Incandescent light bulb ban

Yeah the ban seems pretty stupid to me, so much for the free market. If LED's were really so much better people would buy them because they are better. IMO the LED prices still need to come down some. I went to Home Depot the other day to find some lights for my soffits. My soffits are supposed to take the round halogen bulbs. They cost $8 and are supposed to last 2 years, I have found them to last 3-4 months. I have 10 of the stupid lights on the front of my house so I am out $80 every 4 months in light bulbs. Went and looked at LED's the equivalent LED bulb is $30 per bulb. Supposed to last 22 years but I am reluctant to believe that. 

Guess I may find that LED is the way to go after the $300 investment, but if they aren't amazing I will be peeved. They definitely don't provide the same warmth that a standard bulb would. 

There's the problem, in a nutshell.    This is a classic example of the "tragedy of the commons" ... where each person gets a perceived advantage from buying "just one more" incandescent bulb, but the sum total of the effect (in consumption and pollution) is harmful to everyone.

There are many, many times that people will not make a "smart" purchase, even if it is in their best interest.   All they see is the initial cost, and immediately decide.  In this case, if the LED lights only last 16 months, you're still saving $20 in hardware cost, and somewhere around 5 cents per hour on electricity.  (and some intangible cost of your time to change the light bulbs)    The money is clearly in your favor to buy the LEDs.  If the lights last 48 months, You're saving over $600.  (if they go the full 22 years, you're up 5 GRAND just in light bulbs)

The upshot:  Come home with 10 LED lights and a REALLY NICE new bike.   Tell your wife you just broke even. :^) 

LED are the future plain and simple. I do not believe in the life span though. That's fine that a diode will last 20 years, that does not mean the light will. there is not a manufacturer on this planet that will make a product that takes 22 years to replace. Not going to happen. 

the savings in electricity though for the whole country can be quite substantial. Never the less... I hate bans. And at the time they were writing these laws, only CFLs were available... which is much more detrimental to the environment with all the mercury. 

Guess I opened the door pretty wide on that one. Yeah I am a bit of a stick in the mud, the ban thing peeves me a bit. I found I could get 4 CFL bulbs for $6 so I am considering try those outside in the soffits. They claim to last a while and the price is good. 

I guess I just don't like the feds banning something when the alternative is not proven and an expensive gamble. Guess I will have to find some outdoor version of an LED and see how it goes.

The other thing.....since when did incandescent bulbs only last a few weeks/months?  I never changed lilght bulbs years ago as much as I do now.

I smell a rat......I bet tuwood knows. 

It's not a ban, it's an efficiency standard, no different from fuel economy standards for cars.  Companies are still allowed to manufacture incandescent bulbs, they just have to meet the standard, and in fact, some companies have innovated and created incandescent bulbs which meet the standard using halogen.

As much as I believe in conservation, I personally can't stand CFL's.  I don't like the color of the light and how they take an hour to warm up and you can't just throw them away because they have mercury in them.  I've had them in places where I don't really care what the light is like, but I'm not a huge fan.  I've gradually been replacing all of our bulbs with LEDs, especially as the prices have been coming down.  What I've found is that you have to look for bulbs that are at a color temperature of 2700k.  At that temp the light is basically no different from an incandescent.  Even 3000k looks too blue for me though.  If you go to Home Depot you can get a two-pack of 40w equivalents for $15.  I've heard there's supposed to be a new 60w equivalent out for something like $10 but I haven't seen it yet.  And the prices should keep dropping as they become more and more popular and the companies can really bring economies of scale to bear.  More expensive than an old fashioned incandescent, sure, but over it's lifetime it'll save a lot of money, plus, when you're using 11w instead of 60w per bulb, you won't have to keep yelling at the kids to turn the light of when they leave a room.

This has nothing to do with nothing (so, a perfect pCOJ post! ) ... the strong push to move to CFL and LED also means that far fewer incandescents are available here in the Third World.

There are a few problems with this.

1. The vast majority of people just can't afford them, and it places a burden on those least able to bear it to try to find incandescents.

2. We certainly do not have any kind of proper disposal infrastructure, services, or space for them.

3. Power surges = they blow out just as fast as incandescents.

I always find it interesting how various people who truly have a heart for conservation deal with the CFL thing.  You've laid out the dilemma quite well because they're just not that great of a solution when you look at the offset.  They do conserve energy, but at a higher disposal cost to the environment and a higher initial cost to your wallet.

Personally, I never gave much thought to the cost savings of the CFL's or even the light quality.  I'm just really lazy when it comes to changing light bulbs.  We moved into our oversized house about 10 years ago and it would have one or two bulbs every week that would go out.  It seemed like I was constantly changing light bulbs every weekend.  I found these wonderful things called CFL's that promised me that I could be lazy for a longer periods of time if I bought them.  So that's all it took to sell me and boy did they make me happy.  I'm lucky if I change one bulb every three months now.  If you struggle with believing in God, how can this not be proof that there is a God.  ;-)

My last nemesis was our fancy outdoor garage lights in the driveway.  I have to darn near disassemble the front of my house to change the bulbs in them, but they had to have the cutesy little candle lights that the CFL's didn't have.  About two years ago I found some LED bulbs that said I could be lazy for 20 years and I didn't care how much they cost.  I paid something like $20 a light.   Those things have been running 24/7 for over two years and I've yet to have to replace one.  Yet again, proof that there is a God.  ;-)

I'm assuming that like most other electronic parts for mass consumption ... China.

