Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread (Page 10)
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2014-08-05 6:50 PM in reply to: #5033463 |
475 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread I really wish I would have consulted with this group first. ?? I paid a deposit already but may still be worth looking into. Thanks. |
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2014-08-05 7:43 PM in reply to: midwesttrimom |
Champion 7704 Williamston, Michigan | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by midwesttrimom I really wish I would have consulted with this group first. ?? I paid a deposit already but may still be worth looking into. Thanks. Seriously cramped crappy hotel room (and unless they have renovated since last year I mean CRAPPY) with your whole family squashed in on top of each other or nice swishy condo where everyone has their own bedroom you have a full kitchen and more importantly a washer and dryer. http://www.vrbo.com |
2014-08-05 8:08 PM in reply to: #5035614 |
475 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread I think I will only lose $50 of the deposit so l am looking into the condo tomorrow! Agree- 3 kids under 12 and 2 adults!! Thanks for the info. I will do some looking ASAP! |
2014-08-07 9:00 AM in reply to: midwesttrimom |
29 Greenville, South Carolina | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread 85 day count down: Really felt good about the way training has been going since following Don Fink Iron Fit book/program which focuses in time in training rather than mileage and lays out swim sessions. Also got through hip bursitis and going to weekly PT to work on an old shoulder injury that really flairs up on the bike - this PT focuses on scar tissue removal and adjustments and I really am a fan (he also did IM Hawaii 2X and has been a good mentor). Beginning to think I can actually do this IM thing ... but ... I just started training with heart rate monitor and am pretty concerned/perplexed about my run HR zones. My HR max tests out at 178 (my own unscientific workout max threshold). The 220 minus age route gives me a max of 164 (56 yrs) which is just too low for me as I can sustain that HR pretty easily. I went for an aerobic fairly easy pace (10:30) 1:15 run and my average HR around 159! I have been training in +10/min pace now for a while (ran a 5K of 8:50 this Spring) hoping for 9's on these "shorter" runs under 10 miles as I drop another 5 - 10lb leading up to IMFL. According to the charts my Z1 and Z2 HR should be 116 - 132 and 133 - 151 (using the 178 max); where most of the IM training should be in Z1, which basically for me is a walking pace! No way! And zone 2 would keep in 11/min pace - speed walking. I don't think so. I am a little perplexed and maybe a bit concerned - I have gone as long as 1 1/2 runs so far (mid 10ish pace) and 4 hr bike rides and it's not like I am crawling at the finish and need 3 days to recover. My bike HR is 15 - 20 beats below my run HR and even though I know the Zones for bike are a bit lower, I can pretty much maintain a decent for me, but which it was faster, 17mph ride in Z2. I have an appointment Monday coincidently with a cardiac sports specialist for a check up (first check- up I've had since I registered for IMFL). I'm beginning to wish I hadn't strapped on the HR monitor, it has kind of put a confusing spin on my mental attitude - I just can't see myself "running" at a 124 HR which for me is a slightly brisk walk - and on the other hand it concerns me that it could be a medical issue, which I at least can put to rest one way or the other I guess in 3 or 4 days. Any thoughts? |
2014-08-07 11:43 AM in reply to: DavidKSC |
Champion 7704 Williamston, Michigan | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by DavidKSC 85 day count down: Really felt good about the way training has been going since following Don Fink Iron Fit book/program which focuses in time in training rather than mileage and lays out swim sessions. Also got through hip bursitis and going to weekly PT to work on an old shoulder injury that really flairs up on the bike - this PT focuses on scar tissue removal and adjustments and I really am a fan (he also did IM Hawaii 2X and has been a good mentor). Beginning to think I can actually do this IM thing ... but ... I just started training with heart rate monitor and am pretty concerned/perplexed about my run HR zones. My HR max tests out at 178 (my own unscientific workout max threshold). The 220 minus age route gives me a max of 164 (56 yrs) which is just too low for me as I can sustain that HR pretty easily. I went for an aerobic fairly easy pace (10:30) 1:15 run and my average HR around 159! I have been training in +10/min pace now for a while (ran a 