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2008-06-02 5:26 PM
in reply to: #1439671

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!

I had a mixed bag of that on Sunday too. I passed a fair share of people both uphill and downhill but where I find myself fading is on the flats (not that there was much of that on Sunday) where there is no question that aerobars would help me. I have learned something interesting this season and even tested it as I was racing yesterday... that there are certainly times when easing back in the saddle, going down in the drop outs, and just letting gravity take it's course without pedaling is the fastest way down the hill. With an initial push at the crest and couple hard strokes going through the gears I found myself adding 2-3 MPH when I dropped down and cruised a little.

Along these lines... for sake of Chris and myself and anybody else considering the aero/road setup... what do you guys think about the Profile Design, "Fast Forward" carbon or aluminum seat post? I found the carbon model for $75 on ebay and was seriously considering putting together 2-setups for my bike where I could just swap out the seat post complete with saddle and mark the seat heights respectively.



2008-06-02 6:31 PM
in reply to: #1439525

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Fishers, IN
Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
The tri season is in full swing and you've been training all winter in anticipation for this so keep on cranking. You got the base, so the races serve as optimal as the ultimate in speed work. I didn't really start training till late due to running or I'd be doing the same.

I had planned on making my first ever tri in two weeks, but just discovered that the web page I was checking had the wrong date rather than this year's date (the 21st) which conflicts with a family vacation. That said, I think I am going to have to move my date for my first tri to this weekend. It seems pretty complicated relative to a running race. Hope I remember everything.

Scott, I agree with your assessment of downhills. If they have much length at all, get a couple of good cranks at the top and then get in an aero position (whether you have aero bars or not - flat back and bring your knees in together toward one another) and let it fly. As David said, keep a hand over the hoods of the brakes in case you need to scrub off speed going into a corner or encounter sand etc.
2008-06-02 10:33 PM
in reply to: #1439827

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
that seatpost is good for its purpose, but if you use that it needs to be in conjunction with areobars and a stem long enough for the bars, simply putting that on a road bike wont do much good other than put you over the top of your bars.
2008-06-03 6:12 AM
in reply to: #1440522

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!

That was my plan to do both.  I have aero bars but I have not put them on yet this year.  It kind of seems like it would have the same effect as the reversible seat post on the Cervelo Soloist's.   Did Cervelo fully engineer a bike to excel at both road and TT or is it a tweener bike for those who want something modest in both worlds?  That's kind of what I'm looking for.  With only 5 tri's this year and plans for a family next year, I will probably race even less in 2009.  Doubt I can spring for a tri bike anytime soon so I'm just tinkering with cost-effective solutions.  The first of which is just spending more time in the saddle which I definitely am this year.    

2008-06-03 10:33 AM
in reply to: #1440698

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
sounds good.

the dual is actually set up with a 75 and 78 degree post (whereas a road bike is 73).

the soloist is more what you are thinking, with a 73 and 76, for road or tri.



EDIT: you were talking about the soloist.
2008-06-03 10:36 AM
in reply to: #1354430

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
Thanks for the info on recovery drinks... I know I always take it for granted being all of 28 and how well my body can recover from heavy training days and minor injuries.

I mainly asked because it seems to be the neuvo thing in hydration/fueling. Cliff has mix, Infinit, EAS, Accelerade, Hammer has one which I tried, Recoverite and is nasty... you basically name the company and they have a product.

In the past I used to have a EAS protein shake after a workout which was mostly to take off the edge of working out in the mornings and just being hungry. I didn't know if anyone had been doing it regularly to justify or look at the cost/benefit. I've been thinking about starting to do it again just to see how it impacts my recovery now that I am starting to look at the meat of my HIM training plan.

As for the downhill passing issue. It is all about aero and ability. I agree with a couple of good cranks to get to top speed and tuck into your drops and try to be as small as possible. Top speed I have cruised at was just over 45mph... It was a blast. Where I ride around home I don't have that great of hills to get that type of downhill experience... if they are okay hills most of the time I want to ride up them... not down. This weekend up in Akron I will be able to get some hilly rides in which is gonna be fun in the forecasted heat.


