login
swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! (Page 8)
-
No new posts
|
 2010-10-12 10:05 AM in reply to: #3147023 |
Master  1497    Maryland |  Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!!Linda, it was a slow ramp up for me. I singed up for a mary in 2000 and 2003 and broke my foot both times since I did not know how to train. I thought, I gotta run more, and it was a big mistake! Triathlon and cross training allowed me to build up my endurance without all of the pounding. When I am sore, I listen and back off. When I have to go long (20miles +), I take an ice bath for 10min. and that really helps! (although not pleasant for the 10min.) |
| 2010-10-12 10:46 AM in reply to: #3147083 |
Champion 7163  Verona WI--Ironman Bike Country! | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! Terps421 - 2010-10-12 10:05 AM Linda, it was a slow ramp up for me. I singed up for a mary in 2000 and 2003 and broke my foot both times since I did not know how to train. I thought, I gotta run more, and it was a big mistake! Triathlon and cross training allowed me to build up my endurance without all of the pounding. When I am sore, I listen and back off. When I have to go long (20miles +), I take an ice bath for 10min. and that really helps! (although not pleasant for the 10min.) In the olden days when I was JUST a marathoner, I racked up around 60-70mpw, ran two marathons, two halfs and countless 10Ks per year and I was NEVER injured during that time. In my last year of running, I had a total of 6 days off the entire year. I credit that to having a great coach who mixed in intensities, a singular focus (running) and a ton of masssage (think weekly). And I was already past 40! By having that singular focus I was working out far fewer hours per week than I did for a HIM or IM build and I think that matters. PS. There was no natural talent, just a will to get faster in every distance I ran. PPS. You shouldn't be sore everyday. I'm no expert, but it feels like your easy days are probably not easy enough or you are not taking enough rest days between each build. Don't discount what S and B do to the equation either. Edited by SSMinnow 2010-10-12 11:14 AM |
| 2010-10-12 11:26 AM in reply to: #3147173 |
Master 2501 | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! SSMinnow - 2010-10-12 8:46 AM Terps421 - 2010-10-12 10:05 AM Linda, it was a slow ramp up for me. I singed up for a mary in 2000 and 2003 and broke my foot both times since I did not know how to train. I thought, I gotta run more, and it was a big mistake! Triathlon and cross training allowed me to build up my endurance without all of the pounding. When I am sore, I listen and back off. When I have to go long (20miles +), I take an ice bath for 10min. and that really helps! (although not pleasant for the 10min.) In the olden days when I was JUST a marathoner, I racked up around 60-70mpw, ran two marathons, two halfs and countless 10Ks per year and I was NEVER injured during that time. In my last year of running, I had a total of 6 days off the entire year. I credit that to having a great coach who mixed in intensities, a singular focus (running) and a ton of masssage (think weekly). And I was already past 40! By having that singular focus I was working out far fewer hours per week than I did for a HIM or IM build and I think that matters. PS. There was no natural talent, just a will to get faster in every distance I ran. PPS. You shouldn't be sore everyday. I'm no expert, but it feels like your easy days are probably not easy enough or you are not taking enough rest days between each build. Don't discount what S and B do to the equation either. OK, I don't mean this to sound snarky or prying... but weekly massage, really?? Man, I would LOVE that but to me it would cost a fortune. I don't do massage often and it's mostly due to the price. Yes, I could go the Massage Envy route which is something like $40 or $50 for a montly massage but I've never been overly impressed with the massages I've received there, not to mention they are hardly athletic specialists. I did more miles for this past marathon... felt a constant fatigue for sure, but never injury. It was a slow build-up. Coach said the constant fatigue was to be expected when I put in 5 consecutive weeks of my highest mileage ever. I have not had a post-race chat with him yet, but I wonder if I maybe needed more rest. Or maybe it was just meant to be a crap day. I will say my legs are MISERABLE