5K of 8:50 this Spring) hoping for 9's on these "shorter" runs under 10 miles as I drop another 5 - 10lb leading up to IMFL. According to the charts my Z1 and Z2 HR should be 116 - 132 and 133 - 151 (using the 178 max); where most of the IM training should be in Z1, which basically for me is a walking pace! No way! And zone 2 would keep in 11/min pace - speed walking. I don't think so. I am a little perplexed and maybe a bit concerned - I have gone as long as 1 1/2 runs so far (mid 10ish pace) and 4 hr bike rides and it's not like I am crawling at the finish and need 3 days to recover. My bike HR is 15 - 20 beats below my run HR and even though I know the Zones for bike are a bit lower, I can pretty much maintain a decent for me, but which it was faster, 17mph ride in Z2. I have an appointment Monday coincidently with a cardiac sports specialist for a check up (first check- up I've had since I registered for IMFL). I'm beginning to wish I hadn't strapped on the HR monitor, it has kind of put a confusing spin on my mental attitude - I just can't see myself "running" at a 124 HR which for me is a slightly brisk walk - and on the other hand it concerns me that it could be a medical issue, which I at least can put to rest one way or the other I guess in 3 or 4 days. Any thoughts? Its probably not a medical issue. The 220 - your age is notoriously not accurate. HR is a good tool but I would not hang your hat on it 100% because its a TOOL. Heat esp will effect HR and cause it to drift up over the course of your workout. My best suggestion would be to hire a coach if you can afford it because its really invaluable. We are all individuals and for better or for worse those plans are not one size fits all. Either that do the gold membership here so you have someone you can bounce things off of or try a mentor group. Perhaps your Sports doc will be able to help. Good luck |
2014-08-10 9:58 AM in reply to: Socks |
475 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH!!! I appreciate all the feedback on condos in the Panama City area!! I booked a room on the 12th floor of the Shores of Panama from Wed-Sun nights and my kids and husband can all stay comfortably with me! My kids are going to actually feel like it's a VACATION instead of a boring trip to the Ironman (what is possibly boring about that anyway???). I saved over $500 as well! That is huge! The hotel was very nice in refunding all but $40 of my fees so that worked out just fine. They completely understood. Thanks again! CANNOT WAIT...but I guess I better get back to training or I won't be ready for the real reason I am headed to Florida. I would certainly make a great spectator, though. |
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2014-08-11 2:13 PM in reply to: midwesttrimom |
38 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by midwesttrimom Thanks again! CANNOT WAIT...but I guess I better get back to training or I won't be ready for the real reason I am headed to Florida. I would certainly make a great spectator, though. I'll be staying at Shores of Panama for the week aswell with my wife and kids (Monday to Monday) But i love your enthusiasm ... i can't wait either. I have a 100mile charity ride this weekend and then Rev3 Maine on Aug 24th. After that, it will be the final push with a lot of long runs that i hope my hamstring can sustain. Have a great week ! |
2014-08-11 7:41 PM in reply to: #5035638 |
Expert 663 Williamsburg, VA | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread I am doing the race with a friend and we rented a house for both families to stay together. We will get there on we'd and the rest of the families will come on fri. Half way done training!!! Everyone stay healthy! |
2014-08-11 11:26 PM in reply to: midwesttrimom |
Champion 7704 Williamston, Michigan | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by midwesttrimom THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH!!! I appreciate all the feedback on condos in the Panama City area!! I booked a room on the 12th floor of the Shores of Panama from Wed-Sun nights and my kids and husband can all stay comfortably with me! My kids are going to actually feel like it's a VACATION instead of a boring trip to the Ironman (what is possibly boring about that anyway???). I saved over $500 as well! That is huge! The hotel was very nice in refunding all but $40 of my fees so that worked out just fine. They completely understood. Thanks again! CANNOT WAIT...but I guess I better get back to training or I won't be ready for the real reason I am headed to Florida. I would certainly make a great spectator, though. seriously great decision. It might be 1/2 mile -3/4 of a mile from the venue. VERY walkable AND a full kitchen multiple bathrooms and bedrooms, indoor outdoor pools and hot tubs and WASHER ANS DRYER, Plus you and your family won't be tripping over each other. Look into your husband maybe taking the kids on a dolphin watch Friday. You can take a nap the family does something fun and different win win win. Plus they can go play on the beach. I think there is a mini golf place not far away either |
