login
OK, so HR zone question
-
No new posts
|
 2009-10-28 7:15 AM |
Extreme Veteran  425  |  Subject: OK, so HR zone questionSo everything I am reading makes me believe my HR is too high during my runs. Let me state right upfront that I do not feel "out of breath" during my runs at all which makes me think my pacing is fine. I just started this month trying to work on my runs and have dropped my average heartrate from mid 160s to 150s. The thing is I keep reading that it should be morelike 140s?!? I am new at this so I am trying to do it right but I cannot see myself running with my heart rate that low. My long run right now is 8 miles (just upped it this week) and my other runs are just short of 4 miles. The weird thing is my HR is the same for both distances. Am I not "pushing" enough on my shorter runs? I am seriously considering getting a coach but thought I would throw this out there. I have a HIM and an IM next year and do not want to blow up on the run... OK, go ahead...fire away.... |
| 2009-10-28 7:20 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
Regular 88 spokane | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question This wont answer your question but I am in the same boat as you. All online heart rates say I should be around 150. But when I run no matter how long I am right around 165. I don't really feel out of breath wether I am running 4 miles or my max 9 miles. Hope you figure it out so I can read your responses. |
| 2009-10-28 7:24 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
Veteran 210 | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question You should be able to take your age from 180 and that would be the top end of your aerobic zone then subtract 10 to find the lower end. I am 30 so my zone would be 140-150. There are a lot of factors that could affect his though. If its really hot your hr will jump up. I know mine does. I think you would want to be at the low end of your zone for a HIM or IM. That is my plan at least LOL. |
| 2009-10-28 7:25 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question dewcubs - 2009-10-28 7:15 AM I keep reading that it should be morelike 140s?!? . Then stop reading.  If what you're reading is based on a formula (220-age is common), then it's likely wrong. Do a search here for the protocol for doing a lactate threshhold heart rate (LTHR) field test, and use that to establish your HR training zones. |
 2009-10-28 7:25 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2009-10-28 7:25 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
Champion 9600  Fountain Hills, AZ | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question It doesn't sound like either of you have done any HR testing protocol to actually determine what your individual HR might mean for your own athletic abilities. No one can answer this question for you unless you have actually established you HR zones and LT via either a lab test or field test. So it's either spend $150 for an LT or VO@ test or go out and do a field test. |
| 2009-10-28 7:32 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
| Pro 4827 McKinney, TX | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question "The thing is I keep reading that it should be morelike 140s?!?" Why should YOUR heart rate be in the 140s? HR is a very individual thing. Just because a group of people's zone 2 HR is 140-146 (pulled #'s out of the air) does not mean yours will be. If your average HR for your long runs and your short runs are the same, either you're not pushing the short runs or you're going to hard on the long runs. What is the purpose of each run? I would suggest a field lactate threshold test to determine your HR zones. Link for field test. |
| 2009-10-28 7:32 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
| Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question To provide some evidence that it doesn't have to be in the 140s, when I was looking at HR, I trained in the high 150s. My last marathon my HR never went below 160. Your HR is what it is. You cannot compare it to anyone else's. Doing so gets you into trouble. If you're going to use HR for training, then you really need to learn how to set up zones for yourself, what they mean, the core concepts behind HR training, and how to structure your training appropriately. That goes for any method you use, be it pace, RPE, or HR. |
| 2009-10-28 7:34 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
| Extreme Veteran 563 Pekin, IL | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question I would say, If you want to run by pace use this: http://www.mcmillanrunning.com/mcmillanrunningcalculator.htm if you want to run by HR, read this:http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=25733&start=1 or a combination of the 2, Chris |
| 2009-10-28 7:51 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
