BT Development Mentor Program Archives » Fred D Mentor Group Part III Rss Feed  
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2012-10-08 6:21 AM
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2012-10-08 7:36 AM
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Payson, AZ
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Another running question.  Does anyone really worry about their running cadence or do you just let it settle into whatever it is?  I do not think I have very good running form, I feel the way I run slows me down.  I attribute that to the fact that to most of my early running was marathon training and I was taught to conserve energy by not lifting my feet much, basically leading to the marathon shuffle.  I went to a running clinic a while ago and think I have a better handle on how I should be running but still having trouble applying it.  But there was never any mention of cadence that I recall.  There were some warmup drills that were suppose to help that I of course never do.  Guess I should correct that and start doing them.  For some reason I never want to take the time to do them, I just want to go run
2012-10-08 7:53 AM
in reply to: #4444713

Master
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Re Cadence: I never did until a coach stressed that I should keep it high and even do drills.  I'm not fast compared to some but it did help me get faster.  She wanted me at 96 which I could never really achieve.  I even got a footpod to track it and see how it fell off as I got tired.  I was able to have it up around 90 when I was focused on it more.  Interesting you bring it up because just a week or two ago I put the foot pod back on and started tracking it again.  It does make a difference.  The few guys I run with in groups sometimes who can run <3 marathons all have fast cadences and nice form and said in college they did a lot of drills and running form work.  They said it is something they notice a lot of people with non-running backgrounds don't take the time to do but they should...take that for what it's worth...not really scientific but maybe Shane has something in his back pocket to back it up with science....I've seen stuff here and there out there.

 

Good posts from everyone.  Catching up.  Congrats to those getting stuff done out there!  Really like that 5k story too and have had the same thing happen to me as you (why bother showing up to race, I suck right now kind of feeling).  I should just enjoy it all and the races I've been able to do where that was the case, I did have the most fun.

Fred, I agree with Baldwin.  I was reading his blog too.  It's cool to wonder 'what if' sometimes, but I have my own life and it isn't 100% triathlon focused.  I train to keep in shape and complement the rest of my life.  Through the year different levels of obsessiveness creep in and out about it all...but that's normal for us AGers trying to achieve decent results I think on limited time and resources.

 

Wow, if you don't read this for awhile, you fall way behind in a hurry!  



Edited by acumenjay 2012-10-08 7:56 AM
2012-10-08 8:32 AM
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2012-10-08 8:46 AM
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Elite
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Ontario
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Sally - really great race result considering you were doubting your run abilities before the race.

Melissa - nice job getting through the fever, etc. and getting the race done.

Fred - sounds pretty extreme for throwing a chain.  Do you know how you managed to do that much damage?

Run cadence - I've read about people wanting to keep their cadence high, but never really looked at it and just let my natural cadence dictate how fast my turnover was.  I'll be interested to see if anyone else has thoughts in addition to Jason's.

As for me, I'm recovering from over indulgence and glutony that seems to go hand in hand with Thanksgiving.

2012-10-08 10:28 AM
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Champion
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Run cadence -- I think it is best to let your body self-select, but I also think that many of us benefit from doing some drills, and these will help guide us to a good choice.  I always feel that drills (even a very small amount) help me.  I probably don't do them frequently enough.

I ended up having a family day yesterday, with no training, which was much needed and much enjoyed.  So I'll make up my long run today (probably in the cold rain, ugh).



2012-10-08 10:41 AM
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Elite
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

I woke up today with a sinus cold - I could feel it coming on yesterday.  It made for a very runny nose during my run this morning (TMI?)....

I've never paid much attention to my run cadence but just for fun I counted a couple of times during my run today - it was right on 180 steps for 60 seconds.

Sally and Melissa, great results in your runs!

2012-10-08 10:48 AM
in reply to: #4444673

Elite
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PEI, Canada
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Fred D - 2012-10-08 8:21 AM Sort of a rest day for me. I have a 2 mile run on today and that's really it, as the last few days were pretty high volume. Somehow I got more SBR hours in last week than I did for the vast majority of my IM training this year, but work will not let that happen again for me this week.

Funny you should mention that your SBR was higher than IM training.  My total volume certainly wasn't but I ran 42 km last week spread over 6 runs and that is more than most weeks during IM training for me.  I think that was a major flaw in the training I did - not enough run frequency.  

2012-10-08 11:57 AM
in reply to: #4444670

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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Fred D - 2012-10-08 5:15 AM
mndymond - 2012-10-07 9:27 PM
marcag - 2012-10-07 8:39 AM

mndymond - 2012-10-07 8:15 AM Ready to go race! Ive been really achy and have been having fevers overnight but I'm going to get out there and see what I can do anyways. Yay acetaminophen!

 

Cooooooool

At my coaching clinic, during the 'ethical questions' discussion, there was a debate on whether a coach should let an athlete with a fever race. People were going on and one about how "NO" was the answer. I remember thinking to myself "what would a triathlete doctor do". Not a triathlete, not a doctor, a triathlete doctor.

