Peter Sagan....it was just a pinch (Page 3)

In Europe, don't they have commercials where topless women are advertising for ordinary things like orange juice?

I dunno...considering the circumstances, I thought it was pretty funny.  I'm pretty sure it's just the western world (knowing Cannondale is a US company) that's reacting to this.  Sagan is Slovakian and the Tour of Flanders is in Belgium.

I suppose people are entitled to their opinon or views...this incident cries BFD to me.

I never do.

Serious question, if we primarily valued women in competitive cycling as athletes, however you define that, would you still see podium girls as a problem?

yes but as a society we often vilify anyone who "tells" It is not confined to women and this issue. But I still think you are making a mountain out of a molehill. On the scale of terrible things that a 23 year old can do, this is very low on the list.  If you have an extreme reaction to everything, the reaction becomes meaningless.  An extreme reaction should be reserved for an extreme offense.  Its like the boy who cried wolf.

If women had pay equity across all fields, I think the role of podium girl would probably go away on its own. We'll agree that I won't be seeing those changes any time soon. You may say I'm a dreamer, and all that ...

I called his actions shameful. They are. 

I called the practice of hiring podium girls ridiculous.

I'm not seeing the extremeness in that reaction. 

You didn't answer the question.  

ETA: I'm all for pay equity.  But I have no interest in a society that tells me that it's inappropriate to appreciate good looking people.  I love looking at a really hot chick.  If I was into dudes, I would feel the same about hot dudes (except for George Clooney, he's hot to straight and gay guys).

In another life my wife was a model.  It's a job.  She eventually quit and found a job that carried more meaning (and ALOT less money) to her.  Hiring models, of both sexes, to promote a product, or "dress up" a podium, because they are great to look at, is not ridiculous....and it probably pays pretty damn well depending on the race and coverage.

i mean you just called an entire profession, modeling, ridiculous. thats a pretty extreme position. shameful is a pretty strong descriptor.

I think there is a continuum that includes appreciation for and personal definitions of attraction. That's great. I like looking at certain things and not others. Similarly, I find some people attractive and not others. Such is human nature and the practice rests on generations of our evolution as a species.

On that same continuum exists the practice of objectifying men and women. Given the patriarchy upon which our society is defined, women are objectified more than men and the costs of that objectification are greater. But to head you off at the pass, men are objectified as well. I have a problem with that and place the practice of hiring podium girls toward the objectification end of the continuum. I would continue to have a problem with that objectification were we to suddenly find ourselves in a scenario where women athletes were valued to the degree that male athletes are.

In short, yes ... I'd still have a problem with the practice. 

The reaction to me calling the practice of hiring podium girls ridiculous was more extreme than me using the word ridiculous.

Shameful is not a very strong descriptor. It's a fitting adjective in this case.
 

Thank you.  I can understand this position much more easily than one that only advocates the removal of podium girls as a partial solution to a much larger problem (although I understand you feel that way as way).

We're approaching the "exceptions" game again. I know people who used to be models too. You list one, I'll list one. It's not productive and deflects from the larger conversation.

Have you considered some nicely coordinated streamers for dressing up the podium?

Maybe we should only allow ugly women to do sports and be podium girls.  Then you might be happy.  Oh and also who would pay these equal $$$ to these professional women?  They need to earn the money by providing a product people want to pay to watch.  Obviously that is not happening.  

No, I will not watch that.

Regardless of the discussion of podium girls, I agree Sagan's behavior was shameful.  He should be ashamed for doing this.  I get he thinks it was just a joke, but it's an inappropriate joke.  I think some reactions to it can be extreme, but that doesn't change my opinion of the behavior.  I'm still going to cheer for Sagan as an athlete because he is sick good and entertaining.  This incident isn't going to change that - for me.

If I saw my son do this, he would get an earful from me.  There would be no misunderstanding that it is inappropriate and he should be ashamed for the behavior.  

You are obviously passionate about your work and it deserves a lot more attention however; if as you say this is "human nature and the practice rests on generations of our evolution as a species”

We can only hope to influence the next generation, or two…

I know I value women in general (which I was taught by my mother) and in sports which I would assume is a result of the lessons (in general) I was taught.

My sons have been taught the same lessons; to respect them and treat them as they themselves would want to be treated.

I would venture to say there is a much deeper root to this problem but I have done my part in shaping the future treatment of women at least from my sons…

As far as pay and worth those two must be separated.

You can only get paid what the market deems is your worth.   

A sponsor makes money through sales of their products more men, more money, more sales, more pay…

The “draw” to woman’s sports say WNB is much lower so their pay is going to be lower. It is not they are not as good or not “valued” as highly they just cannot generate enough income to support the pay you think is fair or equitable…

I for one would love to be able to Swim, Bike and Run like a girl (woman) say like

"The Queen of Kona"  Paula Newby-Fraser. Just sayin...

So will there be podium guys in womens cycling??

Just saying......swings and roundabouts and all that.

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