Baowolf's Beginner Banquet -Sorry all tables are full no room.. (Page 9)

I think maybe you are right about racing a little less...Maybe I do not need to race a final Oly in October.  I would like to just keep my momentum going and I do well when I have a goal to strive for.  I am nervous...renting a wetsuit....never have used one but I guess I will figure it out.

It sounds like a number of us are bumping up against our Type A personalities.  Running too much, running too fast, doubling our swim yards, etc.  Dangerous times.  Although I can confess that I have been there and am currently struggling with wanting to just hop back into training full speed without being fully recovered from the marathon.... we need to remember that this is a lifestyle and not a weekend warrior thing.  Injuries happen when we do not listen to our training plan and do not listen to our body.  Injuries are extremely frustrating and usually result in not being able to run for 2 months or whatever. 

So, take a deep breath, pat yourself on the back for going from less fit to more fit and take it slow to go fast.  The garmin/hr/dps toys are good for helping one be aware of what pace they are shooting for time wise and HR wise.  You do not want to go all out every run.  Your training plan should specify if today's run is a LSR (long steady run) at a slower pace or if it is a LT (lactate threshold) 400 repeat kind of run.  Your longest run should be at your slow steady pace.  Your shorter medium run often has some speed  or harder effort built into it and your shortest run is typically a slow recovery run.  If you run them all fast you won't recover properly will cary too much fatigue and your scheduled speedier day will suck. 

You don't have to necessarily drop the last Oly, but you may wait to see how you feel after doing a sprint and an Oly.  For some folks racing is way more fun than training.  I like to train as my main goal is improvement.  Long races with long recovery interfere with improvement... but they focus my training as far as base building and such.  I contemplated not doing an IM this year due to the shoulder injury but told my wife that I needed the IM to focus my training and it doesn't matter that much that it probably will not be a PR.  I just need my training to peek towards the end of race season.  Now am I going to race it hard and be thrilled with a PR... you betcha, but it won't be the end of the world having lost 3 months of training and having the marathon trash 5 weeks of training for the IM (taper and recovery). 

In the triathlon lifestyle we are looking for identifying which distance we enjoy and finding a balance between work, family, sprituality, friends and exercize.  Finding the balance between skill learning, slow, medium and fast workouts.  It is harder for the Type A get er done folks to slow down and it is hard for the stop and smell the roses folks to do the really high HR intensity work to get faster once that base is in place.  My daughter for example will never run faster than a 10 minute mile, too many roses along the way. 

So, congrats on all of your progress, your training plan if followed with integrity will get you across the finish line barring injury or mechanical problems and you all are already rockstars for taking on a challenge such as triathlon, changing your lifestyles for the better and getting out there every day.  It really is the journey and not the destination that brings meaning.  The finisher medals or even podium medals simply mark noteworthy points on the journey.    

Cheri, can't wait to hear about your race!  I wore my wetsuit for a swim for the first time yesterday and it went fine.  As you're putting it on, really pull up at each stage, especially the legs...don't leave room in the crotch or it will pull down on your shoulders. 

And did I hear right that we have another group member racing this weekend?  Come on out Brian and tell us about it!

Went for a ride this morning....feeling kinda tired, so first time in a while I just didn't really want to go.  But the weather was perfect, so I knew I couldn't pass it up.  Met up with with a few other folks accidentally, and rode with them for a while, which was nice. They invited me to continue on a longer ride w/ them, but given my tired state and need to log some work hours, I declined.  They gave me a card though, and I may just join them next time.

Learned lots at the open water swim clinic last night and really glad I went.  Got to mix it up in the water with about a dozen folks, practice sighting and swimming around bouys, etc.  We learned whether we tended to swim left, straight or right.  Also found out where people meet to swim around here, so should be able to get in more practice.  You may already know this stuff, but since some of you asked -- big takeaways for me were:

• Sight every 6-8 strokes whether you think you need to or not.
• Create space around yourself to the extent possible...wide arms.  If an in water start, go horizontal before start.
• Don't be mean (pulling people under, etc), but don't be too polite either (no need to apologize for bumping or accidentally kicking someone...they probably can't hear you anyway).
• Get some water in your wetsuit and dip your head in the water before you start if possible.  Helps you stay a bit warmer and not freak out at the cold when you actually start.
• Aim to swim several feet away from the buoys as you go around them to avoid the congestion.
• If you generally breathe left, start on the right side of your wave so you can use the group to sight. 
• If you need to fix your goggles, float on your back and keep you elbows in as you do it.

