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2010-10-27 11:09 AM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS

RedShark - 2010-10-26 4:37 PM
Brock Samson - 2010-10-26 10:33 AM

Shermbelle - 2010-10-25 8:21 PM
stuarbc - 2010-10-25 10:32 AM First off....

WAR EAGLE!!!

Second...

Any person being honest with themselves can look at the top ten and pick at least 2 if not 3 teams that should not even be considered. The local college here in Mobile just started their program last year and they haven't lost a game yet.....does that mean they should be in the top ten?!?!...even though they are only playing fluff opponents like Hargrave Academy that no one has heard of...

I think Kirk Herb. said it best last night when he was actually trying to argure for Boise....."if you are going to look at who a team beats to judge how good they are....then they shouldn't even be ranking Boise and TCU".....my argument is how can you not look at that?!?


Obviously not  a D1 school, so that argument is out but what I am asking is legit. Should these teams be disqualified from being ranked? Should Michigan State be out because this year the schedule helps them by not facing Ohio State and Penn State is down this year? What is the criteria?

The flip side argument could be made.  Should a 1 loss team that loses to AUburn, like LSU be automatically out of contention in favor of a Boise or TCU team that plays next to no one?

Strength of schedule has to count for something.  Boise's schedule is an absolute joke.  I know it's impossible to answer and based on total speculation, but would Boise be looking at an undefeated season every year if they were in the PAC-10, Big-10 or SEC.  I think they wouldn't run the table in the ACC having to face FSU, Miami and Va. Tech every year.

Now I know you aren't supposed to hold a teams conference schedule against them, but their non-conference shcedule can be held against them and their non-conference schedule is a joke too.  Schedule a pernial powerhouse, an OU, or OSU,.



How can you complain about non-conference when they schedule good schools like VTech and OSU. These schedules are done 3-5+ yrs in advance.

The top schools REFUSE to play Boise - then they complain they don't play anyone!

If the NCAA doesn't want the non BCS schools in the championship talk they should get rid of them in D1A (FBS). But they can't because they couldn't fill there schedues.

You despise Boise because they only have a couple touch games per year - but that is not there fault. I don't hear about them turning down games or having turned down an invitation to a super conference.

Boise has been beating big schools year in year out - often on the road. Let's have a Auburn, LSU or other school say they will pay Boise for a home and home for the next several years.

This notion that other teams "refuse to play" them is pure fiction.   What "top teams" have "refused to play" Boise?  Florida? Texas? OSU?  USC?

Making the schedule 4 or 5 years in advance not much of an excuse for scheduling low tiered teams.  I'm pretty sure that ther's no notion that the likes of Toledo and Tulsa are ever going to be a BIG time program.

Huge difference between Boise and other schools.  My school for eample, FSU, built there program and their 14 consecutive years in the top 5 by playing anyone anywhere.  ND, OSU, Michigan, Texas A &M, BYU, Florida (every single year), Miami (evey year), Nebraska, USC, Penn State...

Those games are out there.  I don't believe for a single second that every top tier program has refused to play Boise.

 And another GREAT win for the boise state team, another Home win against a team with a lossing record.  Wow!!

Their 2011 non-conference games: 'Ole Miss., Toledo, and Tulsa; 2012 is a little better with Oregon State, and BYU.  Let's see who they pick up in 2013, 2014 & 2015.  Let's see if their serious.  And NO I don't believe for a minute that the big schools have refused to play them.  I know for a fact that they have never sought out a game against FSU (not a big program anymore, a middle of top 25 team)

Yes I'm far more impressed with an SEC team with one loss who loses to day only Florida, or Alabama or Auburn, rather than an undefeated Boise team.



2010-10-27 11:12 AM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
McFuzz - 2010-10-26 11:02 AM
ditchdoc - 2010-10-26 10:51 AM Here is about the only play off system I would like to see...maybe...

All teams converge into four super conferences.  ( Northeast, Southeast, Northwest Southwest)

Each conference has a conference championship game. ( ie SEC west v/s SEC east).

Then each Conference Champion has an (East West or a North South) play off game  determine the top two. These to then play for the National Championship.

Of course there would have to be special consideration payed to who went to what conference to try and keep things even, plus not disrupt any huge rivalry games.




This'll last about a year, until they decide they must bring the 9th-best team into the tournament...


