a cop who feared for his life accidentally shot a kid with a toy gun in a split-second decision. This is a guy who did something that common sense says is a stupid idea--namely not looking where you're going while you're driving and killed someone. That he feels sorry for his actions is nice, but I doubt it's much of a comfort to the family of the innocent person he killed.

Courts are historically easy on people who kill other people with no intention to do so.  I get your point, but I'm on the side of the courts in these cases.....I don't care if it's LE or not either. I don't think prison is needed for those who kill accidently, or with no criminal intent.

Even if the Officer in this case is charged, it is MOST unlikely that he would ever see the inside of a jail cell, and that has nothing to do with him being a Police Officer.

You might as well get used to the idea, because it's not going to change any time soon. 

Don't get me wrong--I'm not saying he should go to prison. I'm just saying that I hate the "he'll have to live with the pain of what he did for the rest of his life" argument as if it somehow changes the outcome of his poor decison.

This.   If convicted of vehicular manslaughter (which would be the likely charge) he would get probation I am sure.

 

Except he's not going to be convicted of anything because nothing he was doing is currently illegal.

2014-09-03 7:11 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by dmbfan4life20
Originally posted by crusevegas

I wonder what the outrage would be and the media attention would be if instead of it being an old white guy getting killed by a police officer it was a young black child who was about to go to college?

The cop made a mistake, the cyclists and his family are the only one's paying the price and burdened with the results of the poor judgement of this officer actions.  

I think you are right in saying the cop made a mistake. After all, the cop is human, we all make mistakes. I think its wrong to assume the cyclist and his family are the only ones paying the price and being burdened with the results. Do you know the Officer? Do you know how he feels? Have you ever killed anyone before? I am sure the Officer is under a tremendous amount of grief, stress, regret and full of other emotions. He will have to live with this incident for the rest of his life and so will his family. All the attention, scrutiny and emotional baggage that comes with it. Just because he is a cop does not mean he is a cyborg, he is human and has feelings too and wears that badge 8hrs a day just like other people wear suits and ties to work. To think that because he has a badge and a gun he wont be paying the price for this incident is flat out wrong. I bet not a day will go by for the rest of his life where he won't think about this incident and I for sure would never want to carry around that burden.
I hate this argument, and you hear it all the time whenever a driver runs over a cyclist and escapes punishment, whether they're LE or not. Whatever remorse, stress, or whatever other burden the officer is feeling, it's nothing compared to what the family is going through and will continue to go through for the rest of their lives. That he feels remorse that his irresponsible action killed someone just means that he's not a soulless zombie. It should not exempt him from being punished for it. This isn't a case where a cop who feared for his life accidentally shot a kid with a toy gun in a split-second decision. This is a guy who did something that common sense says is a stupid idea--namely not looking where you're going while you're driving and killed someone. That he feels sorry for his actions is nice, but I doubt it's much of a comfort to the family of the innocent person he killed.

Courts are historically easy on people who kill other people with no intention to do so.  I get your point, but I'm on the side of the courts in these cases.....I don't care if it's LE or not either. I don't think prison is needed for those who kill accidently, or with no criminal intent.

Even if the Officer in this case is charged, it is MOST unlikely that he would ever see the inside of a jail cell, and that has nothing to do with him being a Police Officer.

You might as well get used to the idea, because it's not going to change any time soon. 

Don't get me wrong--I'm not saying he should go to prison. I'm just saying that I hate the "he'll have to live with the pain of what he did for the rest of his life" argument as if it somehow changes the outcome of his poor decison.

Well, the fact is, NOTHING changes the outcome of a poor decision.....but some poor decisions can have a profound affect on a person's life from what I have witnessed.  Some of those are much worse than a court can apply.




Super. It'll never amount to a fraction of the pain of losing a husband/father because of one persons carelessness. He's getting off easier than the family, not to mention easier than the guy he killed. Maybe he can devote his life to making sure that others don't make the same mistake. That would mean more to me than just his being sorry.
2014-09-03 7:48 PM
in reply to: jmk-brooklyn

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by jmk-brooklyn
Originally posted by dmbfan4life20
Originally posted by crusevegas

I wonder what the outrage would be and the media attention would be if instead of it being an old white guy getting killed by a police officer it was a young black child who was about to go to college?

The cop made a mistake, the cyclists and his family are the only one's paying the price and burdened with the results of the poor judgement of this officer actions.  