2008-06-03 12:54 PM
in reply to: #1354430

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!

David, take us through your transitions step by step when you get a chance.  I am getting to the point where I want to target a reduction of 0:45 seconds off of my T's.

In my last two Sprints my total T times were 2:06 and 2:09.  In both I attempted to be quicker.  My first three Sprints averaged about 2:30.

In addition to just making sure one is running in the T area, what tips can help speed us up. (step by step if you can)

Thank you.

 

2008-06-03 2:21 PM
in reply to: #1441873

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
yep not a problem. also, let me say this applies to sprint races only (some of this carries over, but the longer races i start worrying about other stuff a bit more).


in transition i have my helmet, running shoes, and bike shoes , and race number. (for duathlon you are already wearing the shoes.

the helmet goes on the ground under my bike, inside up and teh straps laying out of it. one running shoes on either side, race belt with number under it. bike shoes are clipped onto the pedals.

i run into transition (goggles and swim cap are already foff), duathlon you dont worry about this.

run to bike, helmet on, grab bike and go. jump on bike at mount line, up to speed, then slide feet into shoes.

on the way back in, i slide my feet out of the shoes a efw hundred feet away and dismount at the line, sprint to rack, helmet off while running, rack back/running shoes on, grab number belt and sprint out.

in a normal sized transition area this will get you out of there in 15-30 sec if you move quickly
2008-06-03 2:43 PM
in reply to: #1442274

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
also, and i see this all the time, nothing, and i mean nothing you dont need goes into transition with you. for sprints i dont take sunglasses, hat, socks, gel, anything like that. keep it simple, only what you need.
2008-06-03 6:24 PM
in reply to: #1442357

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Fishers, IN
Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
Kind of a stupid question perhaps, do they have stuff for you to drink at most sprints or do you carry water/gatorade on your bike during the ride or just skip it all together?
2008-06-03 7:45 PM
in reply to: #1442927

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
In the three I've done you carry what you need on the bike and there is one water station on the run - two if you count the same one twice during a two loop course


2008-06-04 6:54 AM
in reply to: #1354430

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
I really only ride and do short runs with water. When the session is going to be over an hour or the heat has gotten out of control then I'll start mixing in some gatorade and/or electrolyte replacements..speaking of which has anyone used NUUN's? I just picked some up and am planning on using it during a 2 hour ride this Saturday morning...

--Chris
2008-06-04 7:06 AM
in reply to: #1442927

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
rc63413 - 2008-06-03 7:24 PM

Kind of a stupid question perhaps, do they have stuff for you to drink at most sprints or do you carry water/gatorade on your bike during the ride or just skip it all together?


Scott's got it right. Normally you don't get bike course support until you reach a HIM level. Sprints and Olys you bring what you need with you.

For Sprints hydration/fueling isn't really needed. You are going to be out there for little over an hour... you won't need gels... water/gatorade is up to you. I usually just put a bottle of gatorade on the bike just in case I need a drink. Most of the time I don't even make it to a half a bottle. I take nothing on the run. Taking a gel, or drinking for that matter, probably slows you down.

For Olympics it is a different situation. It is long, but not too long that you risk "bonking." Normal time is just around 2-3 hours. The swim really starts to become a greater factor in an Oly v. any other distance because you are in the water for a greater percentage of total race time. I usually take a bottle of water and gatorade on the bike, plus a gel or two. Practice what you think you will need during training and see what works for you. I don't normally take anything in on the run, just because it is still pretty short, 10k, and is still within a reasonable distance that you wont dehydrate if you have something on the bike. It is a long enough race that you do need to start thinking about having a hydration and pacing plan... but you can do it without. With a longer distance... you gotta have a plan or you risk not finishing.
2008-06-05 6:55 AM
in reply to: #1354430

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!

Good morning guys,

I just logged this on my regualr logs but I wanted to let you know also. I am going to be off BT for a while. I am still training and racing but what with work and logging for my Coach and Team, I just don't really have the time to give it what I feel it deserves to hang here.  I'll still be popping in from time to time to see what everyone is up to.

