Brian and the Tri Tarts Group - Full (Page 17)

enders_shadow - 2008-02-27 8:31 AM Morning! (Sorry I've been MIA - lurking mostly, that whole work thing, y'know) I have a potentially stupid question about racing & HR. Pretty much all of my training now is HR - which is working out great for me. But now what happens when I race? Do I pay attention to HR? Or just run run run run run? Does it matter if it's a long race vs. a short race? (Do I pay attention to HR during my half-mary but ignore it during the sprint tri?) I like to listen to the cheep cheep cheep of my HRM when I run, but I assume that's quite irritating to do during a race. I've said it before, and I'm sure I'll say it again - training was so much easier when I didn't know what I was doing. Have a great day!

Hehe i'm glad you asked this!  I've been wondering the same thing.  I LOVE the HR training, especially for running.  It's done some great things for me.  But do I turn the zones off for my races and trust my body to do what it's been trained to do or do I pace myself.  I'd imagine for a sprint or a 5K, it's fine to just GO.  But I would think for longer races, where the success factor is more about your endurance training, then you would need to pay more attention to it to make sure you can get through the day.  But I was thinking to you hurt your base building by pushing that hard for that long?  I really am liking this sport and long term, I know I need to work on base building if I ever want to get my running up enough to do longer runs after swimming and biking. 

enders_shadow - 2008-02-27 7:31 AM Morning! (Sorry I've been MIA - lurking mostly, that whole work thing, y'know) I have a potentially stupid question about racing & HR. Pretty much all of my training now is HR - which is working out great for me. But now what happens when I race? Do I pay attention to HR? Or just run run run run run? Does it matter if it's a long race vs. a short race? (Do I pay attention to HR during my half-mary but ignore it during the sprint tri?) I like to listen to the cheep cheep cheep of my HRM when I run, but I assume that's quite irritating to do during a race. I've said it before, and I'm sure I'll say it again - training was so much easier when I didn't know what I was doing. Have a great day!

Hi Kristin

I do pay attention to my HR during races.   For marathons, I know what HR I need to stay under in order to avoid blowing up and I learned that through training, but also racing.  For me, I need to keep my HR below the mid 160s until the last several miles of the race.  MY HR max is 197.  I follow a similar approach for the half marathon, but give myself more latitude to goose it up at around the 10K point to low 170s.  Let your training HR be your guide.  I raced my first duathlon without any guidance on HR (MY Garmin malfunctioned) and it was a little disconcerting.  I tried to run and bike by feel which seemed to work ok for that distance. The last 1m run leg I ran all out and am guessing I was in the upper 170s based on how crappy I felt .  I am sure others will give you better advice on the Sprint.

I used to have the beeping going on my Garmin during races, but I think it did bug the heck out of people.  Now I have it set up so I can look at the pacing without needing the beep. 

Suzy 

Poor thing   Get your rest and I hope you feel better and enjoy your reading.   

enders_shadow - 2008-02-27 8:31 AM Morning! (Sorry I've been MIA - lurking mostly, that whole work thing, y'know) I have a potentially stupid question about racing & HR. Pretty much all of my training now is HR - which is working out great for me. But now what happens when I race? Do I pay attention to HR? Or just run run run run run? Does it matter if it's a long race vs. a short race? (Do I pay attention to HR during my half-mary but ignore it during the sprint tri?) I like to listen to the cheep cheep cheep of my HRM when I run, but I assume that's quite irritating to do during a race. I've said it before, and I'm sure I'll say it again - training was so much easier when I didn't know what I was doing. Have a great day!

I do pay attention to HR during a race.  With experience, I'm beginning to understand how long I can sustain xHR.

For my upcoming 1/2 marathon here is my intended strategy:

• run a few beats below my LTHR (169) or in the 165-166 range for the first half.
• 7-10 miles build up to Lactate Threshold Heart-rate (LTHR)
• 11-13.1 push to about 171bpm and hold on for dear life...

A word of caution, as the above would be a little aggressive for a 1st 1/2 marathon.  This will be my 4th 1/2 marathon in the last 13 months.  So, I'm getting pretty well tuned in for this distance and certainly wasn't this "dialed in" on the first two races.  I learn a lot when racing.  I ran my last 1/2M by HR (see chart below) and learned a few things:

• My sustainable 1/2M HR is at least in the low 160's.
• I can push above LTHR for the last 3 miles.

Honestly, for triathlons, I'm still working this out.  Training at different paces and lengths while paying attention to HR is the best way to get more "in tune."  Here are a couple articles that disucss pacing for triathlon races...

• Racing a Sprint Distance Triathlon
• Racing an Olympic Distance Triathlon

Please turn off the beeping during the race.  I might run you over otherwise.

