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2010-10-18 2:07 PM
in reply to: #3158307

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
JorgeM - 2010-10-18 10:31 AM
shmeeg - 2010-10-18 9:41 AM Jorge, I am looking to do this in conjunction with a OS run program as well.  I should just do days 1 and 3 then the optional w/o on non running days correct?
If that fits your needs and how much training load you can handle then yes, but you'll have to try this out and see if it it is too much, too little or just enough.


Sorry, maybe I didn't ask that right.  If all things were equal, and I were to only pick two of the workouts to do each week would 1&3 be the best combination or would 1&2 or 2&3 be better?  Or can that not be answered here because it's too specific as you said above? 

Do you (or anyone who has done this plan before and seen this result) have any idea if there is a run efficiency or speed increase from just doing the cycling program?


Thanks!


2010-10-18 2:13 PM
in reply to: #3158559

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
shmeeg - 2010-10-18 2:07 PM
JorgeM - 2010-10-18 10:31 AM
shmeeg - 2010-10-18 9:41 AM Jorge, I am looking to do this in conjunction with a OS run program as well.  I should just do days 1 and 3 then the optional w/o on non running days correct?
If that fits your needs and how much training load you can handle then yes, but you'll have to try this out and see if it it is too much, too little or just enough.


Sorry, maybe I didn't ask that right.  If all things were equal, and I were to only pick two of the workouts to do each week would 1&3 be the best combination or would 1&2 or 2&3 be better?  Or can that not be answered here because it's too specific as you said above? 

Do you (or anyone who has done this plan before and seen this result) have any idea if there is a run efficiency or speed increase from just doing the cycling program?


Thanks!


Prob Day 1 and Day 3 would work best as those would be the most specific/intense goal-wise for a give phase. That said, I don't know how intense the running program you'll follow will be hence try it out see how it goes.
2010-10-18 2:18 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Thank you Jorge for this great training resource. Having worked with you for over 3 years as my coach prior to having my son, I can honestly say I am excited for the challenge and motivation to get my cycle fitness back on track. I will be starting this week with the workouts as the trainer, tri bike and I need to get reacquainted
2010-10-18 2:21 PM
in reply to: #3158573

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Prob Day 1 and Day 3 would work best as those would be the most specific/intense goal-wise for a give phase. That said, I don't know how intense the running program you'll follow will be hence try it out see how it goes.


Understood, thanks! 
2010-10-18 3:23 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Thanks Jorge!

Day 1 in the books - this is going to be painful.
2010-10-18 4:00 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011

muchos gracias!  sorry if i screwed up the spelling there.....  



2010-10-18 7:29 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Just out of curiosity, what is the best readout to have my bike computer set to? I used 3s avg power today, but I'm a complete newb to using power and am currently only 1/2 way through training and racing with a power meter Embarassed
2010-10-18 8:26 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
So far so good.  Day 1 seemed pretty easy but it was a good chance to try to get a better feel for what cadence and resistance felt like at a particular watt reading.  I did my tests last week so I had something to go off of.  Being pretty new to it, I may not have given it all.  I'll roll with it for now until we are instructed to retest.

Having some sort of structure is a lot more fun than just jumping on and riding.  As everyone said, thank you Jorge.
2010-10-18 10:27 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Day 1 went good for me, anxious for some new testing to have more accurate #'s to work with
2010-10-19 1:04 AM
in reply to: #3159440

Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
I will chime in on something I learned last winter.  I tried several ways to see the program changes as I was on the bike.  I tried pinning them to the floor joice above my head, tryng to remember, taped to my bars, etec etec. 

The best one I found was my daughters fold out chalk board.  I was able to sit it out in front of me, write down the plan and what my power parameters for each step and see it at a glance.

They are cheap and can be found in garage sales and kids resale shops.  I think we paid $5 for this one.

Joe

Mine is something like this one, just older
http://www.toysrus.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2323094


Edited by Puppetmaster 2010-10-19 1:09 AM
2010-10-19 1:43 AM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
I do the same with a small whiteboard from Staples propped-up in my window.  Works like a charm.


2010-10-19 7:59 AM
in reply to: #3159186

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
shmeeg - 2010-10-18 7:29 PM Just out of curiosity, what is the best readout to have my bike computer set to? I used 3s avg power today, but I'm a complete newb to using power and am currently only 1/2 way through training and racing with a power meter Embarassed


For recording try setting up to 1 seconds or the smallest setp your model has. For display you can set up to 3-5 seconds, this will make the power less 'jumpy' as it usually is. Still, riding indoors it is easier to control the effort while riding outdoors you will notice your power is all over the place. Over time you'll learn to pace at the right intensity but a few things to try:

1. set intervals for the sets and look at the avg power
2. some sets try to keep the power as even as possible staying within 5w +/- of your target
3. some sets ride blind, that is, don't look at the power and go by feel, that should help you sync RPE with power
2010-10-19 8:36 AM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
For those who DON'T have a power meter but who have a Kurt Kinetic or CycleOps Fluid trainer and plan using the speed/power curve to estimate power and guide your sessions with it please us the link at the bottom of this link.

Don Mckinnon (Donto) was kind enough to put that spread sheet together to make like easier for some of you. Please, of you have any questions, Don can help answering. Just post it here so it can be helpful for others! The info is based AFIK in the Kurt Kinetic power curve

Enjoy!
2010-10-19 8:39 AM
in reply to: #3159707

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
JorgeM - 2010-10-19 8:59 AM

For recording try setting up to 1 seconds or the smallest setp your model has. For display you can set up to 3-5 seconds, this will make the power less 'jumpy' as it usually is. Still, riding indoors it is easier to control the effort while riding outdoors you will notice your power is all over the place. Over time you'll learn to pace at the right intensity but a few things to try:

1. set intervals for the sets and look at the avg power
2. some sets try to keep the power as even as possible staying within 5w +/- of your target
3. some sets ride blind, that is, don't look at the power and go by feel, that should help you sync RPE with power


Hi Jorge, I just finished up Day 1.

