SBR Utopia - OPEN (Page 21)

You might want to check out Profile Design, they have a much cheaper option.

Nice going! Don't think I've ever been able to bring myself to work like that on the bike so early in the morning.

Yep. TSS is a great place to start and I won't add to your description because it's pretty good.

An interesting concept is adding up TSS for the week rather than hours. This is actually how I measure my training load. Tougher weeks were more than 1100 TSS points across all 3 sports. Last week I did 750.

TSS on the bike is computed from your FTP, the power you are generating during a workout and the time you generate it.

TSS on the run is similar but is computed from your threshold pace, the pace you are running and the time you run

TSS on the swim is like the run, it's based on threshold pace and time

I really hope that the people that think this is greek will ask questions or show interest or else we will lose them. How do we avoid this ?

Once we get everyone on board with TSS, maybe we could post a Performance Chart which shows training load over time, tapering, peeking for races......

So what if you do not use power?

Will someone tell the outdoors I live in AZ and to warm up?

For me, maybe French vs Greek. It's a bit like when I worked in Paris and could follow some of the conversation but not necessarily speak/join in. Doesn't mean I'm not interested. One thing that might help is define some of the acronyms the first few times you use them and how they're calculated. I'm probably not going to train with power this year but I would like to learn. Also, if there are ways to apply the concepts to other training approaches (for me that will be HR) it might keep ppl tracking. Regardless, keep the conversation going. Good stuff. 

I get the TSS concept...but I feel like my volume is too low to have any significance to me as a metric.

For instance I am doing 3-4 rides per week of which 2 are 1 hr rides and 1-2 are 1.5 hr rides.  The 1 hr rides are typically in the 80-90 TSS range and the 1.5 hr rides in the 100-110 range.  The long rides get longer as the season gets closer.  I guess I don't have a lot of variability in my training from that standpoint where I look at weekly TSS (more just daily).  Get on and ride hard. 

I do think that if I were training for HIM or IM it comes into play much more and I would pay much more attention.

This is helpful to me. I'll be reading along, but I have VERRRRY little to add. Learning time.

A little insight to me LT test http://www.mamatris.blogspot.com/2013/01/reluctant-cyclist.html

Friel published a way of estimating TSS by HR. But it's just an estimate. The article is here

In theory you could use the BT Logs to estimate the time spent in various HR zones and then calculate a TSS. Time in each Zone is a feature of the bronze level I believe

For hoots, I did it for 2 weeks. It wasn't far off the TSS measured by power meter.

It may be fun just to see how much TSS you did in a big week, but I am not sure I would want to manually calculate this all the time

I like this idea and approach - like I mentioned, it's somewhere where I really want to improve my knowledge.  I know what TSS is, and how to measure, but that's as far as it goes = useless info.  I'm all for tracking, comparing, and getting a basic undertsanding of the physiological changes and stresses that occur once you reach certain thresholds.

How are you measuring it for the swim and run?

TP calculates it for me based on my Threshold paces. I just upload my Garmin files.

Raceday Apollo does the same. I think BT only does it for Power

This is exactly what I need to see...I have no PM, go by HR primarily and love the idea of figuring out my loading based on TSS...and no worries about calculating by hand - that's what excel is for. I'll come up with some goofy spreadsheet for you all if anyone is interested.

Please continue the discussions about metrics. It's a big black box to me - so even if I don't participate, I can absorb some knowledge.

I just read your blog. The LT test sounded like an interesting experience. With your IM training it looks like 2013 will be a very cool year for you.

I'll be happy to cheer you on :=)

<Yes - I'm a little slow to the party...sorry about that!>

I approach long rides in two different, fairly distinct ways:

1) All by myself to build up my fortitude. I look at this time as an escape from the stress of my day to day work/home and just try to take pleasure in the world around, the fact that I'm outside, I have the ability to ride down the road, and I'm preparing myself for the ultimate event (my race). For these types of rides, I plan on having everything I need with me - so lots of gear/water/food/$$. The feeling of accomplishment when returning from a long solo ride is pretty great.

2) Meeting up with people. This can either be a group ride (that i can tack some distance on before or after), or a meet-up. Often, I'll ride my bike to where my family is going to be for the day. My husband's family has a beach house about 25 miles from our house. I'll set out before anyone is ready to go and meet them there...play in the sand/surf (maybe OWS depending on the water temp), spend time with the family and then ride home.

For me - the easiest way to get from one distance (let's say 30 miles) to the next (let's say 56 so you are ready for the HIM) is to add 5 miles to each long ride...telling myself the entire time that I can ride 5 miles in my sleep...so an additional 5 miles is nothing. If you've got the time - this might be the least intimidating approach.

I also really like the idea of loops - so you know you've got a place to pee, eat a snack, put some more sunscreen on, refill the water bottles, drop off extra clothes, change the shorts that are driving you batty.

Good luck! If all else fails, just think of Yanti doing the 9-10 hour trainer ride preparing for her last IM...if she can do *that* - you can totally do 56 miles.

Ain't testing fun .  Keep cycling more and the improving test results, although painful, make all the training worth while!

So - I had a bit of an epiphany in the last couple of days...as you all may already know - I have been struggling with a severe lack of mojo (due to a very frustrating HIM last Sept) and had hesitated signing up for any races because I was afraid of getting to that dark place again. On New Year's Eve (I know - how trite), I decided I was going to do the Patriot HIM again this year because I had such a great time last year at the race. I went to the web site knowing that prices go up Jan 1. I clicked on the Register button, selected "Individual" and clicked "Submit"...and it rejected it. What? After looking at the form a little more carefully - the Individual entries were SOLD OUT! Holy Cow! The race isn't until mid June! Good for the RDs...but deflated my brief excitement.