Now I know !!

You docs need to not speak code and just say Tylenol. I googled acetamiblabla and Midol came out.

Lol. Oh midol. Haha. I don't know how I feel about racing with a fever. I mean I did it and I didn't totally die...but I wasn't in good shape after that is for sure. I would probably tell a patient it wasn't a good decision and my doc would prob say not a good decision....but I did it. Haha. Im hurting again now
. What you are learning (and others watching this) is that doctors are not very good patients....(ever). Lol
Ya. Docs are the worst. Athletes are bad patients as well though...so some of us are double combos. Haha.
2012-10-08 12:10 PM
in reply to: #4444168

Master
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...at home in The ATL
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Sally that really IS a great story - and congratulations to both you and Melissa on your performances this weekend! With tri season winding down for most of us it really helps to hear good results from those still racing. 

2012-10-08 12:24 PM
in reply to: #4444673

Master
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...at home in The ATL
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Fred D - 2012-10-08 7:21 AM Sort of a rest day for me. I have a 2 mile run on today and that's really it, as the last few days were pretty high volume. Somehow I got more SBR hours in last week than I did for the vast majority of my IM training this year, but work will not let that happen again for me this week. I was reading the blog of Nick Baldwin (Sessel) on ST the other day. He has been in Kona for weeks acclimatizing to the weather and training. Prior to that he was in the USA racing and training for 3 months. My guess is that we could all do better (maybe not as well as him, but better) in triathlon if we had minimal work and family commitments, but there aren't a lot of folks who can live Sessel's life and a good friend of mine reminded me that he wouldn't trade his situation for another as he has (and so do I) a great life. Just always interesting for me to think what I could do without all the sleep disruptive on call stuff. Human nature to speculate I guess.

Times about a million on the "great life" part. The way I figure it anybody that has figured out how to carve out enough time for this little SBR thing, has a relatively good life compared to many. I am about 9 weeks away from unplugging from work for 8 months and focusing on SBR, sort of a once in a lifetime opportunity for me. Getting through the block of work to get there is about to wear me out though. Way too much travel and long hours starting to make me wonder if it is worth it. I am only just coming to grips with the fact that it has me in base-level maintenance mode relative to training til December. I am just hoping I haven't put on 25 pounds by then... 

And I still owe the group a bio - hope I can find a real keyboard before the group hits 50 pages, which by my estimation should be Thursday around 3pm... Laughing



2012-10-08 12:47 PM
in reply to: #4444673

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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Fred D - 2012-10-08 5:21 AMSort of a rest day for me. I have a 2 mile run on today and that's really it, as the last few days were pretty high volume. Somehow I got more SBR hours in last week than I did for the vast majority of my IM training this year, but work will not let that happen again for me this week. I was reading the blog of Nick Baldwin (Sessel) on ST the other day. He has been in Kona for weeks acclimatizing to the weather and training. Prior to that he was in the USA racing and training for 3 months. My guess is that we could all do better (maybe not as well as him, but better) in triathlon if we had minimal work and family commitments, but there aren't a lot of folks who can live Sessel's life and a good friend of mine reminded me that he wouldn't trade his situation for another as he has (and so do I) a great life. Just always interesting for me to think what I could do without all the sleep disruptive on call stuff. Human nature to speculate I guess.
I'm living my "pro triathlete" lifestyle from April-June next year. It's likely the last opportunity I will have to bum around and train (have a few exams but no call or anything). I think it's def human nature to speculate. Third year took a huge hit on my training time and energy and I noticed a huge difference in my results from the minimal racing I was able to do this year compared to last. Just one of those things I suppose, have to do the best we can in light of the life commitments we have.
2012-10-08 2:43 PM
in reply to: #4445259

Extreme Veteran
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Northampton, UK
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Back from my week off and haven't had a chance to catch up on everything yet, but I think I noticed a couple of people had some races so I'll do a blanket congrats now and try and be more personal as soon as I get a chance!

Quick couple of questions.

Since the weather is now turning miserable again here I'm moving my cycling to the rollers and I was wondering what sort of sessions I should do. I think I'll be doing a 2x20' for one of the sessions, but can't decide what to do for the other 2.

The other question is about running. When I don't run for a few days (some times a little as 3 days) I find that the next time I run my shins get really sore, but am back to normal the very next day. Any idea what might be causing this? Is the time off doing something to my running form that takes a run to get back in order?

2012-10-08 4:18 PM
in reply to: #4444713

Champion
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Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
bzgl40 - 2012-10-08 9:36 AM

Another running question.  Does anyone really worry about their running cadence or do you just let it settle into whatever it is?


Do you know what your cadence is currently? While there isn't a magic cadence, generally anyone with a cadence under 80 would be well served by some strides or fast repeats (Daniels R pace) with a goal of increasing turnover. Similar to cycling, it seems that most athletes will self select the most efficient cadence but they need to spend time at a variety of cadences.

