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2008-08-18 9:49 AM

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Subject: Open water swim

Hey folks, I'm new to this forum.

 6'4" 258, doing tris for the competition and weight loss.

 ok here's my question, what is the minimum temperature you would do an open water swim without a wetsuit?

 thanks for help.

 Chad



2008-08-18 10:17 AM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim

I've SEEN people do them in the high 50's, but I wouldn't mark it down as the smartest thing in the books.  If the temp is in the mid 70's, I'm more willing.  If not, gimme my wetsuit!

2008-08-18 10:41 AM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I did one (a sprint) that was 67 F. I was a little worried, but it was fine. I just made sure to get in the water and get my face wet before the race, so I didn't hyperventilate when first hitting the cold water. I don't like wetsuits! I think I could probably do low 60's without much trouble. Although, if the water was low 60s and the air was also cold, I might reconsider.
2008-08-18 12:18 PM
in reply to: #1610278

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Folsom, CA (Sacramento Area)
Subject: RE: Open water swim
That is a very personal choice. everybody tolerates cold water differently. Others also use the wetsuit more for the flotation help than the cold protection. I personally think I can comfortably do mid 60's temps and up.
2008-08-18 3:25 PM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I race is wetsuit legal, I would use one.
2008-08-18 6:09 PM
in reply to: #1611392

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Subject: RE: Open water swim

likeastrike - 2008-08-18 4:25 PM I race is wetsuit legal, I would use one.

 X2

I don't like water under 70 but to each their own.  



2008-08-19 5:19 PM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I think my first tri was around 60 degrees without a wetsuit and omg it was cold. I was out there for an hour but I cramp up alot too.

Distance is an important factor also in that desicion also. Now I will wear a wetsuit whenever I can unless I have a good reason not too.

2008-08-19 7:20 PM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
Chad, I am trying to read between the lines here. Are you trying to avoid buying a wetsuit? I will ows in the high 60's, but prefer at least low 70's. Personal tolerances is the key. If you do not want to commit to a wetsuit, consider two things. Latter season races with warmer water/ pool swims early in the season, or rent a wetsuit. They can be had for around $40 depending on the company.
2008-08-22 9:32 AM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I really don't want to hijack the thread, but I find it funny that a sport that prides itself on toughness allows the use of wetsuits, when one of the sports its based on doesn't.

OWS races do not allow wetsuits. If you want to swim the English channel the standard is suit, goggles and cap, no wetsuit allowed.

Just my $.02.

2008-08-22 10:39 AM
in reply to: #1621014

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Subject: RE: Open water swim

photonic - 2008-08-22 10:32 AM I really don't want to hijack the thread, but I find it funny that a sport that prides itself on toughness allows the use of wetsuits, when one of the sports its based on doesn't. OWS races do not allow wetsuits. If you want to swim the English channel the standard is suit, goggles and cap, no wetsuit allowed. Just my $.02.

Plenty of people summit everest without supplemental oxygen but plenty don't.  When swimmers are done swimming in OWS they

A: Bike and then run

B: Sit down and have a snack.

Since wetsuits aren't allowed in OWS races how many people use them?

A: some

B: 0

In triathlon since wetsuits offer a performance advantage you should:

A: use one and be even

B: HTFU and give up your advantage, while remembering that your mountain bike has knobby tires and you will be running in barefeet like many runners in poorer countries do (Nike is probably an advantage).   

Let's review UCI bike racing-

Drafting- you have to.  Failing to draft means not being anywhere the front. Triathlon drafting means penalties and DQ's. 

Bike breaks- mechanic jumps out of the team car and gives you a new one.  This is slightly different in triathlon.

Aerodynamic clothing- of course, Use it in triathlon?  Nope 

Cyclists racing need to have sleeves on their jerseys, triathlon suits... not so much.

Just so toughness is identified clearly: Michael Phelps wouldn't wear any suit that might create an advantage.

Nothing to see here

Yes it's a speedsuit not a wetsuit and it's pool vs. OWS but honestly the same thing applies.

People are competiting doing the best they can with what they have.  How many people have NOT DROWNED due to wearing a wetsuit?  Probably countless numbers.  Only 937 people have swam the English channel how can you compare that to the membership of USAT?