While you DO have to be careful about where you dispose them... if electricity is generated by coal, then the environmental mercury is still net LESS with CFL than incandescent. 

Unless you define "environment" as: "My kitchen where I just dropped a CFL bulb."  

Similar story.  I used to own a "paint your own pottery" store.   We had 3 "retro"  fixtures in the front of the store that had 8  60W bulbs each.  They hung from the 16 foot ceilings.  They ran all night, as they showcased our customer pieces that were waiting for pickup.  (Customers LOVED it when their piece "made the window!) I was up that damn 10foot ladder EVERY OTHER DAY replacing incandescent bulbs.  I finally got fed up and told my wife I was going to drop the coin on 24 CFLs for the window (this was 2002)   For the next 3 years I didn't change bulbs in those fixtures again! 

After a month of that, the next to go were the 24 100W incandescent bulbs in our main fixtures.   They were also running at least 40 hours a week while we were open.  That was ~25c an hour just to run them, which  dropped to ~5c with the 23W CFL.   They were all the "warm" color bulbs.  People always complemented us about how bright the store was.   For me, I saved $1000 a year in electricity(n one of the cheapest electric zones in the country) and got to quit standing on the "danger step" on the 10foot ladder! 

This thread prompted me to do some looking around online yesterday. My current lights are halogen PAR20 bulbs. We turn them on before we go to bed and turn them off as soon as we wake and they last about 3 months, at $8 per it gets annoying.

Found this bulb from Lowes http://www.lowes.com/pd_372039-3-78838_0__?productId=3609956 Says it will work outside and should be close to what I have now. Bit spendy at $23 per, but if they last a year I will be happy. According to their claims they should last 5 years but I won't hold my breath. Going to pick up 1 or 2 of these this evening and give them a shot.

Anyone ever tried anything from Miracle LED? They come up often in amazon searches for LED's but the reviews are sparse. Decent prices but hard to confirm they work and not much talk of warranty. 

I haven't tried those specifically, but I've had really good luck with my LED lights so far.

I have 6 of these in the decorative lights on our garage.  They have been going 24/7 for over two years in NE weather extremes and I've yet to lose one.  They look awesome too because the blue coloring they give off looks awesome with our grey house.  

They've come down in price quite a bit too because I think i paid something like $18-$20 ea. when I got them a couple years ago.

x2, I had a run-of-the-mill spiral (? what are they called ?) light bulb in my basement on 24/7 and it lasted 6 years. 
I have a flood light on my garage with a spiral bulb inside and it lasted around 4-5 years.

I can't say I would continue to invest in them if I had to replace every few months... would definitely look into a different product if that was the case.

i HATE the color of fluorescent in my bathroom vanity!  i need to know what my skin looks like and if my makeup looks natural.  fluorescent are AWFUL for that.

also - i am amazed at the frequency of lightbulb changing as well.  i've bought maybe 20 or 30 lightbulbs total for my house in 6 years.  that averages out to changing out every bulb that is used regularly maybe every 2 years????  of course...it's always 3 that burn out at the same exact time....now THAT is annoying.

When the wife and I picked out new recessed lighting fixtures, we should have investigated the cost of bulbs.  They need those smaller halogen bulbs (about 3" in diameter) instead of the larger flood lights we used to have (5" diameter).  Those new ones are like 10 bucks each!  AND they burn out every 12-18 months.

The other day, I saw LED replacements for them for 18 bucks at Costco and said "hmmmm".  They say 22.8 years of life but I'm dubious.  BUT, if they even last TWO years, I'm ahead.  Then I read this thread and I was set on giving it a try.

Got one last night to replace a burned out on and it's FANTASTIC.  It's brighter, I like the light more, it's more efficient, doesn't get as hot, and IF the life span is even 50% of what they promise?  I'm stoked.  I will get another 5 as they burn out...  I also plan to replace the one last flood light I have in the house.

Now my next decision is just to replace all the other bulbs with LED.  One things for sure, at the price?  If I sell the house, I'm taking every bulb out and packing them and putting in cheep ones for the new owner or none at all.  Shoot, I wonder if that will be part of a house contract?  "Appliances and light bulbs to remain with the house"....

OH, as a side note.  Switched over to LED Christmas tree lights because I was SICK AND TIRED of a string of lights going out after one season because one bulb blew.  I was getting new ones every year instead of searching for a burned out bulb...  But, they look odd to me.  They just have a different type of light.  Nothing I can't get used to, but just different.  Anyone else notice?

Yeah, fluorescent is annoying.  The delay to turn on and the color is odd.  I use them in the garage, laundry room, and outdoor lighting uses.  Mostly just utilitarian applications.  Anything that needs something a bit warmer, I use standard bulbs.  I'm  hoping the LED inside diffused fixtures look ok (or under lamp shades). 

YES. We picked up some "soft white" LED Christmas lights and they look BLUE. Like straight up BLUE. Was glad we only had silver and white decorations because it looked nice. But if we had a hodge-podge of different colors it would have looked awful.