swbkrun mentor group 6 years running closed (Page 112)

Sorry about adding to your anxiety!!!      but, if you figure 6ish hours on the bike you are close to 33,000 revolutions.  Crank arm length will be an important factor with that many Revolutions.  As Suzy says, "Nothing new on race day!!"  

Ok, you asked so my official opinion is that "Compact Cranks have their place on certain bikes."  Playing Devils Advocate,  Are you one of those people?  If so, why do you think you are?      

Compacts were originally an answer from some of the component manufacturer's to correct some issues created by triples on the front.  Front derailleur travel distances, actual different front derailleurs & different shifters, a longer rear wheel cage to accept the extra chain when on the "granny" gear, weird gear combinations, chain angle issues, a wider pedal stance, a general disdain among roadies towards triples, etc. were all issues.  These same component companies have "marketed" Compacts as the answer to all woes.  After compacts found some limited success in the 2003 Tour de France, the marketing effort was bumped up even more.  Compacts fixed more component woes than bikers.  

That being said, a compact may be the best thing for you on your bike, but make sure it is before you invest the money in it because it may be unnecessary.  Make sure you have played and exhausted the cassette game first ....  As an example: a 50/34 compact with a 12/25 cassette will give you the same hill climbing gears as a 53/39 standard with a 11/28.  Shimano now offers a 12/30 in the Ultegra line and SRAM also has a 11-32 available and it is rumored they are coming out with a 11-36 later in the year.  The only issue you might run into here is your chain length when you get much bigger.      

A great chart to play with to compare crank/cassette options... 

Disclaimer .....  I do ride a 46/36 compact on my CX bike because I found I needed the lower gear ratios that it offers for Cross (usually run with a 12/28 cassette but I have run up to a 32.  When racing CX you never drop to the small front ring because of fear of dropping your chain) but I ride a 53/39 on both my tri bike and roadie with different cassettes based on course, a group ride or a race, etc.       

Yes, and just to clarify furhter Crank Size and Crank Arm length are 2 separate discussions.  You can have different cranks with the same crank arm lengths.  You should have the same crank arm length on ALL your bikes, regardless of the crank size you are running on that rig.      

You are correct about what I am currently riding. The compact crank I purchased is actually a 50/34.

That's what I thought too. Having the shorter crank arm would give me a little more "breathing room" too, right?

No worries, it's just the realization that Sept 9th is only 54 days away.  It's going to go by so fast!!!!!! 

Thank you for the explanation.  Maybe I don't need a compact but my fitter does recommend it for me, from what I've read it sounds like the majority benefit from riding a compact, and since I need a new crank (can't just swap out the arm) anyway...

Anyway, does the fact that the compact is a 50/34 and it has the same # of cogs as what I'm currently riding make any difference?

The number of cogs is what determines the crank size.  A 50/34 is considered a compact crank.  If your new crank is also a 50/34, then it is a compact also.  If I understand you correctly, you are not making any changes to your gear ratios at all.  However, it sounds like your fitter wants you to have a compact crank with 170mm vs 172.5mm crank arms.  That would be a very valid fitting decision, so as they say down by Fatty, get 'er done and get on that bike and ride so you get used to the shorter crank arms. 

If you find you need more gears, start looking at your cassette options.  

There has been a lot of crank length discussion over on ST and they're advocating going shorter than 170 for many folks.  From what I have read even crank length can be a personal preference.  For me I just stick with my 170's they seem to work well enough, not sure if I could tell much difference with 172.5's or not.

I'll also stick with my thought that a compact is better for tri's due to having more lower end gears, which is what it's really all about, do you need more for going up, or going down.  There will be gaps depending on what cassette you go with, I ran a compact 50/34 and an 11/28 and raced a heck of a lot better than I am now on a 52/36 with an 11-25 in the back. Should be less gaps in that 11-25 but I never seem to be in the right gear with that setup.

Find a good gear ratio that works for you and go for it.  I don't think it will be a problem at all to go with the 170's.

Also you'd probably need a long cage derailleur for most of those, they won't fit under most standard RD's.

LOL, I keep going back and re-reading.  By Cogs do you mean teeth?  If so then it's the same thing as Dino said or do you mean the chainrings (i.e. 2 for a double, 3 for a triple)?  Both a standard double and compact have 2 chainrings

Ha!  I was riding a compact and didn't know it.

Yes, Tony, I did mean teeth. Thankfully, Dino knew what I meant.

Again, thanks for the schooling. 

No worries, always fun to talk bike stuff.

As long as we have been talking bikes, cranks, crank-arms, and gearing.  I thought this might be interesting fodder since it all relates back to Cadence somehow .......

Fatty's Godfather of Power!!

I have a compact crank 50/34 and run a 11-28 cassette. I do better on the hills now then when I used a 11-25.  I have a Cervelo S2 with clip on aerobars. I dream about getting a Tri-bike but I keep telling myself that my is S2 more than good enough for my engine. 

There was a cute guy who shared my lane at the pool at noon today. Helped me alittle  on my high elbow. Kinda hope I run into him again when I'm not wearing my most ugly swim suit.