Exactly why I am against a play off! In theroy it would be good until we have a 16-18 32 68 team play off. just like NCAABB.
2010-10-27 11:27 AM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS

RedShark - 2010-10-26 4:37 PM
Brock Samson - 2010-10-26 10:33 AM

Shermbelle - 2010-10-25 8:21 PM
stuarbc - 2010-10-25 10:32 AM First off....

WAR EAGLE!!!

Second...

Any person being honest with themselves can look at the top ten and pick at least 2 if not 3 teams that should not even be considered. The local college here in Mobile just started their program last year and they haven't lost a game yet.....does that mean they should be in the top ten?!?!...even though they are only playing fluff opponents like Hargrave Academy that no one has heard of...

I think Kirk Herb. said it best last night when he was actually trying to argure for Boise....."if you are going to look at who a team beats to judge how good they are....then they shouldn't even be ranking Boise and TCU".....my argument is how can you not look at that?!?


Obviously not  a D1 school, so that argument is out but what I am asking is legit. Should these teams be disqualified from being ranked? Should Michigan State be out because this year the schedule helps them by not facing Ohio State and Penn State is down this year? What is the criteria?

The flip side argument could be made.  Should a 1 loss team that loses to AUburn, like LSU be automatically out of contention in favor of a Boise or TCU team that plays next to no one?

Strength of schedule has to count for something.  Boise's schedule is an absolute joke.  I know it's impossible to answer and based on total speculation, but would Boise be looking at an undefeated season every year if they were in the PAC-10, Big-10 or SEC.  I think they wouldn't run the table in the ACC having to face FSU, Miami and Va. Tech every year.

Now I know you aren't supposed to hold a teams conference schedule against them, but their non-conference shcedule can be held against them and their non-conference schedule is a joke too.  Schedule a pernial powerhouse, an OU, or OSU,.



How can you complain about non-conference when they schedule good schools like VTech and OSU. These schedules are done 3-5+ yrs in advance.

The top schools REFUSE to play Boise - then they complain they don't play anyone!

If the NCAA doesn't want the non BCS schools in the championship talk they should get rid of them in D1A (FBS). But they can't because they couldn't fill there schedues.

You despise Boise because they only have a couple touch games per year - but that is not there fault. I don't hear about them turning down games or having turned down an invitation to a super conference.

Boise has been beating big schools year in year out - often on the road. Let's have a Auburn, LSU or other school say they will pay Boise for a home and home for the next several years.

Oh, and the notion that they have been "beating big schools year in and year out" is also pure fiction.

Going back only 10 years how many of these "beating big teams year in and year out" have they done?

2000 Season: didn't play a ranked team Beat UTEP in the Humanitarian Bowl (Played in Boise);

2001 Season: lost to South Carolina, Lost to Wa. State, beat Fresno state;

2002 Season: again didn't play a ranked team and beat Iowa State in the Humanitarian Bowl;

2003 season: lost to Oregon State, beat BYU and beat TCU in the Fort Worth Bowl;

2004 Season: Beat Oregon State, beat BYU and lost to Louisville in the bowl game.

2005 season:lost to EVERY ranked team they played: Georgia, Oregon State, Fresno St., and BC in the bowl game.

2006 season: beat Oregon State and beat Oklahoma in the bowl game (GREAT WIN!!! No doubt about that!!!)

2007 season: Loss to Washington, beat Southern Miss (in Boise), loss to Hawaii (the only ranked team they played) and loss to E. Carolina in the bowl game.

2008 season: wins over Oregon, S. Miss., and Fresno, but lost to TCU in the bowl game.

2009 season: Well we know what happened last year.

So, I'm asking where is this history of beating the big programs year in and year out and beating teams on the road.  It's pure fiction...

2010-10-27 12:17 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
idahocraig - 2010-10-26 10:05

Last point how does Auburn jump from 4th to first by beating the 6th place team that is total crap Oregon should have been number 1 I could see Auburn going to number 2.
 


Holy runon sentence, Batman.

Strength of schedule is cumulative and directly affects the computer polls and the subjective human polls.  If you don't know how this happened, then you're not terribly familiar with how this works.

And Boise does NOT beat big names schools "year in and year out".  They just don't play them. 
2010-10-27 12:26 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.  just ask Okla in the last bowl they played together.  the big schools have nothing to gain but everything to lose from scheduling them.  they can only beat who you put on the field with them.  and the system is crap, TCU destroys Aif Force, but last weeks #1, Okla barely beat them.  But the computers don't count margin of victory to offer no benifit to big schools from running up the score on the smaller guys.
2010-10-27 12:44 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
brycoy - 2010-10-27 12:26 PM boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.