2014-08-17 8:42 AM in reply to: Socks |
Expert 1148 Santa Fe, New Mexico | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread I just got back from an epic South America vacation with my grown kids. One week of skiing in Chile, and a week in Costa Rica, hiking, canyoneering, ziplines, and scuba diving. No bike riding, running, or swimming unless you count 50 yards in a hotel swimming pool. Time to get back in the saddle. Hope I can get ready by Nov 3. That's only two and a half months away. Yikes! I'm sure my training suffered, but my attitude is 100% better. Here we go, the 'final' push. |
2014-08-18 8:33 AM in reply to: jashac |
38 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by jashac I just got back from an epic South America vacation with my grown kids. One week of skiing in Chile, and a week in Costa Rica, hiking, canyoneering, ziplines, and scuba diving. No bike riding, running, or swimming unless you count 50 yards in a hotel swimming pool. Time to get back in the saddle. Hope I can get ready by Nov 3. That's only two and a half months away. Yikes! I'm sure my training suffered, but my attitude is 100% better. Here we go, the 'final' push. I was on vacation two weeks ago and my motivation faltered aswell. It's not too late, you're right. But, this is it now ! We are under 75 days or 11 weeks out. This is the time when workouts make the biggest difference in your end results. That's what i tell myself these days. |
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2014-08-18 10:35 AM in reply to: dge12 |
Champion 7704 Williamston, Michigan | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread I wish I could go on vacation. I wish anything made me happy anymore I did Steelhead 70.3 on the 10th and is was a disaster. Swim was meh, I was really happy with my bike and came off feeling great and was ready to have a decent run. I crumped and crumped HARD with on 3 miles and it quickly turned into a death march of epic proportions. I don't think I ran one of the last 10 miles. I will not finish FL if things go that badly in November. I am very upset about the whole thing because for me my running was coming along pretty well going into that race and I just imploded. No idea why either. I did NOT go too hard on the bike. took it pretty easy in fact, it was not hot for me and I sweated WAY less than I usually do on the bike. Took in enough calories and just BOOM. I'm very disheartened |
2014-08-19 8:01 AM in reply to: Socks |
Member 42 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Hate to hear about your tough race. On the flipside, you were able to finish. We've all had those kinds of days and hopefully it will not happen again. |
2014-08-19 8:19 AM in reply to: Socks |
38 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by Socks I wish I could go on vacation. I wish anything made me happy anymore I did Steelhead 70.3 on the 10th and is was a disaster. Swim was meh, I was really happy with my bike and came off feeling great and was ready to have a decent run. I crumped and crumped HARD with on 3 miles and it quickly turned into a death march of epic proportions. I don't think I ran one of the last 10 miles. I will not finish FL if things go that badly in November. I am very upset about the whole thing because for me my running was coming along pretty well going into that race and I just imploded. No idea why either. I did NOT go too hard on the bike. took it pretty easy in fact, it was not hot for me and I sweated WAY less than I usually do on the bike. Took in enough calories and just BOOM. I'm very disheartened Socks, you are such a pillar of this community. It saddens me to hear about your state. I see how crashing during a race without any reasonable causes can be disheartening. Don't let it bring you down, scrub it off to some unknown factor and get back on the saddle. |
2014-08-19 10:17 AM in reply to: dge12 |
