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2012-05-17 5:14 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Oh big hugs to you and your mom!!!  

She's a bit out of my practice area (pediatrics) but I would agree with it being likely infectious with a CNS component.  I don't know much about typhoid and dengue (though my BFF diagnosed dengue in residency- in Rochester NY!).  Did they test for influenza, and is that prevalence now where you are?  Influenza can present with encephalitis, and with a diffuse viral pneumonia.  Not much to do besides supportive care (unless you count tamiflu, which is marginally helpful, and I'm guessing not available there).

I hope she is feeling better soon!

 



2012-05-17 6:23 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
momandmd - 2012-05-17 4:14 PM

Oh big hugs to you and your mom!!!  

She's a bit out of my practice area (pediatrics) but I would agree with it being likely infectious with a CNS component.  I don't know much about typhoid and dengue (though my BFF diagnosed dengue in residency- in Rochester NY!).  Did they test for influenza, and is that prevalence now where you are?  Influenza can present with encephalitis, and with a diffuse viral pneumonia.  Not much to do besides supportive care (unless you count tamiflu, which is marginally helpful, and I'm guessing not available there).

I hope she is feeling better soon!

 

Agree with the bold above.

Thoughts your way, hope your mom gets better :-)

2012-05-17 7:40 PM
in reply to: #4215024

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Master
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
I have nothing to add as this is way out of my specialty area but I think you have gotten some really good advice. I agree that they have probably not done a spinal tap because your mom is on coumadin--smart doctors. Even though I have nothing medically to add my well wishes are being sent your way. I hope you figure this all out and have your mom back healthy asap.
2012-05-17 10:39 PM
in reply to: #4215024

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Elite
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Goodness I wish I were a doctor or had some kind of medical experience, alas I have none.  BUt I do have the power of positive thinking and prayer and I send both to you and your family.

Keep well keep safe Yanti.xxxxx

2012-05-17 11:02 PM
in reply to: #4215024

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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
I don't know enough to make an educated comment on this thread. But, hugs to and prayers for you and Mama Yanti. I'll be thinking about you guys this weekend.
2012-05-18 2:58 AM
in reply to: #4215024

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Champion
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

I absolutely wish that I could help with either medical knowledge or a magic wand that I could swoosh around in a fancy way to make you all healthy - but alas, I have no such wand (but it would be SO cool if I did!) and I'm not one that has any medical knowledge whatsoever (though I'm pretty sure I could play a doctor on tv... I'm pretty good with multi-syllabic words) so, in lieu of anything concretely helpful... thoughts, good vibes and hugs being sent to you and your Mutti!

 



2012-05-18 12:54 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
No expertise here either, but the impact of you being there, in person, for support for your mom and as an advocate with the staff, cannot be overestimated.  Just wanted to join the chorus of well-wishing from across the globe.
2012-05-18 1:11 PM
in reply to: #4215024

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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
Any update Yanti? No medical knowlege but lots of prayers from my friends and family to offer!
2012-05-18 2:12 PM
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Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

I deeply appreciate all your kind words, thoughts, and prayers. We need them.

Come to Jakarta to find that no one in the hospital has been taking care of my mom the last three days. They're not regularly checking her temperature and vital signs; they're not trying to control her fever; they're not paying attention to her pain; nearly 90% of the tests, procedures, care and medication they claimed to have given her never actually happened.

Spend the afternoon there taking care of my mom MYSELF--I found her with her limbs tied to the bed with strips of a ripped-up bedsheet, and with a fever between 104 and 105, she's bundled up in socks, gowns, sheets and blankets. No one has noticed that her IV is pouring solution into her skin, creating a big painful bruised bubble. Finally I just start ordering tests, ordering doctors, ordering medications, ordering routine care. Every decision takes hours to implement.

When her fever was spiking again tonight, and she was extremely agitated, in severe pain and her limb muscles all deeply cramping, and she was continually yelling and grimacing as loud as a sick old lady can ... which I personally consider an emergency situation (as an elderly person with dementia is going to rip her IV lines, catheter, oxygen mask etc. off), it took over two and a half hours for a physician to see her and administer medication. And no, the nurses were not going to do a single thing in the meanwhile--if it isn't on a doctor's order, they will not do anything. Not check the lines, not check her vitals, not try to calm or restrain her--not a damned thing.