I told my husband about it and he said, "Why don't you try to focus on one type of event instead of a tri?" Hmmm....but I like triathlon. And then I thought about it some more. He has a good point. Maybe I should. So, I thought about it some more. And I came to the conclusion that I would do the following for 2013: Great Bay Half Marathon April 7 (kind of hilly half marathon - this will be the third year in a row I will race), Vermont City Marathon Memorial Day weekend (I've run this as part of a relay team - it's in Burlington, VT and is a total blast...but I'm frightened of the distance which is a good thing), the two local tris (one sprint in July and one Oly in August), a couple of organized centuries on the bike and then see where fall takes me - either the Rev3 HIM in Old Orchard Beach (if they are still accepting entries when I get my courage up) or the Mount Desert Island Marathon in October.

Once I got this figured out - suddenly, everything kind of clicked into place. Now I'm motivated again - partially by fear of the marathon distance, but also because I'm not feeling overwhelmed by the concept of all that training. And a little part of my pea brain is saying, "Perfect - this is great for setting a base for that 2014 IM you've been thinking about."

So - bring on those long runs and long bikes...I've got this.

This to me is one of the biggest reasons for measuring TSS. The PM chart

What you are seeing here is a Performance Chart for all of last year
I included both Run and Bike. I could have added Swim, but I don't do enough of it to make it significant

There are 3 lines

Think of the pink line as "short term" load that was placed on the body. Do a tough workout, this spikes. Rest a day, it drops

Think of the blue line as "accumulated" load. In fact it's average load over something like 42 days. It's not only a measure of accumulated fatigue but also of fitness. So think of it as the 'fitness' line

The Goldish color is your "freshness". As you decrease load, your freshness goes up. But your Blue line (Fitness) is also going down. This gold line goes up and down quite quickly, almost mirroring the pink line


When you taper, your Fitness is going down slightly but your fatigue is going down faster and the net result is optimal balance/ performance

so starting in Jan 2012 going from left to right, I was building, building....exactly where we are at today

At point 1, I peaked in fatigue/fitness (blue) for my first HIM of the year and started to taper off
At point 2, I peaked in terms of freshness (gold), but I also believe I let too much fitness get away
At point 2 I did Florida 70.3 with average results, I felt stale on race day.

At Point 3, I peaked in fitness for Canadian LD champs and started to taper. My ftiness was not as high as Florida, because I was racing Olys in between and could not build much load
At Point 4, I peaked in freshness but did less of a taper. I didn't drop as much fitness as race 1. I did well


I wanted to take a run at Muskoka. So I decided to bring my Blue line the highest it had been. Point 5
But I brought it down slower than the previous two races and ended up with more fitness, less fatigue and my Podium at Muskoka 70.3

These charts are all based on TSS. That is why TSS is important.

They allow you to manage load, tapers and experiment.

I now know I can take a load greater than 5 and I know I can race well with a "freshness" like point 6. I just need to manage it.

If I am not mistaken, Bryan's coach does this for him in the background. That's what good coaches do :-)

PS : point 7 is the fall when we let our bodies recover and then start rebuilding

Doesn't Apollo do it for the swim as well? Been awhile since I've used it, and was mostly just for the bike at that.

I'm glad I'm not the only one chatting up the fauna on a long ride (or run, for that matter). It can get a little lonely out there.

yes it does. You had to manually enter the swims but I saw a twit/tweet from Dr Skiba that he has a beta version that downloads from your watch.

Calculating it all the time could be tiresome, but taking a benchmark every few weeks probably would be a good idea. I hadn't thought about this concept (TSS) before, to be honest. I don't train with power, so I am figuratively riding in the dark. It would be nice to know if my mind is conning me or not -- telling me I'm working "so hard," but when I'm actually just skating.

This sounds like a great solution and a lot of fun! I'm glad you found a plan that motivates you.

So my "benchmark" idea would be pretty worthless. To get good amazing data, like you have, one would need to be very consistent in keeping track. I can see how this chart also helps you plan for future training, as well.

With what you're doing, the workouts are similar enough each time that it won't really matter which way you go to tell how much it was. There isn't *that* much difference between 3x15 or 2x20 in this regard. When you get more into it, you can do things like what Marc showed very well in his diagram. That's something I'm still working towards as well, being able to balance the loads in that manner. So far it's been managing the accumulated points.

And my workouts will vary quite a bit more. I'll see 80 or so at times, but can also see up to 150 or more. From reading and experience, I know that much can start to have a noticeable impact on workouts for the next day or two. So when doing something harder at first, I can watch the TSS on the Garmin to keep tabs on the load. I may have had it in my head to ride for 2.5-3 hrs, but if that score is getting up higher, then I'll know i can stop earlier. Or if I didn't watch the score, I'll know to expect to be a touch less energetic the next day or two if it's up at 180 when reviewing later.

Yes, the TSS is more for measuring loads, so you would want to have as much of the data as you can get. I'm not sure what all BT has (or will have with the update), but Training Peaks does also attempt to do a heartrate version of TSS (hrTSS). I don't know how accurate or consistent it is, but it would be something to get used to the idea.