This was a great message to read this morning. I am somewhere between smell the roses and type A, but love smelling roses. I had never really understood the difference between how to use the long, medium and short distances for different effects. That is good info for me as I am really starting to ramp my training up. I often feel I have to work consistently hard each workout. Now I understand.

Thanks for your awesome encouragement and I love knowing you have walked your talk and I trust your perspective. I will continue enduring for the love of health and participation in life! ~Samantha

Steve - wow - thanks for the words of encouragement!  I was beginning to re-think my in-gym sprint in a couple weeks, because honestly, it's too soon.  I'm pretty sure that I can finish it - but the fact that I actually wouldn't really do it well has been getting me down.  If I'm gonna do it, I want to do it well, not just barely make it!  (Guess that's the type A in me!)  So, I think that I may opt out of the sprint in 2 weeks and sign up for the NJ state sprint tri at the end of July and set that as my new goal. (500yard, 11.5mi, 3.1miles)  Although, I guess, for me, the race is kind of cool, but getting into shape enough to do it is really the goal for me.

Also - thanks for mentioning about muscle fatigue - I wasn't really sure what was going on.

Carol - thanks for that OWS clinic info.  There is one planned about an hour south of me that I may try to get to and we have some camping planned in areas that I may be able to practice - both nervous and looking forward to it.

Work and life stuff have been messing with my training this week and last - but hoping to set up a real workable schedule that will be able to balance with work/family/training.  Blew off some friends for dinner on monday to go to master swim class, but then had work cause me to miss a couple days.

Neighbor is lending me his hybrid bike to try it out - but the weather and my workload hasn't been too cooperative.  All the talk about falling on your bike with your feet clipped in sounds painful!

I would encourage you to do the sprint actually.  You learn so much in your first race about transition and how things work and what it feels like to get one under your belt.  I would just treat it as a no stress dry run with no outcome expectations.  Practice your transition, meet people cross that finish line, get a feel for what it is all about. 

Things I have learned:

Putting on a tri shirt when wet is harder than you would think.  If the water was cold buckling a helmit is harder than you would think.  Putting socks onto wet feet is harder.  Finding your bike can be hard.  Getting both your watch and your timing chip cught between the lower and upper layer of the wetsuit makes it really hard to get off.  Drinking too much too late on the bike gives you side cramps on the run.  Eating half as much as you should during a HIM is really bad.  Anyway lost of stuff just from experiencing.  There will always be another day to try to get it perfect.  That is the day we qualify for Kona 8). 

CK -- I agree with Steve. Do that triathlon just for the fun of doing it. I believe you will learn a ton that will make the next one go that much smoother. It will feel great to complete it and you can share the sweet story with all of us. Besides it wouldn't surprise me if you did better than you think you will.

The next two days are bigger days for me as far as time is concerned.

Friday         Saturday

Not sure how it will go, but I will take it easy and stay steady. I am not sure when to really starting adding in things like fartleks/speed training. (Karen I believe you explained that to me and I hope I am remembering it correctly - thanks.) Or really ramping up my short workout since I am still in the early stages. I do not want to injure myself. Anyway. Hope all of you are doing well and getting in your workouts. I know the weather around the States has been pretty crazy.

Here's hoping spring/summer makes an appearance sooner than later.

Cheri I hope your race this weekend is awesome! (I hope I am getting people names right; is anyone else struggling to keep straight who is who in our group? Sorry if I blow it. Talking to people without meeting them makes it interesting )

Those are some great tips for swimming Carol and thanks for the transition tips Steve!

