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Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts?
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 2015-07-31 11:24 AM |
 31 |  Subject: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts?Random question but does anyone have any feedback on the chinese carbon rims from ebay or aliexpress. There are mixed feelings about them but it seems mostly positive. People who have never tried them are always like "oh man, you don't want to cut costs on wheels" and the people who have them say good things. Is it a perceived quality issue or are they actually that bad? I know I'll be out the money if they have issues but they're so cheap I almost want to give them a test run. |
| 2015-07-31 11:58 AM in reply to: amalgamate |
Champion 10668    Tacoma, Washington | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? I will give only my views of Chinese manufacturing, as I have no direct experience with unbranded "grey market" Chinese bikes or wheels (nor will I ever have direct experience). I work for a company that contracts out to Chinese suppliers for large carbon layup parts and assemblies. We have direct oversight with on-sight direct hired manufacturing folks who are there to keep their eyes on the process, making sure it meets our specs and requirements. The things that they try to get away with are amazing. One of the latest things was a question regarding sanding of the layups in the clean room. Now if you don't understand how these things are supposed to be produced, I'll illucidate -- you absolutely DO NOT do any sanding in the clean room. This is where the carbon is layed up before cure, and there is to be no foreign debris in that layup (it causes voids, disbonds, and eventually can cause part failure). Sanding will, in effect, introduce what amounts to a layer of parting agent into the layup. Rocket science degrees are not required. So this is the kind of thing that these suppliers are trying to get away with WHEN THEY'RE BEING WATCHED LIKE HAWKS. I shudder to think of what they do when they're left to their own devices. There have been articles written recently about the grey-market frames, where one was cut up and compared to the "genuine article". It came up short in some very important ways. They're great at making products that look the same. But they are NOT the same beneath the skin. So... I'm not saying all this to maintain that any wheels you buy will detonate on you. They might work out just fine. I'm saying that quality control is basically non-existent when no one is watching. And if something does got wrong, what kind of recourse will you have? |
| 2015-07-31 12:09 PM in reply to: briderdt |
| 31 | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by briderdt I will give only my views of Chinese manufacturing, as I have no direct experience with unbranded "grey market" Chinese bikes or wheels (nor will I ever have direct experience). I work for a company that contracts out to Chinese suppliers for large carbon layup parts and assemblies. We have direct oversight with on-sight direct hired manufacturing folks who are there to keep their eyes on the process, making sure it meets our specs and requirements. The things that they try to get away with are amazing. One of the latest things was a question regarding sanding of the layups in the clean room. Now if you don't understand how these things are supposed to be produced, I'll illucidate -- you absolutely DO NOT do any sanding in the clean room. This is where the carbon is layed up before cure, and there is to be no foreign debris in that layup (it causes voids, disbonds, and eventually can cause part failure). Sanding will, in effect, introduce what amounts to a layer of parting agent into the layup. Rocket science degrees are not required. So this is the kind of thing that these suppliers are trying to get away with WHEN THEY'RE BEING WATCHED LIKE HAWKS. I shudder to think of what they do when they're left to their own devices. There have been articles written recently about the grey-market frames, where one was cut up and compared to the "genuine article". It came up short in some very important ways. They're great at making products that look the same. But they are NOT the same beneath the skin. So... I'm not saying all this to maintain that any wheels you buy will detonate on you. They might work out just fine. I'm saying that quality control is basically non-existent when no one is watching. And if something does got wrong, what kind of recourse will you have? Good insight! I saw the article about the frames and its actually what made me think twice...... because I've been eyeing cheap rims, thinking that they would be not as good but still decent. I'm okay with them not being great..... then I'm only out $400...... just don't want to shatter into pieces while going down a hill. Still might play the lottery and just avoid hills for a while (I live in a flat area so thats most days) |
| 2015-07-31 12:42 PM in reply to: amalgamate |
