seeing racism first hand (Page 2)

Excuse me, but:

http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/category-view.asp?showcat=6#l6.

Excuse you but what?  Was that a terribly lame attempt at trying to being funny and telling me to go away? 

I see it as racism - he made a judgement on someone's nationality based on how he appeared.  Non-white. Don't know the details. Either way it was an ignorant comment. 

Simmer down.  Just a joke, apparently a terribly lame one.

Fail

Simmer down.  Just a joke, apparently a terribly lame one.

Yeah, yeah.

That is not racist it is expedience.  We make judgements about context placement based on appearances every day.  One's nationality does not necessarily equate to a negative.

I got it and laughed!  So I have your back.

That's a fair point (not that I agree with it) and there's nothing to be gained by putting a label on it either I guess.  Does it matter if it was racist / xenophobic / nationalist - the point is that if I'd have been paying and not said thank you (which i wouldn't do obviously) he would have just mouthed of at me for being rude.  

Difficult to have a constructive debate because, as you say, we all create our own context.  What's funny to some is offensive to others (as demonstrated). 

I wonder, as a foreigner on this board, what bias that might introduce to what people assume about me?

All fascinating stuff. To me at least!

I was suggesting, possibly more subtely than I thought, that the topic of your conference, and possibly your race/gender, had you primed to interpret the comment as racist.

All fascinating stuff. To me at least!

I did not say we all create our own context but simply that we tend to group things in related categories all the time, every day.  Not just people but things as well.  It is how our brains are constructed, it is how we learn.  Surface judgements are part of everyday life, it is how we survive.  Those judgements are not always accurate but they are the best we have.  If you had to analyze the exact nature of the object barrelling down the street at you before you acted you would most likely get run over by a lorry.

The saddest part of the story.  I hate that racism of this kind is just accepted. 

I'm from Essex (outside of London) I know this is the norm for a lot of people  I now live in Australia where i find people to be very openly racist against anyone who isn't an Aussie - including us POMs.  It's very tongue in cheek and I can generally laugh it off.  What makes me really chuckle is that only the indigenous people are truly Australian a lot of everyone else is descended from English and other European criminals...

That's a fair point (not that I agree with it) and there's nothing to be gained by putting a label on it either I guess.  Does it matter if it was racist / xenophobic / nationalist - the point is that if I'd have been paying and not said thank you (which i wouldn't do obviously) he would have just mouthed of at me for being rude.  

Difficult to have a constructive debate because, as you say, we all create our own context.  What's funny to some is offensive to others (as demonstrated). 

I wonder, as a foreigner on this board, what bias that might introduce to what people assume about me?

All fascinating stuff. To me at least!

Actually, I have all good impressions of most Brits.  I served with a few Blokes in Iraq. 

I will say that your accent makes you sound smarter than you are...

There's a guy who does Water Studies here in TX for power companies and I said "you know you wouldn't get as much credibility if it wasn't for your accent." 

In our TV shows for example, whenever we want to show some scientist as being "brilliant", we show a person with a british accent.  When we want to show someone stupid, we give them a southern accent.

It's not right or wrong, just an observation. I feel, at least here in the U.S. racisim is thrown away way too much for no reason. True racisim is quite ugly, and yes it certainly exists. But it seems most times it is more etiquette and not actually racial superiority/inferiority. Every single person most certainly has predjudices, that's natural, but actually think and acting as if another race is inferior... well, to me that is different. I only say it, because it seems to make light of actual racisim. Just rambling here. Bottom line is I can't tell you how you reacted to the situation is right or wrong, it just is. That is how you perceived it.

Sometimes it's not that overt and if you are not the one getting descriminated against, you may not even know it's there.  I used to think racism was on it's way out, untill I married a african american woman and started to see the subtle stuff first hand I NEVER saw before.