and yesterday late in the day I was doing the handicapped toilet sit, bracing myself on the walls. Sitting down to the dinner table took about 15 seconds. My knees buckled when I walked because my quads are so sore. This further reinforces I could not sustain my pace without risking injury or total collapse. Or maybe I was mentally weak. Whatever. I'm in a funk today  and I think it's because my body feels like crap and I don't have anything to show for it and I can't go out and do anything hard and I'm not sure what I'm going to do next. If I get my chores done (and get off this dang computer) I'm treating myself to a swim. I, too, am curious how peeps sustain high mileage. And Suzy, really? Six days off in a YEAR??!!! How can you do that? I mean, part of me sees how you can, but part of me feels like rest is such a huge component of training, especially as we (sniff) get older. |
| 2010-10-12 11:44 AM in reply to: #3147023 |
Expert 1797 CHARLOTTESVILLE, Virginia | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! velcromom - 2010-10-12 9:41 AM Serious training question..... Linda, and anyone else out there that's putting in huge run miles - how do you do it and stay injury free? Was it a really slow ramp-up, a natural talent( reallly? I'm not kidding!) or is there a trick I'm missing somewhere. I'm sore every day, and I know my mileage isn't where it should be. Weighing in on the massage thing - when I was getting ready the OBX marathon last year, I tried my best to get 2 in a month from a really experienced massage therapist. I can't remember being sore after workouts - long or track. This spring I did my best to see him when getting ready for my HIM. Again legs always felt great. Over the summer, time and money took priority and I haven't been since April. Result - my legs built up a constant fatigue, my muscles got tight and I lost a lot of flexibility. Not sure if it's the massage or not but I plan on making one/two a month work in my budget and calendar leading up to my next BQ attempt in March. |
| 2010-10-12 11:51 AM in reply to: #3146771 |
Master 2621 Almaden Valley, San Jose, California | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! Plainsman AU - 2010-10-12 6:22 AM CAUTION......Training question ahead!!!!!!!! I am a little ( or maybe a lot) confused about the direction I need to head over the course of the winter. I am volunteering next month at IMFL to sign up for next years race. Trying to figure out what direction to take to be ready to start IM training next june. My running is my main concern, and I was going to train for a feb marathon so that I would be really RUN focused over the winter, but I have been steered away from that as it would jeopardize my other two sports. I have been looking at some of the End. Nation stuff which suggests work on the bike and the run, and that makes sense. I am thinking that Jorges winter cycling plan would be similar intensity as the EN cycling????and free from BT. Work on increasing my long run each week and mix in some intensity and intervals during the week (which I have never done)???? Maybe swim once or twice a week???? Any advice from you seasoned Ironmen and Ironwomen? Well, I'm obviously out here looking for help, too, but I don't see why a February mary would be a problem for a November IM. IM plans are 16-24 weeks long, so you wouldn't start 'training' for Florida until mid-late March at the earliest, right? so between now and then you are building a base, and training for a mary would do good things for your run and cardio. I wouldn't stop doing the s/b by any means, but a run focus sees like a good plan to me. Of course, I did Napa in March before IMWI in Sept, and Boston in April before CdA in June. Maybe there was a negative...... |
| 2010-10-12 11:53 AM in reply to: #3138641 |
Master 2621 Almaden Valley, San Jose, California | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! with the massages, when do you schedule them? Before/after a long or hilly day? Before the big race? Right after? I'm 19 days out. I can get one in, maybe 2 before the wallet implodes. Suggestions for finding a good one? As much as I love my local day spas, they probably aren't the right choice. |
| 2010-10-12 1:21 PM in reply to: #3147408 |