| 36 | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Good thread. I am generally a "you get what you pay for" kind of guy. But lots of the guys around here race the Chinese rims - on very expensive frames. This gives me pause before I dismiss this out of hand. I have the same concern about quality control at the $399/set price point. Especially, since the leading manufacturers charge a minimum of $1500/set ... The delta in the expense is so drastic - not like we are just talking about saving a couple hundred bucks. I'm not sure if it's worth taking my life into my hands. I wouldn't trust cheap, Chinese gun to defend myself ... |
| 2015-07-31 1:10 PM in reply to: amalgamate |
Member 1748 Exton, PA | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by amalgamate Originally posted by briderdt I will give only my views of Chinese manufacturing, as I have no direct experience with unbranded "grey market" Chinese bikes or wheels (nor will I ever have direct experience). I work for a company that contracts out to Chinese suppliers for large carbon layup parts and assemblies. We have direct oversight with on-sight direct hired manufacturing folks who are there to keep their eyes on the process, making sure it meets our specs and requirements. The things that they try to get away with are amazing. One of the latest things was a question regarding sanding of the layups in the clean room. Now if you don't understand how these things are supposed to be produced, I'll illucidate -- you absolutely DO NOT do any sanding in the clean room. This is where the carbon is layed up before cure, and there is to be no foreign debris in that layup (it causes voids, disbonds, and eventually can cause part failure). Sanding will, in effect, introduce what amounts to a layer of parting agent into the layup. Rocket science degrees are not required. So this is the kind of thing that these suppliers are trying to get away with WHEN THEY'RE BEING WATCHED LIKE HAWKS. I shudder to think of what they do when they're left to their own devices. There have been articles written recently about the grey-market frames, where one was cut up and compared to the "genuine article". It came up short in some very important ways. They're great at making products that look the same. But they are NOT the same beneath the skin. So... I'm not saying all this to maintain that any wheels you buy will detonate on you. They might work out just fine. I'm saying that quality control is basically non-existent when no one is watching. And if something does got wrong, what kind of recourse will you have? Good insight! I saw the article about the frames and its actually what made me think twice...... because I've been eyeing cheap rims, thinking that they would be not as good but still decent. I'm okay with them not being great..... then I'm only out $400...... just don't want to shatter into pieces while going down a hill. Still might play the lottery and just avoid hills for a while (I live in a flat area so thats most days) I also have a lot of experience with manufacturing and Chinese manufacturing. There are 2 ways the Chinese generally make a product; they duplicate the way a product looks which means you have no idea how it will perform, or they steal the entire manufacturing process from a company that spent R&D money designing and figuring out a product. The Chinese companies and government actually brag about stealing technogy(patents) from the western world. As for the quality I'll just agree with the above. As for riding flat terrain with wheels that might shatter vs hills with wheels that might shatter. Think about that: pieces of Carbon fiber jammed into your leg as you hit the pavement at 20mph or as you hit at 35 mph. |
| 2015-07-31 2:02 PM in reply to: amalgamate |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Here's what I have found; the only negative reviews I was able to find were from people who never owned them. I wasn't able to find a single bad first hand experience, and I checked around quite a bit. It was the same story on this and other chat rooms; first hand experience was all good, second hand hearsay, always negative (sorry guys). I bought wheels from what would be considered a reputable Chinese wheel manufacturer (www.wheelsfar.com). They arrived at my door within 7 days of ordering, in perfect shape, very well packaged (it was the fastest delivery I have ever got from anywhere in the world). Customer service was excellent and better than I've received from a lot of US companies. I have rode these wheels for thousands of miles (somewhere between 2,000-3,000) and had ZERO issues. They are awesome. That is first hand. They have all the newest technology in regard to the U-shape wheels and for a fraction of the cost of the big name brands. That, and I'm able to train with them because if anything happens it will only cost me a couple hundred dollars to replace them instead of a couple thousand. No offense to the other posters, but I did a lot of searching and all I needed was a single bad review and I wouldn't have pulled the trigger, but found none. Anything negative comes from people with no experience (or at least that's what I found). |
| 2015-07-31 2:12 PM in reply to: mike761 |
| Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by mike761 There are 2 ways the Chinese generally make a product; they duplicate the way a product looks which means you have no idea how it will perform, or they steal the entire manufacturing process from a company that spent R&D money designing and figuring out a product. The Chinese companies and government actually brag about stealing technogy(patents) from the western world. Yeah...you're either buying a product that may have zero reliability, or a product that was essentially stolen by a company who operates in a country that doesn't care. If you want to take a chance on the former, or support the latter, that is up to you. I won't. |
| 2015-07-31 2:17 PM in reply to: Jason N |
Expert 1484 | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? I had a set of 50mm all carbon random Chinese wheels. Did over 5000 miles one season on them, over 10,000 miles total. Brake track was starting to show wear on the rear Rear hub pawls blew up -- Just got an other wheel also solved the brake track wear Figure I've still have them if not for the entire bike being stolen. |
| 2015-07-31 2:19 PM in reply to: 0 |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by Jason N Originally posted by mike761 There are 2 ways the Chinese generally make a product; they duplicate the way a product looks which means you have no idea how it will perform, or they steal the entire manufacturing process from a company that spent R&D money designing and figuring out a product. The Chinese companies and government actually brag about stealing technogy(patents) from the western world. Yeah...you're either buying a product that may have zero reliability, or a product that was essentially stolen by a company who operates in a country that doesn't care. If you want to take a chance on the former, or support the latter, that is up to you. I won't. Can you point to an actual example of either of those? If so, I would absolutely agree, but I doubt it. Edited by 3mar 2015-07-31 2:20 PM |
| 2015-07-31 2:32 PM in reply to: 0 |
Champion 9407 Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar Can you point to an actual example of either of those? If so, I would absolutely agree, but I doubt it. Well, if your wheels have the newest rim technology, then you're riding an example of ripping off R&D. Shane Edited by gsmacleod 2015-07-31 2:34 PM |
| 2015-07-31 2:39 PM in reply to: gsmacleod |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by gsmacleod Originally posted by 3mar Can you point to an actual example of either of those? If so, I would absolutely agree, but I doubt it. Well, if your wheels have the newest rim technology, then you're riding an example of ripping off R&D. Shane So Flo ripped off Zipp? Or Envy? They all have VERY similar wheels and use the latest technology and shape...there are only so many ways to make a U shape...well, ok, there is one way to make a U, it's in the shape of a U, and they all look like that. So did they all come up with it independently at the exact same time or do you think they worked off of each others progress? I'm playing devil's advocate here, but you've got actual experience vs hearsay, it's as simple as that. People who say they are unreliable or bad quality have zero examples. Those that say the technology is ripped off have no examples. Those that have used them say they're fine. People here pay a lot for branding. |
| 2015-07-31 2:41 PM in reply to: 3mar |
Member 1748 Exton, PA | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar Originally posted by Jason N Originally posted by mike761 There are 2 ways the Chinese generally make a product; they duplicate the way a product looks which means you have no idea how it will perform, or they steal the entire manufacturing process from a company that spent R&D money designing and figuring out a product. The Chinese companies and government actually brag about stealing technogy(patents) from the western world. Yeah...you're either buying a product that may have zero reliability, or a product that was essentially stolen by a company who operates in a country that doesn't care. If you want to take a chance on the former, or support the latter, that is up to you. I won't. Can you point to an actual example of either of those? If so, I would absolutely agree, but I doubt it. You would not doubt it if you took a trip to China. They are very good at stealing technology, and their government supports it(it is not a secret) If the wheels you have are high quality wheels they are probably being made on the same production line as a name brand wheel with the tooling for the name brand wheel. However since they Chinese company did not pay for the tooling, pay for the design work, pay for the testing, pay for the manufacturing start up they are able to sell the wheel for a lot less. |
| 2015-07-31 2:49 PM in reply to: 3mar |
