2008 to 2012 what has changed?

We'll be saying the same thing in 2016 if Romney wins. Of course that is irrelevant to today though.

I saw that one over the weekend.  I thought it was a very effective ad.

I'm going to be watching the convention this week because I'm genuinely interested in how they're going to shape their campaign and more importantly what are they going to run on?

I think the Republicans have found a good line of offense with the question "Are we better off today than we were four years ago".  Every time a Dem gets asked that question they don't know how to answer.  If they say yes then they're "out of touch" and if they say no then they're admitting that Obama has failed.

I also think Obama just potentially set himself up again over the weekend.  His speech about the republican convention being from last century and watching it on the rabbit ears.  This while the DNC is trotting out the Clinton and Carter at the convention.

The economy is by far my #1 issue this election so it would be down right impossible for the Dem's to sway my vote, but I do genuinely enjoy watching the conventions.   I love politics.  

Blasphemy, there will be 0% unemployment with no deficit and world peace.  

that is how is framed, but I don't that is the truth.

I  don't have the numbers off-hand, but the rate at which we are losing jobs is down; we are no longer involved in both Iraq and Afghanistan (soon neither); we no longer wonder where Osama Bin Laden is, my kids can stay on my insurance while they are in grad school, my brother-in-law who was recently diagnosed with diabetes doesn't have to worry that he won't be able to get insurance in the future.

So when people refer to this as a failed presidency, I have to wonder what they demand as markers of success.

The growth of my business over the last 3 years can be directly attributed to Obama's policies. My company does biomedical research and early stage drug discovery.

Yes, it is a very niche business. There are big differences in the political parties when it comes to science and technology and those weigh heavily in my decision making process.

I don't believe Obama has fulfilled 10% of his campaign promises, and I doubt Romney would either. Both Congress and the Senate are dysfunctional and place their own political ambitions above the good of the country.

But if you ask me if I'm better off now than I was 4 years ago, the answer is yes.

Yeah, what's funny is my answer is the same as yours.  I now own my own business and am way better off than I was 4 years ago.  lol

My business has benefitted to some extent from the public sector $ that came in from the various stimulus programs as well.  That being said, I still don't think as a country we can keep living off our credit cards so even though it will likely harm my business in the short term I still want our Govt. to stop the dang spending.  

My mark of success is to actually do SOME of what you proposed you do.  This video shows that he obviously did not get things done...

1.  We are still losing jobs.  Obama said that if we did NOT pass the stimulus we'd be at 8% unemployment.  We are WELL above that # currently even after the stimulus.

2.  We are still in Afghanistan.  The # of deaths under Obama in 3.75 years: 1147 and climbing.  Under 8 years of Bush it was 630 deaths.

3.  On day 1 he said he'd close Gitmo.  Still open. Haven't hard much about it in 3+ years either.

4.  Some would argue that your kids staying on your insurance is a good thing.  Others would see the hidden costs that will makes rates rise.  Same for your BIL.  There is no such thing as a free lunch.

5.  The deficit rose between $1-4 trillion depending on how funny you want to get with the math under Obama.  The largest rise in history, by far.

6.  He promised to put tighter regulation on the banks and wall street to prevent another crash.  No a thing has happened.

7.  He promised to have the most transparent administration in history.  By most accounts (Google it) his admin is one of the most closed.

I have gotten some public sector funds. We received a Small Business Innovation Research grant from the National Institutes of Health last year. As a program it's pretty good. The money is used to develop a new product which launches this month. Most of the money was used for salaries, with 1.5 new employees hired and now paying taxes.

I'd like to see the government do more programs of this type to build innovative businesses in the private sector. The money goes right back into the economy, profit is capped at 7% of the grant, and it's a highly competitive funding process.

It blows my mind some continue to trot that one out in favor of Obama. Iraq was "ended" by Bush right before he left office. When Obama took office,there were ~35,000 troops in Afghanistan...he added 60,000, (the exact opposite of what he promised) and has now removed around 30,000... leaving more troops there than when he took office. What he said was we will be transitioning from a military mission to a support mission. That does not mean NO mission, and it most certainly does not mean "no longer involved". U.S. troops will remain in Afghanistan for some time to come. They will just stop reporting on it.