And yes, training is easier when you don't know what you're doing...  However, early on (when you don't know what you're doing), you gain tons of fitness by just training consistently.  As you progress, become fitter and faster, the returns will become smaller and smaller until you plateau.  Taking it to the next level will require a step change and the "little" details will get you there along with staying healthy, avoiding injury and staying motivated.  Those details include pacing, recovery, nutrition, periodization and sleep habits; all often overlooked when people say "just train more."

(Cleveland Half-marathon Pace and HR Chart.jpg)

enders_shadow - 2008-02-29 9:01 AM Oooh. I love charts! Thanks for the info and the pretty graph. What you're saying makes a lot of sense (especially about turning off the beeping )...I'll see if I can figure out some modified version that I think will work with what I know about my HR and how I feel. And I finally registered for a tri this season, which means I should get back in the pool. Our summer plans have been up in the air and I've avoided registering, but the fee bumps today so I went ahead and signed up for the first one at least. It's a 300m pool/12m/5K that I did last year (my 2nd tri ever)...and last year it was miserable. Cold and rainy the whole race. I should be able to beat my time, though!

Oh, you're doing Shady Grove again?  I thought about it but I think I'll stick to my current schedule for now.

I may be exhausted from the lack of sleep last night but I'm still planning how I'll come back.  I walked today--one of my shorter run loops.  I think I'll keep walking for the next week then mix in walk/jog with longer walks at first but eventually flip to longer jogs until I can run again.  No definite time line on when, just as I tolerate the change in activity.

Bike will be next--since that's actually a pretty weak area for me anyway some easy/liesurely rides at first. When I'm  a little stronger to do some speed work and get used to the aero bars!

Swimming will wait until I can keep a consistent peak flow over 600 without using the rescue inhalers.  I'll focus on slow drills and short sets until my endurance is back.

My heart rate will probably be high until I'm fully recovered so I can't see playing with the HRM he ordered me until that time.  Won't all the settings be off kilter if I start using it now?

I don't know what the details are  for yours, but nothing you enter now should be affected by your HR.  You set your own zones, so you'll have input those yourself, same thing with your weight.  So as long as you put non-sick settings, then it'll be fine when you are rocking again.

Brian

My latest Spinerval focuses on technique with two sets of single leg drills.  The first is 6 :30s each side at SCR 15 and the second is 3:30s each side at BCR 23. I noticed dead spots at the top of the pedal stroke, mainly on the left side.  What is the flaw in my technique and how do I get rid of it? 

Thanks.

Suzy

YEAH KIM!  How did the swim go?

Went fine actually.  We shared lanes but stuck to sides instead of doing circles.  I felt comfy, although I swam next to a guy who was really good and got caught in his wake a few times, especially if it was around when he flip turned.   At one point i caught a mouth full of water b/c the water level got high when he went past me, so i ended up doing a doggy paddle to clear my mouth so I could breathe, then got back into the form.  I *think* I did around 200m but honestly, I totally stopped paying attention at some point so I don't really know what I did, I'll have to wait for the results for that one.   

OWS questions...

 Okay so I did my indoor tri and loved it.  Know it's different outside w/ transitions and a real bike and all that, but I think I'm in for the long haul.  Knowing that, my tri team is considering doing North East, which is a 750m OWS.  I would love to do it since it's with the team.  In my thinking, as long as I can do 100m swim comfortably and get some OWS experience I would be okay to do this.  Does that make sense for a OWS?  Do I need to think about a wet suit?  The tri is Aug 17th and I'm trying to decide so I can hit early registration by March 31st with the team if I do it.  The rest of the race is 15 mi bike and 3.5 mi run, so that's similar to the sprint I'm already training for.  Opinions?  Thoughts?  This is 2.5 months after Reston, so I figure I have enough time to really gear up for this...

Kim,

In general, wetsuits are not worn in water over 72 degrees as you will likely oveheat.  You frequently don't know water temp for race day until race day.  Wet suits are available to rent, though I'm no sure of the fees.  They are also easily purchased, however...they take some getting used to as does OWS.

I would encourage as much OWS practice as you can get, it really is a different sort of swim than a pool swim.  Crowding, lack of defined lane space, sighting...all issues.  My second race last summer was OWS, go back an look in my RR's...it was a disaster from the get go.  I never felt comfortable in the lake, had only used my wetsuit a few times so I felt too constricted and had to partially unzip it.  Found my goggles boken race morning and had a volunteer loan me hers so I wouldn't leave a contact lens in the botom of the lake.

I won't say don't do it because this is part of the process we each decide along the way.  Just know what you may be facing. 

Congratulations on finishing your race today and having fun with it--that's the best pat!