Champion 9407 Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar So Flo ripped off Zipp? Or Envy? They all have VERY similar wheels and use the latest technology and shape...there are only so many ways to make a U shape...well, ok, there is one way to make a U, it's in the shape of a U, and they all look like that. So did they all come up with it independently at the exact same time or do you think they worked off of each others progress? I'm playing devil's advocate here, but you've got actual experience vs hearsay, it's as simple as that. People who say they are unreliable or bad quality have zero examples. Those that say the technology is ripped off have no examples. Those that have used them say they're fine. People here pay a lot for branding. Do you have a "Jump to Conclusions Mat?" Notice I said "if" - as in if you have the newest rim designs, they've been ripped off from someone else's R&D. As to Flo et. al. there's a reason why there were only two makers of toroidal rims for many years - until the patent expired. There's also (likely) a reason why the buldge shape came out just before the patent expiry. There are actually many ways to make an aerodynamic looking rim - in many cases that's all that's happening with the Chinese rims. But there are some that are counterfeit and have stolen the research from companies like Zipp and Hed that have put the time and money into R&D. Shane |
| 2015-07-31 2:52 PM in reply to: 3mar |
| Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar Originally posted by gsmacleod So Flo ripped off Zipp? Or Envy? They all have VERY similar wheels and use the latest technology and shape...there are only so many ways to make a U shape...well, ok, there is one way to make a U, it's in the shape of a U, and they all look like that. So did they all come up with it independently at the exact same time or do you think they worked off of each others progress? I'm playing devil's advocate here, but you've got actual experience vs hearsay, it's as simple as that. People who say they are unreliable or bad quality have zero examples. Those that say the technology is ripped off have no examples. Those that have used them say they're fine. People here pay a lot for branding. Originally posted by 3mar Can you point to an actual example of either of those? If so, I would absolutely agree, but I doubt it. Well, if your wheels have the newest rim technology, then you're riding an example of ripping off R&D. Shane FLO is not nearly the design of Zipp or ENVE because their fairing is not structural. They designed their own non structural fairing that is then applied to what is basically a normal aluminum rim. That's why they are so much more heavy and also much cheaper to manufacture. I don't have a problem with the Chinese manufacturers using a U shaped design as that is what all other companies are using. But did they develop their own molds and research the manufacturing process to ensure that they are reliable? Zipp, Enve, Reynolds, etc all did their own separate R&D to create their own molds and did their own testing on their molds to meet certain standards? Do you think a Chinese manufacturer also went through that entire process, or do you think they just copied the process of another wheel company who has their wheels produced in China? If China can produce these wheels at 20% of the cost of all other companies not in China while doing their own R&D...why do you think that is? Are all other companies just stupid at how to manufacture and test wheels? |
| 2015-07-31 3:58 PM in reply to: 3mar |
Champion 10668 Tacoma, Washington | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar Here's what I have found; the only negative reviews I was able to find were from people who never owned them. I wasn't able to find a single bad first hand experience, and I checked around quite a bit. It was the same story on this and other chat rooms; first hand experience was all good, second hand hearsay, always negative (sorry guys). I bought wheels from what would be considered a reputable Chinese wheel manufacturer (www.wheelsfar.com). They arrived at my door within 7 days of ordering, in perfect shape, very well packaged (it was the fastest delivery I have ever got from anywhere in the world). Customer service was excellent and better than I've received from a lot of US companies. I have rode these wheels for thousands of miles (somewhere between 2,000-3,000) and had ZERO issues. They are awesome. That is first hand. They have all the newest technology in regard to the U-shape wheels and for a fraction of the cost of the big name brands. That, and I'm able to train with them because if anything happens it will only cost me a couple hundred dollars to replace them instead of a couple thousand. No offense to the other posters, but I did a lot of searching and all I needed was a single bad review and I wouldn't have pulled the trigger, but found none. Anything negative comes from people with no experience (or at least that's what I found). I'm well aware that there is a dearth of negative reviews with direct experience on the wheels -- my above experience with manufacturing was dismissed out-of-hand by one particular poster on ST because I didn't have direct experience with the wheels. But I maintain my views of the manufacturing, and it's a cultural thing: I have no problem with any of the Chinese people I know (and I do know several), it's the culture of manufacturing in China that I have problems with -- the same mind-set that put lead in the paint on children's toys and arsenic in imported baby food. As long as it looks the same and can be sold to an unsuspecting public, they don't care. |