| Extreme Veteran 425 | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question I actually have read up on the process of determining your HR zone doing a field test, but isn't that just your everyday short run? I mean the way I read it, it says to warm up and then do a 30 minute TT. 10 minutes in start a timer and run for 20 more minutes with that being your HR number to figure your zones by. I guess maybe I have done my short runs wrong because I always try and make sure I am "tired" at the very end by pushing it. I may just fork over the $$ for a test. I know there is eye rolling going on reading this but not all of us have been doing this for along time and we want to get it right, especially since we will be doing this for some time to come...thanks for reading. |
| 2009-10-28 7:59 AM in reply to: #2483426 |
| Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question dewcubs - 2009-10-28 8:51 AM I actually have read up on the process of determining your HR zone doing a field test, but isn't that just your everyday short run? I mean the way I read it, it says to warm up and then do a 30 minute TT. 10 minutes in start a timer and run for 20 more minutes with that being your HR number to figure your zones by. I guess maybe I have done my short runs wrong because I always try and make sure I am "tired" at the very end by pushing it. I may just fork over the $$ for a test. I know there is eye rolling going on reading this but not all of us have been doing this for along time and we want to get it right, especially since we will be doing this for some time to come...thanks for reading. What do you mean by "tired"? You said you weren't breathing heavy, but you feel "tired" at the end? I'm not being nitpicky, I'm trying to understand what you are doing. I guess one of my questions for you would be why are you using HR? I know that sounds trite, but I cannot think of a better way to ask it. I want to know what your underlying reasoning is for using HR over other options. |
| 2009-10-28 8:02 AM in reply to: #2483426 |
| 29 | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question One of the things I found when I started training with a HR monitor under a coach, I was going a lot slower at first than I would have thought. Eventually my I got stronger and was able to run faster at the same HR. I probably went from an 8:30 pace to around 7:45 over 1.5 years in my "normal" training zone which is app. 75-80% of max. Here's the thing though - I was training for HIMs. That's with very little speed work. So a lot of it depends on what you are training for - I imagine, for a full ironman I would train at a lower HR percentage. My Dad who has done Boston several times was walking at times when he first trained with an HR. |
| 2009-10-28 8:05 AM in reply to: #2483440 |
| Extreme Veteran 425 | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question Scout7 - 2009-10-28 7:59 AM dewcubs - 2009-10-28 8:51 AM I actually have read up on the process of determining your HR zone doing a field test, but isn't that just your everyday short run? I mean the way I read it, it says to warm up and then do a 30 minute TT. 10 minutes in start a timer and run for 20 more minutes with that being your HR number to figure your zones by. I guess maybe I have done my short runs wrong because I always try and make sure I am "tired" at the very end by pushing it. I may just fork over the $$ for a test. I know there is eye rolling going on reading this but not all of us have been doing this for along time and we want to get it right, especially since we will be doing this for some time to come...thanks for reading. What do you mean by "tired"? You said you weren't breathing heavy, but you feel "tired" at the end? I'm not being nitpicky, I'm trying to understand what you are doing. I guess one of my questions for you would be why are you using HR? I know that sounds trite, but I cannot think of a better way to ask it. I want to know what your underlying reasoning is for using HR over other options. I do not have a "good" reason why I am using HR over "other methods". I guess because I have just read on here that HR is a good way to go. I also try and incorporate distances in according to what I have read that state that your long run should be no more than 1/3 of your weekly total.....to be honest I don't know the best way and that is why I am probably going to find a coach. As far as the "tired" comment, I mean I may feel it in my legs, but I am not out of breath. I recover my breath fairly quickly after finishing.....make sense or no? |
| 2009-10-28 8:10 AM in reply to: #2483440 |
