Becoming a forefoot runner (Page 3)

the issue with this, is that good running form is diff for everyone. And what good form looks like off a 56 mile bike is not what a good runner looks like in most cases.

Prefountain, zapotek, and many others have some goofy strides but were very very fast.

for the most part, just going out and running the miles IS the drill you need to run with better form (whatever is best for you). Our bodies ARE meant to run. you dont do drills to walk better. you do it more, and slowly it becomes natural. this is a natural movement for humans, it just takes some time and repitition to get it down smoothly.

if you have something terribly wrong, then yes, some drills or changing something might be in order.

And something else to consider..... The people you see with poor form in races, how do you know it was not simply due to biking too hard, or too little running?

i apologize, I made the mistake of saying that there is one absolute way of running.  what i meant to say was a "right" running style for that individual person.  And I never thought about the correlation between running volume and form, that one develops the other, that's a great thought.  Appreciate all the thoughts here and I'm going to be very cautious about where my legs land as opposed to foot landing, and work out the kinks later on if there are injuries that are incurred with the increase in miles.  Unfortunately for all of you, I have BT friended yall...so as time would allow, please update the blogs, as I'm looking forward to learning from you peeps...

I think this is what they are saying when they say run the way that is most natural for YOU.  Obviously there is some fine tuning to do, but overall...your form is your form is your form.



Haha, don't worry, we'll be following you.  Sleep with one eye open.

Edited by jgerbodegrant 2010-04-20 10:34 AM

I'm glad to know that there are people that have the intrinsic ability to know how someone's physiology affects their gait and form and what is going on internally!  I would love to have that ability!

Yes, that is a facetious statement.  But it provides a point.  One doesn't know.  And one doesn't have the ability to tell when someone is doing something wrong based on how that person is running.

How about this.  Go watch Paula Radcliffe run.  Go watch Ryan Hall run.  Go watch the one female triathlete (I can never remember her name) run.  They will make you cringe as well.

There IS no right way to run.  There IS no way to prevent an injury.  If there were, then everyone would be running the exact same and no one would be hurt.

Yes, there is technique for running.  I'll sum it all up for everyone right here and make it easy:

1) Keep your body upright and chest open.
2) Keep your arms relaxed and try to keep from going across your centerline while running.
3) Land overtop of your feet so the force application is correct to the ground.

You do those things and increase your running volume with consistency and building up duration and pace and guess what?  Your body will sort out it's most efficient way to run and you will get better.

Scout has already metnioned it many times that I've seen since coming on the board - do some drills as part of your weekly running.  That and those 3 simple things I listed above are all you need to worry about for form work.

To me it is as simple as that.  What is being presented here on one side is "You have to do these things to get fast!"  I am firmly of the mind that is not correct, nor do the instructors I had for my track and field coaching certification agree with that.  I am of the mind (as are they) that "You do these things because you are fast."

Again, triathletes over analyze.  Runners don't.  They run.  Sometimes hard, mostly slow.  They build up from 15 - 20 miles a week in a progressive fashion and when they are running consistently 50+ miles a week they see results.  INJURY FREE even because they built up in a smart fashion and let their body sort it out.  You know where I see the most injuries happen?  Two instances.  When people think they are doing something wrong and try to make it right.  And when they try to do too much too soon and don't let their body adapt.

It's because triathletes don't run enough. If they ran more, they'd have better form.

Damn...you said it.  I'm trying to swallow it, but it's difficult.

water it down with a dose of swim volume, and life is good

This is not a valid comparision; humans did not evolve to swim and therefore we need to learn how to swim properly (as well as humans can swim anyway).

Since we did evolve to run, it is mostly a matter of nature taking its course (the same way that a dolphin doesn't need swimming lessons).

Shane

Ah...if only my good swimming could outweigh my poor running.

A lot of posts to go through so I might have missed it.  I know when I was starting to ramp up my mileage last summer, essentially coming from the "just not running enough" side of the fence.  I started thinking a bunch about this and know a bunch of people who were off buying Newton's and "becoming" forefoot strikers.

I thought I was a heavy heel striker but that wasn't the real issue.  The issue for was that I was over-striding quite a bit and the more I ran and just started shortening my stride a little, the better and more comfortable I became.  Now, I don't really know what to consider myself, mid-foot maybe?  Not really the point, the point was kind for the coaches and knowledgeable people to comment on "over striding" as opposed to "foot strike".  Is this something that you notice quite a bit and can you comment?

Edit because it is pointless. 

Edited by TracyV 2010-04-20 12:46 PM

i run about 95% on rocky/tech trails, and still run with a heal strike. No ankle rolls;-)

Here's a great picture of some very fast athletes and you can see that Hunter Kemper is heel striking and it appears that Simon Whitfield is about to.

Shane

Edited by gsmacleod 2010-04-20 1:20 PM

nope, just sayin they both work.

I do notice though that when i start running 5k pace efforts, i start shifting into a bit more midfoot strike without any thought on my part

Tracy,

I'm all for working on running form. You will never ever see me tell someone to ignore their form. I don't think I've done so in this thread at all.

Where perhaps we disagree is the manner in which a person goes about it. I agree with you 100% that form is something people should consider. However, I have always been of the mindset that there is no one perfect way to run, and that we are all unique individuals. So, with that in mind, I have the opinion that it is a better idea to work with what you got rather than try to force something you do not.

I do nothing but run. No swimming, no biking, no weight lifting. I just run. I come from a running background, having run in HS, and then with the military. I have had the experience and privilege of helping people learn how to run, and how to improve their fitness. It has been my experience that the average person will find his or her own rhythm naturally, without having to put a whole lot of thought into it. Not everyone, but the majority of people. This has been my personal experience over the last 20 years.

If you want to get better at running, you have to run a lot. The average triathlete, who is already strapped for time, tends not to run a lot, because there are two other time-consuming pieces to worry about. Hey, I understand that, and I know that it is generally unrealistic to tell most people they should be running 70 miles a week. Hence the reason I stated that most triathletes don't run enough; I think most people have not come to that realization yet.

tri bike or road bike for triathlon?

This user's post has been ignored.

^^^It really is that simple. Nicely said Fred and great pic Shane.

Wait! Here are more offenders!!!!! It's a miracle they finished the race. The terrible heel striking woman on the left actually came in 2nd, must be due to bad form. Oh, they dropped the old heel striking dude in the back with the first 3 miles...



Edited by bryancd 2010-04-20 6:52 PM

...And anyone who really watches a lot of elite marathoners can't miss that fact.  (I find this especially true among the women and particularly when you watch the elite African women and the Russians.)

What can be said about form, IMO, is in the nature of fairly broad areas where a lot of inexperienced runners are often not focused:  Relaxation (esp. neck, arms and shoulders) & breathing, posture & core support, balance (incl. that often discussed footstrike under the center of gravity) & symmetry (something even some very, very, good elites don't exhibit), avoiding needless vertical or side-to-side motion ("bounding" strides, excessive crossing over the midline with the arms).  Within these areas, though, there are huge differences among athletes, most of which are perfectly benign.  It's the absence of relaxation or core support or balance, etc., that becomes a genuine "form" issue, IMO. 

bryan,

You are, sir, very wrong.

They did not drop you because of heal striking.





It was the fugly socks.

Calf sleeves only.

whatever.

Comfortable and if it's a wet suit swim, on from the start.

...would you like to provide me with racing advice, junior?