I'm really not experienced enough to answer that.  Honestly, I've never done a single-leg drill.  All last year, I just rode, getting time in the saddle.  I do plan to be more methodical this year.  I'm betting the best way to address the dead spot at the top is to keep doing single-leg drills.  Anything that techincal in nature, I know this from swim drills, is going to take drilling the technique over weeks, perhaps months, to make improvements.

FIRST OF ALL... GREAT JOB ON YOUR FIRST TRIATHLON!!!

You should be fine by then for a 750m open water swim.  I bet your tri-team has some OWS practices planned over the summer.  Do as many as you can.  Continue to log time in the pool.  They usually have kayaks out there for you to grab if needed. You won't need to, but it's nice to know they are there.

By August in Virgina, it is highly unlikely you will need a wetsuit.  However, might be helpful for OWS practices in the early summer.  I have a sleeveless (QR Ultrajohn) that has worked for temperatures between 60 and 77 (didn't need for 77deg water, but 2 of my races were this warm and it didn't hurt).  Most triathlons don't allow wetsuits for 78deg and above.

How is the "clipping in" going?

That makes sense for OWS.  I def want to get out and in some lakes to practice to just get comfortable out there.  I have friends that live near where the tri would be that are water people, so it is possible to get out to that lake or whatever before Aug.  Yeah I read the site and they said there are kayaks and buoys that you can grab on to if you really need to as long as you don't move forward with them.  I'm glad I may not need a wet suit..that's a lot of $$ that I'd rather not swim.  I know I may need one before I reach my goal weight, but I would rather put it off as long as possible so I maybe only need one now and one at goal rather than maybe having to go through 2 before goal and one at goal.

 Badly.  I am going to the shop this week to get my pedals loosened.  I am having so much trouble, but non on spin bikes.  They are all shimano cleats and pedals, it has to be that they are too tight.

OK "Tarts," I know this is the toughest time of the year to stick with training.  You're all doing marvelously.  I can attest at least a portion of my consistency to being accountable to you gals... I wouldn't be much of a mentor if I didn't practice what I preach. 

A lot of us have races coming up.  I really think having some early Spring races keeps us honest through the winter death-grip months.  For me, having a stretching goal for that April half-marathon has really kept me motivated... along with all of your inspires. 

With these races coming up, start thinking about your plan for race day.  What to wear has got to be high on the priority list for fashion and comfort.  Also, begin to envision yourself accomplishing your goal.  At this point, you should have a pretty good idea of what you accomplish on race day - start to visuallize that success as you embark on your daily training.  A mental game I use is when doing Fartleks, I envision myself passing other guys in my age group:  It's fun and pumps me up - corny, I know...

With regard to pre-race training, you can taper a little on the volume of training the 6-12 days before your race (10-20 days for a marathon or half-iron), but probably don't need to back off too much for shorter races.  I will start incorporating slightly more running at my planned pace.  That is, my weekend runs will start slow, build to race pace, hold for a few miles then cool-down for a couple miles at recovery pace (vs. all slow).  The idea is to get the body and mind prepared to race.

Rest and nutrition the week prior to the race are really important.  Get lots of sleep - for some, maintaining a regular training routine is helpful to consistent sleep.  Some people think carbo-loading means gorging yourself the night before a race.  DON'T DO IT!!!  Again, for shorter races (5k, 10k, sprint Tri) it's totally unnecessary.  Further, it should occur in moderation the 3-4 days prior to the race.  The same goes for fluids and electrolytes.  The night before any race should be relaxing with a conservative, nothing funky, moderate meal; low in fats, spices and easily digested.  Keep hydrated, but don't flush all the electrolytes.  I consume lots of water and moderate amounts of pretzels the day before a race.

Great words of advice in that post! 

 
I'm kind of nervous about my 5k next week b/c with this last minute business trip, my training (more nutrition)  is not going to be as on point.  I am definitely going to be able to get to the hotel gym tonight for my long treadmill run (50 minutes), so that is good, I was worried I wouldn't have any time to work out.  I'm hoping that tomorrow morning before starting the trip back I can get something in as well. 

Hey where is everyone?!?! 

I'm really not on program right now with  moving and then my trip end of the week for work.  What should I do to get ready for Sunday's 5K??  Maybe long run on Wednesday, shorter runs Thur-Fri?   

Hi Kim

What about changing out the Thursday run for the bike and a swim or just a bike?  That would probably keep your legs limber, but not too tired heading into the 5K.  I swear that biking and learning to swim has done wonders for my running.  I talked to a guy last night who said he took an hour off his marathon time when training for his first IM and he attributes that to the cross training the bike and learning to swim provided him.

Suzy