Also, the physician was going to give her pills (wow--you really think she can swallow?), and the painkiller was going to be an NSAID ... which is highly contraindicated when the #1 suspects are among the tropical hemorrhagic fevers.

So I will try to get her med-evac'ed to Singapore first thing in the morning. Unfortunately my father and I disagree about this, and I'm not sure how I'll be able to get around that.

I really wish I had better news. I'm disheartened and struggling, especially as I am fairly ill myself right now, but all the more reason to go to Singapore and seek treatment for myself as well.

Again ... thank you so much for your help, your thoughts, your advice, and simply for letting me rant.

2012-05-18 2:22 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Oh, Yanti, my thoughts are with your mom and you.  I would not tolerate that level of care for my mom either - you're doing the right thing getting her out of there.  Her hands tied down would have been the last straw for me as well.  Wish I could be a physical help, but for now I will just say prayers for you guys.

{hugs}

2012-05-18 5:15 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Yanti, You gotta stay strong and level-headed in the face of utter chaos.  You are your mothers  advocate and you will do what needs to be done to get her through this. 

All the good kharma, vibes and prayers I can muster heading your way. 



2012-05-18 5:28 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
Prayers for your mom, Yanti!
2012-05-18 5:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
Wow, I am incredibly sorry to hear about your mother and the lack of care she is receiving. Put a boot up their arse and make them do their jobs!!! Oh and get her to Singapore where she can get proper medical care instead of the poor job she is getting now.
2012-05-18 9:07 PM
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Master
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
OMG, Yanti. Get her out.....anything short of tying up your dad...whatever it takes! It's awful that the hospital is dropping the ball like that. Honestly in the US (in "rehab" homes) it isn't always a whole lot better--had some bad situations there with my dad last winter. My thoughts and prayers are with both you and your mom. The Singaporeans know how to do stuff properly and hopefully both of you will be on the way to recovery soon.
2012-05-19 2:17 AM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Stay strong Yanti - you're an angel for your mom, but please also look after yourself at the same time.

Great idea to get to Singapore so you can both be treated.  Would Perth or Darwin also be an option?

My thoughts are with you.

N xx

2012-05-19 12:23 PM
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Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

The good news is: well, what I had to say in the last update WAS the good news.

Then it got bad.

And compared to how it is now, the "got bad" would be good news.

This is some kind of nightmare, and I can't even imagine how it is for my mom. I am really, really scared for her.

I'm in terrible shape. I am shaking and have fever and chills again. I will not physically be able to hang on much longer, although of course I will since there is no other choice.

And emotionally ... well, I've been worse.

My brother and I have been in the process all day of trying to get her transferred to intensive care at another (acceptable) facility or medevac'ed to Singapore (we would have to charter a private jet and pay out of pocket for all the transfers and attending medical team. That's the same cost anywhere in the world, so you can imagine it's staggering. We'd do it, but truly only if there were no other local option possible ... local possibly meaning 4-5 hours in Jakarta traffic. But still.)

In the meanwhile, we continued begging and arguing with her physician here to run some more diagnostics and please, at least treat her symptoms, please, maybe just Tylenol for the fever? That she's been spiking into 104 and 105F? Can we move her into ICU so we can maybe get some sleep? A good part of the day was spent doing this.

We debated for nearly an hour to repeat the typhoid test (since they don't show up positive until a few days into the illness), and he was consistently spewing completely incorrect facts and diagnostics about typhoid (and this argument was about ONE TEST and ONE ASPECT of her care ... we argued about many others as well ... no, moron, YET AGAIN because we had this argument yesterday, you do not give NSAIDS to someone who may very well have a hemorrhagic fever ... no, moron, Ultram is NOT contraindicated for elderly people with Alzheimers, but Haldol sure is, which you prescribed ... which is an antipsychotic that takes time to build up anyway. ???)

... after all that, he still refused to order one simple little blood test for typhoid, because it would be IMPOSSIBLE for her to have typhoid. And even if she did, it would be IMPOSSIBLE for it to show up on a test. The test doesn't work that way. (Yes, it does, you moron). I had him tell me to my face that my own experience and results with typhoid were IMPOSSIBLE (no. They're not even unusual).