Good rant but it's comparing apples to Jupiter.

 

 

2008-08-22 11:27 AM
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Subject: RE: Open water swim
in the English channel don't you have to have your own personal support water craft?

in my area we have 4 ows races that are fairly close to me. Only the races with the 5k have non wet suit divisions. The 2 mile races your kinda stupid not to wear a wet suit.

If you really want to be a good ows swimmer and swim completely in ows yes you need to get used to not wearing a wet suit. If you swim because you do triathlons then get your wetsuit and do not worry about it since many if not most are wet suit legal and unless you doing 400 yard swim you always save time and energy if you wear one.


2008-08-22 6:25 PM
in reply to: #1621231

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I didn't say that people shouldn't use a wetsuit. You are free to use anything the rules allow, I don't have a problem with that. I was just commenting on what I feel is an inconsistancy.

I promise, I won't sneek into your house and steal your blankie.. I mean wetsuit. ;)

Though now that I think about it, I carry my own internal wetsuit, just beneath my skin! :)

Edited by photonic 2008-08-22 6:35 PM
2008-08-22 9:21 PM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
First off, I am a dumb MF about triathlon wetsuits, don't have one, never worn one. With that out of the way, can I ask a couple questions about them? Are they different than scuba wetsuits? I understand the flotation advantage, but does a tri wetsuit restrict you in the shoulders like a scuba wetsuit? I have a 3mm scuba wetsuit and was wondering if this is the same thing being used. Maybe mine doesn't fit all that great, because when I dive, it wears me out just from normal use of my arms underwater. I have never tried swimming freestyle in it but imagined that I would make about 50 yards before floating belly up in it.
2008-08-22 10:00 PM
in reply to: #1621014

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Subject: RE: Open water swim

photonic - 2008-08-22 7:32 AM I really don't want to hijack the thread, but I find it funny that a sport that prides itself on toughness allows the use of wetsuits, when one of the sports its based on doesn't. OWS races do not allow wetsuits. If you want to swim the English channel the standard is suit, goggles and cap, no wetsuit allowed. Just my $.02.

 

Umm... the hour and 25 minutes of the Olympics 10K OWS race I watched would suggest otherwise... or are we narrowing the definition to full wrist to ankle suits?  Because 80% of the field wore full legs or legs with farmer john torsos. 

2008-08-23 6:53 AM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I'm not 100% positive on this, but I do believe the full suits those athletes wore in the 10k marathon OWS were NOT wetsuits. They most likely were similar (in some way) to the suits worn by the pool swimmers...worn to enhance speed and performance. Remember too, that the water temp of that rowing/canoe lake that they swam in was a tepid 80 degrees.
2008-08-23 10:02 AM
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Subject: RE: Open water swim
Thanks for clarifying - so we are talking the thickness of the material not the amount of body covered. 


2008-08-23 8:38 PM
in reply to: #1610278

Subject: RE: Open water swim

I swam my sprint in about 60 degree water in my bike tights and nothing else.  I would not do that again.  It was three days before I seen my Thingy againSurprised

Joe

2008-08-25 10:33 AM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I'm a wimp when it comes to cold water. If the water is is 78 or less I wear the suit but when it comes to air temp I still run in shorts and tank top at 35*. lol
2008-09-17 10:47 PM
in reply to: #1623573

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Subject: RE: Open water swim
Puppetmaster - 2008-08-23 9:38 PM

I swam my sprint in about 60 degree water in my bike tights and nothing else.  I would not do that again.  It was three days before I seen my Thingy againSurprised

Joe

LOL!! It's almost midnight and I'm laughing my of in the living room alone because of this!

2008-09-17 11:05 PM
in reply to: #1610278

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Subject: RE: Open water swim

I'm still trying to decide on this same issue.  I'll be doing a sprint triathlon (1/4 mile OWS) this weekend in what I estimate will be about 61-64 degree water.  Nantasket Beach, Hull, MA.  Everywhere I look for advice and guidance, people are pointing to the wetsuit.  But its too late to rent a wetsuit online and I'm doubtful that I'll find one locally (I will look though.)  Poor planning on my part.  And part deliberate procrastination because I'm reluctant to spend money on a wetsuit for a first (possibly last) sprint tri.