This is nonsense.  Powerhouse schools play other tough teams all the time.  The "nobody will play us" excuse is getting old. 


2010-10-27 12:50 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
brycoy - 2010-10-27 1:26 PM boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.  just ask Okla in the last bowl they played together.  the big schools have nothing to gain but everything to lose from scheduling them.  they can only beat who you put on the field with them.  and the system is crap, TCU destroys Aif Force, but last weeks #1, Okla barely beat them.  But the computers don't count margin of victory to offer no benifit to big schools from running up the score on the smaller guys.


I seriously don't get how people can propagate this theory.  If there is "nothing to gain" from playing a good team, then why do Bama and PSU agree to play?  Miami and tOSU?  The big name schools DO play each other.  And they do so in order to boost their rankings (human polls and BCS) at the national level. 

If Boise State REALLY wants to get in the BCS title game, they really only have once choice.  Go and play AT a big name school. 
2010-10-27 5:39 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
jcnipper - 2010-10-27 11:50 AM
brycoy - 2010-10-27 1:26 PM boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.  just ask Okla in the last bowl they played together.  the big schools have nothing to gain but everything to lose from scheduling them.  they can only beat who you put on the field with them.  and the system is crap, TCU destroys Aif Force, but last weeks #1, Okla barely beat them.  But the computers don't count margin of victory to offer no benifit to big schools from running up the score on the smaller guys.


I seriously don't get how people can propagate this theory.  If there is "nothing to gain" from playing a good team, then why do Bama and PSU agree to play?  Miami and tOSU?  The big name schools DO play each other.  And they do so in order to boost their rankings (human polls and BCS) at the national level. 

If Boise State REALLY wants to get in the BCS title game, they really only have once choice.  Go and play AT a big name school. 



There is a difference between a good team from one of the AQ conferences and a good team from a non-AQ conference. If Alabama loses to VT/PSU it's not a huge deal. If they lose to Boise State, then all of a sudden Boise has a legit gripe about getting into the BCS title game. That just adds 1 more team to the whole BCS mess about who deserves a shot at the BCS championship game. In my mind it makes no sense for a big school to play us.

Many of the top schools don't want to play tough games early in the season. Here is a list of the season opening opponents of the top 10 by ranking.

Arkansas State, New Mexico, Virginia Tech, Oregon State, Western Michigan, Illinois, San Jose State, Pittsburgh, Utah State, UNLV.

4 AQ schools are on that list, 3 from BSU/TCU/Utah and 1 on Missouri's schedule. Not exactly a lot of teams willing to open up with a tough game.
2010-10-27 6:45 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS

JoshR - 2010-10-27 6:39 PM
jcnipper - 2010-10-27 11:50 AM
brycoy - 2010-10-27 1:26 PM boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.  just ask Okla in the last bowl they played together.  the big schools have nothing to gain but everything to lose from scheduling them.  they can only beat who you put on the field with them.  and the system is crap, TCU destroys Aif Force, but last weeks #1, Okla barely beat them.  But the computers don't count margin of victory to offer no benifit to big schools from running up the score on the smaller guys.


I seriously don't get how people can propagate this theory.  If there is "nothing to gain" from playing a good team, then why do Bama and PSU agree to play?  Miami and tOSU?  The big name schools DO play each other.  And they do so in order to boost their rankings (human polls and BCS) at the national level. 

If Boise State REALLY wants to get in the BCS title game, they really only have once choice.  Go and play AT a big name school. 



There is a difference between a good team from one of the AQ conferences and a good team from a non-AQ conference. If Alabama loses to VT/PSU it's not a huge deal. If they lose to Boise State, then all of a sudden Boise has a legit gripe about getting into the BCS title game. That just adds 1 more team to the whole BCS mess about who deserves a shot at the BCS championship game. In my mind it makes no sense for a big school to play us.

Many of the top schools don't want to play tough games early in the season. Here is a list of the season opening opponents of the top 10 by ranking.

Arkansas State, New Mexico, Virginia Tech, Oregon State, Western Michigan, Illinois, San Jose State, Pittsburgh, Utah State, UNLV.