As for my week... The pool was closed tonight for a formal function as it is part of a city park so I didn't get my swim in before my weekend on the road.  I did get a little bit of running in, including testing out my new Merrell Trail Gloves and slowly working those minimal running shoes into my routine is going to take some time I can already tell!  Hopefully I can get up early as all get out tomorrow in order to jam a short bike and swim in before catching my plane.  I am sure I will at least get some running in over the weekend.

I hope everyone elses training is going much more consistantly than mine!

Have a good weekend everyone if I can't find an internet connection somewhere.

Marcus

Oh my.  Not a hard workout day 4 mile run 25 mile bike but boy did I burn up on the bike.  Combination of not quite recovered from the mary and trying to build bike and swim.... fatigue land.  Tomorrow is a lite workout and I will consider just taking the day off from training depending how quickly I recoup with some food.  Definately a fatigue warning sign though. 

Every time I think about taking my bike off the trainer it snows... today = no exception. 

Often I can find a YMCA and buy a day pass for when I am on a business trip or just use the hotel pool and do 20000 laps. I will use a hotel junk stationary bike in a pinch, better than nothing usually.  And running welll bring your shoes.  The smalest pool I have done laps in was around 9 yards. 

Some really hard things about OWS are 1) water below 60F, 2) wind chop more than 1 foot, 3) lots of bodies, 4)wind blowing you offcourse/downwind, 5) us vision impaired folks not being able to see the markers well, 6) the course looks really long from shore compared to how long the pool looks even if you are swimming shorter overall, 7) sun in your eyes, 8) feeling anxious at the start, 9) recovering from a full mouth full of water, 10) markers on the side you don't breath on.

  Love that!  It's so easy to do too.

(I hope I am getting people names right; is anyone else struggling to keep straight who is who in our group? Sorry if I blow it. Talking to people without meeting them makes it interesting )

Yes!  I'm about to go make myself a cheat sheet of usernames/real names so I can keep up with everyone. 

Today's training plan called for 5 miles including 4x800 intervals at 7:48 pace with 400 recovery.  Did it on the treadmill at 1% incline.  (I usually do 2% but I've not run intervals under an 8:00 pace and was a wee bit scared.)  It ended up being easier than I expected, probably because it was the first run in a while where I haven't had a strong head/crosswind blowing, been pushing a stroller, or both.

We're headed to the mountains tomorrow and I'm so excited.  If it doesn't rain, I'll run up there for the first time this season.  If it does rain, I'll pass because I run on the side of the road.  I'd love to run trails, but there are things like mountain lions and bears and I prefer not being eaten.  Once upon a time I didn't worry about such things, and was out for a run when I startled a moose.  I heard something big move in the nearby bushes and was so startled myself that I promptly tripped over a tree root, got back up and carefully backed away, thanking my lucky stars the whole time that it had been a moose and not a mountain lion. He was probably 100 years away, if that.  After that, I've stuck to running along roads in the mountains.  ETA: lest I sound paranoid, a number of runners along the trails in Boulder have had mountain lion encounters, even though those mountain trails are *very* close to town.  Plus there was a high school track runner who was apparently eaten by a mountain lion 10 or 15 years ago in Idaho Springs.  So unless I'm with a group or participating in a trail race, I'm not taking chances. 

Ah good, I am not the only one.

Your workouts always seem so intense. I suppose that makes sense since you are usually pushing or pulling the two wee ones. I admire you and your tenacity! Not to mention, you are teaching your children sweet life skills and healthy living; I support and salute you. Have you heard about Dick and Rick Hoyt? If you have you will know why I mention them. If you haven't check them out on YouTube. Amazing story!

Please don't get eaten! But have tons of fun in the mountains!

I have a crazy busy weekend ahead and am not so convinced I will get all my workouts in. It is currently one in the morning and I am still working on a project I need to get finished by tomorrow. I will be thankful when things slow down a bit. Whatever would I do if I had children?

