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Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance
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 2009-08-13 12:53 PM |
Member 33  Valdosta, GA |  Subject: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint DistanceLike the title says.. I need your help getting faster on the bike... A little background, I am pretty fit, although coming off knee surgery. Doc says that the pounding from run training needs to be limited to short 5k distance only from now. I am fine with that actually, so my goal is now to be a competitive age grouper at the Sprint Distance. I have no other goals at this point in respect to cycling other than being fast for 12-15 miles... (no century rides or bike races). I just want to get fast for the bike leg of the Sprint. I am better than avg in the water, avg to below on the bike 18mph for the 15 mile distance, and the run will be what the knee allows for... so I NEED the bike to be my strong point. Been training for about 9 months (no running for while though.. but still riding), I guess I have always simply went hard on the bike in training EVERY time out. I now know that this is not a necessarily the best idea. And I simply am not seeing any speed improvement doing it this way either. Hence my question to you guys. With this in mind.. My goal of being fast at 12-15 miles only Is there any reason/benefits that my training rides be 20, 25, 40 miles or more? Or do I need to focus on quality at the 12-20 mile range for most/if not all workouts? With an occasional weekend ride pushing distance. If I ride say 4-5 times a week, what would a good routine be? Any true TT or hard rides of 12 miles weekly, 2-3 rides with fast interval training incorporated within, and 1-2 recovery (depending on how legs feel) rides pushing a bit further distance (20-25 miles) but at very easy zone 2-3 HR? What do you advise? I am all ears for your suggestions. Edited by Crue4 2009-08-13 12:55 PM |
| 2009-08-13 12:58 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Veteran 253 Sarasota FL | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance I'm also very interested in this subject. |
| 2009-08-13 1:01 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Master 1927  Guilford, CT | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance What kind of terrain? All flat? If you are going to ride that many times a week, you should mix it up in my opinion. Intervals one day, steady state zone 4 one day, zone 3 "longer" ride one day (in your case 40 is probably a good number if you want to be able to hammer 15 hard), hill work would be nice too if you can find it...otherwise the intervals will be good for you. This is sort of my generic advice...to pretty much mix it up a little more. You need more mileage than what your logs say if you really want to get faster. My 2 cents...I'm not a coach though. Some of the others can probably be more constructive. |
| 2009-08-13 1:05 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Veteran 143 Longview | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance Honestly it sounds as though you have a very well thought out plan. If you are going to ride 4 times per week, I would attack it like this. 1. 20 mile hard ride (push the pace as hard as I can and still finish the 20 miles) 2. 20-30 mile Z2 ride (HR low and pace soft) 3. 15 mile TT (all out as hard as you can go for the full 15 miles) 4. 1 ride per week push the distance a little (30-50 miles) I have nothing scientific that says this is smart or works other than I did this over the last 6-8 months and I went from an average of 18mph to an average of 21mph. Bottom line you will get faster by riding but I do think you need a mix of long and short rides and a mix of hard to recovery pace. Good luck. |
| 2009-08-13 1:09 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Not a Coach 11473 Media, PA | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance Yes, you will benefit by riding more--including longer rides. You will also want to do some harder riding. Long intervals (mostly 2-3x 15-20min at a level you can just barely sustain through the session and, perhaps, the odd 12-15mi TT) would be your staple. But you'll also benefit by doing some shorter (say 4-6 x 4-6min intervals) ones at a higher effort level. Essentially you will work on your VO2max with these and your threshold with the longer ones. Other rides build your endurance while not 'shelling' you the way these sessions can. With 4-5 rides per week, I would do one or two of these interval sessions and then longer rides with the others. Those may be 'easy' recovery rides or 'mid-level' rides that require you to 'push' but not 'dig deep'. The problem you likely have with your training is that going 'hard' every time, means that you are not going as hard as you need to be to make new adaptations. But never going easy enough to allow yourself to recover so that you can go harder. |
| 2009-08-13 1:31 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Expert 1116 Thornton, CO | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance What has helped me tremendously is doing hill climbs. Twice a week I go for a 12 mile ride, it's out and back, but it's 6 miles uphill on the way out. Granted I'm in CO, so it's 1500ft vertical in those 6 miles, but perhaps you can find something similar near you, in terms of a steady uphill for 5-10miles (it doesn't need to be 5.5% grade like here). But I have found that these uphill workouts have translated to faster flat rides. Since my muscles became used to having no choice but to push hard to go uphill no matter what gear I'm in those days, I'm able to push hard when that wind resistance begins to show itself around 20+mph. Since the muscles are used to sustaining that uphill push where it's so hard to spin for 30minutes without a break it has translated to being willing and able to push a much harder gear when on the flats since 12-15miles will only take about the same 30minutes. I'm also not a trainer, but this has worked for me. I just don't see a huge difference between pushing hard uphill or pushing hard on the flats, except that uphill doesn't allow you to easy off without a drastic change in how hard those gears feel. So that makes flatter sections feel 'easier' and allow me to still push hard on the rollers. oh... one more thing... keep pushing hard gears on the downhills until you're out of gears, if you're used to 30 minutes of pushing hard from training, then do the same in the races, even if it's a downhill... it'll just help you get farther up the next uphill with less effort anyway. |