Expert 1797 CHARLOTTESVILLE, Virginia | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! velcromom - 2010-10-12 11:53 AM with the massages, when do you schedule them? Before/after a long or hilly day? Before the big race? Right after? I'm 19 days out. I can get one in, maybe 2 before the wallet implodes. Suggestions for finding a good one? As much as I love my local day spas, they probably aren't the right choice. I think it needs to be after long/hilly/hard workouts. My coach has posted comments in my training logs about the effects taking 24-36 hrs. I've also been a little sore right after a massage but then everything starts to loosen up. I would typically schedule in the evening or day after my last hard weekday workout then I wouldn't do anything long/hard until Sunday. My therapist also recommends an epsom salt bath after the massage to help remove toxins. Edited by sdalessio 2010-10-12 1:25 PM |
| 2010-10-12 1:34 PM in reply to: #3146771 |
Elite 4108 Calgary,AB,Canada | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! Plainsman AU - 2010-10-12 7:22 AM CAUTION......Training question ahead!!!!!!!! I am a little ( or maybe a lot) confused about the direction I need to head over the course of the winter. I am volunteering next month at IMFL to sign up for next years race. Trying to figure out what direction to take to be ready to start IM training next june. My running is my main concern, and I was going to train for a feb marathon so that I would be really RUN focused over the winter, but I have been steered away from that as it would jeopardize my other two sports. I have been looking at some of the End. Nation stuff which suggests work on the bike and the run, and that makes sense. I am thinking that Jorges winter cycling plan would be similar intensity as the EN cycling????and free from BT. Work on increasing my long run each week and mix in some intensity and intervals during the week (which I have never done)???? Maybe swim once or twice a week???? Any advice from you seasoned Ironmen and Ironwomen? I am not a seasoned Ironman. Barry, you and I similar in that we both suck at running. I am doing the Dec. marathon to physically prove that I can complete one. So when I'm doing IM Canada in Aug, I know I've done the marathon distance at least once before. You know how to ride a bike and swim. I say learn to run over the mild winter down there, and run the Feb Marathon. |
| 2010-10-12 1:46 PM in reply to: #3147396 |
Expert 945 Auburn AL | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! velcromom - 2010-10-12 11:51 AM Plainsman AU - 2010-10-12 6:22 AM CAUTION......Training question ahead!!!!!!!! I am a little ( or maybe a lot) confused about the direction I need to head over the course of the winter. I am volunteering next month at IMFL to sign up for next years race. Trying to figure out what direction to take to be ready to start IM training next june. My running is my main concern, and I was going to train for a feb marathon so that I would be really RUN focused over the winter, but I have been steered away from that as it would jeopardize my other two sports. I have been looking at some of the End. Nation stuff which suggests work on the bike and the run, and that makes sense. I am thinking that Jorges winter cycling plan would be similar intensity as the EN cycling????and free from BT. Work on increasing my long run each week and mix in some intensity and intervals during the week (which I have never done)???? Maybe swim once or twice a week???? Any advice from you seasoned Ironmen and Ironwomen? Well, I'm obviously out here looking for help, too, but I don't see why a February mary would be a problem for a November IM. IM plans are 16-24 weeks long, so you wouldn't start 'training' for Florida until mid-late March at the earliest, right? so between now and then you are building a base, and training for a mary would do good things for your run and cardio. I wouldn't stop doing the s/b by any means, but a run focus sees like a good plan to me. Of course, I did Napa in March before IMWI in Sept, and Boston in April before CdA in June. Maybe there was a negative...... Ha! I just wished I needed YOUR kind of help. I am just trying to become a runner in some shape or fashion. I guess we all have our hurdles though. I guess I will stay on track to see if I can handle the run build up along with Jorges winter plan for cycling and see how it goes. I am not dead set on running a marathon, but just thought that would be a goal to help the focus, and besides...I would only want to FINISH the marathon, as I am not trying to BQ like you speed demons. |
| 2010-10-12 1:52 PM in reply to: #3147703 |
