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2012-08-09 10:51 AM
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Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 8:56 PM So I have been able to have good Strategy meetings with both my coach and doc this week to discuss recovery strategy going forward for the knee. Based on their feedback I am going to call this tri season done and begin focusing on core, strength, and proprioception development. Strength should especially target glutes and hips for both power and endurance. The doc wants me to commit to daily myofascial release - nothing major, just 5~10 minutes per day. Will keep cycling and swimming and ease back into "recreational" type running, but my emphasis should be primarily on strength. School starts back up in a few more days, so I am going to stay fairly unstructured for a couple of more weeks before I begin my real strength acclimatization block. They both thought it would be good to have some targets that would be fun and liked that I was really interested in focusing on my longer distance road cycling so long as it is structured as to not impact the strength block too much. My coach seemed a little disappointed that I might be backing away from the 10 Gap ride.

Based on my natural running mechanics, my doc also suggested I try out Newtons as I ease back in to running. I found this kinda interesting, because he is actually reasonably well known for talking folks out of them. My legs are still pretty beat up from my ride earlier this week, but in a couple of days I will go to the local running store and give them a whirl. Until then I am just spending as much time in my magic squeezy pants - I know Melissa understands...

Oh. And I switched my Olympic entry this weekend to the aquabike category, but depending on how the legs are feeling I may just go and cheerlead.

Sounds like a good game plan. I'm more impressed by that you have the prescience and maturity to actually follow it (I wouldn't, I'm an idiot about doing the wise thing regarding rehab/recovery).



2012-08-09 10:53 AM
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Melon Presser
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
GoFaster - 2012-08-09 11:39 PM
juniperjen - 2012-08-09 9:25 AM

The best news from my end though (not tri-related) is that my mom finished chemotherapy on Tuesday.  Time for her to get back to being herself and building back up her strength.  It's really a relief that we got through everything and this chapter is closing.  I'll definitely be dedicating my race to her.  Well, her and my uncle Chris who has Parkinsons.

Great news Jen. 

As for your race - this has been building for a long time, and you've put a significant part of your life into preparing for this.  I think you're nerves are completely normal at this point, as they would be with any other big life event.

x2. I'm really happy for you, and the race will be a celebration in many ways.

2012-08-09 11:14 AM
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2012-08-09 11:16 AM
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2012-08-09 11:17 AM
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2012-08-09 11:22 AM
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2012-08-09 11:26 AM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
Fred D - 2012-08-09 12:17 PM
GoFaster - 2012-08-09 11:48 AM
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 11:25 AM

Fred D - 2012-08-09 10:41 AM Ok I have a good nutrition plan for the bike. Basically I will be drinking a bottle of perform every hour and 1 honey stinger waffle per hour or so, that will be over 300cal/hr. run I don't have a concrete plan yet. Was just going to go with perform and whatever gel they have on course trying more for 100-150 cal/hr as I don't digest that well on the run. Anyone have any thoughts? And yes I know I should have a better run nutrition plan but wasn't really sure I was doing this race until late. Thoughts?

Nutrition is highly personalized  of course - but that seems like a lot of calories on the bike. If that is what has been working on your long bricks then stick with it for sure though. To minimize GI issues on the run I have found that sticking to water only for hydration and gels for calories to do the trick for me - no sports drink at all.

I won't comment on the calories piece, but will add to Rusty's comment about water for hydration.  Most of my failed races have been the result of suffering with side stitches during the run (but they start on the bike).  I moved to the idea of just water this year to see what the impact would be, and have had success with it.  For long rides I've been using gels in a flask and waffles for the calories, but have also carried one bottle of gatorade for occasional sips just to break the monotony of water for a 3-4hr ride.  I usually have 1/2 a bottle left by the time I'm done.

. Good thoughts. I will consider water on the run, but I really am going to make it up as I go to a degree. What seems appeal.ing to eat on the ruins what's will eat.

Exactly what I did this year at IMLP with zero complaints.

2012-08-09 11:28 AM
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2012-08-09 11:30 AM
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Edited by Fred D 2012-08-09 11:30 AM
2012-08-09 11:44 AM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 1:26 PM
Fred D - 2012-08-09 12:17 PM
GoFaster - 2012-08-09 11:48 AM
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 11:25 AM

Fred D - 2012-08-09 10:41 AM Ok I have a good nutrition plan for the bike. Basically I will be drinking a bottle of perform every hour and 1 honey stinger waffle per hour or so, that will be over 300cal/hr. run I don't have a concrete plan yet. Was just going to go with perform and whatever gel they have on course trying more for 100-150 cal/hr as I don't digest that well on the run. Anyone have any thoughts? And yes I know I should have a better run nutrition plan but wasn't really sure I was doing this race until late. Thoughts?

Nutrition is highly personalized  of course - but that seems like a lot of calories on the bike. If that is what has been working on your long bricks then stick with it for sure though. To minimize GI issues on the run I have found that sticking to water only for hydration and gels for calories to do the trick for me - no sports drink at all.

I won't comment on the calories piece, but will add to Rusty's comment about water for hydration.  Most of my failed races have been the result of suffering with side stitches during the run (but they start on the bike).  I moved to the idea of just water this year to see what the impact would be, and have had success with it.  For long rides I've been using gels in a flask and waffles for the calories, but have also carried one bottle of gatorade for occasional sips just to break the monotony of water for a 3-4hr ride.  I usually have 1/2 a bottle left by the time I'm done.

. Good thoughts. I will consider water on the run, but I really am going to make it up as I go to a degree. What seems appeal.ing to eat on the ruins what's will eat.

Exactly what I did this year at IMLP with zero complaints.

