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2012-04-04 12:26 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
kenj - 2012-04-04 10:24 AM

bdenehy - 2012-04-04 11:15 AM

First,  Thanks Ken, for hosting this group!  All of the bios are inspirational in themselves.

Since there are a lot of Yankees here, I'm wondering when you start OWS training.  Last year I started swimming in my backyard pool once I opened it and hit around 67F.  I was a non-swimming rock and had no cold weather gear for swimming.  It took some getting used to, but no real problems with the temperature.  Thankfully, I've outgrown my pool in terms of distance, and when I can I fit it in I swim with a masters group.  Since I have a June 3 HIM, I'm getting antsy to work on OWS (which I either do in the Hudson river, or in a lake about 30 minutes from me).  Thanks to the warm winter, the Hudson is 10 degrees warmer than it was at this time last year (50 deg F now).  I know its still too soon but when would you jump in? I'm thinking ~55F might be safe now that I have a wetsuit and just ordered a neoprene cap, socks, and gloves (My wife is going to cut up my credit card soon).

Happy training!

Most recent instantaneous value: 10.3   04-04-2012  09:45 EST 
Graph of  Temperature, water, degrees Celsius

 

Good question! I have the benefit of 2 pools, high school where I can swim the masters and Y where I take lessons with the tri group and swim early in the morning.  In the summer we have Canandaigua lake, which is one of the finger lakes.  We swim a buoy line which is about a mile out and back.  Plus at any point along the buoys it is never more than neck level.  The buoy line is put in just prior to Memorial Day weekend, which works out since the first race is the first weekend in June.

Temperature wise, I force myself in at least once prior to the race just to get a wet suit swim in, but it is usually in the low 60's by then.  This year, unless things change, I am guessing it will be in the upper 60's!

Now swimming in the Hudson, doesn't that offer a whole host of other issues besides temperatures? Wink



I swim in Lake Michigan in downtown Chicago or a small local lake a friend lives on. Temps will probably be near 60 before I do any OWS'ing. Till then I go to the local Lifetime Fitness pool


2012-04-04 12:50 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
bdenehy - 2012-04-04 12:23 PM
CyborgQueen - 2012-04-04 11:34 AM

Bill - Since I live here in Vegas, OWS is pretty much available all year. Due to the very mild winter we had (it lasted like a month), the water is a little warmer than last year.   

I think water temps is also relying on how much you can handle the cold water. You'll never know until you jump in. 

When May starts, the Tri Club has OWS every Wednesday night (right before dusk, so it'll still be light out. :-)

I would avoid Hudson River often because of the current, it can throw off your times, unless if you swim against the current! 

Thanks DJ and Ken.  So I guess its not a safety issue below 60.  I'll just have to see if its for me.  I swim accross the river and back so the current hurts a little since i like to end where i started (swim upstream a bit on the return), but time isnt my concern right now so much as going farther without stopping.  Its closer to me than the closest lake, but I'll probably move to the lake once the speed boat crowd starts filling up the river.  BTW, I'm way jealous of anyone living in or around Vegas...

I would say that you are risking hypothermia under sixty and wouldn't do it.
2012-04-04 1:39 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
Meulen - 2012-04-04 12:39 PM
n.k - 2012-04-04 11:09 AM

Hello everyone, I am really excited about being apart of this group.  It sounds like we have some very experienced members... I am looking forward to picking your brains for how to go faster and longer.  Also, I am excited for the newer members too- I can't wait to hear about your first races and to watch you all get hooked on this sport!

So, my first question: living in Oregon and training almost exclusively in the early AM means that I am spending a lot of time on the trainer.  I don't have a power meter (or even a cycle computer on my bike), so I am doing all my trainer sessions using time as my intervals. 

For example, this morning I did 8 sets of: [6 mins moderate spin, 2 mins hard effort in the big ring].  I mix up my time intervals from session to session.  You can go back into my logs to see some other examples. 

Is this good use of my time?  Other ideas of trainer sessions?  I do have a heart rate monitor I could use, but I'm confused on HR zones and how to use them while riding the trainer.

N.K. for me, I use a power meter. But what you're doing is in no way a waste of time. RPE is an old tried and true method. Although, with the power meter you do get a new perspective on RPE and most of the time it's pretty shocking. Which is why PM's are sooooo effective. Other ideas: I'm not sure what kind of trainer you're using, but kurt kinetic has a powermeter for theirs that can be had for $75 You could study HR a little more and train with HR You could also train by speed. Get a computer that hooks up to the back wheel. I think trainerroad.com has a plan that's based on using your speed on the trainer.

Definitely will look into the power meter option for the KK since I have one. I've considered trainer road with the ANT+ stick too, but I may wait til the fall/winter now.

