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2013-09-19 8:49 AM
in reply to: cdban66

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by cdban66
Originally posted by QueenZipp
Originally posted by cdban66
Originally posted by QueenZipp

My friend Ken made a great observation today.....this is what I summed up in my blog:

Ken made a great point today--last year I was doing almost equal volume to this year--though the long runs were not as long and I was not as exhausted as this year.  I dug through last years logs (August--September).  I was tired....had a butt load of migraines.....but was not bone weary exhausted like I am now.   I think  one thing I did differently was run some evenings so I would not have to get up at dawn every day.  I did a lot more yoga. My legs didn't kick in with decent speed until October so I guess this slow azz stuff is the norm for now.....That said, I may alternate weeks of 5 days a week running and 4 days a week to run cause that was my plan last year.  I will also not force myself out of bed at 5 AM all the time now that it's cooling off.  I can do  some running after work which may help.....I haven't gone vegan or even vegetarian --yet....but I am more plant focused. 

 

So I have some direction on how to "fix" what ever is messing up my run and hope to recover it before too long.  Started with a Vinyasa Yoga class tonight (and meat with dinner for the first time since the weekend)

Judy, I wonder how much of a role nutrition is playing in this, since you went more plant focused. Is your protein intake around the same level?

Just throwing it out there, I'm so far away from knowledgeable on this stuff that I really need to get up to speed.

I haven't eliminated meat and have done recipes that  had a good balance of other sources of proteins (ie beans and cheeses) BUT I will say that after eating chicken last night my body perked up like nobody's business so some may be related to that change.

I'm kinda interested, as I have been struggling with diet (and the affect there of) lately. It is such a challenge, I feel your pain. 

Judi,

After just going through a bout of over reaching, it sounds like you may be over reached.  There are lots of things that can go into causing one to over reach--work stress, personal stress, sub optimal nutrition, increased volume, intensity, frequency, poor sleep, lack of sleep, etc. 

I have been there two times this year, and for me it's been a combination of increased volume and intensity and personal stress.  When I get there,  I have to back it WAY, WAY down to recover.  Some recommendations I have seen are to do nothing for two days and then no more than light 50 minutes for three days before resuming previous volume with NO intensity for an additional week. 

If we keep pushing without recovery we just dig ourselves into a hole and delay the inevitable rest--your body will get it one way or another.   You can give it to it, or it will take it from you :/

I would also strongly suggest taking a look at your nutrition.  It is not uncommon for endurance athletes to be low on protein or iron.  I know you've had blood work recently, did they happen to do an iron panel?  Often, a doc will check hemoglobin but not specifically check ferritin --this does not mean that we should supplement iron without having it checked as high iron is potentially worse than low iron. Apologies if you know this stuff already, but just thought I'd throw it out there. :)



2013-09-19 8:58 AM
in reply to: jobaxas

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by jobaxas

I'M BACK!

So today was first training since the fracture - went for my usual 6.6km Zone 2 lunchtime run.  and i was faster - 9 days rest has done wonders.

I started this Z2 thing at 7.52/km - today was 7.07/km.

Now that is progress - and Zone 2 is comfortable running no out of breath no effort.

I am DELIGHTED.

Yeeeeaaaah, JoJo, wooooooo!!!! Cool

2013-09-19 9:01 AM
in reply to: QueenZipp

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by QueenZipp

My friend Ken made a great observation today.....this is what I summed up in my blog:

Ken made a great point today--last year I was doing almost equal volume to this year--though the long runs were not as long and I was not as exhausted as this year.  I dug through last years logs (August--September).  I was tired....had a butt load of migraines.....but was not bone weary exhausted like I am now.   I think  one thing I did differently was run some evenings so I would not have to get up at dawn every day.  I did a lot more yoga. My legs didn't kick in with decent speed until October so I guess this slow azz stuff is the norm for now.....That said, I may alternate weeks of 5 days a week running and 4 days a week to run cause that was my plan last year.  I will also not force myself out of bed at 5 AM all the time now that it's cooling off.  I can do  some running after work which may help.....I haven't gone vegan or even vegetarian --yet....but I am more plant focused. 