Champion 7704 Williamston, Michigan | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by dge12 Originally posted by Socks Socks, you are such a pillar of this community. It saddens me to hear about your state. I see how crashing during a race without any reasonable causes can be disheartening. Don't let it bring you down, scrub it off to some unknown factor and get back on the saddle. I wish I could go on vacation. I wish anything made me happy anymore I did Steelhead 70.3 on the 10th and is was a disaster. Swim was meh, I was really happy with my bike and came off feeling great and was ready to have a decent run. I crumped and crumped HARD with on 3 miles and it quickly turned into a death march of epic proportions. I don't think I ran one of the last 10 miles. I will not finish FL if things go that badly in November. I am very upset about the whole thing because for me my running was coming along pretty well going into that race and I just imploded. No idea why either. I did NOT go too hard on the bike. took it pretty easy in fact, it was not hot for me and I sweated WAY less than I usually do on the bike. Took in enough calories and just BOOM. I'm very disheartened thanks. the thing is for me that training is very much my mental health thing. I am VERY cranky if I don't train. so I am soldiering forward the best I can. My hip is very unhappy with me right now. |
2014-08-19 1:04 PM in reply to: Socks |
Regular 273 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by Socks thanks. the thing is for me that training is very much my mental health thing. I am VERY cranky if I don't train. so I am soldiering forward the best I can. My hip is very unhappy with me right now. Hang in there and just look forward. I trust you've had way more good races than ones like that one. Since misery loves company...I had to take 2 weeks off running due to my PF pain, and slogged through just 13.5 miles total last week. I'm just hoping I can build up a bit more volume, manage the pain and rely on all those base miles from January through July. It is what it is, and I can change it, so I'm just soldiering on. I hope you do the same! |
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2014-08-19 7:19 PM in reply to: #5038348 |
3 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : 10 weeks and counting Hello. I wanted to say a while back I posted about the swim and received great advice. I am now and left and right side breather depending on the conditions. I was in PCB last week and I got some longer swims in 1.3 miles. I did come across a new problem. I got very nauseous on my swim. Not sure if it was the swim along the shore line or the salt water. I've gotten ginger gum, sea bands and might try a patch to help with nausea. I am signed up for the 5150 in Galveston same swim as the 70.3 which I had a horrible swim and almost got pulled out 30x but fraught thru only to stop on the run due to asthma problems. So I will test my ginger gum there and see what happens. Any other suggestions for nausea? See you all In 10 weeks. |
2014-08-20 10:46 AM in reply to: Socks |
475 | Subject: RE: Ironman Florida 2014 : Official Thread Originally posted by Socks Originally posted by dge12 Originally posted by Socks Socks, you are such a pillar of this community. It saddens me to hear about your state. I see how crashing during a race without any reasonable causes can be disheartening. Don't let it bring you down, scrub it off to some unknown factor and get back on the saddle. I wish I could go on vacation. I wish anything made me happy anymore I did Steelhead 70.3 on the 10th and is was a disaster. Swim was meh, I was really happy with my bike and came off feeling great and was ready to have a decent run. I crumped and crumped HARD with on 3 miles and it quickly turned into a death march of epic proportions. I don't think I ran one of the last 10 miles. I will not finish FL if things go that badly in November. I am very upset about the whole thing because for me my running was coming along pretty well going into that race and I just imploded. No idea why either. I did NOT go too hard on the bike. took it pretty easy in fact, it was not hot for me and I sweated WAY less than I usually do on the bike. Took in enough calories and just BOOM. I'm very disheartened thanks. the thing is for me that training is very much my mental health thing. I am VERY cranky if I don't train. so I am soldiering forward the best I can. My hip is very unhappy with me right now. Ahhhh, so sorry to hear this. I always count on you for solid advice so maybe you need some TLC sometimes too. I hope you get through this okay. I haven't crashed like that but last week's bike ride had me pretty bummed. I was around 3 hours and was just DONE. I swore I had taken in enough fluid and fuel as well. I wanted to call someone to come and pick me up. I am sorry this happened to you during an event. Has to be hard on the confidence. Think of all the things you've accomplished before. Maybe your body is telling you something??? I know I am not really helping but just know that we are rooting for you! |
2014-08-21 9:59 AM in reply to: Tlbirse99 |