The funny thing is, we know politicians like to stretch the truth. They promise a lot... but they also have been around long enough to be careful what they really promise. I don't have to look to any "marker" to find improvement, all I have to do its look at Obama himself. In practically every single area he "promised" improvement, he has failed... by his own words. He has not delivered any of the things he said he would.

I have seen 4 years an inept leadership style, that suggests it will not bee any better for 4 more years. And again, a convenient little fact most like to forget because Obama keeps telling the lie... he had the full support of a Dem controlled Legislature when he took office, and failed win any significant victories. Obama care was no where near what he actually wanted, and could not get enough support from his own party to back him. I don't need a talking head to deliver a "marker" to me to show me what I have already seen.

I believe the upper middle class and up (and let's admit it, we are all in that boat) is doing OK.  But the middle and lower class are not.  And when the base is shaky the entire tower is prone to collapse.

This article popped up today: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-09-04/food-stamp-use-climbed-to-record-46-7-million-in-june-u-s-says.html

Food-stamp spending, which has more than doubled in four years to a record $75.7 billion in the fiscal year ended Sept. 30, 2011, is the USDA’s biggest annual expense.

Food stamps doubled in 4 years?  Sounds like a lot of people are not doing so well.

I understand your position.  But to clarify, you didn't complete that Iroman, the government did.   Without paved roads, EPA rules to limit water/air pollution, etc, you never would have finished.  

On a serious note, I think OP point of being better off now vs. 4 years ago is related to Obama in office.   All I have heard so far is good people who worked hard to get where they were and were disciplined to do so.   That didn't take Obama lifting one finger to accomplish.  Im also better off thanks to a better job etc, but this administration didnt do a thing to do that.  If anything they were a major roadblock since i am in financial sector and they have done all that is possible to cut the legs out of the industry.  Some of these regulations were genuinely needed, but the bashing of big banks has called major loss of jobs.    

The emphasis in my statement (hard to convey in this format) is that we are no longer involved in BOTH countries, not that we are NO LONGER INVOLVED.

Don't mean to be "shouting" the words here, just trying to show where my emphasis is.

Wow, we appear to be in agreement here. To me, this is a problem that is a result of policies that favor the wealthy. Not saying we should have no classes, but that the current situation is one of severe inequality between the top and bottom, with fewer opportunities to move out of one's current class (or at least to move upwards) than much of Europe, which is not the way our system is intended to work.

So, if you succeeded, it was on your own hard work, and if you struggled, it was because of the government?

Either it is a joint effort or it's not. I think it would be challenging to defend the financial industry when so much of what caused the problems today was the result of internal policies and choices made by the industry. I'll just ask you to call to mind the whole "too big to fail" mentality, that puts the taxpayers on the hook to bail out certain companies. 

We may agree on the outcome but we do not agree on the cause.  I feel that a lot of it is due to personal responsibility (a philosophy that I feel the current admin is fostering), not a lack of opportunities.  But that is a topic for another thread.

Got it. And overall, no matter who get's the "credit" it's a good thing. Something I certainly support.

But I have heard it said... not by you... that "Obama ended both wars", which is simply not true. I only say it because we listened to Obama rail against Bush's play book for 2 straight years, and then once Obama was in office... he adopted it and now gets "credit" for doing something.

Uh oh, Obama's in trouble now.  I just saw that a picture has been found of Obama with Karl Marx.

i know I know, I need to stay off the conservative blogs.  

But who do you think the lower class and unemployed will be voting for.  The party that promises new jobs and wants to extend/increase benefits, or the party that promises new jobs and wants to reduce/eliminate benefits?  People being worse off is not necessarily a good thing for Republicans and Romney.

You are introducing an assumption that people engage in rational self-interest. I don't think that is necessarily true. I think people will vote for whoever's message makes them feel best - regardless of any truthfulness.

I never said you struggle due to government.  If given a choice of being a joint effort or not, I would side with minimal gov't intrusion all day long.   Consumer Advocacy is the newest way of saying, "American's you can no longer be expected to formulate your own opinions so we will try to make it so that you dont have to".