 

So I have some direction on how to "fix" what ever is messing up my run and hope to recover it before too long.  Started with a Vinyasa Yoga class tonight (and meat with dinner for the first time since the weekend)

Hope you get things worked out soon, Judi.  Your comment about your body perking up after eating chicken for dinner really stood out, plus you are addressing the issue of sleep and time of day of workouts, which may also be affecting how you feel.

2013-09-19 9:04 AM
in reply to: melbo55

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by melbo55
Originally posted by QueenZipp

My friend Ken made a great observation today.....this is what I summed up in my blog:

Ken made a great point today--last year I was doing almost equal volume to this year--though the long runs were not as long and I was not as exhausted as this year.  I dug through last years logs (August--September).  I was tired....had a butt load of migraines.....but was not bone weary exhausted like I am now.   I think  one thing I did differently was run some evenings so I would not have to get up at dawn every day.  I did a lot more yoga. My legs didn't kick in with decent speed until October so I guess this slow azz stuff is the norm for now.....That said, I may alternate weeks of 5 days a week running and 4 days a week to run cause that was my plan last year.  I will also not force myself out of bed at 5 AM all the time now that it's cooling off.  I can do  some running after work which may help.....I haven't gone vegan or even vegetarian --yet....but I am more plant focused. 

 

So I have some direction on how to "fix" what ever is messing up my run and hope to recover it before too long.  Started with a Vinyasa Yoga class tonight (and meat with dinner for the first time since the weekend)

Hope you get things worked out soon, Judi.  Your comment about your body perking up after eating chicken for dinner really stood out, plus you are addressing the issue of sleep and time of day of workouts, which may also be affecting how you feel.

Agreed.  Even an extra 30 minutes of sleep per night can make a big difference to me!

2013-09-19 9:09 AM
in reply to: jmkizer

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)

Originally posted by jmkizer NOT LIKING THE ADS IN THE FORUM!

MEGA annoying.  Back when the changeover happened, I actually renewed my membership mainly to get rid of the ads in the forum.  Now apparently the changed how that works.

2013-09-19 9:21 AM
in reply to: switch

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Judy, you've pushed me to begin logging my food again. Thanks a bunch for that!


2013-09-19 9:48 AM
in reply to: cdban66

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)

Originally posted by cdban66 Judy, you've pushed me to begin logging my food again. Thanks a bunch for that!

I've thought about doing that. Sometimes I wonder if my sluggish days are just sluggish days or if it is nutrition related. Logging food seems like such a PAIN though.

2013-09-19 9:52 AM
in reply to: rrrunner

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)

Speaking of nutrition...

A new micro brewery just opened up about 10 minutes from my house. Soooo we are going to try it out tomorrow night for my pre-race dinner Laughing

2013-09-19 10:05 AM
in reply to: rrrunner

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by rrrunner

Originally posted by cdban66 Judy, you've pushed me to begin logging my food again. Thanks a bunch for that!

I've thought about doing that. Sometimes I wonder if my sluggish days are just sluggish days or if it is nutrition related. Logging food seems like such a PAIN though.

It takes some time. And the stuff I've used are solely calorie related. So I don't know how well it'll help in the long run, but I think I'll give it a shot for a couple of weeks and see what I can pull out of it.

2013-09-19 10:42 AM
in reply to: cdban66

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by cdban66
Originally posted by rrrunner

Originally posted by cdban66 Judy, you've pushed me to begin logging my food again. Thanks a bunch for that!

I've thought about doing that. Sometimes I wonder if my sluggish days are just sluggish days or if it is nutrition related. Logging food seems like such a PAIN though.

It takes some time. And the stuff I've used are solely calorie related. So I don't know how well it'll help in the long run, but I think I'll give it a shot for a couple of weeks and see what I can pull out of it.