4 AQ schools are on that list, 3 from BSU/TCU/Utah and 1 on Missouri's schedule. Not exactly a lot of teams willing to open up with a tough game.

I don't get your point about opening up with a tough game.   You've lost me.  You don't have to open up against a tough team to have a difficult schedule.  You can have the game at anytime during the season.  My alma matter has historically played it's two big non-conference rivals, in mid october and the last game of the season. (Prior to Miami joining the ACC)  FSU played Miami in October and Florida the last game of the season.

In 2009 there was story that circulated that the Boise AD had contacted 10 "top tiered" schools to play a game and all had declined.  Sounds great until you dig a little deeper.  First, the game was to be in 2011.  By the time the story broke I know that most of the D-1 schools had their entire 2011 schedule set.  Additionally, Boise was looking for a September 3rd date.  So in order to bite at the offer you had to not have your schedule set AND have an open date for Sept 3rd.  Also, the AD has never actually said which 10 teams were contacted and declined to play Boise.

Is Boise getting doged by some programs?  Probably.  Has every top tiered program in the country refused to play Boise?  Absolutely no way.  Those who actually believe this are fooling themselves.

For example in the 2009 season Texas played 3 ranked opponents during the season OK at #18 on October 17th, Ok State #13 on October 31st, and Nebraska #21 on December 5th. Similarly UF played LSU #4 in October and Alabama # 2 in December.  Likewise OSU played 4 ranked teams during the regular season including #3 USC.

2010-10-27 7:49 PM
in reply to: #3169673

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Once people realize that the goal of the BCS is not to crown a true national champion, and it's goal is really to make money...then all of this starts to make sense.

I wish the BCS would simply get rid of their ranking system and just match up teams that would draw the best ratings.  Who cares about crowning a champion...because it doesn't really exist without a playoff system.

If I had it my way...this would be the games I would like to see...and I'm sure the BCS would prefer something along these lines as well...

BCS "Championship" game - Alabama vs. Oregon (I assume Alabama would beat Auburn)
Rose Bowl - Ohio St. vs. Auburn
Sugar Bowl - Stanford vs. Nebraska
Orange Bowl - Florida St. vs. Michigan St.  <----you can interchange these teams with many others.
Fiesta Bowl - Oklahoma vs. Wisconsin

Yes...I could care less about Boise, TCU, Utah, and even Missouri.  I have no problem putting these teams in a playoff system...but if we aren't going to have a playoff system...why even pretend that we are trying to determine who's #1.  Why not just match up the teams that people want to see play.

Just my opinion...I'm sure there's people that disagree...but that's okay.



Edited by tri808 2010-10-27 7:50 PM
2010-10-27 7:50 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
Brock Samson - 2010-10-27 6:45 PM

JoshR - 2010-10-27 6:39 PM
jcnipper - 2010-10-27 11:50 AM
brycoy - 2010-10-27 1:26 PM boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.  just ask Okla in the last bowl they played together.  the big schools have nothing to gain but everything to lose from scheduling them.  they can only beat who you put on the field with them.  and the system is crap, TCU destroys Aif Force, but last weeks #1, Okla barely beat them.  But the computers don't count margin of victory to offer no benifit to big schools from running up the score on the smaller guys.


I seriously don't get how people can propagate this theory.  If there is "nothing to gain" from playing a good team, then why do Bama and PSU agree to play?  Miami and tOSU?  The big name schools DO play each other.  And they do so in order to boost their rankings (human polls and BCS) at the national level. 

If Boise State REALLY wants to get in the BCS title game, they really only have once choice.  Go and play AT a big name school. 



There is a difference between a good team from one of the AQ conferences and a good team from a non-AQ conference. If Alabama loses to VT/PSU it's not a huge deal. If they lose to Boise State, then all of a sudden Boise has a legit gripe about getting into the BCS title game. That just adds 1 more team to the whole BCS mess about who deserves a shot at the BCS championship game. In my mind it makes no sense for a big school to play us.

Many of the top schools don't want to play tough games early in the season. Here is a list of the season opening opponents of the top 10 by ranking.

Arkansas State, New Mexico, Virginia Tech, Oregon State, Western Michigan, Illinois, San Jose State, Pittsburgh, Utah State, UNLV.

4 AQ schools are on that list, 3 from BSU/TCU/Utah and 1 on Missouri's schedule. Not exactly a lot of teams willing to open up with a tough game.