| Champion 9600 Fountain Hills, AZ | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question Scout7 - 2009-10-28 7:59 AM dewcubs - 2009-10-28 8:51 AM I actually have read up on the process of determining your HR zone doing a field test, but isn't that just your everyday short run? I mean the way I read it, it says to warm up and then do a 30 minute TT. 10 minutes in start a timer and run for 20 more minutes with that being your HR number to figure your zones by. I guess maybe I have done my short runs wrong because I always try and make sure I am "tired" at the very end by pushing it. I may just fork over the $$ for a test. I know there is eye rolling going on reading this but not all of us have been doing this for along time and we want to get it right, especially since we will be doing this for some time to come...thanks for reading. What do you mean by "tired"? You said you weren't breathing heavy, but you feel "tired" at the end? I'm not being nitpicky, I'm trying to understand what you are doing. I guess one of my questions for you would be why are you using HR? I know that sounds trite, but I cannot think of a better way to ask it. I want to know what your underlying reasoning is for using HR over other options. I'm not sure the "why" of what he is doing is part of the conversation. Why not? To the OP, it doesn't sound like you are doing the field test correctly. A TT is the max effort you can do for the time without fading too much at the end, so it requires some pacing, but it shouldl be VERY diificult. This is usually where a lot of people have issue's, they either go too hard at he start or just don't go hard enough. If you are serious about training this way, I would say a lab test might be worth the investment if you can't do the field test properly. |
| 2009-10-28 8:25 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
| Member 190 Panama City Beach | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question dewcubs - 2009-10-28 7:15 AM So everything I am reading makes me believe my HR is too high during my runs. Let me state right upfront that I do not feel "out of breath" during my runs at all which makes me think my pacing is fine. I just started this month trying to work on my runs and have dropped my average heartrate from mid 160s to 150s. The thing is I keep reading that it should be morelike 140s?!? I am new at this so I am trying to do it right but I cannot see myself running with my heart rate that low. My long run right now is 8 miles (just upped it this week) and my other runs are just short of 4 miles. The weird thing is my HR is the same for both distances. Am I not "pushing" enough on my shorter runs? I am seriously considering getting a coach but thought I would throw this out there. I have a HIM and an IM next year and do not want to blow up on the run... OK, go ahead...fire away.... A little encouragement from a newbi to HR. First the HR formula for calculating you max HR only works for a % of people. It was developed by taking an average of a lot of people. While it's not critical at the beginning, it's a good to have an accurate max HR or lactate threshold to base your zones on. Here is the anecdotal encouragement. I started training by HR at the beginning of the summer after I started wanting to do things a little smarter. I was doing all my runs at the same pace, and it was way too fast. My first time out with my new zone numbers, I ran at a 12:30 pace. that was 2-2.5 min/mile slower than normal. I found it very difficult just to get my stride right to run that slow. I was very depressed!!! I was following a MarkAllanOnline training plan, and I was going to follow it and see what the results were, good or bad. The first thing I noticed is that I didn't feel beat down after my runs, and I could put in more time. My pace at the same HR kept getting faster and faster. I am now running at a 10:30 pace at the same HR. I do most of my runs at this lower HR, and am now starting to add in tempo runs and intervals. Using HR to make sure I am working hard enough on those. |
| 2009-10-28 8:28 AM in reply to: #2483426 |
| Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question dewcubs - 2009-10-28 7:51 AM I actually have read up on the process of determining your HR zone doing a field test, but isn't that just your everyday short run? I mean the way I read it, it says to warm up and then do a 30 minute TT. 10 minutes in start a timer and run for 20 more minutes with that being your HR number to figure your zones by. I guess maybe I have done my short runs wrong because I always try and make sure I am "tired" at the very end by pushing it. I may just fork over the $$ for a test. I know there is eye rolling going on reading this but not all of us have been doing this for along time and we want to get it right, especially since we will be doing this for some time to come...thanks for reading. You should be not just tired at the end of the field test, but totally spent. Your effort should be the hardest effort you can hold for the thirty minutes. If you're doing your "everyday short run" in this manner, then you are doing those wrong. |
| 2009-10-28 8:40 AM in reply to: #2483499 |