Case in point, went to a mani/pedi salon so she could get them done while I waited in the car.  She went up and they said they were too busy to take her, but there wasn't anyone in the salon AT ALL.  Empty.  She came back visably upset but I figured to give them the benefit of the doubt and maybe that had a load of reservations coming so couldn't take her.  But to be sure, I went up without her, and asked if I could get fit in for a male manacure and suddenly they had time/room?  Of course after a few choice words, I left...

Or the time I saw a cashier put the change on the counter for my wife to pick up instead of handing it to her.  I didn't catch it until my wife said stuff like that was typical.  I was surprised, so again, stuck around in the back ground and sure enough, same cashier handed cash to everyone else - not once just put it on the counter.

It doesn't have to be overt to be present or hurtful. 

Sometimes it's not that overt and if you are not the one getting descriminated against, you may not even know it's there.  I used to think racism was on it's way out, untill I married a african american woman and started to see the subtle stuff first hand I NEVER saw before.

Case in point, went to a mani/pedi salon so she could get them done while I waited in the car.  She went up and they said they were too busy to take her, but there wasn't anyone in the salon AT ALL.  Empty.  She came back visably upset but I figured to give them the benefit of the doubt and maybe that had a load of reservations coming so couldn't take her.  But to be sure, I went up without her, and asked if I could get fit in for a male manacure and suddenly they had time/room?  Of course after a few choice words, I left...

Or the time I saw a cashier put the change on the counter for my wife to pick up instead of handing it to her.  I didn't catch it until my wife said stuff like that was typical.  I was surprised, so again, stuck around in the back ground and sure enough, same cashier handed cash to everyone else - not once just put it on the counter.

It doesn't have to be overt to be present or hurtful. 

Sometimes it's not that overt and if you are not the one getting descriminated against, you may not even know it's there.  I used to think racism was on it's way out, untill I married a african american woman and started to see the subtle stuff first hand I NEVER saw before.

Case in point, went to a mani/pedi salon so she could get them done while I waited in the car.  She went up and they said they were too busy to take her, but there wasn't anyone in the salon AT ALL.  Empty.  She came back visably upset but I figured to give them the benefit of the doubt and maybe that had a load of reservations coming so couldn't take her.  But to be sure, I went up without her, and asked if I could get fit in for a male manacure and suddenly they had time/room?  Of course after a few choice words, I left...

Or the time I saw a cashier put the change on the counter for my wife to pick up instead of handing it to her.  I didn't catch it until my wife said stuff like that was typical.  I was surprised, so again, stuck around in the back ground and sure enough, same cashier handed cash to everyone else - not once just put it on the counter.

It doesn't have to be overt to be present or hurtful. 

I wasn't trying to say that racism does not exist but that judging one to be "not from around here" based on appearence is not inherently racist.

I know what you ment.  And I even agree.  Sometimes the racist card gets thrown around because it's easy to use and gets attention.

Again, for example.  A homeless guy asked me for a handout in Chicago and I said no (African American).  He started to yell after me and accuse me of being a racist.  BTW, I was hold hands with my african american wife!  I obviously wasn't being racist, I just dind't want to give bum my money!

I'm just wanted to make clear that there is probably more subtle types of racism still out there than most people might realize.  But there are some true false accusations.  Hey, I might just not like someone becuase they are simply a D-bag!  Not that they are a D-bag of a particular race...  But they earned that dislike from me, not born with it - if that makes sense.

I think this is similar to my situation.  I don't have many good friends of a different ethnicity to me, just two - one black and one Asian, so my experience of racism was limited to people like my Grandparents saying "I was worried when I saw he was black but he actually turned out to be a nice doctor" etc but now I've been out a few times with these two I'm amazed how often they have to deal with it.  My black mate called Dwayne had 50 job applications ignored and when he put his middle name on his resume; George, he started getting interviews and is now a partner at PWC.  But an anecdote or two doesn't frame a society.

Incidentally, the observations about the Brits earlier are pretty much spot on! I always take the mickey out of my American colleague (and good friend) who must be able to read a book at night without a bedside lamp his teeth are so white.