So we spoke to his superior. He took the same line, but after another half-hour of arguing with him, too, finally my brother and I literally stood on either side of him and bullied him into signing the order. He was sure PO'ed, but not as PO'ed as us, and we got a pyrrhic victory in that peeing contest ...

The results came back. IT'S TYPHOID FEVER. Of course, now it's the middle of the night, so he can't be contacted (doesn't work that way here), but in any case, we WILL get her moved to a facility with a higher level of care, ASAP. In the meanwhile, I and one of our household help have been providing direct nursing care for my mother today. Good thing, too, because she's been vomiting. The nurses only check in on her every 6 hours (because those were the doctor's orders) and if we weren't here, she might very well just aspirate her own puke and die.

So that's where we're at. We finally have a hospital that may be suitable for her to be transferred to, and are waiting for the attending physician on that end to call me back. It's an extreme lot of loopholes we're asking of the other hospital to get through, since usually transfers have to be made on the recommendation and direction of the current facility's attending physician. We're breaking an enormous number of laws here and asking them to, and asking them to assume some significant liability ... the only reason it's possible is that we happen to be close friends with the hospital's owner. (My mother was not initially taken there because it's all the way across town, as in, yes, a 4-5 hour drive on a weekday).

Progress, of a kind.



Edited by TriAya 2012-05-19 12:53 PM


2012-05-19 12:56 PM
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Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

ETA: That hospital's ICU is full, and there's no alternative, so we are taking her home and will care for her there, and we are scrounging up the medications we need on our own. We have IV lines, sets, and poles at home, and thank God I know how to use them. See Dad ... not all that money you spent on my scientific and medical training went to waste. When she's a little more stable we can take her to our usual ER/clinic for continuing blood work.

It's a crappy option, but it's the best one we've got.

2012-05-19 4:11 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

I don't know what to say Yanti.  I am lost for words. 

The incompetence of some people is mind-blowing.

More prayers and thoughts are heading your way.  Hang in there, and don't forget about you.

2012-05-19 5:17 PM
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Master
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Yanti, my dear, all I have to say is that I am awed by your mental and physical fortitude, your plenitude, nay, excess, of moral courage, and your downright astounding ability of cussednessly getting the job done;  not to mention your brilliant mind and to-die-for body.  

 

I salute you.   Oo Rah!

 

Courage, and play your cards.

2012-05-19 5:29 PM
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Oh sweetheart I am so sorry to hear you were having to continually deal with incompetent doctors.  I am sure she is much happier to be home with you, even though it is not the ideal option for you right now, but hopefully things will improve and you will be able to get her somewhere you feel comfortable with.  

My heart and thoughts are still with you all, and I know you are thinking of your mom, but please remember to also take care of yourself!  

2012-05-19 5:43 PM
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Master
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
Speechless again, Yanti.  Know that prayers are coming at you and your family from all corners of the world.  Hook yourself up to some IV fluids if you need to as well. 


2012-05-19 6:06 PM
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Royal(PITA)
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.
Yanti, I am sick reading this.  Praying for all of you.
2012-05-19 6:30 PM
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Master
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Verga and Vergette prayers are with you, your family, and the doctors.

Don't ever wonder why you are my heroine again

2012-05-19 6:59 PM
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Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

All I can do is express my tremendous gratitude for your prayers and kind words.

I will say that I've encountered some pretty horrendous medical professionals and situations here, and even the best private medical care here is mediocre, but this is truly anomalous (obviously, or we would have never taken her to this facility in the first place).

I'll post more when I can. Funny, too, in the few hours between when this decision was made and now (we'll be bringing her home as soon as the troops--literally, I guess, they are freshly former Special Forces --get here to help us, in an hour or so) my mother has markedly improved. She may be deaf and have Alzheimer's but she's very sensitive to people's body language and such, and I have a feeling she suffered from the intense tension in the air and the incessant harsh words between the physicians and ourselves.

I am sure on a subconscious level she's picked up the vibe that she's going home.

2012-05-19 7:04 PM
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Master
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Somewhere on the Tennessee River
Subject: RE: Have any medical knowledge? PLEASE help if you can.

Sweety, you are going to laugh at me, but this has been some of your finest hours; some of your finest days.  Hang in  there, no one ever said life is easy; if they did, then they lied.  Your true character is showing.

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