| 2009-08-13 1:46 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Extreme Veteran 669 Olathe, Kansas | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance Crue4 - 2009-08-13 12:53 PM Like the title says.. I need your help getting faster on the bike... A little background, I am pretty fit, although coming off knee surgery. Doc says that the pounding from run training needs to be limited to short 5k distance only from now. I am fine with that actually, so my goal is now to be a competitive age grouper at the Sprint Distance. I have no other goals at this point in respect to cycling other than being fast for 12-15 miles... (no century rides or bike races). I just want to get fast for the bike leg of the Sprint. I am better than avg in the water, avg to below on the bike 18mph for the 15 mile distance, and the run will be what the knee allows for... so I NEED the bike to be my strong point. Been training for about 9 months (no running for while though.. but still riding), I guess I have always simply went hard on the bike in training EVERY time out. I now know that this is not a necessarily the best idea. And I simply am not seeing any speed improvement doing it this way either. Hence my question to you guys. With this in mind.. My goal of being fast at 12-15 miles only Is there any reason/benefits that my training rides be 20, 25, 40 miles or more? Or do I need to focus on quality at the 12-20 mile range for most/if not all workouts? With an occasional weekend ride pushing distance. If I ride say 4-5 times a week, what would a good routine be? Any true TT or hard rides of 12 miles weekly, 2-3 rides with fast interval training incorporated within, and 1-2 recovery (depending on how legs feel) rides pushing a bit further distance (20-25 miles) but at very easy zone 2-3 HR? What do you advise? I am all ears for your suggestions. I am not a coach. But you can enjoy this week: VO2max 5x3min(3min) Z5a-b Threshold 30min Z4-5a continuos Long ride 2hrs, upper Z2 Force 4x6min(2min) Z4 cad 65-70 |
| 2009-08-13 2:19 PM in reply to: #2346665 |
| Member 33 Valdosta, GA | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance acumenjay - 2009-08-13 2:01 PM What kind of terrain? All flat? If you are going to ride that many times a week, you should mix it up in my opinion. Intervals one day, steady state zone 4 one day, zone 3 "longer" ride one day (in your case 40 is probably a good number if you want to be able to hammer 15 hard), hill work would be nice too if you can find it...otherwise the intervals will be good for you. This is sort of my generic advice...to pretty much mix it up a little more. You need more mileage than what your logs say if you really want to get faster. My 2 cents...I'm not a coach though. Some of the others can probably be more constructive. Thanks, sadly I live in "flat" south GA so only a few rollers which I would hardly call hills. I agree that I need to push fitness by increasing distance more than I have. I have just gotten back to riding on road so my current milage is low, but just coming off knee surgery, I am progressing. Thanks for the input, that is good advice. |
| 2009-08-13 2:22 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
| Member 33 Valdosta, GA | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance Lots of good advice guys and exactly the type of info I was looking for. Thank you all again. |
| 2009-08-13 3:34 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Veteran 237 Buffalo Grove | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance Everyone has their own ideas as to what works and I will give you mine. I will say this, I have a very good bike. My last 70.3 I had the 4th fastest bike in the 40 - 44 age group. I can average 23 to 25 MPH for a half (depending). So I am not the best but I am not bad either. Anyway, I would say quality over qantity. No need to throw in a bunch of Junk Miles. Intervals are good for speed. This is true for bike just like the run. You can do some 2 mile all out with 2 minutes of rest. Or some 5 mile sprints followed by a few minutes rest. The number depends on your level of fitness. A typical early season intercal workout will be: 8 Mile warmup 4 x 1 mile ALL OUT w 1 minute rest 2 x 2 mile ALL out w 1 minute rest 4 x 1 mile out all w 1 minute rest 4 to 8 mile cool down You can adjust as you want. Maybe a few 20 to 40 mile rides at a good pace. Not all out but not slow. If you want throw in a long ride once a week. |
| 2009-08-13 3:39 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Veteran 237 Buffalo Grove | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance I forgot one thing. CADENCE. I am a big believer in keeping your cadence between 90 RPM and 105 RPM (usually around 95 for me). |
| 2009-08-13 3:47 PM in reply to: #2347103 |
Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance gshtrisport - 2009-08-13 3:39 PM I forgot one thing. CADENCE. I am a big believer in keeping your cadence between 90 RPM and 105 RPM (usually around 95 for me). Works for some, doesn't work for others. No proof that there is an "ideal cadence range." |
| 2009-08-13 3:57 PM in reply to: #2346643 |
Veteran 237 Buffalo Grove | Subject: RE: Help me get faster on the bike for Sprint Distance Well if you look at most "pro" riders they ride with a high cadence. There are a group of people that "hammer" on the bike and for that small set of riders that can work for them. But over the years the one thing that I have learned is that Most (not all) successful riders use a high cadence and you will find this supported on most cycling discussons. |
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