13 | Subject: Bike Nutrition Hello all, I have been experimenting a lot with nutrition on the bike but I am not sure I have it down yet. I am curious to hear what others are doing. Please share as I'd like to try out some new ideas on my rides this weekend. 1. What are you eating/drinking? 2. Are you basing it on time? Distance? Or feeling? 3. Do you have a calorie or carb count you follow? 4. How do you transport it on your bike during training/race? In a box? In your jersey? Stopping back at the car? I am especially interested in anyone who is using a more natural food approach versus all Gu/gels but am interested in everyone's opinions. Thanks for the ideas. Barbara Ann |
2014-08-21 12:33 PM in reply to: Sulik24 |
Expert 1148 Santa Fe, New Mexico | Subject: RE: Bike Nutrition Originally posted by Sulik24 Hello all, I have been experimenting a lot with nutrition on the bike but I am not sure I have it down yet. I am curious to hear what others are doing. Please share as I'd like to try out some new ideas on my rides this weekend. 1. What are you eating/drinking? 2. Are you basing it on time? Distance? Or feeling? 3. Do you have a calorie or carb count you follow? 4. How do you transport it on your bike during training/race? In a box? In your jersey? Stopping back at the car? I am especially interested in anyone who is using a more natural food approach versus all Gu/gels but am interested in everyone's opinions. Thanks for the ideas. Barbara Ann Generally what I use on the bike is a bottle of pretty concentrated Perpetuem. The bottle is marked off in hours. That way I can be sure I am taking my prescribed amount each hour. I usually mix a five hour bottle, and have a three hour cold bottle in my special needs bag. Over time I figured out that I need 1.5 scoops per hour. I supplement that with a PowerBar gel every 45 min to hour. Or more if I want it. Add to that an occasional bananna or whatever from aide stations. I mix gatoraide 1/2 strength and that's what I drink as I need it. My nutrition is all time based. I use an aerobottle for gatoraide and have a bento box for gels, and put the Perpetuem in my bike frame bottle holder. -- for long training rides I have a double water bottle holder mounted behind my seat. -- supplemented by stops at convenience stores. You should know what they serve on the course and practice with that if you plan to use it. Plan B is gels and aide station food only. You are very wise to consider this now while you have many long training rides left to experiment. I suggest that you also have a plan B and maybe even a plan C for nutrition. You may reach a point in the race where your nutrition simply will not work for you any more. Hope this helps. |
2014-08-21 12:34 PM in reply to: jashac |
Expert 1148 Santa Fe, New Mexico | Subject: RE: Bike Nutrition I made my condo and air reservations Monday! I suppose that means I'm really going. Staying at Shores of Panama in the same condo I used last year. When you don't have to look for something new it gets real easy. |
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2014-08-22 6:37 AM in reply to: 0 |
Veteran 493 West Palm Beach | Subject: RE: Bike Nutrition Originally posted by Sulik24 Hello all, I have been experimenting a lot with nutrition on the bike but I am not sure I have it down yet. I am curious to hear what others are doing. Please share as I'd like to try out some new ideas on my rides this weekend. 1. What are you eating/drinking? 2. Are you basing it on time? Distance? Or feeling? 3. Do you have a calorie or carb count you follow? 4. How do you transport it on your bike during training/race? In a box? In your jersey? Stopping back at the car? I am especially interested in anyone who is using a more natural food approach versus all Gu/gels but am interested in everyone's opinions. Thanks for the ideas. Barbara Ann I have used the following nutrition for 2 prior IM and training: I use NUUN for hydration, I can't tolerate other drinks I have tried as they have given me an upset stomach. I have 1-2 bonk bars, honey stinger gummies and I make a trail mix with cashews/craisins/sea salt. In my special needs bag I have a bag of potato chips, chex mix, p&j sandwich and one coke....not that I am going to eat all this but I just have it in case I am craving salt or sweet. The coke has helped me in the past with stomach upset and low morale ..lol...it's funny I never ever have soda except in a long distance tri. Experiment, experiment....that's all I can tell you and have several plans as u never know how your body will be that day! Have fun and safe training :-) Alicia Edited by trirun26 2014-08-22 6:39 AM |
2014-08-22 7:04 AM in reply to: trirun26 |
13 | Subject: RE: Bike Nutrition Thank you for the ideas. I now have a few new things to try this weekend! And I never would have thought to pack soda, as I don't drink it either, but it can't hurt to include it, just in case. Barbara Ann |
