SBR Utopia Season II - OPEN (Page 114)

In your case, you don't have any sport drinks or gels, but 600mg of sodium/hour in hot weather is roughly 2 bottles of gatorade + 2 gels (to match just the sodium). I thought the recent consensus was that you didn't need to supplement with additional sodium, but the 600mg amount sounds like you would advocate it in hot weather racing.  Or am I reading this incorrectly? 

Back from Miami.  fun race, not sure I'd go do it again, too many other races.  

My nutrition is not as well thought out as Marc's.  I had 600 cals available on the bike in Infinit and carried two gels.  I had my garmin lapping every 5 miles, and tried to take two sips of Infinit between each lap, about 12-13 minutes.  Only took one gel about the 25 mile mark.  Problem was the water bottles didn't fit very well in the BTS cage, and I had to take water after every Infinit sip, causing me to sit up, grab the water, then try furiously to shove it back in the cage while the flimsy plastic bottle just collapsed.  This caused me to drink a little less than I should have as it got frustrating to be out of aero for so long dealing with it (probably 45-60 seconds each time).  Need a new system.  I don't remember dumping the A2 bottle, think my wife did, but I know I did not finish the 600 calories.   So I probably had 650 or so calories on the bike, about 300 an hour

For the run, it was too hot and I knew I wouldn't be able to process a gel very well, or even perform, so I just used water and then started coke about half way through.  Very few calories on the run, but not sure that really affected me..   Maybe it did, but it was sure something to think about as I usually take in much more on the run.   

My infinit is pretty high in sodium, so no salt tabs for me.  One thing I was worried about was dehydration, that happened pretty badly at Canada.  I carried my own hand bottle and wa glad I did, even though my shoulders were sore after the run.   I would fill it up with water and ice every other aid station or so, so always had coolish water.  I also wore arm coolers, despite Jason's warnings that they wouldn't work that well in humidity.  They didn't work as well as they do in the desert, but there was enough of a breeze where if I sprayed them with water, they were OK.  Dumped a lot of water on my head, neck, arms, down the front, and socks wer siaking wet, but thankfully no blisters.  And I had a nice, long, fairly clear pee about 4.5 miles in (TMI, i know) , so I knew dehydration was not an issue

I was pretty hungry after the race.

So, I have decided my goal next season will not be another IM but focus on the HIM and go sub 5.  I've never been a proponent of chasing times and going to races designed to get that time.... until last weekend.  Miami was my 8th HIM and the only flat one I've ever done.  The others - oceanside, pumpkinman (vegas), wildflower, and orangeman - all had significant climbing, which I really like.

I came off the bike actually in contention, i was 15th in my AG.  Then ran myself back to the top 20% or so.   But the bike effort (which was within my zones, so I don't think it negatively affected the run), showed me that I can duke it out up there.   Run was my limiter at Canada, it was my limiter at Miami.  Until I get serious about it, it always will be.  So this winter will be dedicated to it.  I've never run more than 800 or so miles in a year.

Obviously, I pay Shane for his advice so will be listening to it, but also would like the group's input about what kind of volume and training stress I should be looking at and advocating for.   Have a friend or two doing New Orleans in April, similar course to Miami from what I can tell but about 5-10 degrees cooler (and a wetsuit swim), don't know if that is too soon to try sub 5....

yes

When I was 20-30 pounds heavier, every time i'd get over 25 mpw or so I'd get some soft tissue injury, usually calf related.  Lost weight and regular massages seems to have helped in that regard, and I've been [knock on wood] injury free for about a year and a half.  But IM trainng only got up to 30 mpw a couple times.

Yeah they've changed the swim and put it inside a marina now following the almost yearly swim cancellation.  would benefit me as it's WS legal and a little cold, which I like.  As for the PTP nature of the race, the worst part is that the only PTP part is the run, so you finish then have to go back to T1 to collect your bike.  I'll use tri bike transport so that will be a little easier.  But  yeah, there are other issues.  We'll have a car and my wife as a sherpa.

It's not an ideal race, but my training partner is already going, so that's on the plus side

I try to do much like what Bryan does. Keep it simple. I don't know how some people manage 4-5 (or more) different items. Using Picky Bars instead as they've worked better for me, but would like to get back to gels as they're just so darn convenient. I may have some salt available as well, particularly if the race may be hotter.

Do know that not all gels are quite the same. A number do use 100 cal/packet, but PowerGel is 110 and Stinger is 120. Many seem to use 50 mg of sodium, but PowerGel uses 200. So 3/ hr could be a lot. More than I would try for. I have to be careful of flavors as most disagree. Also can not have caffeine. Some say to just get used to it, but these can have a very strong effect on my performance for quite some time after ingesting and I do feel the urge to heave it out. Have slowed down before doing so. It's not the same internal feeling as late in a short race.

Got to see some of the kids club team before masters tonight, finishing with some 100's. One kid was coming in :55-56. I'd still be a full length behind him. Made it look so easy too.