2012-04-04 2:28 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
n.k - 2012-04-04 12:09 PM

Hello everyone, I am really excited about being apart of this group.  It sounds like we have some very experienced members... I am looking forward to picking your brains for how to go faster and longer.  Also, I am excited for the newer members too- I can't wait to hear about your first races and to watch you all get hooked on this sport!

So, my first question: living in Oregon and training almost exclusively in the early AM means that I am spending a lot of time on the trainer.  I don't have a power meter (or even a cycle computer on my bike), so I am doing all my trainer sessions using time as my intervals. 

For example, this morning I did 8 sets of: [6 mins moderate spin, 2 mins hard effort in the big ring].  I mix up my time intervals from session to session.  You can go back into my logs to see some other examples. 

Is this good use of my time?  Other ideas of trainer sessions?  I do have a heart rate monitor I could use, but I'm confused on HR zones and how to use them while riding the trainer.

There was a very good article on this posted yesterday on the Carmichael Training System facebook page.  I looked quickly for a link but cant find the article today.  In a nutshell it said for time crunched triathletes, you are much better off doing hard intervals with adequate recovery 3 or 4 days per week per sport than doing long endurance efforts day in and day out.  In other words, what your are doing on the bike trainer is a good thing, as long as you are being honest with yourself on the effort. 

There are also different ways to do this.  You can do low cadence high resistant efforts or low resistance and high cadence efforts as well.  I would mix them up.  I would also do a variety of longer efforts, say 3 X 10 minutes with 3 minutes recovery one day then a couple days later do 6 X 4 minutes.  The effort on the 4 minute intervals should be harder than the 10 minutes. 

The key is consistency and being honest with yourself on the efforts when using perceived effort.

2012-04-04 2:31 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
robingray_260 - 2012-04-04 1:10 PM

speaking of trainers.... I have been waiting a very long time (over a year) for our piece of crap trainer to finally break (it is like 10 years old performance brand trainer and I have to have the TV volume at max).  The bolt that changes the roller height is now stripped and it is a major PITA to change the height and since my hubby and I have diferent size wheels, well.....

So I am pushing a new trainer and soon! Based on all the reviews I have read I think it is between the kurt kinetic fluid trainer and the Cycleops 2 fluid trainer. What would you all get - do you have a preference?  Price is pretty much identical. Thanks!   

I have had both and prefer the cyclops fluid over the KK, just because it is easier to put the bike in and out.  But if you are considering the low cost option for power training, then the KK makes a lot of sense.  Either way, you can't go wrong.

2012-04-04 7:52 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
May I join your group again, Ken?  


2012-04-04 7:53 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED

abake - 2012-04-04 8:52 PM May I join your group again, Ken?  

I have been saving you a spot!

Post an updated bio when you can!

2012-04-04 10:12 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training OPEN
I will be moving to Ft Eustis, VA in Jul/Aug time frame.  These were my first two post to BT so it may take a while to get the trick of the trade on this. This may seem a random on page 6 from a question on page 3.

Edited by rpmfast 2012-04-04 10:14 PM
2012-04-04 10:13 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
Got an 8 mile run in this evening.  I was going to try and get a brick in but a thunderstorm popped up about 6:30 and put an end to those hopes.  So I worked to about 7:30 and took off for a run.  My time was very slow but I was just taking it easy.  I guess that's kind of what I'm going to be doing this year while training for the longer races.
2012-04-05 7:45 AM
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rpmfast - 2012-04-04 11:12 PM I will be moving to Ft Eustis, VA in Jul/Aug time frame.  These were my first two post to BT so it may take a while to get the trick of the trade on this. This may seem a random on page 6 from a question on page 3.

Don't worry about it Ryan, it will come to you pretty quick!  Once you get it all figured out it will probably change since they are in the middle of re-writing the site now.  Hopefully for the better!  They have included the users in this so I think it will be!

2012-04-05 7:46 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED

Wesley12 - 2012-04-04 11:13 PM Got an 8 mile run in this evening.  I was going to try and get a brick in but a thunderstorm popped up about 6:30 and put an end to those hopes.  So I worked to about 7:30 and took off for a run.  My time was very slow but I was just taking it easy.  I guess that's kind of what I'm going to be doing this year while training for the longer races.

When it comes to running, mostly slow is a good thing!  Nice running Wesley!



2012-04-05 7:47 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED

Going to get in some running and maybe some strength training this morning.  Slow getting moving, but I guess that is what vacations are for.  (or so my wife tells me Laughing)

So what are the rest of you up to today?



Edited by kenj 2012-04-05 7:51 AM
2012-04-05 8:07 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
Swim today for me, not till later though. Going to get out on the bike this afternoon I hope. Depends on how long I spend trying to get a passport
2012-04-05 8:29 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
Working at the moment!