I don't get your point about opening up with a tough game.   You've lost me.  You don't have to open up against a tough team to have a difficult schedule.  You can have the game at anytime during the season.  My alma matter has historically played it's two big non-conference rivals, in mid october and the last game of the season. (Prior to Miami joining the ACC)  FSU played Miami in October and Florida the last game of the season.

In 2009 there was story that circulated that the Boise AD had contacted 10 "top tiered" schools to play a game and all had declined.  Sounds great until you dig a little deeper.  First, the game was to be in 2011.  By the time the story broke I know that most of the D-1 schools had their entire 2011 schedule set.  Additionally, Boise was looking for a September 3rd date.  So in order to bite at the offer you had to not have your schedule set AND have an open date for Sept 3rd.  Also, the AD has never actually said which 10 teams were contacted and declined to play Boise.

Is Boise getting doged by some programs?  Probably.  Has every top tiered program in the country refused to play Boise?  Absolutely no way.  Those who actually believe this are fooling themselves.

For example in the 2009 season Texas played 3 ranked opponents during the season OK at #18 on October 17th, Ok State #13 on October 31st, and Nebraska #21 on December 5th. Similarly UF played LSU #4 in October and Alabama # 2 in December.  Likewise OSU played 4 ranked teams during the regular season including #3 USC.



2 problems with your post:

1) Your examples of Texas & UF consist entirely of conference games, which means they'd play each other regardless of if the team was good or not.  Even 3 of OSU's 4 ranked teams were conference games.  They don't get a choice in playing those games.

2) Scheduling games 2 years out isn't uncommon.  Some teams cancel/move gigs on a year-by-year basis; a prime example is Arkansas backing out of their series with Texas, which left a hole to fill in the next season.  This was particularly true the last couple years after the NCAA allowed for a 12 game season(13 if you play at Hawaii).

Teams could have scheduled BSU if they wanted, but they usually don't.


2010-10-28 8:22 AM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS

JBrashear - 2010-10-27 8:50 PM
Brock Samson - 2010-10-27 6:45 PM

JoshR - 2010-10-27 6:39 PM
jcnipper - 2010-10-27 11:50 AM
brycoy - 2010-10-27 1:26 PM boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.  just ask Okla in the last bowl they played together.  the big schools have nothing to gain but everything to lose from scheduling them.  they can only beat who you put on the field with them.  and the system is crap, TCU destroys Aif Force, but last weeks #1, Okla barely beat them.  But the computers don't count margin of victory to offer no benifit to big schools from running up the score on the smaller guys.


I seriously don't get how people can propagate this theory.  If there is "nothing to gain" from playing a good team, then why do Bama and PSU agree to play?  Miami and tOSU?  The big name schools DO play each other.  And they do so in order to boost their rankings (human polls and BCS) at the national level. 

If Boise State REALLY wants to get in the BCS title game, they really only have once choice.  Go and play AT a big name school. 



There is a difference between a good team from one of the AQ conferences and a good team from a non-AQ conference. If Alabama loses to VT/PSU it's not a huge deal. If they lose to Boise State, then all of a sudden Boise has a legit gripe about getting into the BCS title game. That just adds 1 more team to the whole BCS mess about who deserves a shot at the BCS championship game. In my mind it makes no sense for a big school to play us.

Many of the top schools don't want to play tough games early in the season. Here is a list of the season opening opponents of the top 10 by ranking.

Arkansas State, New Mexico, Virginia Tech, Oregon State, Western Michigan, Illinois, San Jose State, Pittsburgh, Utah State, UNLV.

4 AQ schools are on that list, 3 from BSU/TCU/Utah and 1 on Missouri's schedule. Not exactly a lot of teams willing to open up with a tough game.

I don't get your point about opening up with a tough game.   You've lost me.  You don't have to open up against a tough team to have a difficult schedule.  You can have the game at anytime during the season.  My alma matter has historically played it's two big non-conference rivals, in mid october and the last game of the season. (Prior to Miami joining the ACC)  FSU played Miami in October and Florida the last game of the season.

In 2009 there was story that circulated that the Boise AD had contacted 10 "top tiered" schools to play a game and all had declined.  Sounds great until you dig a little deeper.  First, the game was to be in 2011.  By the time the story broke I know that most of the D-1 schools had their entire 2011 schedule set.  Additionally, Boise was looking for a September 3rd date.  So in order to bite at the offer you had to not have your schedule set AND have an open date for Sept 3rd.  Also, the AD has never actually said which 10 teams were contacted and declined to play Boise.