I appreicate all the help and support and look forward to meeting yall' at the race this year. David you keep up the good mentoring and luck with you knee. Take care, gotta go swim and run.

Chris

2008-06-05 7:22 AM
in reply to: #1446557

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
chrisrunzs26 - 2008-06-05 7:55 AM

Good morning guys,

I just logged this on my regualr logs but I wanted to let you know also. I am going to be off BT for a while. I am still training and racing but what with work and logging for my Coach and Team, I just don't really have the time to give it what I feel it deserves to hang here.  I'll still be popping in from time to time to see what everyone is up to.

I appreicate all the help and support and look forward to meeting yall' at the race this year. David you keep up the good mentoring and luck with you knee. Take care, gotta go swim and run.

Chris



Good luck this season Chris... Keep up the good work... and keep in touch when possible.

Time for the weekly check in:
Swim: 1:42:13 ~31%
Bike: 5:39:02 ~36%
Run: 3:47:00 ~55%
Overall: 11:08:15 ~41%

I need to get to the pool and ride and swim more. Or maybe stick to my schedule.

Edited by JChristoff 2008-06-05 7:22 AM
2008-06-05 9:34 AM
in reply to: #1354430

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!

Weekly check in:

(I took the swim off so as not to skew my other work with a zero percent for not at least swimming 100 yards)

Run: 53.11 miles, ~71%

Run time: 7:31 hours

Bike: 7:56 hours, ~79%

Total hours = 15:27, ~75%



Edited by DieuEtMonDroit 2008-06-05 9:38 AM


2008-06-05 11:05 AM
in reply to: #1446884

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
DieuEtMonDroit - 2008-06-05 10:34 AM

Weekly check in:

(I took the swim off so as not to skew my other work with a zero percent for not at least swimming 100 yards)

Run: 53.11 miles, ~71%

Run time: 7:31 hours

Bike: 7:56 hours, ~79%

Total hours = 15:27, ~75%



Oh come on Tom... You know you want to get in the pool... All the cool kids are doing it.

You way ahead of schedule.
2008-06-05 11:55 AM
in reply to: #1354430

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
I was just thinking an update was in order, you guys beat me too it!

Swim - 22,500 yards (Actual - 9,000)
Run - 60 miles (Actual - 33.6)
Bike 16 hours/~260 miles (Actual - 107.8)

Wow, am I behind. Oh well, I'll make up some that this weekend...I've got about 5,000 yards of swimming, 32-40 miles on the bike and 9-10 miles of running between now and the end of the weekend. Looks like slowing down last week to prep for my race screwed me on these goals...oh well, I'll do what I can.

--Chris

2008-06-05 12:51 PM
in reply to: #1354430

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!

It is now 1:50 PM, do you know where your mentor is?

David, how's it hangin?

 

2008-06-05 1:17 PM
in reply to: #1443711

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
i race and train with nuun, and am sponsored by them this season, a GREAT product
2008-06-05 1:21 PM
in reply to: #1447537

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
haha not too bad. knee is feeling better, i am packing up to leave for rockman half iron in a few min.

looking to come top 25 and go under 4:50. should be a long day out there. good luck this weekend everone!


2008-06-05 5:10 PM
in reply to: #1446557

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Fishers, IN
Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
My week went well, though I am still behind in some areas.

This week
Swim 9100 meters for the week (89% of three week goal)
Bike 129 miles (62%) thanks to 90 miler last weekend
Run 40.5 miles (34%)

Bicycling and running are like oil and water. My goal of 50 mpw was totally unrealistic.
I need to find the right balance and make it where my quality run sessions aren't compromised by my cycling. I think cycling takes more out of my run than run takes out of my cycle. Swim is still weak, but getting better.

Calfs very tight, else OK

Either way, a good week. First Tri Saturday (400 meter, 13, 3.1) should be interesting.
2008-06-05 8:02 PM
in reply to: #1448310

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!