Expert 945 Auburn AL | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! TrevorC - 2010-10-12 1:34 PM Plainsman AU - 2010-10-12 7:22 AM CAUTION......Training question ahead!!!!!!!! I am a little ( or maybe a lot) confused about the direction I need to head over the course of the winter. I am volunteering next month at IMFL to sign up for next years race. Trying to figure out what direction to take to be ready to start IM training next june. My running is my main concern, and I was going to train for a feb marathon so that I would be really RUN focused over the winter, but I have been steered away from that as it would jeopardize my other two sports. I have been looking at some of the End. Nation stuff which suggests work on the bike and the run, and that makes sense. I am thinking that Jorges winter cycling plan would be similar intensity as the EN cycling????and free from BT. Work on increasing my long run each week and mix in some intensity and intervals during the week (which I have never done)???? Maybe swim once or twice a week???? Any advice from you seasoned Ironmen and Ironwomen? I am not a seasoned Ironman. Barry, you and I similar in that we both suck at running. I am doing the Dec. marathon to physically prove that I can complete one. So when I'm doing IM Canada in Aug, I know I've done the marathon distance at least once before. You know how to ride a bike and swim. I say learn to run over the mild winter down there, and run the Feb Marathon. Yep, I think COMPLETING the marathon would be a confidence builder even if I let one of those BQ pace groups pass me on the back stretch  What are you doing for your bike training over the next few months...anything? or are you just focusing on the marathon? |
| 2010-10-12 2:02 PM in reply to: #3138641 |
Champion 6973 marietta | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! i'd pick the half at mercedes. train your a$$ off for it. get faster. save 3+ hour workouts for IM training. the family will thank you later. not disagreeing with trev, just a different angle. i've completed a marathon. i've never completed a marathon off a 112 mile bike. but i don't see how one relates to the other though. guess i'll find out soon enough! |
| 2010-10-12 2:11 PM in reply to: #3138641 |
Champion 7163 Verona WI--Ironman Bike Country! | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! Pampered pet here.....I know weekly is a lot, so if that isn't possible, the other route is simply stretching religiously including doing TP at least every day, ice baths after every hard effort with the addition of epsom salts/baking soda, an amazing alkaline diet, a serving of whey protein before bed and a load of sleep. And I'll say it again, I was ONLY RUNNING....it might not seem like that ez swim or bike is detrimental, but it takes away from recovery time. PERIOD. I did workout all but 6 days with Lowell and three of them were after Boston. I told Barry this before, but I'll say it again here, you don't need to do a marathon and it's build up to become a better runner. It certainly gives you a good base, but it also takes away from other sports. I think you can do a runner's focused SBR plan and be just as far ahead. From my limited experience, the IM Marathon is nothing like a marathon. It is a low intensity effort, way lower than a stand alone marathon. ****NOW, I have a real NON TRAINING, but important LIFE QUESTION***** Has anyone ever done research on breeders? I have convinced the man I can get a puppy, but want to make sure I don't get one that is crazy because of inbreeding or whatever. I don't want a pound dog so please don't tell me to go that route...I am allergic to them so need a hypo allergenic, small dog. |
| 2010-10-12 3:36 PM in reply to: #3138641 |
Extreme Veteran 689 | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! Ok I'm pretty sore. I'm not sure how you guys can run such long distances during and after races or just running so long. I did a long run during lunch to gauge my run fitness to see what type of training I need to do for the HIM I want to do next year. Proud to say I completed 2 complete loops around Central Park and only stopped for 20 sec or so to down a gel and drink water at a fountain. Time was just under 2 hrs and 2 min for 12.65 ish miles. A PR for me in distance by more than 4 miles (i think). The first 8-9 miles I felt great, no fatigue and I was thinking I'll have no problems finishing. At mile 10 or so my body started to break down a bit. My quads felt sore but then they just felt rubbery. I thought I was maintaining my 9 min ish pace but i was only going maybe 10-11min pace. I also thought my HR was at it's normal 165-168ish bpm but noticed at several points it shot up to 189bpm. I have a lot to learn about running this distance and pacing. My knees and pf are sore too so I'm pretty sure my running form was way off at the end of the run as well. Today was definitely a good learning experience for me. Good thing is I know I can run over 12miles on a semi hilly course, but now I know i have a lot of training to do if I want to run this distance after a long bike and swim.. |