I think you are right in saying the cop made a mistake. After all, the cop is human, we all make mistakes. I think its wrong to assume the cyclist and his family are the only ones paying the price and being burdened with the results. Do you know the Officer? Do you know how he feels? Have you ever killed anyone before? I am sure the Officer is under a tremendous amount of grief, stress, regret and full of other emotions. He will have to live with this incident for the rest of his life and so will his family. All the attention, scrutiny and emotional baggage that comes with it. Just because he is a cop does not mean he is a cyborg, he is human and has feelings too and wears that badge 8hrs a day just like other people wear suits and ties to work. To think that because he has a badge and a gun he wont be paying the price for this incident is flat out wrong. I bet not a day will go by for the rest of his life where he won't think about this incident and I for sure would never want to carry around that burden.
I hate this argument, and you hear it all the time whenever a driver runs over a cyclist and escapes punishment, whether they're LE or not. Whatever remorse, stress, or whatever other burden the officer is feeling, it's nothing compared to what the family is going through and will continue to go through for the rest of their lives. That he feels remorse that his irresponsible action killed someone just means that he's not a soulless zombie. It should not exempt him from being punished for it. This isn't a case where a cop who feared for his life accidentally shot a kid with a toy gun in a split-second decision. This is a guy who did something that common sense says is a stupid idea--namely not looking where you're going while you're driving and killed someone. That he feels sorry for his actions is nice, but I doubt it's much of a comfort to the family of the innocent person he killed.

Courts are historically easy on people who kill other people with no intention to do so.  I get your point, but I'm on the side of the courts in these cases.....I don't care if it's LE or not either. I don't think prison is needed for those who kill accidently, or with no criminal intent.

Even if the Officer in this case is charged, it is MOST unlikely that he would ever see the inside of a jail cell, and that has nothing to do with him being a Police Officer.

You might as well get used to the idea, because it's not going to change any time soon. 

Don't get me wrong--I'm not saying he should go to prison. I'm just saying that I hate the "he'll have to live with the pain of what he did for the rest of his life" argument as if it somehow changes the outcome of his poor decison.

Well, the fact is, NOTHING changes the outcome of a poor decision.....but some poor decisions can have a profound affect on a person's life from what I have witnessed.  Some of those are much worse than a court can apply.

Super. It'll never amount to a fraction of the pain of losing a husband/father because of one persons carelessness. He's getting off easier than the family, not to mention easier than the guy he killed. Maybe he can devote his life to making sure that others don't make the same mistake. That would mean more to me than just his being sorry.

Look, the remedy here is civil.  The ONLY way to get city govts., and hence Police Departments, to do away with Officers using in-car computers is to hit them in the pocket book.  There will be no criminal remedy, forget about it.  If you want your Officers to not have their heads buried in a computer then it has to be shown that these types of accidents will costs cities a great deal of money. 

This will happen again, it's a virtual surety if in-car computers keep being required to be used.  (It's money saver if you take safety out of it)  Less dispatchers, less Officers because they can stay "in-service" while they do reports, etc.  Once it becomes something that could cost more than it saves you will see a change.



2014-09-04 12:44 PM
in reply to: dmbfan4life20

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing

Originally posted by dmbfan4life20
Originally posted by crusevegas

I wonder what the outrage would be and the media attention would be if instead of it being an old white guy getting killed by a police officer it was a young black child who was about to go to college?

The cop made a mistake, the cyclists and his family are the only one's paying the price and burdened with the results of the poor judgement of this officer actions.  

I think you are right in saying the cop made a mistake. After all, the cop is human, we all make mistakes. I think its wrong to assume the cyclist and his family are the only ones paying the price and being burdened with the results. Do you know the Officer? Do you know how he feels? Have you ever killed anyone before? I am sure the Officer is under a tremendous amount of grief, stress, regret and full of other emotions. He will have to live with this incident for the rest of his life and so will his family. All the attention, scrutiny and emotional baggage that comes with it. Just because he is a cop does not mean he is a cyborg, he is human and has feelings too and wears that badge 8hrs a day just like other people wear suits and ties to work. To think that because he has a badge and a gun he wont be paying the price for this incident is flat out wrong. I bet not a day will go by for the rest of his life where he won't think about this incident and I for sure would never want to carry around that burden.

 

What I know is he can go home to his family the man he killed cannot.  His family can still spend time with him, the man he killed, his family cannot spend another moment with him. That's what I know.

It sounds like you are saying due to legislation that the officer has a license to kill. 

Do you know for fact the officer didn't run into him with intent and/or malice? I don't say this because he is a police officer, I say this simply because he is a human being charged with operating a motor vehicle and killing someone while he was doing so.

I personally am sick and tired of seeing cyclists being killed by motorists and NOT being held accountable for the killing that they do and the devastation to the family and friends that are left in the wake of, I didn't see him, he shouldn't have been on the shoulder of that road, bikes don't belong on the road and a thousand of other ignorant and irresponsible excuses. 

2014-09-04 12:49 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Officer will not be charged in killing

 

Originally posted by Left Brain

I fought on-board computers until I was just overwhelmed by younger and more "progressive" ideas and supervisors.  Hell, most of the new officers don't even know how to talk to people......they ride around with their windows rolled up, faces buried into their computers, running endless numbers of license plates and drivers associated with those plates.  Most of them couldn't discover an on view crime if it ran over them. (and unfortunately, because of the inattention it sometimes does)  I'll never get it......I became a cop so I could deal with people every day, not alienate myself from them. /rant

Thanks for fighting the good fight LB! Great post.

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