Is Boise getting doged by some programs?  Probably.  Has every top tiered program in the country refused to play Boise?  Absolutely no way.  Those who actually believe this are fooling themselves.

For example in the 2009 season Texas played 3 ranked opponents during the season OK at #18 on October 17th, Ok State #13 on October 31st, and Nebraska #21 on December 5th. Similarly UF played LSU #4 in October and Alabama # 2 in December.  Likewise OSU played 4 ranked teams during the regular season including #3 USC.



2 problems with your post:

1) Your examples of Texas & UF consist entirely of conference games, which means they'd play each other regardless of if the team was good or not.  Even 3 of OSU's 4 ranked teams were conference games.  They don't get a choice in playing those games.

2) Scheduling games 2 years out isn't uncommon.  Some teams cancel/move gigs on a year-by-year basis; a prime example is Arkansas backing out of their series with Texas, which left a hole to fill in the next season.  This was particularly true the last couple years after the NCAA allowed for a 12 game season(13 if you play at Hawaii).

Teams could have scheduled BSU if they wanted, but they usually don't.

I think this "Teams could have scheduled BSU if they wanted, but they usually don't" is pure fantasy.  The ony evidence of it is in 2009 the statement of the Boise AD who said they contacted 10 teams all who refused to play them.  Of course the game he was requesting was for a specific date (september 3rd) and only 2 years out.  Of course the names of the schools have never been made public.

And the playing ranked conference opponents is part of the point.  Boise's conference is a JOKE!  With the exception of Nevada, and only this year, there isn't another ranked team in that conference.  So Yes, an SEC team that will play 3 ranked teams in conference play doesn't have to justify their schedule by adding another non-conference ranked opponent.  Especially, when one loss can mean the end of the season for championship hopes.  There's a huge difference between say Florida scheduling Boise and Boise scheduling Florida.  Without Boise on the schedule Florida will play at least 3 ranked conference teams, along with yearly games against FSU.  While without Boise scheduling a ranked non-conference opponent, they will play NOBODY RANKED!

Once agaoin, do I believe that there are teams that have ducked playing Boise?  Yes.  Do I believe there is some vast NCAA conspiracy in which every single top tiered school has refused to play Boise?  Not a chance.

The other thing to remember is that Boise has a chip in the game too.  They can't actually argue that their schedule is as difficult as an SEC/Big-10/Pac-10 schedule, at least not with a straight face.  So it is in their best interest if people "believe" that no one will play them.  It helps to perpetuate the mystique of the "little team on the outside".

My hope, is that Boise finishes 1 or 2 in the regular season, and plays for the BCS championship against a traditional power house and they get absolutely destroyed.

There's a lot of myths about Boise

2010-10-28 10:26 AM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
Brock Samson - 2010-10-27 4:45 PM

I don't get your point about opening up with a tough game.   You've lost me.  You don't have to open up against a tough team to have a difficult schedule.  You can have the game at anytime during the season.  My alma matter has historically played it's two big non-conference rivals, in mid october and the last game of the season. (Prior to Miami joining the ACC)  FSU played Miami in October and Florida the last game of the season.


It also depends on the conference.
Historically, the last nine games of the year for Big 10 teams were always against other Big 10 teams.  You get 3 or 4 non-conference games to start your season, and if you are UM, MSU, or Purdue, one of those better be ND.

SO, your an AD.  Your job is to make the school money.  How do you make money?  Filling stadiums and winning games (thus getting booster donations).  You want home games in your 80,000+ seat sold out stadium, so your take of the gate is more than $1 million, and so your boosters can come to the games in person.  Why would you risk any of that by playing at Boise?  Why would you risk booster donations playing a non-conference games that you could loose at home?  Why would you risk the multi million dollar pay out for a BCS bowl by playing a non-conference game you could loose?
2010-10-28 10:47 AM
in reply to: #3179034

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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
scorpio516 - 2010-10-28 11:26 AM
Brock Samson - 2010-10-27 4:45 PM

I don't get your point about opening up with a tough game.   You've lost me.  You don't have to open up against a tough team to have a difficult schedule.  You can have the game at anytime during the season.  My alma matter has historically played it's two big non-conference rivals, in mid october and the last game of the season. (Prior to Miami joining the ACC)  FSU played Miami in October and Florida the last game of the season.