| 2010-10-12 3:49 PM in reply to: #3147023 |
Elite 3072 san francisco | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! velcromom - 2010-10-12 7:41 AM Serious training question..... Linda, and anyone else out there that's putting in huge run miles - how do you do it and stay injury free? Was it a really slow ramp-up, a natural talent( reallly? I'm not kidding!) or is there a trick I'm missing somewhere. I'm sore every day, and I know my mileage isn't where it should be. Linda-I don't log huge miles but during mary training I did 4-5 runs/week and initially felt pretty sore especially after hill workouts and speed sessions. Tempo and long runs never seemed to bother me much. Suzy recommended massages or at the very least, the trigger point for myofascial release. Being on the frugal side, (okay, I'm cheap!) I opted for TP and the stick, both of which worked really well to reduce my soreness. Since you are 3 weeks out, though, maybe you should treat yourself to a massage or someone who does ART soon and then foam rollers after that? I notice that you went from running only 2-3x/week for much of Aug/Sept during tri training and now have been putting in lots more (4-5x/wk) in prep. for your marathon. September was only 12 days ago, btw  And based on your FB posts, lots of elevation on those runs...maybe your body is simply not used to it, especially with the reduction in swimming, which I think my legs, feet, ankles really love for recovery. I know that when I would swim after a hard run day, it really felt good, and I was much less sore. just food for thought.Good luck, I think it's all a learning experience. Even with all of the controversy around nutrition, I think having some protein within 30 minutes of finishing a hard workout does wonders for reducing soreness. Or jumping on the trainer for 30 minutes later the day of a long run and just easy spinning helps too. Oh, and don't forget hydration. |
| 2010-10-12 4:02 PM in reply to: #3138641 |
Elite 4108 Calgary,AB,Canada | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! It took me a while, but for those of us who have NO CLUE what barry looks like, I found him!! http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=57915&BIB=2909&LNSEARCH=1&PWD=  |
| 2010-10-12 4:05 PM in reply to: #3147802 |
Elite 4108 Calgary,AB,Canada | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! fattyfatfat - 2010-10-12 1:02 PM i'd pick the half at mercedes. train your a$$ off for it. get faster. save 3+ hour workouts for IM training. the family will thank you later. not disagreeing with trev, just a different angle. i've completed a marathon. i've never completed a marathon off a 112 mile bike. but i don't see how one relates to the other though. guess i'll find out soon enough! They do, but they don't. For me, I just need to know in my head that when I jump off the bike after 180kms I have covered the remaining 42kms on my feet at least once. I know what you are saying though. 2 totally different beasts. |
| 2010-10-12 4:08 PM in reply to: #3147828 |
Elite 4108 Calgary,AB,Canada | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! SSMinnow - 2010-10-12 1:11 PM Pampered pet here.....I know weekly is a lot, so if that isn't possible, the other route is simply stretching religiously including doing TP at least every day, ice baths after every hard effort with the addition of epsom salts/baking soda, an amazing alkaline diet, a serving of whey protein before bed and a load of sleep. And I'll say it again, I was ONLY RUNNING....it might not seem like that ez swim or bike is detrimental, but it takes away from recovery time. PERIOD. I did workout all but 6 days with Lowell and three of them were after Boston. I told Barry this before, but I'll say it again here, you don't need to do a marathon and it's build up to become a better runner. It certainly gives you a good base, but it also takes away from other sports. I think you can do a runner's focused SBR plan and be just as far ahead. From my limited experience, the IM Marathon is nothing like a marathon. It is a low intensity effort, way lower than a stand alone marathon. ****NOW, I have a real NON TRAINING, but important LIFE QUESTION***** Has anyone ever done research on breeders? I have convinced the man I can get a puppy, but want to make sure I don't get one that is crazy because of inbreeding or whatever. I don't want a pound dog so please don't tell me to go that route...I am allergic to them so need a hypo allergenic, small dog.  |