About a month or two ago I decided to log my food as I wanted to drop a few pounds, so I started using the myfitnesspal app. This is the first time I've ever logged food and with this app it is pretty simple as it seems to have a huge data base of food, which makes life easy. I also log my workouts in the app and it adjusts how many calories I can consume for the day. I believe it really over estimates the calories burned, but it is good for a general guide. I have n't logged in a few weeks as I eat very similarly week to week, so once I got a better handle on the hidden calories - who knew micro brews were THAT much more in calories than lite beer!, I haven't felt the need. My clothes are falling off me now ( yay), so I know it has worked. I probably need to start logging again as I'm sure my caloric need has changed. It really stinks being short- I can't eat nearly as much as I would like!
2013-09-19 10:49 AM
in reply to: QueenZipp

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by QueenZipp

My friend Ken made a great observation today.....this is what I summed up in my blog:

Ken made a great point today--last year I was doing almost equal volume to this year--though the long runs were not as long and I was not as exhausted as this year.  I dug through last years logs (August--September).  I was tired....had a butt load of migraines.....but was not bone weary exhausted like I am now.   I think  one thing I did differently was run some evenings so I would not have to get up at dawn every day.  I did a lot more yoga. My legs didn't kick in with decent speed until October so I guess this slow azz stuff is the norm for now.....That said, I may alternate weeks of 5 days a week running and 4 days a week to run cause that was my plan last year.  I will also not force myself out of bed at 5 AM all the time now that it's cooling off.  I can do  some running after work which may help.....I haven't gone vegan or even vegetarian --yet....but I am more plant focused. 

 

Judi, I think sleep, hydration, nutrition - all of those things play an important role and should not be taking lightly. Certainly you can make the changes above.

But ultimately I think the biggest issue with your plan is that your long run is WAY too high of a percentage of your weekly mileage. Even look at bolded portion of the above statement.

You can do two things, either shorten your long run or build up the volume of your other runs during the week to support the long run. This should go without saying but all nice and easy running. Shortening the long run is less than ideal, as you should be peaking soon. But obviously you can't ramp up the volume too fast either so do it slowly.

Finally, as far as not feeling the speed? Yeah. That is typical in marathon training. Additionally, it's been hot and I don't care who you are, that is going to slow you down.



2013-09-19 11:02 AM
in reply to: amd723

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)

I have to go for a short run because it's not 90* yet and I MUST take advantage of that.

But all this food talk is making me ask a slightly different question...

I've been barely hungry for about two weeks. Like my appetite just isn't there. It's bad because I'm needing the fuel, but nothing sounds good. Even food I normally love just tastes blah to me.Undecided

Anyone else have to kick-start their eating? How?

2013-09-19 11:07 AM
in reply to: 4agoodlife

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Ok, my racing family is complete. For now Smile
2013-09-19 11:16 AM
in reply to: Asalzwed

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)

Elesa (and anyone else who was curious) here is a compelation video of the XC meet http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq5zqDymXTg 

It's totally cheesy and is from the HS perspective (they had HS and college at the same time although slightly different distances as HS runs 5K vs 6K or 8K) but you get the idea of what the start, the course and the finish are like. 

2013-09-19 11:28 AM
in reply to: 4agoodlife

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by 4agoodlife

I have to go for a short run because it's not 90* yet and I MUST take advantage of that.

But all this food talk is making me ask a slightly different question...

I've been barely hungry for about two weeks. Like my appetite just isn't there. It's bad because I'm needing the fuel, but nothing sounds good. Even food I normally love just tastes blah to me.Undecided

Anyone else have to kick-start their eating? How?

Sorry.  Eating is not a problem for me!

2013-09-19 11:28 AM
in reply to: melbo55

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by melbo55

Originally posted by jmkizer NOT LIKING THE ADS IN THE FORUM!

MEGA annoying.  Back when the changeover happened, I actually renewed my membership mainly to get rid of the ads in the forum.  Now apparently the changed how that works.

I agree.  I was like, "What, ads? Really?"



2013-09-19 11:31 AM
in reply to: Asalzwed

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by Asalzwed
Ok, my racing family is complete. For now Smile

Very NICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2013-09-19 11:49 AM
in reply to: 4agoodlife

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by 4agoodlife

I have to go for a short run because it's not 90* yet and I MUST take advantage of that.

But all this food talk is making me ask a slightly different question...

I've been barely hungry for about two weeks. Like my appetite just isn't there. It's bad because I'm needing the fuel, but nothing sounds good. Even food I normally love just tastes blah to me.Undecided

Anyone else have to kick-start their eating? How?

Um, no.
2013-09-19 11:55 AM
in reply to: rrrunner

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)

In answer to all the posts....gonna group answer cause I  will miss something if I try to go one at a time....heck I will still miss something I'm sure:

Lesa....I see my Dr next week for my check up.  He did not order a ferritin/ TIBC but if I am even low normal for h&h I may ask if we can check these.