Tiana

I came across this yesterday.  Good articles - follow the link from the first article to the second and from there to the third (Couzen's was actually the most interesting).

funny.  i was reading an old post of his earlier today about pacing a 1 hour time trial and how the same principles can be applied to running races. 

kkcbelle - 2012-07-18 1:24 AM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

good luck racing peeps!!!   nada here.  just some riding and hopefully running.  gonna head out at luch today and see if i can run. 

1. favorite desert... carrot cake (my mom's recipe only though.  one time jarrett bought a box mix and we didn't speak for a week)
2. favorite post race meal... come on. 
3. favorite book... to kill a mockingbird.  
4. something you don't know... i like to fart and then wave the smell into peoples faces, especially my kids.  prod papa moment last week when jacy did it to june for the first time!!!

kkcbelle - 2012-07-18 1:24 AM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

No racing again for me until September unless it's on a whim.  Good luck to all those racing this weekend.  I will be picking up my CLE's at a beach conference Saturday - Wednesday.  At least I get to track a friend doing Lake Placid on Sunday. 

Dessert:  Banana pudding

Post-race meal:  Beer and a turkey leg

Book:  The Count of Monte Cristo

Something you didn't know:  After 5 days at the beach next week, I will be home for 2 days then heading to Maine for a week. 

kkcbelle - 2012-07-17 10:24 PM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

Great answers!!!

Alas, I am racing, so I don't have to answer those!!

Friday-Saturday I'm doing the Ragnar Relay from the Canadian border to Whidbey Island. Currently the spreadsheet has me running 3 legs for 17 miles at 10pm, 4am, and 1:30pm. I've also offered up another short run leg if the leader (who sounds like she's injured) needs help. We'll see how that goes! Two other local dudes are doing this with me... Supposed to finish up Saturday afternoon.

Sunday morning us three amigos are slated to race the Seafair Olympic triathlon. Did I say race? Oh, maybe just slog. We'll see how we're all doing after spending 36 hours in a van with 9 other peeps. Good times!!

And FWIW, Granny Hupfeld's Apple Cream Pie served warm with homemade ice cream, (tiramisu if I'm in a restaurant). Post-race meal is whatever I'm craving at the moment, but something with french fries is always good. And I have many favorite books by A Prayer for Owen Meany by John Irving is a strong contender. I think you know everything about me. I'll have to think about that one more...

kkcbelle - 2012-07-18 12:24 AM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

I'm home!!!!  And all I can say is I don't like two days off in a row even on a recovery week.  Feel blah and bloated!

Anywho, maybe on the race front.  There is a little sprint about 1:30 away from Madison that I might do.  I'm not setting an alarm so if I wake up and feel like it, off I go.  If not, I have the back up work out from he$$ to keep me occupied.

Technically, I don't need to answer the extra credit question, by my favorite post race meal is a either left-over spicy sausage lasagna from Vin Santo (took Kim there) or left-over mushroom Chicken Burrito from Eldorado Grille.  Neither can be eaten for at least three hours post race, but totally yummy once the gut settles down.

Favorite dessert is Tirimasu from Vin Santo.  Otherwise, 60% dark chocolate will do.

kkcbelle - 2012-07-17 10:24 PM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

No racing for me, Good Luck with your relay and Oly, Kyla!!!!  That sounds like an endurance weekend in more ways than one!

My favorite dessert is probably panna cotta...but at home we always have ice cream in the fridge, my most recent fave is this Kentucky Bourbon Vanilla, omg, super duper rich and yummy.

Post race, a big juicy bacon burger will do just fine with bottled root beer, preferably Sprecher.

You guys know everything about me already...well, did I ever tell you I learned how to filet a salmon perfectly using just an ulu?  Interesting tidbit from my life in the arctic. 

edited to find out why Suzy doesn't technically need to answer the extra credit question???

kt65 - 2012-07-18 2:41 PM

kkcbelle - 2012-07-17 10:24 PM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

 

No racing for me, Good Luck with your relay and Oly, Kyla!!!!  That sounds like an endurance weekend in more ways than one!

My favorite dessert is probably panna cotta...but at home we always have ice cream in the fridge, my most recent fave is this Kentucky Bourbon Vanilla, omg, super duper rich and yummy.

Post race, a big juicy bacon burger will do just fine with bottled root beer, preferably Sprecher.

You guys know everything about me already...well, did I ever tell you I learned how to filet a salmon perfectly using just an ulu?  Interesting tidbit from my life in the arctic. 

 

edited to find out why Suzy doesn't technically need to answer the extra credit question???

Because if you're racing you don't have to answer it!  I did, just in case, I sleep in.

Did you know Sprecher is a WI Brand?  The brewery is very close to where we live and the restaurant is less than 5' from our house!

I am also an open book.  I am trying to think what people might not know about me, but can't come up with a thing. Ha!

kkcbelle - 2012-07-18 12:24 AM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

I'm not racing this weekend. We have a big family reunion to go to. 

