Mad Manatees Mentor Group - VERY CLOSED!!! Sorry! (Page 37)

Asalzwed - 2013-01-08 5:00 AM

Alright guys I am about to drop a bomb on you guys. I have a decision to make in a couple weeks and I am extremely open to suggestions. I just don't know what I should do.

I am halfway considering the Oly Nationals BUT I only want to go if I think I can be somewhat competitive and have a chance at finishing in the top 20.

It appears (from last years results) that means approximately a 1:40 per hundred swim, 22 MPH bike, 43 minute 10K. Obviously these are ballpark numbers and due to the nature of triathlon there is some give and take with these numbers.

Now, unfortunately I don't have a great indicator of exactly where I fall because my last and most competitive triathlon (sprint distance) I have done was with no bike training (other than riding to work) and about 4 weeks swimming (2 times per week) Also, it was a sprint.  But, it's a place to start. My times were 1:59 per hundred m for the swim, 19.29 MPH for the bike course (hilly) and, well I think the run is not something I will worry about for now. 

Now IF I am going to do this, training needs to start right after Boston. I was thinking I could take a few weeks off running (which I will have to do anyway) and go straight to the pool. If I can get someone to help me with my stroke early on (Chad? ) and be consistent I think there is a lot of room for improvement for my swimming (obviously.)

I think in terms of biking I just need to do some longer sessions and work hard and pushing the pace every time I am out there. But I am not sure specifically how I will tackle this.

The running will drop down in MPW but I would probably focus on more intensity.

Other information you should know: If I start right after Boston I would have almost 4 months of training. 

 

So, I don't know exactly what I am asking. I guess first off, how does this sound? Doable? What else should I keep in mind? Is my little roadie that doesn't really fit me very well (I am pretty sure) going to get me where I need to be? Should I invest in a proper fit even though I am quite certain it's too small for me? Most important, is this going to set me back in my long term running goals?

TriAya - 2013-01-07 12:26 PM

Salty. Srsly. DOOO EEET. No, it's not going to affect your long-term running plans (might be wise, now AND later) to have certain structured periods of time when you're on your feet less. (and it's not like you're gonna be zero on running either)

I'm pretty sure you could get down to 1:50/100 OW with not much more than a few tweaks. Then it's just getting wet. Lots. Funnily enough 1:40/100 is about the threshold of diminishing returns for most people.

In some people's experience (mine included) having a ton of run helps the bike a lot more than having a ton of bike helps the run. (This is assuming that one is relatively untrained in the other).

You might be able to get real close on a "fitting" (exact measurements into a poodle ... err. computer, cycling fit program) and then have someone like HEY SPIGLET eyeball the positioning. Possible your current bike is build-outable. If not, perhaps a new frame wouldn't kill you too much and you could add components on to it.

Looks to me like Oly Nationals would be a great opportunity to really build up aerobic benefits and endurance while taking some pounding off your legs, giving you a much-needed break, and the race itself an excellent experience in higher-level competition.

DOOOO EEEEEET

Now about this baby lemur.

Asalzwed - 2013-01-08 2:38 AM

Yeah, this makes a lot of sense. My plan was to drop down my running for a short period after Boston anyway. And like you said, it's not like I won't be running for goodness sake. In fact, it might be good for my running to have a solid chunk of lower volume higher intensity work (something that has a lot of room for improvement AND that I will be structurally ready for post Boston I think.)

I can just feel that I have a ton of room for improvement in the swim. The light-bulb was FINALLY coming on in that short period of swimming before the sprint tri so with a little more refinement and a lot more time in the pool I think it's possible. Now I just need to get in the mindset where I enjoy the pool. I think that is going to be the ultimate key to my success, believe it or not. 

Great idea about putting Spiglet to work. I didn't think of that  I can go Spiglet to LBS depending on his feedback. My bike sessions wont have to be terribly long for Oly training will they?

Asalzwed - 2013-01-08 2:52 AM

So did you get the lemur under control?

They are so cute!

TriAya - 2013-01-07 12:58 PM

It's ridiculously cute. The ones here are actually lorises, but they resemble lemurs and that's what everyone calls them. Kind of like red pandas, which aren't pandas at all ...