 Lisa, looking at your run times for your typical workouts I was concerned you were running your 800 repeats too fast, but then I checked out your last half mary and ran the numbers 7:44 to 8:08 minute per mile pace appears to be what you are shooting for at the 800 repeat range for longer distance training.  It looks like you were  hitting LT range so probably not much faster than that pace for a while.  Are your other run times with the stroller (10:30 ish mpm)? 

I run with a dog that is slower than I am and we have 100 deer in our neighborhood.  I figure I run faster than the dog, so I am not worried about any mountain lions.  But seriously, do stay safe we all know our comfort zones and you have those little ones.   

Workout schedule for me: Fri 2500 yard swim, Sat 50 (maybe 60) mile bike 2 mile brick run, Sunday 7 mile run (if legs are ok) and 10 mile bike.  Weekly total R 21 miles, B  153 miles S 7500 yards.  Hrm wonder why I am tired this week.  If the legs are good for next week things will build quickly from there. 

X2!  Hahaha, sounds about right.

Half Marathon tomorrow that I have not properly trained for.  This is the first time I have done anything stupid like this so it remains to be seen how much pain I will be in.  Sunday, depending on how I feel, is my first Open water swim of the year.  Excited to try out my new wetsuit somewhere other than the shower.

Aha!  There is our stealth racer, Brian! Might want to put the wetsuit on the night before the OWS in case you seize up overnight after your 1/2 .  Seriously -- good luck and have fun with it!

OK...can I ask for input on cycling?  I'm so new to it, that I'm just not sure what approach to take.  I don't have a trainer, so it will all be outside riding. 

1.  First question is how much volume at this stage, and how quickly to build up?  I'm planning to do 20-25 miles tomorrow to end the week with 55-60 miles total.  Next week can also be a reasonably big week (for me), then following week, I have sprint tri (1/2 mile / 16 miles / 3.1 miles).  After that, no tris for a couple months.  Goal is to make a decent attempt at an olympic distance by the end of the season (September).  What to do? 

2.  Second, I can't decide whether to go it alone or attempt some group rides.  Met a few folks the other day going about my pace that I would feel very comfortable riding with...much more experienced, riding longer distances, etc., but probably not pushing the pace.  So do I join them, seek out another group option?  Or go it alone?

3.  Last -- flat or hills or both?  Easy, hard or both?

Thanks for any and all advice!  Hoping some of the answers will benefit other memebers of our group as well as me, so asking them "publicly" here.

While we are on bike questions.

Anyone that has added tribars to a road bike and wants to share their experience? Does it make much of a difference? Is it worth it for sprint distances? What's the gain if any?

Markus

You can build bike miles faster than you can build run or swim miles because it is much easier on your body.  So one could do a long of 20 this week, 30 next week 40 the week after and 50 the week after that.  You could even go like 20, 35, 45, 60, 70.  You would just be very tired and your bum would hurt. 

 I had been doing 100 miles a week biking, but did not do any biking duiring the 2 week taper and marathon and this week I am doing around 150 miles (40, 18, 25, 50 (or 60), 10).  So on problem building miles.

Riding with folks your own pace is fine it is really up to you.  Problems are when they are much slower or much faster than you are or are going much farther.  These things can all be worked out coordinated or whatever.  My 6 year old, my wife and my dog run with me.  I do a warmup half mile with my son and then drop him off at the house and then do 2 miles or so with my wife and the dog before and then pickup the pace and and may do an additional 15 miles or whatever on my own. 

I am the only cyclist that I know of in my county, so my options are limited there.  The one thing to be careful of is highly competitive group rides where they are going to go bang out a 75 mile ride at 23 mph and if you fall off the back... you find your own way home.  You might be able to play with the big boys or you might not, but bring a map. 

An tri bike/TT bike, is set up with a different design than a road bike, so aero bars on a road bike are different than aero bars on a tri bike.  Basically the tri bike opens up the space between your hips and your shoulders so you can breath easier.  The aero bars require less core strength, do not fry your hands and wrists and put less stress on your shoulders while shifting the muscles you use on the bike so that the dead feeling in your legs coming off the bike is less.  For aero bars on a road bike you need to get the shorter bars because the space between the seat and the handle bars is different.  Some of the same benefits are shared, but not the geometry advantage.  Riding in aero is faster (wind resistance and muscle advantage) but it is hard to hold your neck in that position for longer rides for many people, you are farther away from your brakes and you can not stear as well.  So you are giving up manuverability and neck comfort for speed and hand/wrist shoulder comfort. 

