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Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge (Page 37)
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 2013-11-20 8:24 AM in reply to: 0 |
Master 10208   Northern IL |  Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" ChallengeOriginally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by switch Originally posted by Asalzwed Ummmm...maybe, once in a while. Uhhhh, maybe most of my swim workouts have some sets at CSS...OK, I know I look like a complete dumbazz right now...Originally posted by switch Someone just posted this over on ST, it's from The Time Crunched Triathlete. So let's say you do a trainer ride in the morning that gives you 30 total minutes of LT time, and then a swim in the afternoon that gives you 30 minutes at your CSS (which is like LT), then, uh, what should your recovery look like? Is that just too much? One's legs, ones arms/back/core, but they're both using energy and taxing the body as a whole. Ugh, this is why I need something like TP of GC or just a brain... Wait, you are doing two LT workouts in one day? Sorry, all these terms are really confusing to me. The terms are confusing to me too. I *think* CSS is your swimming "threshold" pace (that's what I gather from the the swim smooth website), though I hadn't thought about it as LT before. I know this shouldn't be that hard to figure out, but I hear so often that you can push harder in swimming because it's no impact, and that you should push harder to get gains there. So, uhhh, I really don't know what to say right now, except I think I was thinking about the swim workouts wrong, and maybe that is why I am feeling pretty tired sometimes. I feel as though I have a pretty good understanding of how to build a solid run program but balancing multi-sport is way outside of my comfort zone. I'm not criticizing you or anything, I am just asking. I just feel like doing a threshold type of workout is about taxing that "system." It's not about overworking your arms or your legs or whatever. As to how much or how frequent (say, two time in one day?) I'm not sure what the rules are. It takes some time to get a feel for it, and there is some individuality (as Dale noted). It's both the "system" and the activity. Not complete overlap and not complete separation either. Somewhere in between, though probably best to look at it being closer to overlap. Also necessary to look at how much. Instead of a 2 x 20' on the bike it's more likely that 2 hard would be 1 x 20' bike and 1 x 20' run, for one simple example. Edited by brigby1 2013-11-20 8:25 AM |
| 2013-11-20 9:13 AM in reply to: 0 |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by popsracer You think you got the market cornered on that story? Lol!Originally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by popsracer Originally posted by el penguino Can I come over for breakfast??? I'm on my own for breakfast (DH and kids are asleep), so I'm usually much simpler than that!! Nutrition might have to be my next challenge... Me too? That beats my sausage mcmuffin STEVE! You need a McDonalds sponsorship! :) I'm working the NBC Kona human interest story thing for next year. Anything is possible. IM after McD addiction. Edited by switch 2013-11-20 9:13 AM |
| 2013-11-20 9:25 AM in reply to: dtoce |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Thanks Dale and Ben. Always good to keep things in perspective. -------------------------------------------------------- FWIW, I haven't eaten fast food in close to 15 years. A big part of my life, both the way my family farms and the non-profit we started seven years ago, is dedicated to raising and eating locally produced, sustainable, GMO and CAFO free food. I don't think eating Taco Bell or Mc Donalds once in a while actually hurts you, but I choose not to eat there for other reasons. This is a subject that should be in PCOJ, and I don't want to derail this thread, but I would be happy to discuss it more either by PM or in PCOJ
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| 2013-11-20 10:26 AM in reply to: MSU_Brad |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by MSU_Brad Hey guys...hope everyone is doing well. I'm still out here running, working on my current biggest weakness. Also taking the weight down just a tad. Had/have some personal life issues going on, so BT has kind of faded away for me for now. I'll be back regularly eventually. Hope everyone is doing well. Hey Brad! I'm glad you checked in. Hope things are OK. Hugs.