| 2015-07-31 4:23 PM in reply to: 0 |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? I have yet to find a single first hand horror story from Chinese wheels. I searched here, slow twitch and a couple of road bike forums. I have found failure stories on Flo and Zipp however, so even if there is one or two, I doubt there's a brand with zero. I couldn't find anything first hand. Every time this comes up it goes like this: Post: Chinese wheels are made with shoddy craftsmanship, they *MUST* but they just *MUST* because of X Y and Z. Response: Can you point to an example because here are four real people that have the wheels that have 0 issues after 1,000nds of miles? OP: No, but they *MUST*. Well, then they *MUST* have stolen the technology. Response: Can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but the *MUST* and if they didn't then they *MUST* have stolen the molds, they *MUST* have Response: can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but they *MUST* have done something I don't know what, I have no direct proof or examples, but they *MUST* have done something. Why *MUST* they have done something? In my opinion it's because there *MUST* be a reason you spent $3,000 on your wheels.  Edited by 3mar 2015-07-31 4:24 PM |
| 2015-07-31 4:45 PM in reply to: 3mar |
| Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar Why *MUST* they have done something? In my opinion it's because there *MUST* be a reason you spent $3,000 on your wheels. Imagine how cheap a wheel you could make if you didn't have to pay for R&D, wind tunnel testing, or stress testing? Imagine the cost savings in production and how cheap you could offer these wheels to customers now that there is less cost to pass down? |
| 2015-07-31 4:51 PM in reply to: Jason N |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by Jason N Originally posted by 3mar Why *MUST* they have done something? In my opinion it's because there *MUST* be a reason you spent $3,000 on your wheels. Imagine how cheap a wheel you could make if you didn't have to pay for R&D, wind tunnel testing, or stress testing? Imagine the cost savings in production and how cheap you could offer these wheels to customers now that there is less cost to pass down? Or pay for booths at ever trade show. A booth at every triathlon. Advertisements in all the magazines. sponsorships of professionals. etc, etc, etc. Branding costs money too. The point is this; you have hearsay and speculation, nothing more. With the quality, the technology, the process, anything. And every time you are asked for a specific example you just default to it *MUST*. There is a reason a pair of Gucci sunglasses cost 10x the exact same pair (probably made in the same location) that you can buy at a gas station. Branding costs money, lots and lots of money. Is that why the wheels are cheaper? I don't know, that's speculation, you know, like every anti-Chinese carbon wheel argument in this thread. |
| 2015-07-31 4:52 PM in reply to: 3mar |
Champion 9407 Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar I have yet to find a single first hand horror story from Chinese wheels. I searched here, slow twitch and a couple of road bike forums. I have found failure stories on Flo and Zipp however, so even if there is one or two, I doubt there's a brand with zero. I couldn't find anything first hand. Every time this comes up it goes like this: Post: Chinese wheels are made with shoddy craftsmanship, they *MUST* but they just *MUST* because of X Y and Z. Response: Can you point to an example because here are four real people that have the wheels that have 0 issues after 1,000nds of miles? OP: No, but they *MUST*. Well, then they *MUST* have stolen the technology. Response: Can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but the *MUST* and if they didn't then they *MUST* have stolen the molds, they *MUST* have Response: can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but they *MUST* have done something I don't know what, I have no direct proof or examples, but they *MUST* have done something. Why *MUST* they have done something? In my opinion it's because there *MUST* be a reason you spent $3,000 on your wheels. Well you did claim to be riding the newest rim shapes on a set of Chinese wheels. If that's the case, then, at the very least, they've copied a shape they don't have a patent for. Shane |
| 2015-07-31 4:53 PM in reply to: gsmacleod |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by gsmacleod Originally posted by 3mar I have yet to find a single first hand horror story from Chinese wheels. I searched here, slow twitch and a couple of road bike forums. I have found failure stories on Flo and Zipp however, so even if there is one or two, I doubt there's a brand with zero. I couldn't find anything first hand. Every time this comes up it goes like this: Post: Chinese wheels are made with shoddy craftsmanship, they *MUST* but they just *MUST* because of X Y and Z. Response: Can you point to an example because here are four real people that have the wheels that have 0 issues after 1,000nds of miles? OP: No, but they *MUST*. Well, then they *MUST* have stolen the technology. Response: Can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but the *MUST* and if they didn't then they *MUST* have stolen the molds, they *MUST* have Response: can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but they *MUST* have done something I don't know what, I have no direct proof or examples, but they *MUST* have done something. Why *MUST* they have done something? In my opinion it's because there *MUST* be a reason you spent $3,000 on your wheels. Well you did claim to be riding the newest rim shapes on a set of Chinese wheels. If that's the case, then, at the very least, they've copied a shape they don't have a patent for. Shane They have detailed cross sections of every wheel. Go find a patent infringement. |
