SBR Utopia ---- Permanently OPEN!! (Page 22)

On that last part, I've seen the same though it's been just congestion for me. Goes up and down directly with the amount of swimming I'm doing.

Gosh, I haven't posted in a while and I really do intend to get an IM AZ race report done one of these days.  On Saturday I did my first x-c ski race of the season and it felt great to be back at it.  They shortened the race a couple km (18km) due to cold temps but once you got moving the cold wasn't too bad.  I have 3 more x-c races in the next 4 weeks, ending with my goal race at the end being the 50 km American Birkebeiner (it will be my 17th Birkie).  The last few winters have been a mental conflict for me because x-c ski racing is my first love and is what got me into endurance training back in high school.  But until I KQ, I won't focus on skiing like I used to before I took up triathlon.  So, I squeeze in a bit of skiing between s/b/r and just enjoy ski racing for the fun of it and try to remain somewhat competitive. 

Yeah, I understand plenty of adaptations are being made while running slow -no matter how slow. But when it comes to nailing specific paces that are designed to create a specific stimulus to s specific "system," I'm not sure.

It might just simply come down to giving my body a moment to adapt, which I think it already is.

The other option would be to decrease mileage a little but then I wonder which training stress is more important, volume or intensity. When it comes to M training, I am inclined to think volume. 

My fear was always about the number of variables, and making mistakes in the testing protocol, hence skewing the results.  I also need to find a wind/traffic free road.  I can't remember if it needs to be flat, slight uphill/downhill, does that matter...

If you are using aerolab, I think it helps if the course has some rolling in it.  That way you can adjust the cda until your power/speed relationship matches the elevation profile.

My first guess is that it was just an off-day for you.  Maybe something was a little different from your normal routine - something you ate or some other sport activity?  If your legs keep feeling dead more often, then I'd look to training adjustments.

I've come to disagree with some of the the slow running / high volume mantra on BT.  The Pfitz plans resonate better with me.  Yes lots of volume but I wouldn't really call them "mostly slow".  I think if you want to run faster, you have to eventually ... run faster.  Shocking.

The thing is, people who already have a solid base can push a bit harder than they think, even on a Z2 run.

Your last comment, I'll point back to the Pfitz mesocycles.  Early in your marathon build, focus on endurance (volume), then midway transition towards more LT workouts and finally taper / race preparation.

I'm hoping to do some testing once the weather improves.  There is a ~1KM loop about 5k from my house that should work well I think as it's a street with only one way in or out so local traffic only and early on a weekend it should be pretty quiet.  There is only one 90 degree turn so I should be able to do the whole loop in aero and maintain my position with no braking.  It has an elevation gain of 20-30 feet probably.

When you're doing these rides, are you aiming for power at any particular % of FTP - does it make any difference if you are on the low side?  10min is certainly doable, and I had not considered just riding around the neighbourhood.  Within the 10min how long do you want to hold each position or change, and I assume you hit the lap button each time you make an adjustment while riding?

Nice going! Think I've been up around 60 days straight before, or about 2 months. A couple things to get out of it are a bunch of consistent running and a better feel for how much one can do at a time to keep up that consistency.

I'm a little leery of going for big streaks though. There is a Challenge thread of 30 runs in 30 days which I think is a great idea and was part of that for awhile. I eventually dropped out of it as some in there became rather enamored with larger and larger streaks. That may sound ok at first, but they were losing sight of the goal of improved running and that the 30 days streak was a tool to help achieve that. The streak became the goal and that improved running should just "happen" because of it. Daily minimums went up and there was less variety in the runs. Don't think they had the overall balance in the types of runs to keep on improving as well. The continuous streak was such a strong component that the view of what all was going on in their training blurred some. Running 29 or 30 days out of a 31 day month is quite good, but was seen as a significant let down. The streaks are a good thing, just so long as it's kept in check as to what they are.

Thanks for the feedback.  Once the ground thaws this is something I have on the "to do" list for the start of the season.  I'll go read the ST thread.

I am coming around to this a bit. One thing this group has prompted me to do is re-assess my effort level. I thank all of you for that.  I think that for the first couple of years I had to just go out and run. Not much push or effort to it, just run. As my body has adjusted, more effort seems to be more necessary. Now, that is not to say always and I think "how often" is important to figure out so that you maximize return while avoiding injury.

Well, as I said it was different because I only had a day between a full 20 mile glycogen depletion run and the quality workout. So, ultimately I think that plays a big part. But it also has me thinking a lot about the tradeoff between volume and intensity. They are both important (especially in the marathon) but striking that balance is not easy and is highly individual. 

I don't really believe the mantra on BT is just slow running/high volume. In my eyes it's always been "mostly easy, sometimes hard." And that is pretty much what the majority of the experts say too, and what I personally believe.

I think we can all work on training smarter, though. 

When I very first started running, I did a 30 day challenge. I think this was was of the most beneficial exercises I have ever done.

Since then, I think I did something like 100-120 days straight but I wasn't counting. It just happened that way.

Conversely, and to Ben's point, I think focusing too much on a streak takes away from more important aspects of training. I also believe complete rest is a crucial part of maximizing your potential. 

I think it would be really hard to make a good decision when you are on streak day 5,000 and you REALLY need a rest.

Have you done any recent field testing to determine your critical velocity?  That will give you a better idea of what you should be working on.

I got up to 117 days in a row once and it got to the point where I was looking for a way out!!  

It finally happened on the day that we were on a bike trip in the Magdalen Islands that involved getting up at 7am for a 1.5 hour bike ride (in the rain) to a ferry terminal, followed by a 5.5 hour ferry ride and then back on the bikes for another 3 hours to get to our car and then an hour drive home.  I think we got home around 5pm and it never occurred to me to run until after 10 and I just said eff it.  

I'm glad I did it at the time as it taught me to run easy and how to be consistent but I wouldn't want to get up that high again on purpose.

Finally, back onto a running schedule!   Got 4 miles in this morning, ran down to the beach and back, I forgot how much I love running in the morning.

What is that?

Awesome!

That's awesome. You were having some injury trouble, right? 

I don't think the mantra is always go slow either, but can see how some may think that. There are a number who get the "mostly easy, sometimes hard". It's just that questions tend to be why running is so tough when they're doing. 2-3 times a week and 2-4 miles at a time. First thing, run more. Or the 3x a week schedule with intervals, tempos & long run. Slow down and run more often. Some could get stuck on that idea for all time, not realizing that they should eventually work in some other types of runs. It's not just distance variation, but effort level. And even more so, it's not just figuring out a weekly template and doing that over and over. Many want that for simplicity and some can get stuck there.

I actually do end up making fairly similar weekly templates and doing them over and over, sometimes for months in a row, but what could easily be missed in there is how I organize and change up the "trees" in each spot of this subset of the "forest". Probably takes looking over at least a month if not several to get the idea whereas many may want to look at just a few days to a week. Someone just asked a question on this as many of my rides look to be about the same size (by time), but pointed out a few other things to look at and think a lightbulb may have gone on there. You guys already know there would be a huge difference in comparing 2 hr rides of 100 TSS vs 160, but that's not obvious to everyone.

I've heard another thing you can do to mark your laps is to tap your brakes.  This would show a spike in your expected cda and be a nice lap marker if you don't hit the lap button or don't have any noticeable elevation changes.