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| 2013-11-20 11:29 AM in reply to: MSU_Brad |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by MSU_Brad Hey guys...hope everyone is doing well. I'm still out here running, working on my current biggest weakness. Also taking the weight down just a tad. Had/have some personal life issues going on, so BT has kind of faded away for me for now. I'll be back regularly eventually. Hope everyone is doing well. Hey Brad!! Hang in there and know we are thinking of ya! |
| 2013-11-20 11:49 AM in reply to: brigby1 |
Veteran 1677  Houston, Texas | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by brigby1 It takes some time to get a feel for it, and there is some individuality (as Dale noted). It's both the "system" and the activity. Not complete overlap and not complete separation either. Somewhere in between, though probably best to look at it being closer to overlap. Also necessary to look at how much. Instead of a 2 x 20' on the bike it's more likely that 2 hard would be 1 x 20' bike and 1 x 20' run, for one simple example. I think I agree with what Ben is saying here (and what Dale said for sure -- it's definitely an individual thing that you have to experiment with yourself). To be honest, I have fairly minimal run background, so I've really only experimented with what I can get away with in regards to bike and swim. Most of my bike and swim sessions are "hard" because you can get away with it with a lower injury potential. I've noticed that my swim is impacted (really just the "fast" swimming) when my legs are very fatigued, which tends to occur with a lot of threshold or VO2max work. My bike workouts are rarely impacted by my swim workouts unless I do something like a Monday night swim (finishing around 9pm) and a Tuesday morning bike (starting around 4am) -- and that's more likely to be due to not getting adequate rest or hydration, more so than having swam hard. I've also noticed that while biking and running a leg-dominant activities, I tend to do well running after a hard bike session (not right after, but 12+ hours after) -- but I also do all of my running in Z2 at the moment, so I suspect this will be another learning curve as I continue to build volumen and eventually (like in a year!) start to add Q sessions. A PMC can only tell you so much. To be honest, logging your workouts and making specific notes about what you did and how you felt (and how you feel the next day or the next session) will give you HUGE insight into how to structure your training. Maybe one day I'll work with a coach, but like Elesa, I'd like to play around with it on my own for a bit. |
| 2013-11-20 11:52 AM in reply to: switch |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by switch Originally posted by popsracer You think you got the market cornered on that story? Lol!Originally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by popsracer Originally posted by el penguino Can I come over for breakfast??? I'm on my own for breakfast (DH and kids are asleep), so I'm usually much simpler than that!! Nutrition might have to be my next challenge... Me too? That beats my sausage mcmuffin STEVE! You need a McDonalds sponsorship! I'm working the NBC Kona human interest story thing for next year. Anything is possible. IM after McD addiction. Steve, in my hand is a bag of nuggets (20 piece)
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| 2013-11-20 12:10 PM in reply to: Asalzwed |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge I'm halfway through week 1 of workin' my weakness. I have a quality workout tonight and then everything else has been and will be easy leading up to the meet on Saturday. I've been sleepy and hungry this week but feel good structurally. I think I might ease up a bit on volume tomorrow and Friday and then do something in the 16-mile range for a long run on Sunday so that I end the week around 55 miles or so. My 5K was evidence of a pretty good VDOT increase (although it had been a while since I had raced something I could compare it to) but I am not sure when or even if I am going to implement these "faster" training paces in before nationals. |
| 2013-11-20 1:48 PM in reply to: Asalzwed |
Regular 1362 Jenison, MI | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by Asalzwed Thank you. It honestly means a lot to read that. Originally posted by MSU_Brad Hey guys...hope everyone is doing well. I'm still out here running, working on my current biggest weakness. Also taking the weight down just a tad. Had/have some personal life issues going on, so BT has kind of faded away for me for now. I'll be back regularly eventually. Hope everyone is doing well. Hey Brad!! Hang in there and know we are thinking of ya!  |
| 2013-11-20 6:02 PM in reply to: MSU_Brad |
Veteran 2441 Western Australia | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge So far this week I am 3 for 3 on both my weaknesses. I have done at least 30 minutes of SB or R each day and I have managed to limit myself to no more than 3 cups of tea a day all with only 1 teaspoon of sugar. I have noticed that all my workouts seem to be short, slow and steady and this really isn't getting me anywhere. So I have decided that for swimming and riding its time to up the anti and push things a bit more. My run I will leave as it is as I am still very new to it and 5k is still a real push for me. So thanks for your conversations over the last couple of days because they have inspired me to take a look at what I have been doing and assess where I'm really at. |
