General Discussion Triathlon Talk » Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early Rss Feed  
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2014-07-27 7:59 AM

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Master
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Subject: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Looks like there is some horrible weather in Lake Placid today - heavy rain, thunder, lightning, wind, cold. According to the IM site, race officials pulled the plug on the swim before the cut off time due to weather concerns. Wonder what happens to those folks who were still in the water when the cancel notice went out? Are they DNF'ed out of the race? Or are they allowed to keep going to the bike? Regardless, hope everyone is fine, and gets to keep going.


2014-07-27 8:15 AM
in reply to: Mike_D

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

The most important thing is that the race organizers make every effort to keep safe the several thousand athletes, volunteers, and fans.

2014-07-27 8:57 AM
in reply to: pga_mike

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

How do you get all the athletes out of the water safely and quickly?

I did IMLP in the Monsoon year and it rained from about 30' from the start until I finished other than about 30 minutes in the early evening.  Folks from town said it was the worse rain they had seen in 10+ years. I hope the athletes stay safe and brought appropriate clothing as you get cold when wet for many many hours.

2014-07-27 9:08 AM
in reply to: KathyG

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

Ironman Live mentions the closing swim course at 2:17 but doesn't say anything more other than final time will likely be just bike/run.

2014-07-27 9:09 AM
in reply to: KathyG

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Master
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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Getting everyone out has to be quite a chore, but from what I've read, much of the field was done by the time the decision was made?

Latest IM.com update says the weather is starting to clear, and should be OK the rest of the day.

As for race timing, all age groupers will have only the 1st swim loop count (even if you did both), no T1 time, but bike, T2, and run will count. Not sure if they will be considered 'official' IM times, thought.

Given the circumstances, I'm sure the RD is doing the best s/he can with the situation. Hope everyone is safe, and can stay warm the rest of the day.
2014-07-27 9:11 AM
in reply to: KathyG

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

Update from IM Live:

The professional race is intact. All time splits will be counted in the official finish time.

For the age group athletes, since all athletes completed one lap of the swim. The official time will be calculated as: One lap of the swim, Bike, T2, and Run. T1 will not be included.



2014-07-27 9:19 AM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
When I was in college Ironman had an event in Provo, Utah. The swim portion was held in Utah Lake which is notorious for heavy chop during storms and winds. The weather turned bad and a swimmer drowned in the chop before swim was cancelled. The race never held in northern Utah again.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/928829/Provos-first-Ironman-may-...

Mother Nature doesn't care about your race... I would definitely err on the side of caution in a stormy swim.

Edited by CRS 2014-07-27 9:20 AM
2014-07-27 9:35 AM
in reply to: Mike_D

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Expert
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Madison, Wisconsin
Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Originally posted by Mike_D

Looks like there is some horrible weather in Lake Placid today - heavy rain, thunder, lightning, wind, cold. According to the IM site, race officials pulled the plug on the swim before the cut off time due to weather concerns. Wonder what happens to those folks who were still in the water when the cancel notice went out? Are they DNF'ed out of the race? Or are they allowed to keep going to the bike? Regardless, hope everyone is fine, and gets to keep going.


Kudos to Ironman and the RD for having a great emergency response plan in place and executed well. Furthermore, with the double loop swim they can have everyone clock some portion of the swim to their overall time. Fairness all around.
2014-07-27 10:36 AM
in reply to: bcagle25

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Wait, so they cutoff the swim three minutes early and the 95% of the other swimmers are penalized even though they have been on their bikes for anywhere up to an hour and a half?

Tell me I'm reading that wrong or I just don't know what I'm talking about.
2014-07-27 1:33 PM
in reply to: #5030986

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
They stopped agers from doing second loop for those about 1:15 or 20 slower. Depending where you were finishing first lap you did second or are sent to T1. Time will be first loop of swim, bike, t2, and run not t1 or second loop if you swam one. They told athletes to take their time in t1 which is why that time isn't included based on what sports stat (the timing company) said over on ST.
2014-07-27 4:25 PM
in reply to: KathyG

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Then double the single lap time for everyone, not perfect but fair.


2014-07-27 5:30 PM
in reply to: KathyG

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
From what I've heard, the AG only had to do 1 swim loop vs. 2 and the time to and in T1 didn't count.
2014-07-27 6:02 PM
in reply to: #5031048

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
That is crazy! Obviously the most important thing is that no participant was hurt by lightening. After that as much as it sucks - all that can be done is try to make the age group race as even a playing field as possible.
2014-07-27 8:17 PM
in reply to: simpsonbo

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

Originally posted by simpsonbo Then double the single lap time for everyone, not perfect but fair.

Exactly right

2014-07-27 10:43 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

Sad part is folks that won their AG and did the whole course, now get moved down to a different placing. Imagine winning your AG doing the whole course as did all the top 20 folks in your AG then getting 4th when they remove second loop and T1 and missing out on KQ?

The top finishers are all getting shuffled up.

I understand the need for safety and as other have brought up why did they start the swim given the forecast and the storm cells moving in?

The aftermath for those who are in the top of their AG and wanted to KQ is a mess. I don't see any fair way to resolve it other than figuring out results both way and letting more than normal get Kona Slots.

 

 

2014-07-27 10:59 PM
in reply to: Left Brain

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Keeps the gaps to what they should have been. Hard to argue not doing this.


2014-07-27 11:50 PM
in reply to: simpsonbo

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Already heard of two people who were third in their AG and Kona spots first one drops to 4th with this ruling the other to 6th. Not fair at all.
2014-07-28 6:26 AM
in reply to: jobaxas

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Originally posted by jobaxas

Already heard of two people who were third in their AG and Kona spots first one drops to 4th with this ruling the other to 6th. Not fair at all.