I am drinking a good bit of water daily, close to 1.5 liters which is my baseline.  Rarely drink alcohol.  My 2 (admittedly large) cups of coffee and glass of V8 daily. I have gatorade or a smoothie post long run.

I think adding in 1 shorter run per week *may* be do able--but I will have to take each week as it comes.  If I am feeling zapped then one more run is just one more potential for injury day by over-doing things.

My diet has not substantially changed.  I have always tried to be fairly plant focused.  I am dabbling with some vegetarian meals but these are using other sources of protein such as beans, low fat cheese....I may limit the meatless meals to 2x/ week until after the marathon is over just to be safe though.

I really think dome of it is sleep deprivation from these early wake ups--even though I get to bed around 10 PM.  Alternating some evening runs may help this some.

Nutrition logging is a royal pain in the butt.....maybe one day I will be consistent with it.

2013-09-19 12:48 PM
in reply to: QueenZipp

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by QueenZipp

 

I think adding in 1 shorter run per week *may* be do able--but I will have to take each week as it comes.  If I am feeling zapped then one more run is just one more potential for injury day by over-doing things.

The ratio of your long run to your weekly mileage is much more of an injury risk than adding a easy run or two. I promise.

You can even drop some of your cross training if you are struggling to find the energy because specitivity is much more important in this case.

2013-09-19 12:51 PM
in reply to: Asalzwed

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)

Does anyone like this stuff?

I have exactly one metric-crap-ton sitting at home, if anyone wants some.



2013-09-19 1:00 PM
in reply to: Asalzwed

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by Asalzwed

Does anyone like this stuff?

I have exactly one metric-crap-ton sitting at home, if anyone wants some.

Never tried it. Methinks you should mix it with vodka.

2013-09-19 1:19 PM
in reply to: QueenZipp

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by QueenZipp

In answer to all the posts....gonna group answer cause I  will miss something if I try to go one at a time....heck I will still miss something I'm sure:

Lesa....I see my Dr next week for my check up.  He did not order a ferritin/ TIBC but if I am even low normal for h&h I may ask if we can check these.

I am drinking a good bit of water daily, close to 1.5 liters which is my baseline.  Rarely drink alcohol.  My 2 (admittedly large) cups of coffee and glass of V8 daily. I have gatorade or a smoothie post long run.

I think adding in 1 shorter run per week *may* be do able--but I will have to take each week as it comes.  If I am feeling zapped then one more run is just one more potential for injury day by over-doing things.

My diet has not substantially changed.  I have always tried to be fairly plant focused.  I am dabbling with some vegetarian meals but these are using other sources of protein such as beans, low fat cheese....I may limit the meatless meals to 2x/ week until after the marathon is over just to be safe though.

I really think dome of it is sleep deprivation from these early wake ups--even though I get to bed around 10 PM.  Alternating some evening runs may help this some.

Nutrition logging is a royal pain in the butt.....maybe one day I will be consistent with it.

Last time I had a problem my H & H was completely normal.  I had to literally beg my doctor for a test, and she acquiesced, with "OK, but it's gonna be normal."  The follow-up phone call was really validating.  Now she tests me whenever I want;)  The iron thing is sometimes really goofy.

I hope whatever it is it get's better for you :)

2013-09-19 1:24 PM
in reply to: Asalzwed

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by Asalzwed

Elesa (and anyone else who was curious) here is a compelation video of the XC meet http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq5zqDymXTg 

It's totally cheesy and is from the HS perspective (they had HS and college at the same time although slightly different distances as HS runs 5K vs 6K or 8K) but you get the idea of what the start, the course and the finish are like. 

Am I a dork if my HR goes up and I get goosebumps? 

Don't answer that.

 That start! Heart. Thumping. Out. Of. Chest. *gulp*

2013-09-19 1:32 PM
in reply to: Asalzwed

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Subject: RE: Mad Manatee Mentors 2013: CLOSED (exc/ Pop Tart bribes)
Originally posted by Asalzwed

Does anyone like this stuff?

I have exactly one metric-crap-ton sitting at home, if anyone wants some.

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And I have a heck of a time finding it locally. I usually get it from Amazon unless I luck out and find it at one of our larger LBS's

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