| 2013-11-20 6:32 PM in reply to: StaceyK |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Hey Stacey! That is great that you are so consistent in tackling those weaknesses and it seems quite natural to now want to start pushing a little. Also, swimming and biking are great places to start as they are lower impact and you recover more quickly. |
| 2013-11-20 6:56 PM in reply to: switch |
Member 3149 | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge First, hang in there Brad. All this talk lately has been way over my head, but I'm learning! Perhaps one day far from now I'll be able to apply some of these concepts. Weather hit the skids around here this week, so even though I want to be riding outside, the 17F temps in the morning are keeping me inside. Oh well, I'm keeping it in mind so when it does get warm for a day, I'll be out there. I have my first race next week, the Turkey Trot, which I'm doing with my sister's entire family (husband and three kids, ages 17, 13, and 10). Because it is in a strange town for the kids, the adults are all paired with a kid. I've been buddied up with my 13yo neice who must be part gazelle. I'm admittedly a little petrefied by this, because she is fast. My sister says I just have to survive the first two miles, then she slows down. Gonna give it my best, but if you don't hear from me after next Wednesday, assume I died chasing a scrawny kid! |
| 2013-11-20 11:06 PM in reply to: drfoodlove |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... |
| 2013-11-21 7:25 AM in reply to: Asalzwed |
| Master 10208 Northern IL | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge That which doesn't kill you ... |
| 2013-11-21 7:37 AM in reply to: Asalzwed |
Expert 4930 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... It was about time you stopped sandbagging your way through practices. I think I could do one of those 1Ks, and then would be crumpled up in a heap. |
| 2013-11-21 8:50 AM in reply to: Asalzwed |
Extreme Veteran 2263 Ridgeland, Mississippi | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... What's the recovery on those 1000s? |
| 2013-11-21 9:01 AM in reply to: msteiner |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by msteiner 90 secondsOriginally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... What's the recovery on those 1000s? |
| 2013-11-21 9:04 AM in reply to: jmhpsu93 |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Well, it wasn't even supposed to be hard! The goal was just to hit splits well and be mentally ready to race Saturday. I'm with you in regard to the crumpled pile. I'm sure it willgeteasier when I get used to a higher level of training.Originally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... It was about time you stopped sandbagging your way through practices. I think I could do one of those 1Ks, and then would be crumpled up in a heap. |
| 2013-11-21 9:25 AM in reply to: Asalzwed |
Extreme Veteran 2263 Ridgeland, Mississippi | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by msteiner 90 seconds Originally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... What's the recovery on those 1000s? That's pretty intense! |
| 2013-11-21 9:48 AM in reply to: Asalzwed |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Well, it wasn't even supposed to be hard! The goal was just to hit splits well and be mentally ready to race Saturday. I'm with you in regard to the crumpled pile. I'm sure it willgeteasier when I get used to a higher level of training. Originally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... It was about time you stopped sandbagging your way through practices. I think I could do one of those 1Ks, and then would be crumpled up in a heap. YAY Salty! Though, really, the sound of that workout makes my teeth hurt. :) When you had posted that you were going to wait, I thought that sounded like a pretty good idea. Did your coach elaborate on the decision at all? I hope you know I'm not questioning your coach's decision, I just like to try to understand the theory behind stuff like this, especially at the levelyou're running.
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| 2013-11-21 9:50 AM in reply to: drfoodlove |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by drfoodlove First, hang in there Brad. All this talk lately has been way over my head, but I'm learning! Perhaps one day far from now I'll be able to apply some of these concepts. Weather hit the skids around here this week, so even though I want to be riding outside, the 17F temps in the morning are keeping me inside. Oh well, I'm keeping it in mind so when it does get warm for a day, I'll be out there. I have my first race next week, the Turkey Trot, which I'm doing with my sister's entire family (husband and three kids, ages 17, 13, and 10). Because it is in a strange town for the kids, the adults are all paired with a kid. I've been buddied up with my 13yo neice who must be part gazelle. I'm admittedly a little petrefied by this, because she is fast. My sister says I just have to survive the first two miles, then she slows down. Gonna give it my best, but if you don't hear from me after next Wednesday, assume I died chasing a scrawny kid! This is pretty exciting Gretchen! We get to "be" with you for your first race--gives me goosebumps:) Do you have a race plan? What have you been doing for your run training?