After work I plan on running. Going to make an attempt at doing 8 miles at race pace. After today my speedwork runs get dialed down. So this will be my last chance to gain some confidence in my race pace. AFter that, it depends how I feel. I might sit on the couch and play Xbox! lol
2012-04-05 9:51 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
kenj - 2012-04-05 8:47 AM

Going to get in some running and maybe some strength training this morning.  Slow getting moving, but I guess that is what vacations are for.  (or so my wife tells me Laughing)

So what are the rest of you up to today?

5 miles today - 8 miles tomorrow - 18 miles Saturday...........

Starting to feel a little beat up - I have a few aches and pains that aren't going away as quick as they used to. 1 more week to go before my taper starts - To be honest I'm looking forward to it.........Embarassed 

I'm stating to plan my tri season which I always find fun to do!



Edited by acv 2012-04-05 9:51 AM
2012-04-05 10:08 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
acv - 2012-04-05 9:51 AM

kenj - 2012-04-05 8:47 AM

Going to get in some running and maybe some strength training this morning.  Slow getting moving, but I guess that is what vacations are for.  (or so my wife tells me Laughing)

So what are the rest of you up to today?

5 miles today - 8 miles tomorrow - 18 miles Saturday...........

Starting to feel a little beat up - I have a few aches and pains that aren't going away as quick as they used to. 1 more week to go before my taper starts - To be honest I'm looking forward to it.........Embarassed 

I'm stating to plan my tri season which I always find fun to do!



Sounds like you're hitting your peak training perfect!! LOL

I always freak out during taper. Things hurt, I feel tired, bored from limited training, etc...etc.. etc... If I trust the plan though, I always end up with some extra spring in my step on race day.


2012-04-05 10:27 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED

Yeah, tapering is tough for me too.  I get all up in my head knowing I can do so much more but need to hold back.

I got a solid hour trainer ride in this morning.  Took everyone's comments about RPE to heart and was really honest with my efforts.  Gotta admit, I pushed myself to a harder level than normal.  Walking up the stairs to my classroom today hurt like hell!

Lastly, is there an easy to read list of all of this group's members (and maybe links to their training blogs)?  Its a little tough to scroll through all the pages and locate all the members.

Happy training!

2012-04-05 10:31 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
n.k - 2012-04-05 10:27 AM

Yeah, tapering is tough for me too.  I get all up in my head knowing I can do so much more but need to hold back.

I got a solid hour trainer ride in this morning.  Took everyone's comments about RPE to heart and was really honest with my efforts.  Gotta admit, I pushed myself to a harder level than normal.  Walking up the stairs to my classroom today hurt like hell!

Lastly, is there an easy to read list of all of this group's members (and maybe links to their training blogs)?  Its a little tough to scroll through all the pages and locate all the members.

Happy training!



Nice job on the trainer!!!

I think Ken is working a list. He's traveling so we should cut him a break and let him enjoy......for now! LOL
2012-04-05 10:41 AM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED

I have a swim and aquajog planned this morning and then hopefully a 1/2 hour easy trainer ride this afternoon. Today is going to be busy though. 

x2 on the trainer N.K.!

Have a great Thursday everyone!



Edited by robingray_260 2012-04-05 10:42 AM
2012-04-05 12:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
Meulen - 2012-04-05 11:08 AM
acv - 2012-04-05 9:51 AM
kenj - 2012-04-05 8:47 AM

Going to get in some running and maybe some strength training this morning.  Slow getting moving, but I guess that is what vacations are for.  (or so my wife tells me Laughing)

So what are the rest of you up to today?

5 miles today - 8 miles tomorrow - 18 miles Saturday...........

Starting to feel a little beat up - I have a few aches and pains that aren't going away as quick as they used to. 1 more week to go before my taper starts - To be honest I'm looking forward to it.........Embarassed 

I'm stating to plan my tri season which I always find fun to do!

Sounds like you're hitting your peak training perfect!! LOL I always freak out during taper. Things hurt, I feel tired, bored from limited training, etc...etc.. etc... If I trust the plan though, I always end up with some extra spring in my step on race day.

Hitting the peak next week! I know I need to trust the plan and let the taper do it's thing, just have to be patient for another week.

Thanks.

2012-04-05 12:12 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
n.k - 2012-04-05 11:27 AM

Yeah, tapering is tough for me too.  I get all up in my head knowing I can do so much more but need to hold back.

I got a solid hour trainer ride in this morning.  Took everyone's comments about RPE to heart and was really honest with my efforts.  Gotta admit, I pushed myself to a harder level than normal.  Walking up the stairs to my classroom today hurt like hell!

Lastly, is there an easy to read list of all of this group's members (and maybe links to their training blogs)?  Its a little tough to scroll through all the pages and locate all the members.

Happy training!

Ken makes a nice little matrix that has links to all the logs. Once the group is settled out I'm sure he will do it.

The other way is to add everyone as a friend. Also if you click on the persons name it takes you to the their blog and then you can click on the logs.