I will be away from the computer until Sunday some time.  Traveling for work all day tomorrow and then heading to Salisbury to camp out for my century ride on Saturday.

VERY slow week for me.  I know we're in a challenge but I decided to take a light week because I am two months from my next TRI and I start a rigorous (for me) marathon training program  in addition to my tri training on July 5th.  So, I took a little breather.

Outside of my race on Sunday (500m, 15 mi, 3.1 mi) I've only exercised once... 1350m on Tuesday night.  BUT I plan to run 3.1 when I get to Salisbury tomorrow afternoon, ride 102 mi on Saturday and get in an OWS on Sunday.

Good luck with your races this weekend guys.  Especially with your first tri, Greg.  You'll have a great time!!!
   

2008-06-06 6:41 AM
in reply to: #1448557

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
shaggy28 - 2008-06-05 9:02 PM

I will be away from the computer until Sunday some time. Traveling for work all day tomorrow and then heading to Salisbury to camp out for my century ride on Saturday.

VERY slow week for me. I know we're in a challenge but I decided to take a light week because I am two months from my next TRI and I start a rigorous (for me) marathon training program in addition to my tri training on July 5th. So, I took a little breather.

Outside of my race on Sunday (500m, 15 mi, 3.1 mi) I've only exercised once... 1350m on Tuesday night. BUT I plan to run 3.1 when I get to Salisbury tomorrow afternoon, ride 102 mi on Saturday and get in an OWS on Sunday.

Good luck with your races this weekend guys. Especially with your first tri, Greg. You'll have a great time!!!


Scott,

Ha..taking it light...just a 100 mile ride this weekend ;-) Hope you have/had a great ride and great weekend.

--Chris
2008-06-06 6:59 AM
in reply to: #1448310

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Subject: RE: Newbz'z group is FULL!!!!!!
rc63413 - 2008-06-05 6:10 PM

My week went well, though I am still behind in some areas.

This week
Swim 9100 meters for the week (89% of three week goal)
Bike 129 miles (62%) thanks to 90 miler last weekend
Run 40.5 miles (34%)

Bicycling and running are like oil and water. My goal of 50 mpw was totally unrealistic.
I need to find the right balance and make it where my quality run sessions aren't compromised by my cycling. I think cycling takes more out of my run than run takes out of my cycle. Swim is still weak, but getting better.

Calfs very tight, else OK

Either way, a good week. First Tri Saturday (400 meter, 13, 3.1) should be interesting.


Good luck this weekend...make sure to take it easy today to rest up for it.

I'm no expert but I did just take a look at your logs and wanted to throw out a few things re: your bike and run. First a question, how long have you been training? Your logs only go back to April but I'm not sure (and don't remember if we've covered it here) what your background and training volume were like prior to that. Regardless, it looks like you have been doing two long rides a week for the last few weeks. So my first suggestion is to get that to three rides a week but make one a shorter recovery based ride (45-60 minutes). That should help you get to your goal volume but not add too much stress to your legs.

Another thing I'd recommend is to separate your most important run session from your most important bike session by a few days. I've read countless pro's who feel that (and I'm paraphrasing) that one of the keys to success is getting in one really high-quality session for each sport each week and spreading those out to allow for recovery. So, maybe make one of your runs a long slow session or a speed workout (depending on your goals and where you are in your training) and separate that by a day or two from your longest/highest-intensity bike workout. FYI, this is an example of do what I suggest, not what I do. My key sessions for all three sports are on the weekends as I just don't have the time during the week for a 2 hour plus run or ride.

Otherwise, your going to just have to give your legs time to get used to it. When I first started training in January, I remember my legs feeling really fatigued and sore a lot. Now, although my training volume is hire and the intensity is greater, the fatigue and soreness are not as nearly as evident. Not sure if that is a good thing for me or not but at least I don't let out audible groans going up stairs any longer ;-)

Hope some of that helps and keep up the good work. Remember, the key is consistent long-term training...I try to think in months and years, not weeks and days. As Gordo says, "be the cup".

--Chris
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