| 2010-10-12 4:10 PM in reply to: #3148116 |
Elite 3072 san francisco | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! TrevorC - 2010-10-12 2:02 PM It took me a while, but for those of us who have NO CLUE what barry looks like, I found him!! http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=57915&BIB=2909&LNSEARCH=1&PWD= You have now reached official stalker status. Leave Barry alone! btw, Barry, nice bike pic, I think that one should be the new avatar! |
| 2010-10-12 4:12 PM in reply to: #3138641 |
Elite 3072 san francisco | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! oh, suzy, here is a link to that "other" dog I was talking about, just in case you change your mind about the small thing http://labradoodle-dogs.net/ |
| 2010-10-12 4:12 PM in reply to: #3138641 |
Elite 3072 san francisco | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! trevor, why are you following me around? |
| 2010-10-12 4:15 PM in reply to: #3138641 |
Master 1952 Guelph, Ontario | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! Hey Barry I am not a seasoned IM'er but I don't see a problem with specific training for beginning of the year marathon. Just don't cut out your biking and running completely. Throw in easy workouts to keep the muscle memory good. After your Mary you can jump back into the IM training by refocusing on the bike and swim. I remember Birdy telling me that in his training for an IM he had trained on each discipline individually for a month at a time in the off season then brought it all back together for the IM. You have lots of time after your marathon to make sure the biking and swimming is up to speed (no pun intended). Also the cross training on your bike and swims will help in your overall conditioning for the marathon. |
| 2010-10-12 4:21 PM in reply to: #3148137 |
Elite 4108 Calgary,AB,Canada | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! kt65 - 2010-10-12 3:12 PM trevor, why are you following me around? Why? Because you said you were going out for your anniversary dinner the on the weekend, and then you made reference to 4 of you being there. Me likes that!! 
Actually, that dog is a Soft-coated Wheaten Terrier. But not a little yappy terrier. that is what he have. We have a female. ~25lbs. her back comes up to my knees. Great dog with the girls. I can run with her up to 20kmsish. She 's 6 and hasn't ever snapped at anyone. Great dog. |
| 2010-10-12 4:22 PM in reply to: #3148116 |
Expert 945 Auburn AL | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! TrevorC - 2010-10-12 4:02 PM It took me a while, but for those of us who have NO CLUE what barry looks like, I found him!! http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=57915&BIB=2909&LNSEARCH=1&PWD= COOL! Would you like me to send you an 8 x 10 for your office How did you pull those up without the blur? |
| 2010-10-12 4:24 PM in reply to: #3148137 |
Master 1675 Suwanee, Ga. | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! kt65 - 2010-10-12 5:12 PM trevor, why are you following me around?
Kim....Thanks for the update on the meal you guys had the other night. I love being a foodie more than being a triathlete |
| 2010-10-12 4:25 PM in reply to: #3148156 |
Elite 4108 Calgary,AB,Canada | Subject: RE: swbkrun Mentor Group II- CLOSED FOR BUSINESS!!! Plainsman AU - 2010-10-12 3:22 PM TrevorC - 2010-10-12 4:02 PM It took me a while, but for those of us who have NO CLUE what barry looks like, I found him!! http://www.brightroom.com/view_user_event.asp?EVENTID=57915&BIB=2909&LNSEARCH=1&PWD= COOL! Would you like me to send you an 8 x 10 for your office How did you pull those up without the blur? Thanks , but I already have one. Tony or one of those smart IT guys can tell you how to rip it. |
|
|
|
|
View profile
Add to friends
Go to training log
Go to race log
Send a message
View album
CONNECT WITH FACEBOOK