Normally cadence comes up with faster paces but doing some strides or fast repeats with a specific goal of raising cadence can be beneficial at all paces.

Shane
2012-10-08 4:30 PM
in reply to: #4445158

Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
mndymond - 2012-10-09 12:57 AM
Fred D - 2012-10-08 5:15 AM
mndymond - 2012-10-07 9:27 PM
marcag - 2012-10-07 8:39 AM

mndymond - 2012-10-07 8:15 AM Ready to go race! Ive been really achy and have been having fevers overnight but I'm going to get out there and see what I can do anyways. Yay acetaminophen!

 

Cooooooool

At my coaching clinic, during the 'ethical questions' discussion, there was a debate on whether a coach should let an athlete with a fever race. People were going on and one about how "NO" was the answer. I remember thinking to myself "what would a triathlete doctor do". Not a triathlete, not a doctor, a triathlete doctor.

Now I know !!

You docs need to not speak code and just say Tylenol. I googled acetamiblabla and Midol came out.

Lol. Oh midol. Haha. I don't know how I feel about racing with a fever. I mean I did it and I didn't totally die...but I wasn't in good shape after that is for sure. I would probably tell a patient it wasn't a good decision and my doc would prob say not a good decision....but I did it. Haha. Im hurting again now
. What you are learning (and others watching this) is that doctors are not very good patients....(ever). Lol
Ya. Docs are the worst. Athletes are bad patients as well though...so some of us are double combos. Haha.

Hm ... athlete and former ACLS/PALS instructor here ... my current housemate (Jim, an old friend from LA) had to drag me by the scruff of the neck to the ER in the wee hours over my protests that I was FINE since I could still walk and talk (barely). I developed sharp stabbing pains in my abdomen with concomitant headache and pouring cold sweats.

Well, I'm not having a heart attack. It's probably not food poisoning. Ultrasound in a few hours (5:30am here). Pain relief worked well so at least I'm comfortable-ish. I'll keep you posted.

So sad. I just started working out again today, too.

2012-10-08 4:44 PM
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2012-10-08 4:50 PM
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2012-10-08 4:50 PM
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Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Fred D - 2012-10-09 5:44 AM Sorry Yanti

Thanks, Fred. Pooh indeed! My wild-azz guess on this is that the clindamycin and tons of scrip NSAIDs from after the complicated molar extraction may have created a raw spot or even little hole in my gut somewhere. Ouch. Headache could be referred pain and cold sweat from the pain too.

We'll see. Ultrasound first, scope next if necessary. Dang they have fast WIFI here, though.

2012-10-08 4:53 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Room for one more?
2012-10-08 4:55 PM
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2012-10-08 4:56 PM
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2012-10-08 4:56 PM
in reply to: #4445613

Payson, AZ
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

gsmacleod - 2012-10-08 2:18 PM
bzgl40 - 2012-10-08 9:36 AM Another running question.  Does anyone really worry about their running cadence or do you just let it settle into whatever it is?
Do you know what your cadence is currently? While there isn't a magic cadence, generally anyone with a cadence under 80 would be well served by some strides or fast repeats (Daniels R pace) with a goal of increasing turnover. Similar to cycling, it seems that most athletes will self select the most efficient cadence but they need to spend time at a variety of cadences. Normally cadence comes up with faster paces but doing some strides or fast repeats with a specific goal of raising cadence can be beneficial at all paces. Shane

After I posted the question I ran today with the cadence sensor and it was 91, which surpised me, and that was a slower run.  I hadn't used it in a while but it had been right at about 80.  Big difference though in my running is that 3x's a week I have been doing some short quick intervals, and have really been concentrating on form.  I think doing some of my intervals uphill have been helping with the form as well.  I'll have to see what kind of numbers I get on my medium run

2012-10-08 4:58 PM
in reply to: #4445652

Payson, AZ
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
TriAya - 2012-10-08 2:50 PM

Fred D - 2012-10-09 5:44 AM Sorry Yanti

Thanks, Fred. Pooh indeed! My wild-azz guess on this is that the clindamycin and tons of scrip NSAIDs from after the complicated molar extraction may have created a raw spot or even little hole in my gut somewhere. Ouch. Headache could be referred pain and cold sweat from the pain too.

We'll see. Ultrasound first, scope next if necessary. Dang they have fast WIFI here, though.

Hey, if you are suffering might as well do it with fast internet.  Sure hope it is something with a quick easy fix, but knowing you ...    Sending positive vibes

2012-10-08 5:04 PM
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2012-10-08 5:09 PM
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Champion
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
bzgl40 - 2012-10-08 6:56 PM

I think doing some of my intervals uphill have been helping with the form as well.


Running fast uphill (and downhill) will often help with turnover as a lower cadence will not feel as fast or powerful while climbing.

I'd say that you are on the right track, keep doing what you're doing and see what happens with the cadence (likely will come up in the easy runs if they've normally be around 80.

Shane
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