Oh and hlls flat fast slow... yes.  Mix it up.  Just like running you want some recovery rides, some faster hard sections of your rides, some big hills, etc.  Just not lots of hill repeats and speed work all back to back continuous.  As with everything else, balance it out.  If you just did 800 repeats and you are biking after, you go moderately slow and steady.  Usually 1 day a week is more intense, one is intermediate and one is more relaxed.  To a certain extent though, you just need to put in many thousands of miles 8).  (aren't you glad you asked).  You can set up heart rate zones for a bike the same way you do for the run and use those to measure your effort level.  You can also work at getting your cadence/rpms up around 85 to 90, small engine turns higher RPM's with less stress.  Do not do hard hill charges on low weekly bike miles or you can pull a calf or hamstring muscle.. ask how I know. 

Thanks so much Steve! I really appreciate it, and know you speak from experience...the good kind and the bad kind.  Definitely have to change my thinking re: ramping up a bit quicker on the bike...had been kind of afraid of that based on running history.  Only group riding I would even think of doing at this stage is the no drop variety at close to my current pace .  And BTW, your training and log shoud come with one of those "don't try this at home" disclaimers for the rest of us! 

Thanks Steve.

Considering my core and wrist strength is pretty decent from years of gymnastics and I'm only doing sprints I'll pass on getting the bars for now.

Ken you have some serious speed on the run and though your swim is slowish (like mine) the place you can make up the most time is on the bike.  Your 1:15:00 goal looks challenging but reasonable if you nail everything.  The transition times will need to be clean. 

Either way have a great race.

Good luck to Cheri, Brian and Ken!  Hope you have great race experiences this weekend

Off on my bike a bit later than planned this morning, but sleeping in was GOOD!

Good luck to everyone racing today. Of course we all want detailed racing reports

Markus

Just got home from my open water swim clinic. It was at a local lake. Air temp this morning was prob around 60-65 when we got in. Not sure what the water temp was, but everyone had a wetsuit. I HIGHLY recommend swimming in open water at least once before your race if it's in open water. There is so much to learn!! If something like this is offered in your area, take advantage! We practiced starts, exits, drafting (a little advanced for beginner me), sighting, getting your wetsuit on and off.

One thing I noticed during our short, "mock" course was that my breathing was totally off. I normally a great tempo of inhale and exhale..it's usually quite soothing, actually. I have never had a problem with breathing in the pool, but something about being in that open water with other people made me forget some of the basics. But once I realized what was happening, it was pretty easy to correct. Just slow down and breath in and out.

It was also really nice to get used to the feel of the wetsuit. It almost felt like a life jacket, that's how buoyant I was! A couple of key takeaways:
1. If you are wearing a wetsuit, put Pam or Body Glide on your arms, legs and neck to help get it on. Once it's on, put Pam on the outside to make it easier to get off.
2. Pace yourself when you get in the water. A slower start will help you stay calm through the chaos. You'll be less likely to be gasping for air and if you find you're feeling good, speed it up.

Conanzchic, so glad you benefitted from the OWS clinic!  Good point on the pam and body glide, as well as going out easy (or as easy as we can with a kazillion other people thrashing around us).  I'm happy to at least be going into it with some of the jitters out.  My hubby was telling me the story of a lady from work who did her first tri, got kicked pretty hard...blood running down her face, hanging onto kayak for dear life, almost pulled out, etc.  Know it can happen, but I am glad to have something to replace that mind image!

Called the bike ride early today....ominous looking clouds rolled in quickly.  Of course it cleared up after I go home, so now I feel like a wuss.  Still a decent week training wise, so perhaps God's way of helping me not do stupid in terms of too much too quickly. 

Looking forward to hearing about how our racers do this weekend!