| 2015-07-31 4:54 PM in reply to: 3mar |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar Originally posted by gsmacleod Originally posted by 3mar I have yet to find a single first hand horror story from Chinese wheels. I searched here, slow twitch and a couple of road bike forums. I have found failure stories on Flo and Zipp however, so even if there is one or two, I doubt there's a brand with zero. I couldn't find anything first hand. Every time this comes up it goes like this: Post: Chinese wheels are made with shoddy craftsmanship, they *MUST* but they just *MUST* because of X Y and Z. Response: Can you point to an example because here are four real people that have the wheels that have 0 issues after 1,000nds of miles? OP: No, but they *MUST*. Well, then they *MUST* have stolen the technology. Response: Can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but the *MUST* and if they didn't then they *MUST* have stolen the molds, they *MUST* have Response: can you point to any specific examples? OP: No, but they *MUST* have done something I don't know what, I have no direct proof or examples, but they *MUST* have done something. Why *MUST* they have done something? In my opinion it's because there *MUST* be a reason you spent $3,000 on your wheels. Well you did claim to be riding the newest rim shapes on a set of Chinese wheels. If that's the case, then, at the very least, they've copied a shape they don't have a patent for. Shane They have detailed cross sections of every wheel. Go find a patent infringement. And what I meant was they have U shaped rims. I'm no expert, but that's what all the others look like to me. The point is that the opposers can't point to anything specific ever. |
| 2015-07-31 4:56 PM in reply to: 3mar |
Champion 9407 Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar They have detailed cross sections of every wheel. Go find a patent infringement. Are you wheels the newer "fat" toroidal design? Shane |
| 2015-07-31 5:00 PM in reply to: 0 |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by gsmacleod Originally posted by 3mar They have detailed cross sections of every wheel. Go find a patent infringement. Are you wheels the newer "fat" toroidal design? Shane No. I read reports that the reason wheels can be unstable in cross winds was due to the large flat surface on side. To me, an 80 toroidal or U shaped design creates a large flat surface because of the elongation of the shape, so I found a design that was sort of a mix between a U and the old wedge shape. Totally unscientific and just went with my gut. Edited by 3mar 2015-07-31 5:00 PM |
| 2015-07-31 5:05 PM in reply to: 3mar |
Champion 9407 Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by 3mar No. I read reports that the reason wheels can be unstable in cross winds was due to the large flat surface on side. To me, an 80 toroidal or U shaped design creates a large flat surface because of the elongation of the shape, so I found a design that was sort of a mix between a U and the old wedge shape. Totally unscientific and just went with my gut. Well then, your wheels are counterfeits - they're just pretty slow. V and U shaped wheels are pretty old technology and there's a reason why Zipp and Hed had mostly cornered the market on aerohwheels as they had the patent on the toroidal design. When it expired you saw others start in with the shape as it is much better than the U and V shapes. While the designed may look similar, there is a reason why toroidal designs will save you 2.5s/km at race speeds. Shane |
| 2015-07-31 5:10 PM in reply to: gsmacleod |
| 1502 Katy, Texas | Subject: RE: Chinese Carbon Wheels - thoughts? Originally posted by gsmacleod Originally posted by 3mar No. I read reports that the reason wheels can be unstable in cross winds was due to the large flat surface on side. To me, an 80 toroidal or U shaped design creates a large flat surface because of the elongation of the shape, so I found a design that was sort of a mix between a U and the old wedge shape. Totally unscientific and just went with my gut. Well then, your wheels are counterfeits - they're just pretty slow. V and U shaped wheels are pretty old technology and there's a reason why Zipp and Hed had mostly cornered the market on aerohwheels as they had the patent on the toroidal design. When it expired you saw others start in with the shape as it is much better than the U and V shapes. While the designed may look similar, there is a reason why toroidal designs will save you 2.5s/km at race speeds. Shane That mus be it. |
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