Anyway, my brother gave it a banana, which it happily took and is now hiding in the vines in his backyard, eating the banana. I have no idea what they're going to do with it but I gave them my .02 worth.

Asalzwed - 2013-01-08 3:02 AM

Oh a banana, that's a good solution 

Actually, I am eating a banana right now, too. Cheers lemur-lorises!

TriAya - 2013-01-07 12:48 PM

I'd take a week, two, even three after Boston (dep/up how you're feeling) to do low-intensity, long-ish stuff on the bike. Not terribly long. Just low enough that it is a true break both in terms of musculature and energy systems.

The rest of the time, honestly, you might want to put in a few rides that are longer (2ish hours) but a lot of shorter, hourish, hourish-plus painful stuff on the bike will get you far and fast. Look into Jorge's cycling program.

Asalzwed - 2013-01-08 3:05 AM

That's also something I don't like (and commented in the other thread about) is the biking being suffering. I don't like doing things that aren't fun. lol. So I probably have a good amount to gain on the bike as well, I just need to adjust my attitude and stop being such a pansy. 

TriAya - 2013-01-07 12:05 PM

Yes. No. Yes. No. No. Wait, what?

DOOOO EEEEEET!!!

I will answer everything shortly, like that Zorba or Zamsah machine in BIG. Please insert Pop Tart to begin.

On a serious note, my brother is having a lemur situation. BRB

Asalzwed - 2013-01-08 3:12 AM

Holy crap I only just noticed you references this machine in BIG!!! OMG! Hahahahahaha

TriAya - 2013-01-07 1:08 PM

And here I thought this was going to be about bananas ...

So don't think of it as suffering. Think of it as TRANSCENDING suffering. Also, you like a good gutfest. Admit it. Compared to some of the track workouts, this IS the easier, softer way.

TriAya - 2013-01-07 1:14 PM

I think we managed to get to p. 46 without some random pop culture reference ... Zorba is the Greek, Zamsah I made up (sounds like Zensah but that's too ... athleticky) ... it's actually Zoltar. Zoltan? Zoltar. I think. Or is that the newer bad hairdresser movie with Ben Stiller. Nope. It's Zoltar. Gotta be.

Asalzwed - 2013-01-08 3:15 AM

Yeah ... but at this point I have such a foundation of long slow distance running, it's a nice break to shake it up every now and again. And sure, I DO like that redlining feeling to a point. I am not sure why I shy away from it on the bike. Probably because I don't do many races involving a bike and therefore don't have results as feedback that what I am doing really is worth something.

Ah transcendence ... that always gets me. 

TriAya - 2013-01-07 1:16 PM

And lookalike sisters, apparently.

Should we NOT be having the guy who goes by Toiletbrush make her license, too?

jobaxas - 2013-01-06 9:52 AM Hey Manatees can't sleep due to time zone change gotta love that! Also stressing about IM!!! Original Manatees you know of my cycling phobia new manatees welcome! I am a triathlete who just cannot ride!! I can put in hours and hours on the drainer but road riding just a cold sweat! Not really asking advice though its always welcome! I've got eleven weeks til IM so serious hours on the drainer coming up I figure all time in the saddle is worthwhile. Can I do IM with this plus minimal riding around a local track? I did my HIM on that alone and it was fine not pretty as I didn't have nearly enough hours in the saddle and wasn't used to steep climbs. Melbourne not hilly no reason to stop (my big hang up) but I need handling skills to eat and drink comfortably. I'm gonna wear a camelpak and two bottles on the bike unless its 100F that will be fine. Aero bars - can I complete IM without I did HIM without and not uncomfortable except wear and tear on nether regions!!! Thoughts manatees. I've got this far I don't wanna pull out. I want to learn to love my bike

TriAya - 2013-01-07 2:14 PM

I think we managed to get to p. 46 without some random pop culture reference ... Zorba is the Greek, Zamsah I made up (sounds like Zensah but that's too ... athleticky) ... it's actually Zoltar. Zoltan? Zoltar. I think. Or is that the newer bad hairdresser movie with Ben Stiller. Nope. It's Zoltar. Gotta be.

cdban66 - 2013-01-07 11:21 AM

Don't mess with the Zohan.