| Champion 7595 Columbia, South Carolina | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question the bear - 2009-10-28 9:28 AM dewcubs - 2009-10-28 7:51 AM I actually have read up on the process of determining your HR zone doing a field test, but isn't that just your everyday short run? I mean the way I read it, it says to warm up and then do a 30 minute TT. 10 minutes in start a timer and run for 20 more minutes with that being your HR number to figure your zones by. I guess maybe I have done my short runs wrong because I always try and make sure I am "tired" at the very end by pushing it. I may just fork over the $$ for a test. I know there is eye rolling going on reading this but not all of us have been doing this for along time and we want to get it right, especially since we will be doing this for some time to come...thanks for reading. You should be not just tired at the end of the field test, but totally spent. Your effort should be the hardest effort you can hold for the thirty minutes. If you're doing your "everyday short run" in this manner, then you are doing those wrong. I'll go a step further and say that you really cannot do the effort required for a field LT test 'everyday'. I got my first try wrong (went out too fast) and it was a week before I could even stomach the thought of doing it again. The second time I did it, I puked during cool-down. That's how hard it should be, IMO. |
| 2009-10-28 9:01 AM in reply to: #2483355 |
| Extreme Veteran 425 | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question Thanks for the feedback....I obviously have not be running my short runs that hard. I will have to make sure I actually do this 100% the proper way. Right now I cannot seem to find anywhere around where I live that does a LT test, so it looks like field test. |
| 2009-10-28 9:14 AM in reply to: #2483605 |
| Champion 9600 Fountain Hills, AZ | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question dewcubs - 2009-10-28 9:01 AM Thanks for the feedback....I obviously have not be running my short runs that hard. I will have to make sure I actually do this 100% the proper way. Right now I cannot seem to find anywhere around where I live that does a LT test, so it looks like field test. If you can get yourself on a local track to do the test, you can remove the variability of hills and really get groving. |
| 2009-10-28 10:22 AM in reply to: #2483605 |
| Extreme Veteran 563 Pekin, IL | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question dewcubs - 2009-10-28 9:01 AM Thanks for the feedback....I obviously have not be running my short runs that hard. I will have to make sure I actually do this 100% the proper way. Right now I cannot seem to find anywhere around where I live that does a LT test, so it looks like field test. You're over by Bloomington, right? Here are tests at ISU: http://www.kinrec.ilstu.edu/facilities/fitness_assessment.shtml |
| 2009-10-28 10:23 AM in reply to: #2483460 |
| Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question bryancd - 2009-10-28 9:10 AM I'm not sure the "why" of what he is doing is part of the conversation. Why not? I think it's an important part to understand where the OP is coming from. If, as was indicated, the OP is doing because he read a bunch of other people were doing it and it seemed like a good idea, then I know the OP's starting point. Answers can be phrased within that context. If the OP had said that other methods were attempted, but problems arose with them (trouble with managing effort, pacing was difficult, whatever), then I think that establishes a different context within which to work. |
| 2009-10-28 10:39 AM in reply to: #2483376 |
| Champion 9407 Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question TUEFELHUNDEN - 2009-10-28 9:24 AM You should be able to take your age from 180 and that would be the top end of your aerobic zone then subtract 10 to find the lower end. This is untrue; all age based formulae are useless to attempt to determine training zones. Instead, anyone who is interested in training using HR should do a field test or two to approximate what is commonly called LTHR and use that to determine training zones. More can be found on the protocol in the 220-age thread started by Mike Ricci. Shane |
| 2009-10-28 10:54 AM in reply to: #2483825 |
| Extreme Veteran 425 | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question CKinsey - 2009-10-28 10:22 AM dewcubs - 2009-10-28 9:01 AM Thanks for the feedback....I obviously have not be running my short runs that hard. I will have to make sure I actually do this 100% the proper way. Right now I cannot seem to find anywhere around where I live that does a LT test, so it looks like field test. You're over by Bloomington, right? Here are tests at ISU: http://www.kinrec.ilstu.edu/facilities/fitness_assessment.shtml Thanks a lot!!! $200 it is!! Edited by dewcubs 2009-10-28 10:55 AM |
| 2009-10-28 10:58 AM in reply to: #2483896 |
| Champion 9407 Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question dewcubs - 2009-10-28 12:54 PM Thanks a lot!!! $200 it is!! IIWY I would keep the $200 and do a field test. Field tests are cheap, repeatable and you can do them on your schedule. Shane |
| 2009-10-28 11:29 AM in reply to: #2483907 |
| Extreme Veteran 425 | Subject: RE: OK, so HR zone question Actually just talked to the peole over there and they are giving me a whole lot of other tests besides VO2(Fuel test, Body composition) and only charging me $150 since I am a Tri-shark member. After talking to the program coordinator, who happens to do triathlons, I believe it will be well worth the money. Thanks for the comments. |
|
|
|
|
View profile
Add to friends
Go to training log
Go to race log
Send a message
View album
CONNECT WITH FACEBOOK