2014-08-22 8:59 AM in reply to: Sulik24 |
475 | Subject: RE: Bike Nutrition Originally posted by Sulik24 Hello all, I have been experimenting a lot with nutrition on the bike but I am not sure I have it down yet. I am curious to hear what others are doing. Please share as I'd like to try out some new ideas on my rides this weekend. 1. What are you eating/drinking? 2. Are you basing it on time? Distance? Or feeling? 3. Do you have a calorie or carb count you follow? 4. How do you transport it on your bike during training/race? In a box? In your jersey? Stopping back at the car? I am especially interested in anyone who is using a more natural food approach versus all Gu/gels but am interested in everyone's opinions. Thanks for the ideas. Barbara Ann I am doing the same but so far I have been doing "something" about every 30 minutes. I take one Bonk Breaker, one granola bar, a bag of Gu chews, 2 Gu packets, and some Hammer Electrolyte tablets on my bike. For hydration I have my front mount water bottle filled with water and my lower bottle filled with Gatorade or Powerade. I typically go through both of those bottles and stop to refill with water. I may invest in a rear mount bottle holder (2 more bottles there) and I think that would almost get me through a 6-6:30 ride?? I still don't really know if that is enough. The items I just mentioned have been for rides between 4-4:30. So, guessing I will add another Bonk Breaker and at least one more Gu (non-caffeinated) for the full Ironman distance. I think I need a plan!!!! Love hearing what others are doing. So far, however, I have not bonked out and have felt really good on my rides. Good enough to hop off and run a few miles (but maybe not 26.2). |
2014-08-22 12:44 PM in reply to: 0 |
Champion 7704 Williamston, Michigan | Subject: RE: Bike Nutrition Originally posted by midwesttrimom Originally posted by Sulik24 Hello all, I have been experimenting a lot with nutrition on the bike but I am not sure I have it down yet. I am curious to hear what others are doing. Please share as I'd like to try out some new ideas on my rides this weekend. 1. What are you eating/drinking? 2. Are you basing it on time? Distance? Or feeling? 3. Do you have a calorie or carb count you follow? 4. How do you transport it on your bike during training/race? In a box? In your jersey? Stopping back at the car? I am especially interested in anyone who is using a more natural food approach versus all Gu/gels but am interested in everyone's opinions. Thanks for the ideas. Barbara Ann I am doing the same but so far I have been doing "something" about every 30 minutes. I take one Bonk Breaker, one granola bar, a bag of Gu chews, 2 Gu packets, and some Hammer Electrolyte tablets on my bike. For hydration I have my front mount water bottle filled with water and my lower bottle filled with Gatorade or Powerade. I typically go through both of those bottles and stop to refill with water. I may invest in a rear mount bottle holder (2 more bottles there) and I think that would almost get me through a 6-6:30 ride?? I still don't really know if that is enough. The items I just mentioned have been for rides between 4-4:30. So, guessing I will add another Bonk Breaker and at least one more Gu (non-caffeinated) for the full Ironman distance. I think I need a plan!!!! Love hearing what others are doing. So far, however, I have not bonked out and have felt really good on my rides. Good enough to hop off and run a few miles (but maybe not 26.2). The longer I do this stuff the simpler I try to make it. -Fluids I use skratch. I really like it. I have 2 servings in my aerobottle and I bring 2 bottles 2 servings each on my frame and water it down with water from the course. I used accelerade the same way for many years and it worked well but I got sick of the taste after 5-6 years. -Solids/food. I have used many different things over the years. licorace actually works brilliantly. Cut them in 1/2 and they fit in a bento box, they don't melt are cheep and readily available. AND they taste a LOT better than a gel. Right now I am using gels because I need to drop some weight and I dont' want to eat the licorace if its sitting around my house. I have used fig newtons. laffy taffy and a bunch of other things over the years Everyone is different. Figure out how much fluid and how many calories you need per hour and then find a fluid and solid that agrees with you. Lots of people use uncrustables too. I usually have on in my T1 and T2 bags. I would suggest going by time rather than distance. Plus it gives you something to do. Usually I will eat something at X time and take an electrolyte tablet at Y time etc etc. Breaks up the ride Edited by Socks 2014-08-22 12:45 PM |
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