Zoltar sits on the boardwalk.

Yep, tonight is trivia night and I am ready!

Asalzwed - 2013-01-07 10:00 AM

Alright guys I am about to drop a bomb on you guys. I have a decision to make in a couple weeks and I am extremely open to suggestions. I just don't know what I should do.

I am halfway considering the Oly Nationals BUT I only want to go if I think I can be somewhat competitive and have a chance at finishing in the top 20.

It appears (from last years results) that means approximately a 1:40 per hundred swim, 22 MPH bike, 43 minute 10K. Obviously these are ballpark numbers and due to the nature of triathlon there is some give and take with these numbers.

Now, unfortunately I don't have a great indicator of exactly where I fall because my last and most competitive triathlon (sprint distance) I have done was with no bike training (other than riding to work) and about 4 weeks swimming (2 times per week) Also, it was a sprint.  But, it's a place to start. My times were 1:59 per hundred m for the swim, 19.29 MPH for the bike course (hilly) and, well I think the run is not something I will worry about for now. 

Now IF I am going to do this, training needs to start right after Boston. I was thinking I could take a few weeks off running (which I will have to do anyway) and go straight to the pool. If I can get someone to help me with my stroke early on (Chad? ) and be consistent I think there is a lot of room for improvement for my swimming (obviously.)

I think in terms of biking I just need to do some longer sessions and work hard and pushing the pace every time I am out there. But I am not sure specifically how I will tackle this.

The running will drop down in MPW but I would probably focus on more intensity.

Other information you should know: If I start right after Boston I would have almost 4 months of training. 

 

So, I don't know exactly what I am asking. I guess first off, how does this sound? Doable? What else should I keep in mind? Is my little roadie that doesn't really fit me very well (I am pretty sure) going to get me where I need to be? Should I invest in a proper fit even though I am quite certain it's too small for me? Most important, is this going to set me back in my long term running goals?

Asalzwed - 2013-01-07 3:30 PMIt was so windy on my run that it blew like a 14" string of snot out of my nose. Anyway, carry on!

Muskrat37 - 2013-01-07 3:48 PM

I would be happy to help!  I, of course, buy into the Manatee Mantra and say "DO EEEET!"  

I agree with Yanti, but want to interject a slightly different view point: (I created a spreadsheet to help understand my viewpoint)

I had to convert your times to yards (it's how I think) - so your current swim time of 1:59 per 100 meters = 1:43 per 100 yard = 103 seconds.  

Swim (1600 yards)	Current Time (seconds per 100 yards)	Goal Time (seconds per 100 yards)	Time Savings (seconds per 100 yards)	Total Savings (In minutes)
	103	86	17	00:04:32
	103	95	8	00:02:08

The bottom row is what I would suggest as a goal.  If we shot for the bottom # (1:35 per 100 yards) the difference in your performance on race day (from a 1:26 per 100 yards) would be 2 mins 24 seconds of swim time.  I think you could more easily make that up on the bike - or by kicking a** in the run OR IN THE 2 TRANSITIONS.  There is a pretty big difference in 1:35 and 1:26 per 100 in both swimming ability and energy output.  I think you would have lot's of energy left at the 1:35 pace.  

You want to get almost 18% faster... IMO, that is a big goal in a short time.  If a runner told you that they wanted to go from 8:00 miles to 6:34 (18% faster) per mile in only 4 months - what would you tell them?

I am not trying to be a negative nancy here.  I totally support you in your goals and if you want to work with me, I will do everything in my power to help you get there. (It will involve a lot of short intervals that you will either love or hate ) And I would suggest plenty of Open Water Swims (think once per week) as you can lose a lot of time on the swim with poor sighting .  When is the race?  Will we have time to swim in lakes for a month or 2 before the race?  I hope this information is helpful and I really, really, really hope I didn't talk you out of it (because I want you to do it).  

Asalzwed - 2013-01-07 2:30 PM It was so windy on my run that it blew like a 14" string of snot out of my nose. Anyway, carry on!

rrrunner - 2013-01-07 4:01 PM

I get those on my bike. Oh if my kids only knew I do snot rockets. They probably think I stop each time my nose starts to run.