As for desserts I like fruit most.  I like Brownies, and if I buy mixes the older boys will make them for me. The kids always beg me to make them chocolate chip cookies and if we have no chips snickerdoddle cookies.

Post race meal, Tacos with lots of salsa, esp. if my Brother in Law makes them. He makes the best tacos. 

My favorite book as a child was Summer of the Monkeys. My older brother and sister read it to us a chapter a night. It was awesome. And then I read it again and again about a million times.

Something that you don't already know. My big news. I'm going to be in Florida in November. Endurance Sports contacted me a couples of weeks ago.  They had a IM Florida spot and I decided to go for it. IM Florida 2012 will be my first Ironman and I'm hoping just to finish.

Tiana

kkcbelle - 2012-07-18 8:55 AM

kkcbelle - 2012-07-17 10:24 PM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

Great answers!!!

Alas, I am racing, so I don't have to answer those!!

Friday-Saturday I'm doing the Ragnar Relay from the Canadian border to Whidbey Island. Currently the spreadsheet has me running 3 legs for 17 miles at 10pm, 4am, and 1:30pm. I've also offered up another short run leg if the leader (who sounds like she's injured) needs help. We'll see how that goes! Two other local dudes are doing this with me... Supposed to finish up Saturday afternoon.

Sunday morning us three amigos are slated to race the Seafair Olympic triathlon. Did I say race? Oh, maybe just slog. We'll see how we're all doing after spending 36 hours in a van with 9 other peeps. Good times!!

And FWIW, Granny Hupfeld's Apple Cream Pie served warm with homemade ice cream, (tiramisu if I'm in a restaurant). Post-race meal is whatever I'm craving at the moment, but something with french fries is always good. And I have many favorite books by A Prayer for Owen Meany by John Irving is a strong contender. I think you know everything about me. I'll have to think about that one more...

 

Yeah what she said!!

tritiny - 2012-07-18 4:12 PM

kkcbelle - 2012-07-18 12:24 AM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

I'm not racing this weekend. We have a big family reunion to go to. 

As for desserts I like fruit most.  I like Brownies, and if I buy mixes the older boys will make them for me. The kids always beg me to make them chocolate chip cookies and if we have no chips snickerdoddle cookies.

Post race meal, Tacos with lots of salsa, esp. if my Brother in Law makes them. He makes the best tacos. 

My favorite book as a child was Summer of the Monkeys. My older brother and sister read it to us a chapter a night. It was awesome. And then I read it again and again about a million times.

Something that you don't already know. My big news. I'm going to be in Florida in November. Endurance Sports contacted me a couples of weeks ago.  They had a IM Florida spot and I decided to go for it. IM Florida 2012 will be my first Ironman and I'm hoping just to finish.

Tiana

WOOHOO!!!  That is awesome news!! 

kt65 - 2012-07-18 3:41 PM

kkcbelle - 2012-07-17 10:24 PM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

 

No racing for me, Good Luck with your relay and Oly, Kyla!!!!  That sounds like an endurance weekend in more ways than one!

My favorite dessert is probably panna cotta...but at home we always have ice cream in the fridge, my most recent fave is this Kentucky Bourbon Vanilla, omg, super duper rich and yummy.

Post race, a big juicy bacon burger will do just fine with bottled root beer, preferably Sprecher.

You guys know everything about me already...well, did I ever tell you I learned how to filet a salmon perfectly using just an ulu?  Interesting tidbit from my life in the arctic. 

 

edited to find out why Suzy doesn't technically need to answer the extra credit question???

How about when your flight is landing in LA (that's Lower Alabama on this side of the country) to join us in Florida???

tdl1972 - 2012-07-18 4:44 PM

tritiny - 2012-07-18 4:12 PM

kkcbelle - 2012-07-18 12:24 AM It may not be Wednesday yet where I sit, but it's close enough!! In Suzy's absence, I get to ask the all-important Wednesday question: Who is ready to throw down this weekend? Tell us about your race and your plan for success!! Not racing? Hmmm... What is your favorite dessert?! Favorite post-race meal? Favorite book? Tell us something about you we don't already know!

I'm not racing this weekend. We have a big family reunion to go to. 

As for desserts I like fruit most.  I like Brownies, and if I buy mixes the older boys will make them for me. The kids always beg me to make them chocolate chip cookies and if we have no chips snickerdoddle cookies.

Post race meal, Tacos with lots of salsa, esp. if my Brother in Law makes them. He makes the best tacos. 

My favorite book as a child was Summer of the Monkeys. My older brother and sister read it to us a chapter a night. It was awesome. And then I read it again and again about a million times.

Something that you don't already know. My big news. I'm going to be in Florida in November. Endurance Sports contacted me a couples of weeks ago.  They had a IM Florida spot and I decided to go for it. IM Florida 2012 will be my first Ironman and I'm hoping just to finish.

Tiana

WOOHOO!!!  That is awesome news!! 

ROGER THAT!!!!   we're all staying at shores of panama.. you need more details, fire away!

can't wait to meet you!!!!