Good advice on looking at avg. power for an interval: my power was varying quite a bit, within 5w +/- is going to be a challenge.  I guess there's a learning curve on bringing down the variance as well.  Definitely have to concentrate during these workouts, especially on 30 sec. intervals.

Like Pector55 said, it wasn't as hard as I expected (used percentages relative to CP), but then again I figure you're just trying to bait us before you set the hook :-)
2010-10-19 8:49 AM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Jorge, about the Monod model: do you agree that it is eventually valid ONLY outdoor? I mean indoor, body weight should have zero influence on the test.
2010-10-19 9:33 AM
in reply to: #3159515

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Puppetmaster - 2010-10-18 11:04 PM I will chime in on something I learned last winter.  I tried several ways to see the program changes as I was on the bike.  I tried pinning them to the floor joice above my head, tryng to remember, taped to my bars, etec etec. 

The best one I found was my daughters fold out chalk board.  I was able to sit it out in front of me, write down the plan and what my power parameters for each step and see it at a glance.


Also, another method if you have this option:  I have sliding mirrored closet doors in the room I train in, and I wrote the workout on the mirror in dry erase marker.  Worked really well yesterday.

Edited by shmeeg 2010-10-19 9:34 AM


2010-10-19 9:44 AM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Day 2  went much better although I left my sweat towel on the kitchen counter but found a better resting place for the program. My heart rate on the Garmin 305 was pegging at  235 staying above 220 for the last 5 minutes, which tells me it's not functioning correctly. I need to find the owners manual for it and reset everything to default before testing time.

Have a great day,
Darrell
2010-10-19 12:23 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
I'm in!  Thanks for doing this Jorge!!
2010-10-19 1:21 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
I'm ready for the pain.

For a display I started using an old 3x4 white board to show the planned workbout, turned long side up.  On the top third, I keep the 3 warm up sets, on the bottom third I keep the 2 cool down sets.  In the middle I write the current Q set and words of encouragement. 

Ready, Steady, Go.

2010-10-19 7:11 PM
in reply to: #3160017

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
inspectord - 2010-10-19 10:44 AM Day 2  went much better although I left my sweat towel on the kitchen counter but found a better resting place for the program. My heart rate on the Garmin 305 was pegging at  235 staying above 220 for the last 5 minutes, which tells me it's not functioning correctly. I need to find the owners manual for it and reset everything to default before testing time.

Have a great day,
Darrell


Wow dude, before I read that you acknowledged that your HRM wasn't working properly my eyes got big at your HR being up at 220 - 235  LOL.  Day 2 was tougher than day 1 but nothing unbearable yet.  This prep work is good because it's giving me a good chance to get a good system set up.  I must average 17 mph at Black Bear (June) this year.
2010-10-19 7:37 PM
in reply to: #3159863

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Plissken74 - 2010-10-19 8:49 AM Jorge, about the Monod model: do you agree that it is eventually valid ONLY outdoor? I mean indoor, body weight should have zero influence on the test.
not really, Critical Power, that is your ability to generate power is still related to your fitness, weight etc. hence the model applies. Certainly weight doesn't play as much factor indoors as you don't have to balance on your bike or overcome gravity, but still, you have to turn the pedals, you don't get as much benefits of inertia or have to overcome wind resistance.


2010-10-19 8:39 PM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
Hi Jorge, thanks for setting this up.  I started last year but had a little medical complication and had to stop riding for a while. 

I am sure it is posted somewhere, but I have been unable to find it.  How many weeks does this program go?  I am trying to set up my calendar for the winter and I have a lot of stuff going on, so I want to have the right times.  Thanks. 
2010-10-19 10:05 PM
in reply to: #3161445

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
jdwright56 - 2010-10-19 8:39 PM Hi Jorge, thanks for setting this up.  I started last year but had a little medical complication and had to stop riding for a while. 

I am sure it is posted somewhere, but I have been unable to find it.  How many weeks does this program go?  I am trying to set up my calendar for the winter and I have a lot of stuff going on, so I want to have the right times.  Thanks. 


Here it is:
http://jorgepbmcoaching.blogspot.com/2010/10/off-season-cycling-plan-v30.html

Good luck with your comeback
2010-10-20 5:28 AM
in reply to: #3154535

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011

First ride over with, and I think my estimate of how fast I should go was a bit....ambitious

I did the work out but went to fast. I know I will not be able to keep that pace for the 4x5 min tomorrow, but maybe once the 12 (?) weeks are over I can

Happy biking.

PS. Good thing this is a trainer program as our local mountain (read big hill) now is white on top

2010-10-20 7:03 AM
in reply to: #3160017

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Subject: RE: Cycling Program v3.0 - 2010 - 2011
inspectord - 2010-10-19 11:44 PM Day 2  went much better although I left my sweat towel on the kitchen counter but found a better resting place for the program. My heart rate on the Garmin 305 was pegging at  235 staying above 220 for the last 5 minutes, which tells me it's not functioning correctly. I need to find the owners manual for it and reset everything to default before testing time.

Have a great day,
Darrell



Try tightening up your strap.  I had problems with the 305 going off the rails while running on really hot, humid days, i.e., lots of sweat was making the strap move around a lot. 
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