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| 2013-11-21 9:52 AM in reply to: StaceyK |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by StaceyK So far this week I am 3 for 3 on both my weaknesses. I have done at least 30 minutes of SB or R each day and I have managed to limit myself to no more than 3 cups of tea a day all with only 1 teaspoon of sugar. I have noticed that all my workouts seem to be short, slow and steady and this really isn't getting me anywhere. So I have decided that for swimming and riding its time to up the anti and push things a bit more. My run I will leave as it is as I am still very new to it and 5k is still a real push for me. So thanks for your conversations over the last couple of days because they have inspired me to take a look at what I have been doing and assess where I'm really at. This whole post made me smile :) Sounds like a very, very good plan and it will be exciting to see how things go for you. Now you have that masters out of the way, you can get some good time for yourself. |
| 2013-11-21 9:57 AM in reply to: ligersandtions |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by ligersandtions Originally posted by brigby1 It takes some time to get a feel for it, and there is some individuality (as Dale noted). It's both the "system" and the activity. Not complete overlap and not complete separation either. Somewhere in between, though probably best to look at it being closer to overlap. Also necessary to look at how much. Instead of a 2 x 20' on the bike it's more likely that 2 hard would be 1 x 20' bike and 1 x 20' run, for one simple example. I think I agree with what Ben is saying here (and what Dale said for sure -- it's definitely an individual thing that you have to experiment with yourself). To be honest, I have fairly minimal run background, so I've really only experimented with what I can get away with in regards to bike and swim. Most of my bike and swim sessions are "hard" because you can get away with it with a lower injury potential. I've noticed that my swim is impacted (really just the "fast" swimming) when my legs are very fatigued, which tends to occur with a lot of threshold or VO2max work. My bike workouts are rarely impacted by my swim workouts unless I do something like a Monday night swim (finishing around 9pm) and a Tuesday morning bike (starting around 4am) -- and that's more likely to be due to not getting adequate rest or hydration, more so than having swam hard. I've also noticed that while biking and running a leg-dominant activities, I tend to do well running after a hard bike session (not right after, but 12+ hours after) -- but I also do all of my running in Z2 at the moment, so I suspect this will be another learning curve as I continue to build volumen and eventually (like in a year!) start to add Q sessions. A PMC can only tell you so much. To be honest, logging your workouts and making specific notes about what you did and how you felt (and how you feel the next day or the next session) will give you HUGE insight into how to structure your training. Maybe one day I'll work with a coach, but like Elesa, I'd like to play around with it on my own for a bit. Lots of good stuff in here, Nicole. I'm curious to see what my PMC will say, and how that lines up with how I feel, but agree that what's ultimately important is how I feel. I must admit, I'm really not digging the TP interface, but maybe I just haven't spent enough time with it. I did spend some time looking at GC and and Apollo yesterday. |
| 2013-11-21 10:09 AM in reply to: 0 |
| Seattle | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by switch I didn't ask. I'd venture to guess its because nationals is still 3 weeks and I've got some fitness to gain between now and then. I've been ready to move up for a while and he's not one to push too hard but I pretty much got called out last night. As I've said before, there's a discrepancy between my training paces and my race paces. Really, I'm just being a pu see and need to HTFU (in this case.) the fact that I didn't get dropped suggests my coach knows what he is doing Originally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Well, it wasn't even supposed to be hard! The goal was just to hit splits well and be mentally ready to race Saturday. I'm with you in regard to the crumpled pile. I'm sure it willgeteasier when I get used to a higher level of training. Originally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... It was about time you stopped sandbagging your way through practices. I think I could do one of those 1Ks, and then would be crumpled up in a heap. YAY Salty! Though, really, the sound of that workout makes my teeth hurt. When you had posted that you were going to wait, I thought that sounded like a pretty good idea. Did your coach elaborate on the decision at all? I hope you know I'm not questioning your coach's decision, I just like to try to understand the theory behind stuff like this, especially at the levelyou're running.
 Edited by Asalzwed 2013-11-21 10:11 AM |
| 2013-11-21 10:33 AM in reply to: Asalzwed |
Regular 5477 LHOTP | Subject: RE: Work your Weakness aka "Hey, Mike, STFU!" Challenge Originally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by switch I didn't ask. I'd venture to guess its because nationals is still 3 weeks and I've got some fitness to gain between now and then. I've been ready to move up for a while and he's not one to push too hard but I pretty much got called out last night. As I've said before, there's a discrepancy between my training paces and my race paces. Really, I'm just being a pu see and need to HTFU (in this case.) the fact that I didn't get dropped suggests my coach knows what he is doing ;) Originally posted by Asalzwed Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Well, it wasn't even supposed to be hard! The goal was just to hit splits well and be mentally ready to race Saturday. I'm with you in regard to the crumpled pile. I'm sure it willgeteasier when I get used to a higher level of training. Originally posted by Asalzwed Welp, there goes My grand ideas about waiting to speed up my training paces. Apparently my coach caught wind of my 5K over the weekend and bumped me to a faster group at practice. The workout was 5 x 1000 @ 3:45 (or 6:00 pace) it was so hard I could swear my inner ears were bleeding. These practices are so much harder than races. Its gotta be good for me though... It was about time you stopped sandbagging your way through practices. I think I could do one of those 1Ks, and then would be crumpled up in a heap. YAY Salty! Though, really, the sound of that workout makes my teeth hurt. :) When you had posted that you were going to wait, I thought that sounded like a pretty good idea. Did your coach elaborate on the decision at all? I hope you know I'm not questioning your coach's decision, I just like to try to understand the theory behind stuff like this, especially at the levelyou're running.
Well I knew he knew what he was doing...that was never a question, Pu See. Sorry, it just rolls right off the fingertips. ;P
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