It also depends on the conference.
Historically, the last nine games of the year for Big 10 teams were always against other Big 10 teams.  You get 3 or 4 non-conference games to start your season, and if you are UM, MSU, or Purdue, one of those better be ND.

SO, your an AD.  Your job is to make the school money.  How do you make money?  Filling stadiums and winning games (thus getting booster donations).  You want home games in your 80,000+ seat sold out stadium, so your take of the gate is more than $1 million, and so your boosters can come to the games in person.  Why would you risk any of that by playing at Boise?  Why would you risk booster donations playing a non-conference games that you could loose at home?  Why would you risk the multi million dollar pay out for a BCS bowl by playing a non-conference game you could loose?


Well, there is a fairly easy answer to that question.  Because if you win that game, you get even MORE booster money, national recognition, etc.  Remember, it's still possible to go undefeated in a BCS conference and not play for the BCS championship.  When that happens, the fans look back and say "Why did we play NW Iowa tech?" 

It's all about building a "brand" for your team.  Most of my annoyane for Boise St come from the fact that their fans want to believe their "brand" should be as valuable as a big name football school because they go undefeated.  But those of us who emperically look at the numbers just don't see it.  I don't hate BSU at all, but grow weary of their whining.  Every college football thread on this board, and others, turns into a discussion of BSU.  Thus, I too find myself hoping they plan in a BCS game (though not neccessarily the championship) and get drilled (see Cincy, Hawaii, etc.). 
2010-10-28 8:10 PM
in reply to: #3178135

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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
Brock Samson - 2010-10-28 8:22 AM

JBrashear - 2010-10-27 8:50 PM
Brock Samson - 2010-10-27 6:45 PM

JoshR - 2010-10-27 6:39 PM
jcnipper - 2010-10-27 11:50 AM
brycoy - 2010-10-27 1:26 PM boise can't get a tougher schedule if they wanted one.  the power house schools schedule tune up games against smaller schools for the most part and boise is good.  just ask Okla in the last bowl they played together.  the big schools have nothing to gain but everything to lose from scheduling them.  they can only beat who you put on the field with them.  and the system is crap, TCU destroys Aif Force, but last weeks #1, Okla barely beat them.  But the computers don't count margin of victory to offer no benifit to big schools from running up the score on the smaller guys.


I seriously don't get how people can propagate this theory.  If there is "nothing to gain" from playing a good team, then why do Bama and PSU agree to play?  Miami and tOSU?  The big name schools DO play each other.  And they do so in order to boost their rankings (human polls and BCS) at the national level. 

If Boise State REALLY wants to get in the BCS title game, they really only have once choice.  Go and play AT a big name school. 



There is a difference between a good team from one of the AQ conferences and a good team from a non-AQ conference. If Alabama loses to VT/PSU it's not a huge deal. If they lose to Boise State, then all of a sudden Boise has a legit gripe about getting into the BCS title game. That just adds 1 more team to the whole BCS mess about who deserves a shot at the BCS championship game. In my mind it makes no sense for a big school to play us.

Many of the top schools don't want to play tough games early in the season. Here is a list of the season opening opponents of the top 10 by ranking.

Arkansas State, New Mexico, Virginia Tech, Oregon State, Western Michigan, Illinois, San Jose State, Pittsburgh, Utah State, UNLV.

4 AQ schools are on that list, 3 from BSU/TCU/Utah and 1 on Missouri's schedule. Not exactly a lot of teams willing to open up with a tough game.

I don't get your point about opening up with a tough game.   You've lost me.  You don't have to open up against a tough team to have a difficult schedule.  You can have the game at anytime during the season.  My alma matter has historically played it's two big non-conference rivals, in mid october and the last game of the season. (Prior to Miami joining the ACC)  FSU played Miami in October and Florida the last game of the season.

In 2009 there was story that circulated that the Boise AD had contacted 10 "top tiered" schools to play a game and all had declined.  Sounds great until you dig a little deeper.  First, the game was to be in 2011.  By the time the story broke I know that most of the D-1 schools had their entire 2011 schedule set.  Additionally, Boise was looking for a September 3rd date.  So in order to bite at the offer you had to not have your schedule set AND have an open date for Sept 3rd.  Also, the AD has never actually said which 10 teams were contacted and declined to play Boise.