My primary/back-up-if-I-can't-get-a-wetsuit plan is to swim and race in a regular 1-piece Tyr bathingsuit, a sports bra, and spandex triathlon shorts, and perhaps an extra cap.  I plan on slowly acclimating myself to the water (fully submerging) about 5 minutes before my race wave.

I swam about a week ago and, although it was uncomfortably cold getting in, once I was swimming I was comfortable and the cool water on my body felt nice and refreshing and kept me feeling fresh for the first mile of a 3-mile run I did promptly after the swim.  It was, however, probably nearly 67-degree water on that day.

 Anyhow, I'm half writing to see if people protest my daring swim plan for race day and half writing to be the voice of people who suck it up for a day.  Its only a sprint triathlon and I don't have a wetsuit.  If I can get one, I will have a different story.  If not, I believe I can deal...  or at least I HOPE so!!!!

 I think, more than anything, its really just a personal call regarding comfort, warmth, and budget.  Unless the water is dangerously cold or warm.

2008-09-18 9:47 AM
in reply to: #1681463

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Folsom, CA (Sacramento Area)
Subject: RE: Open water swim
globalgourmand - 2008-09-17 9:05 PM

My primary/back-up-if-I-can't-get-a-wetsuit plan is to swim and race in a regular 1-piece Tyr bathingsuit, a sports bra, and spandex triathlon shorts, and perhaps an extra cap.  I plan on slowly acclimating myself to the water (fully submerging) about 5 minutes before my race wave.



sounds like a good plan. the only thing I would change is a longer warm up. Let your body get used to the temp by swimming about 15 to 20 minutes prior to race start (not just submerging)

good luck


2008-09-18 9:58 AM
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Subject: RE: Open water swim

If you want to psych yourself up, read about Lynne Cox.  She swam the Bering Strait without a wetsuit.  And in the Antarctic.  Her story is great, I recommend giving it a read.  I often think of her when I am slogging away complaining about a one-mile pool swim, as she is a distance swimmer and her mileage is astounding.  Good luck this weekend!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynne_Cox

2008-09-18 3:08 PM
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Subject: RE: Open water swim
I generally wear a wetsuit in any race its legal. this seems to work for me.
The only exception I have made is a late day start. The water was about 63, so I felt I wanted a wet suit, but the race started at 4pm in May in Las Vegas and it ended up being 100 out, so there was no way I was putting one on! Just couldn't do it, and the water felt great! It was a great swim, but in the mornings, there is no way I would want to do 63 without one.
I prefer a sleeveless, and found I can tolerate the cold fine with it. I ened up buying a full siut for IM because they were threatening temps in the 50s. Ended up at 59 and was very cold by my second lap, so that was a good choice.
If you are going to be doing tri's, I think its worth the money to get one.
2008-09-18 9:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Open water swim

Just did my my first tri (Dewey Beach Sprint) and was scared of the whole wet suit thing.  I just pictured myself rolling on the ground fo 15 minutes of my T1 trying to get the thing off.  I'm not understanding how it makes you faster.  It looks like it would restrict your swimming motion.  I was slower than I swim in a pool, but I think that was mostly from swimming a zig-zag route instead of a straight course. 

I can understand the whole hypothermia thing, and being real cold can't be good for muscle performance, but is it simply helping your body cope with colder water, or is there more to it?

2008-09-19 5:15 AM
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Subject: RE: Open water swim

The guy who won our local Sprint with a 400 meter pool swim wore one, and he cruised in the pool.  There is a reason that there are restrictions on wetsuit use, because they do offer an advantange.  Also, he was one of only 8 male racers who beat my T1 time.  (Transitions are the only thing that I do fast.  We were all gaping at him as he ran off the pool deck while removing his 90% of the way.  By the time he was at the bike racking area, all that he had left to do was pull his suit off his ankles.

I will purchase a wetsuit this winter in preparation for the Lake Anna Sprint in the Spring.

There is more to it, too:

1. Bouyancy

2. Aqua-dynamics.  This is smooth material and takes all of the lumps and bumps out of our Clyde/Athena bodies.  It makes your body less human, and more like a seal or dolphin

c. You will look like Aquaman!



Edited by pga_mike 2008-09-19 5:22 AM
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