How is it not fair? Everyone raced the same race. You cannot just double someones swim time. That is making a prediction of what MIGHT happen. Ironman is about overcoming adversity.

There is no way to by 100% fair to everyone. They were put in a very tough spot and had to make a quick call on the swim and how to handle results, they did the best they could and of course now all the Monday morning QB's are going to rip them apart.
2014-07-28 7:01 AM
in reply to: bcagle25

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

Originally posted by bcagle25
Originally posted by jobaxas Already heard of two people who were third in their AG and Kona spots first one drops to 4th with this ruling the other to 6th. Not fair at all.
How is it not fair? Everyone raced the same race. You cannot just double someones swim time. That is making a prediction of what MIGHT happen. Ironman is about overcoming adversity. There is no way to by 100% fair to everyone. They were put in a very tough spot and had to make a quick call on the swim and how to handle results, they did the best they could and of course now all the Monday morning QB's are going to rip them apart.

When all of the AG and Kona contenders actually completed the swim and T1 then the fair thing is to use those times.  Which is apparently what they are doing for almost all of the AGs.  That is the right thing to do IMO.

2014-07-28 8:44 AM
in reply to: Mike_D

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Originally posted by Mike_D

Looks like there is some horrible weather in Lake Placid today - heavy rain, thunder, lightning, wind, cold.



Sounds normal for the 'Dacks. That's what many of my backpacking trips in the mountains up there are like.
2014-07-28 9:13 AM
in reply to: axteraa

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Originally posted by axteraa

Originally posted by bcagle25
Originally posted by jobaxas Already heard of two people who were third in their AG and Kona spots first one drops to 4th with this ruling the other to 6th. Not fair at all.
How is it not fair? Everyone raced the same race. You cannot just double someones swim time. That is making a prediction of what MIGHT happen. Ironman is about overcoming adversity. There is no way to by 100% fair to everyone. They were put in a very tough spot and had to make a quick call on the swim and how to handle results, they did the best they could and of course now all the Monday morning QB's are going to rip them apart.

When all of the AG and Kona contenders actually completed the swim and T1 then the fair thing is to use those times.  Which is apparently what they are doing for almost all of the AGs.  That is the right thing to do IMO.




Agreed. I am pretty sure that all participants that may have been competing for Kona completed the second loop and T1, so use their entire race time.

It is a mess and I am sure IM did what they had to do for the safety of the participants (priority #1), but after safety was assured for all participants, they should not be unfair with the people who race 140.6 miles and KQ...


2014-07-28 9:19 AM
in reply to: bcagle25

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early

Originally posted by bcagle25
Originally posted by jobaxas Already heard of two people who were third in their AG and Kona spots first one drops to 4th with this ruling the other to 6th. Not fair at all.
How is it not fair? Everyone raced the same race. You cannot just double someones swim time. That is making a prediction of what MIGHT happen. Ironman is about overcoming adversity. There is no way to by 100% fair to everyone. They were put in a very tough spot and had to make a quick call on the swim and how to handle results, they did the best they could and of course now all the Monday morning QB's are going to rip them apart.

How is it not fair?  How about the guys that actually winning the age group getting moved down despite swimming twice as much as the slower swimmers.  How is that even a question?

2014-07-28 9:32 AM
in reply to: 0

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Originally posted by msteiner

Originally posted by bcagle25
Originally posted by jobaxas Already heard of two people who were third in their AG and Kona spots first one drops to 4th with this ruling the other to 6th. Not fair at all.
How is it not fair? Everyone raced the same race. You cannot just double someones swim time. That is making a prediction of what MIGHT happen. Ironman is about overcoming adversity. There is no way to by 100% fair to everyone. They were put in a very tough spot and had to make a quick call on the swim and how to handle results, they did the best they could and of course now all the Monday morning QB's are going to rip them apart.

How is it not fair?  How about the guys that actually winning the age group getting moved down despite swimming twice as much as the slower swimmers.  How is that even a question?




Like I said nothing is 100% fair, but to simply double someones time, usually when people fade (check IM tracker) is giving people benefit of the doubt.

The RD made a call that had a lot of pressure on it. Sometimes I would like to see all the Monday morning QB's be thrown into the situation and handle all the crossfire.

EDIT: I think WTC gave a lot of the Kona contenders a break by giving the Kona slots BACK to 60 after a misprint online from the original 50 that were given out with a misprint of 60 right before the race. So basically WTC handed out an additional 10 slots yesterday.

Edited by bcagle25 2014-07-28 9:35 AM
2014-07-28 9:36 AM
in reply to: msteiner

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
The individuals who were able to complete the entire swim portion would have been more fatigued than those who only did one lap, which could aid the one lappers on the bike/run.
2014-07-28 9:39 AM
in reply to: JakePS

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Subject: RE: Weather impacting IMLP - swim ended early
Looks like they had reassessed and now doing both options depending on how the AG field finished.


"We apologize for any confusion with the results process from today due to the inclement weather that interrupted the swim portion of the race. We are pleased that all athletes were able to safely leave the water and continue the race. Because of the extraordinary circumstances, we have been working to find the fairest way to today’s race results for Age Group Awards and IRONMAN World Championship qualification.


The revised criteria for Age Group Awards and IRONMAN World Championship qualification is as follows:

· For men’s age groups 18-24 and inclusive of 55-59, the time for entire race (both swim loops, T1, Bike, T2, Run) will be used
· For women’s age groups 18-24 and inclusive of 50-54, the time for the entire race (both swim loops, T1, Bike, T2, Run) will be used
· For men’s age groups 60-64 and older, the modified time (first loop of swim, bike T2, run) will be used
· For women’s age groups 55-59 and older, the modified time (first loop of swim, bike T2, run) will be used

Please note the results currently posted online reflect the one loop swim, bike, T2 and run."
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