Is Boise getting doged by some programs?  Probably.  Has every top tiered program in the country refused to play Boise?  Absolutely no way.  Those who actually believe this are fooling themselves.

For example in the 2009 season Texas played 3 ranked opponents during the season OK at #18 on October 17th, Ok State #13 on October 31st, and Nebraska #21 on December 5th. Similarly UF played LSU #4 in October and Alabama # 2 in December.  Likewise OSU played 4 ranked teams during the regular season including #3 USC.



2 problems with your post:

1) Your examples of Texas & UF consist entirely of conference games, which means they'd play each other regardless of if the team was good or not.  Even 3 of OSU's 4 ranked teams were conference games.  They don't get a choice in playing those games.

2) Scheduling games 2 years out isn't uncommon.  Some teams cancel/move gigs on a year-by-year basis; a prime example is Arkansas backing out of their series with Texas, which left a hole to fill in the next season.  This was particularly true the last couple years after the NCAA allowed for a 12 game season(13 if you play at Hawaii).

Teams could have scheduled BSU if they wanted, but they usually don't.

I think this "Teams could have scheduled BSU if they wanted, but they usually don't" is pure fantasy.  The ony evidence of it is in 2009 the statement of the Boise AD who said they contacted 10 teams all who refused to play them.  Of course the game he was requesting was for a specific date (september 3rd) and only 2 years out.  Of course the names of the schools have never been made public.

And the playing ranked conference opponents is part of the point.  Boise's conference is a JOKE!  With the exception of Nevada, and only this year, there isn't another ranked team in that conference.  So Yes, an SEC team that will play 3 ranked teams in conference play doesn't have to justify their schedule by adding another non-conference ranked opponent.  Especially, when one loss can mean the end of the season for championship hopes.  There's a huge difference between say Florida scheduling Boise and Boise scheduling Florida.  Without Boise on the schedule Florida will play at least 3 ranked conference teams, along with yearly games against FSU.  While without Boise scheduling a ranked non-conference opponent, they will play NOBODY RANKED!

Once agaoin, do I believe that there are teams that have ducked playing Boise?  Yes.  Do I believe there is some vast NCAA conspiracy in which every single top tiered school has refused to play Boise?  Not a chance.

The other thing to remember is that Boise has a chip in the game too.  They can't actually argue that their schedule is as difficult as an SEC/Big-10/Pac-10 schedule, at least not with a straight face.  So it is in their best interest if people "believe" that no one will play them.  It helps to perpetuate the mystique of the "little team on the outside".

My hope, is that Boise finishes 1 or 2 in the regular season, and plays for the BCS championship against a traditional power house and they get absolutely destroyed.

There's a lot of myths about Boise



I think conference schedules are irrelevant in this discussion because there's no choice in playing these teams.  Texas can't schedule around Baylor just because they suck 9 years out of 10 no more than BSU can schedule around their conference opponents because they regularly suck.  Unless a BcS conference grows a pair and invites BSU into the fold, there's nothing BSU can do about their conference.  It's what they do in OOC that matters in this sense, and BSU makes attempts to schedule other quality teams but gets few responses because nobody wants to be their next 'Oklahoma'.
2010-10-29 2:54 PM
in reply to: #3169673

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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
to all of you mizzou haters
http://collegefootball.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1145303

Edited by willose50 2010-10-29 2:55 PM


2010-10-29 3:10 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
JBrashear - 2010-10-28 8:10 PM
Brock Samson - 2010-10-28 8:22 AM and BSU makes attempts to schedule other quality teams but gets few responses because nobody wants to be their next 'Oklahoma'.


Other schools are willing to play BSU AND have contacted them to schedule, what the big guys don't want to do is PAY BSU.  There is a difference.  Huge difference.  If I'm a big six school, I'm not paying another school $1 million to come MAYBE beat me.  If I'm dropping a mill, I'm making sure I win and it is a tune up.  BSU is just as culpable in this as any other school. 

jbrashear - this isn't really directed at you, you were just the last one to comment on it).
2010-10-29 4:17 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
Michigan State has the stones to play us AND to pay us.

(sorry-my link isn't coming up.  "Google" for details



Edited by jeffnboise 2010-10-29 4:19 PM
2010-10-29 6:02 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
2010-10-29 6:38 PM
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Subject: RE: The Plan is working! Blow up the BCS
Great. A second-tier school in a second-tier conference. But I guess you have to start somewhere.
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