2012-04-05 4:27 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
kenj - 2012-04-05 5:47 AM

Going to get in some running and maybe some strength training this morning.  Slow getting moving, but I guess that is what vacations are for.  (or so my wife tells me Laughing)

So what are the rest of you up to today?

 

HOPEFULLY - if the winds die down, I'll be starting my Tues/Thurs night rides. Tuesday nights are slightly faster and Hilly. Thursday nights are lower key, and I get Golden Spoon Frozen yogurt afterwards. :-)

The winds need to die down first. 

This has me questioning a little bit:  Will it affect my training much?

Looking at the Beginner 1/2 plan - The bike plan has me going 1 hour rides to 1 1/2 hours for the first month and increasing a little bit for second and third. Longest ride will be 3 hours, and that's done only once, a couple weeks before my HIM.   However, if I do the Tues-Thurs night rides, I will be going more for called for (:45-1:30 more).  I will be following the runs and the swims to the letter.  I will treat my Tuesdays as my hard/hilly days, and Thursdays as my easy days (and it will help because I don't have to go all out and will easily keep up with the group - C ride), and I probably will add other C rides or 2+ hr rides on the weekends OR do any trainer rides that is on the training plan - usually harder effort for 45 minutes or so (stuff that I feel I shouldn't skip). 

Will the extra bike training be alright? FWIW - I've done a Century and did not have any pain/soreness/nor needed recovery. 

My little concern is this is with a group, so we do stop at traffic lights (some parts has no traffic lights for 5 or 7 miles), stop midway for light snack, etc.   I feel like if I don't ride 2+ hours straight without stopping will hurt me at the HIM because I'm used to stopping at points.   Should I schedule some rides that has no-stopping, and "eat as I go" type of ride to help with my endurance?

The HIM is flat. Majority of my routes are hilly.    Sorry if my questions are ambivalent. 

2012-04-05 4:29 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED

Meulen - 2012-04-05 6:29 AM Working at the moment! After work I plan on running. Going to make an attempt at doing 8 miles at race pace. After today my speedwork runs get dialed down. So this will be my last chance to gain some confidence in my race pace. AFter that, it depends how I feel. I might sit on the couch and play Xbox! lol

 

What's your Gamertag? Mine is CyborgQueen. :-)  I've started playing again, Mass Effect 2 - second time around to increase my Character's stats before playing ME2. I'm also playing SSX, and Fallout 3. 

2012-04-05 5:12 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED
DJ

I had the same dilemma last year training for my first HIM. I ran the outdoor cycle club rides at lifetime fitness. So I ended up doing a 56 mile ride every Sunday through the plan. It was also with a group and we did some stopping being it was a no drop ride. It certainly won't hurt you to do more on the bike. Even with the stopping in training you'll be ok in the race if you pace properly. However, you will be better prepared IMO if you do a couple non stop rides of 56 miles about a month out from the race. You'll also be better prepared if you do a couple 75 mile rides during that time. The more comfortable you are getting through the bike the better the run will be. IMO. Be careful with some of those plans. Be sure it's catering to your goals for the race. Some of them are only designed to get you to the finish. If you are stronger in one sport or you want to compete instead of complete you'll need to modify the plan accordingly or find a better one that fits.

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2012-04-05 6:40 PM
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Subject: RE: Kenj - triathletes in training CLOSED

Meulen - 2012-04-05 3:12 PM DJ

I had the same dilemma last year training for my first HIM. I ran the outdoor cycle club rides at lifetime fitness. So I ended up doing a 56 mile ride every Sunday through the plan. It was also with a group and we did some stopping being it was a no drop ride. It certainly won't hurt you to do more on the bike. Even with the stopping in training you'll be ok in the race if you pace properly. However, you will be better prepared IMO if you do a couple non stop rides of 56 miles about a month out from the race. You'll also be better prepared if you do a couple 75 mile rides during that time. The more comfortable you are getting through the bike the better the run will be. IMO. Be careful with some of those plans. Be sure it's catering to your goals for the race. Some of them are only designed to get you to the finish. If you are stronger in one sport or you want to compete instead of complete you'll need to modify the plan accordingly or find a better one that fits.

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All I'm playing these days is call of duty mw3

That's very helpful, thanks! I do plan to put in some longish rides (longer than 56 miles) without stopping.  I think that kind of threw me off a little when I did my Olympic. Not that it was hard (actually it was VERY hard...), but my endurance was just shot because I wasn't used to ticking off 20 miles without stopping.  That's why I wanted to ask about it before finding out too late! I always feel doing 40 minute bike rides outside TOO short. On the trainer with hard intervals, that's a different story.

I'm looking to complete within a reasonable goal time, not compete. While I do want to be a little competitive, but I'm not at that level yet.

I'm working getting aerobars on my bike as well. 

Thanks again!

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