Obama endorses same-sex marriage (Page 15)

I took a zoomed out macro view a while ago in looking at all of this
and see it all as connected. 

It's really an age old story.
We're just the Israelites wandering through the desert
and forgetting, forgetting... 

Exactly.

The SSM movement is just the latest in a long line of really bad ideas involving sex and marriage.
It's been some fifty years of this now.
The track record for all of that "progress" is not so good. 

I was ready to agree with your earlier post correlating support of abortion with the continuation of crimes against humanity on a global scale. I was with you on a metaphysical level; even if we got there in by heading in different directions, but you really lost me completely with this one. I understand your point (I think), but disagree with it 100%.

You mean self righteous attitudes like the following?

Here's a video of gay rights advocate Dan Savage
attacking Christians, the Bible,
and finally bullying the students who chose to walk out
rather than listen to any more of his bigotry.

I've yet to hear or read of a single gay rights advocate who's condemned what Savage did.
I hope some did and I just missed it. 

It's the sort of thing one experiences more and more these days
if you speak out against the LBGT agenda or in support of the Christian faith,
even if you strive to do so with respect, rationality, and in charity. 

Me, I'm just a sinner.
First step in understanding that was to acknowledge that I was sinning and that I continue to sin in many ways.
Perhaps mostly in pridefulness.
It is a very painful, humbling, and continuing process. 

That's kind of my point too. There are strong feelings on both sides. But, I feel that both sides (with strong feelings) are a minority. As an example, this thread has over 350 posts but I would guess only about 20 posters. Everyone else is only reading and not commenting or just passing over. It's those people that need to be persuaded that change is needed. The way both sides present their case is heavy handed so most will just walk away from the issue and keep the status quo.

You prove my point, Tony.

The self righteous indignation seems these days to go in mostly one direction,
from the self proclaimed enlightened ones
to those they would call knuckle dragging traditionalists.

Just google Santorum.

Those are the kind of tactics being used to further the agenda
rather than rational and civil discourse about these important issues.

Well said!  I think many people need to realize that letting other people have rights does not negate yours.  

Buy stock in Purell, the gays are coming!!

I'm divorced and I can honestly say that my ex and I have done a better job raising our kids AS A FAMILY than a lot of married people we know. And yes, we still consider ourselves a family, because we love and raise our kids together. Some day we will dance at their wedding and hopefully bounce some grandkids on our creaky old knees. Hopefully in that order, too! So I don't want anyone telling me what a family is, and I'm not going to tell anyone else what defines a family, either.

Any parent that can tell their child they are a sinner and don't deserve to be happy because they are gay, handicapped, or purple isn't much of a parent.

But they don't want them to have rights. They think it's icky.

Double darn, I was all set to load up on pizza.

That's it, I am calling Shenanigans...you have had to resort to the word icky!  It's rotting your brain slowly....

Then don't let them get married in your church, but why stop them from marrying in another? Would you be ok with that? Ok with a provision in any SSM legislation that allows for individual churches to not marry same sex couples, but would allow them to marry in other churches. Do you consider other religious but non-christian marriages to be scared? What about marriages performed with no religious affiliation at all? Why not simply see this as another one of those? 

So, it sounds like this is just semantics for you.  that 'marriage' is a religious union (specifically your religion), and that you're OK with extending the same partnership rights to any other.  OK- well that almost makes sense.

a couple questions.  do you feel that your religion should own the word 'marriage?'  (as we're just talking about the word now, not the rights)

and, (forgive me, I just don't know), but what is the current LDS (and your) thinking on Interracial Marriage.  As I recall, it wasn't that long ago that this was the same issue for the church.

FWIW- when Obama was born (in Kenya )  His parents marriage was illegal in 22 states.

40 years from now, we'll think about SSM as we do towards interracial marriage today.  Yeah- there are still some small segment of the population that's against it, but they're appropriately marginalized. 

alright, lets make a clear distinction here.  laws that banned interracial marriage and womens right to vote were laws put in place by MAN.  there is/was no rhyme or reason to do that, ever.  it's not in the Christian bible either, since God doesnt care about your skin color or your gender.

banning gay marriage is altogether different.  God DOES care WHO and WHAT you have s#x with, and makes that abundantly clear in the Old AND New testaments.  so trying to legitimize gay marriage by saying that its a civil rights issue like slavery, interracial marriage, and womens rights, could not be farther from the truth.  God condones that type of behavior whether or not you choose to believe it.  for those of us who believe Gods word - SOME of us arent going to accept SSM for those reasons.  do i know gay people?  yeah.  am i cordial and friendly to them? sure!  its not a "bad blood" issue - i simply disagree with the lifestyle.

A question.....

I'm not going to get involved in this argument because, frankly, I don't care.  That being said....it seems that the majority of people on this thread are for gay people being able to marry.

So.....why is it that every time it is put to a vote it fails?  

I'm asking.  I have no motive, I'm just wondering what you all think.  

For the record, I don't care who is married or not.  I am perfectly happy in mine and yours will not affect me, no matter who you marry.

To answer your question with some questions, why was it that bans on interracial marriage passed all the time in the 1800's?  Why did it take courts to ensure equal rights?  Why did the founders set up a government that was specifically designed to ensure rights and prevent a tyranny of the majority?