That's what I did 2 years ago at Muskoka.  I swore off sports drinks on the bike at HIM distance because I just couldn't stand the sweetness any longer.  So I moved to just water + gels in a gel flask.  I used GU cause I get a discount (but prefer powergels) and used Roctane for the extra caffeine on race day.  5-6 gels in the flask if I remember right.  I figured if I lost my flask along the way I could just grab gel packets on course and would be fine.  I also trained this way on a number of rides, and don't recall ever having any issues.

Called Garmin this morning and they confirmed my 910 is pooched.  Looks like both the altimeter and the accelerometer for swimming are both toast (although they coulnd't confirm the accelerometer part).  I'm within warranty so I need to send the unit to Quebec for an exchange.  I'm guessing this will be a refurb, but don't know for sure.

I almost do this.  Normally I'll start w/ 2 bottles of perpetuem on my bike (has sodium) and pick water or perform depending how I feel.  I have a small gel flask in my run bag, but everything else I use is off the course. 

IM Western Australia I went 100% off the course, but I was drinking their Gatorade on the bike because it was so hot out.  I've never used water + gel alone, but sometimes I alternate water with sports drink.

As for the gels, not all are the same, make sure you know how much sodium intake you're getting from them.  It might be zero.  And if you live off the course sooner or later you'll get a nasty one.  I flew by a bike aid station in Australia and tried to slam down one of their gels.  Yeaaaaa it was some kind of thick espresso thing.  In 105 degree weather.  Yech.

I've seen Bry make negative comments about sports drinks in several threads.  I'm sure he has valid reasons for personally not using them, but I don't quite understand that because if you're simply using gels with water, in the end isn't it all the same?  You need the water to dilute the gel so the end result is fairly similar to a sports drink isn't it?  Need to think about that some more and maybe I'll chat with him about it at the ST get together at IM AZ next month.  Looking forward to finally meeting him after all these years.

I don't have any issues with HIM nutrition strategies, and I pretty much rely only on sports drink (Gatorade or Perform).  But for those that have been around BT for a while you are probably well aware of my troubles with stomach shutdown issues during IM.  It has been one of the most frustrating things to deal with in my 35 year endurance sports career.  10 IM starts and 4 DNFs due to stomach issues.  At last year's IM M-T I was pulled off the course by the med staff with a measly 7+ miles to go on the run.  I might have been able to convince them to let me continue if I signed a waiver...and I actually signed a waiver at the med tent 2 miles previous to that!!!...but I knew that continuing would have been potentially unsafe (puking a ton and couldn't keep anything down).

For several years I was very casual about my approach to IM race nutrition.  Last year (after the 3rd DNF - IM Canada) I paid QT2 Systems to put together a race nutrition plan for me, which included the couple of days prior to the race.  They had me do a sweat test and based my race plan around that.  I practiced the plan a few times before the race but never had a chance to do a BIG training day to see if I could get by with it in an IM.  Anyway, I still ended up puking on the second run lap at M-T but I finished.  So, I used the same plan this year at M-T and ran into stomach issues a couple of miles into the second loop on the run.  I realize this problem can be a compound issue involving overcooking the bike and/or nutrition issues.  I really don't think I have ever over-cooked an IM bike, although I haven't raced with power to objectively analyze that.  I am fairly confident that I've done a poor job of keeping up on hydration and being a heavy sweater that is a recipe for disaster.  So, the experiment continues.  Jorge has recommended using boiled potatoes as part of an alternative to "synthetic" race nutrition and I may experiment with that in the next couple of weeks. 

Wow, sorry, I've gotten a little off-topic....anyway...QT2 developed a plan that involved using Perform, PowerGels, Power Bars, Clif Bloks, and S-caps.  Yes, my Dark Speed Works bento box and Fuel Belt pouches were jam packed prior to the race.  Clearly, that type of plan is at one extreme of the spectrum.  Its a PITA to keep track of the timing of when to take all of these products.  By next year Jorge and I will figure out an effective IM race nutrition strategy.  I know by the end of the bike all the sweet tastes is a real turnoff.  Having a strategy based on water, Powergels ( I like them a lot), real food and S-caps is something I want to develop.  I can tolerate GU but I don't like the paste-like consistency.

Thanks for the info, I am a little concerned about NO, but part of the "deal," as it were, would be to sell the race to my wife for a weekend destination.   No offense to Galveston, but NO holds the edge in that competition. 

I am also thinking about making some kind of change.  Administratively dealing with just water would be a huge benefit.  For me, 3 gels/hour would be fine, that's actually a little under what I shoot for with Infinit when you add 1 or 2 gels.  I'd likely have to supplement with salt pills if it were hot.  I hate the hammer gels, everything else seems to work fine for me.

Interesting thoughts here.  I found in Miami that I ddin't need that many calories to do OK, just needs some refinement.

And Shane and I are putting together a plan for a run focus this winter, so looking forward to seeing some improvements there.