I will be absolutely making it up as I go on the run.  I'm probably jinxing myself but to date, there is no food, solid or liquid that I have consumed while training that has caused me any grief.  Most of my training has been with honey stinger stuff - gels, waffles and chews so I should be good there.  Only thing I've never tried is flat coke....

2012-08-09 11:47 AM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
Fred D - 2012-08-09 1:30 PM
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 12:26 PM
Fred D - 2012-08-09 12:17 PM
GoFaster - 2012-08-09 11:48 AM
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 11:25 AM

Fred D - 2012-08-09 10:41 AM Ok I have a good nutrition plan for the bike. Basically I will be drinking a bottle of perform every hour and 1 honey stinger waffle per hour or so, that will be over 300cal/hr. run I don't have a concrete plan yet. Was just going to go with perform and whatever gel they have on course trying more for 100-150 cal/hr as I don't digest that well on the run. Anyone have any thoughts? And yes I know I should have a better run nutrition plan but wasn't really sure I was doing this race until late. Thoughts?

Nutrition is highly personalized  of course - but that seems like a lot of calories on the bike. If that is what has been working on your long bricks then stick with it for sure though. To minimize GI issues on the run I have found that sticking to water only for hydration and gels for calories to do the trick for me - no sports drink at all.

I won't comment on the calories piece, but will add to Rusty's comment about water for hydration.  Most of my failed races have been the result of suffering with side stitches during the run (but they start on the bike).  I moved to the idea of just water this year to see what the impact would be, and have had success with it.  For long rides I've been using gels in a flask and waffles for the calories, but have also carried one bottle of gatorade for occasional sips just to break the monotony of water for a 3-4hr ride.  I usually have 1/2 a bottle left by the time I'm done.

. Good thoughts. I will consider water on the run, but I really am going to make it up as I go to a degree. What seems appeal.ing to eat on the ruins what's will eat.

Exactly what I did this year at IMLP with zero complaints.

. Yeah, even with my coaches careful (crazy) nutrition plan, I often made it p as I went. I won my AG at Musselman despite abandoning the plan near the end of the bike. Again, I think controlling pace and effort early on the bike and run legs will be key for me.

Controlling pace and effort on the bike will be key for me as well.  I'll be getting out of the water near the front (assuming things work out) and I'm going to have to not get sucked into the train of uber bikers that is sure to go flying by me.  That means you Fred.  If (when) you pass me and see me sticking around, tell me to smarten the eff up!  Tongue out



2012-08-09 11:49 AM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
Fred D - 2012-08-09 12:16 PM
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 11:25 AM

 Btw zero bricks for me this year, first one will be at IMMT. Going to be interesting.

That has not gone by without notice. Your race will definitely be an interesting one to watch. I am actually confident it is going to go very well especially in light of your "alternative" training methods that have been dictated by your calf and achilles issues this season. Your fitness has to be through the roof and your running background coupled with your race experience will see you through. From my own experience there is a good chance that you may even learn all sorts of new things that you will cary forward in your training regimen that you would never have thought of if you had not wound up injured this season.

2012-08-09 11:56 AM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II

Fred D - 2012-08-09 12:30 PM 

Yeah, even with my coaches careful (crazy) nutrition plan, I often made it p as I went. I won my AG at Musselman despite abandoning the plan near the end of the bike. Again, I think controlling pace and effort early on the bike and run legs will be key for me.

axteraa - 2012-08-09 12:47 PM 

Controlling pace and effort on the bike will be key for me as well.  I'll be getting out of the water near the front (assuming things work out) and I'm going to have to not get sucked into the train of uber bikers that is sure to go flying by me.  That means you Fred.  If (when) you pass me and see me sticking around, tell me to smarten the eff up!  Tongue out

Huh??? - What is all this "bike pacing" nonsense you guys are talking about??? This is the wrong group for that. Haven't you been listening to ANY of the advice Rudy has given you???? Laughing

OK - have you gotten bib numbers yet? All of the sudden I am getting excited...

2012-08-09 11:59 AM
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2012-08-09 12:00 PM
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2012-08-09 12:08 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II

Fred D - 2012-08-09 1:59 PM  I'm riding the first 30' easy and then going to put it into higher gear thereafter. What swim time are you thinking, I'm hoping 1:10ish myself.

55-57 mins.  My dream is that I find a pack of 6-8 swimmers that can swim 55 mins and I will tag along for the ride.  



2012-08-09 12:17 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
TriAya - 2012-08-09 11:53 AM
GoFaster - 2012-08-09 11:39 PM
juniperjen - 2012-08-09 9:25 AM

The best news from my end though (not tri-related) is that my mom finished chemotherapy on Tuesday.  Time for her to get back to being herself and building back up her strength.  It's really a relief that we got through everything and this chapter is closing.  I'll definitely be dedicating my race to her.  Well, her and my uncle Chris who has Parkinsons.

Great news Jen. 

As for your race - this has been building for a long time, and you've put a significant part of your life into preparing for this.  I think you're nerves are completely normal at this point, as they would be with any other big life event.

x2. I'm really happy for you, and the race will be a celebration in many ways.

Thanks so much. We are so very lucky - this was the best case scenario but it has still been hard.  I didn't really think I would have to face up to health challenges with my parents for a while yet.  It was really bittersweet at my sister's wedding last weekend - after a while my mom was way too hot in her wig so she was dancing around with a fascinator on hairband over her bald head.  She loves good times and good laughs - no matter what.

2012-08-09 12:21 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
TankBoy - 2012-08-09 12:56 PM

Fred D - 2012-08-09 12:30 PM 

Yeah, even with my coaches careful (crazy) nutrition plan, I often made it p as I went. I won my AG at Musselman despite abandoning the plan near the end of the bike. Again, I think controlling pace and effort early on the bike and run legs will be key for me.

axteraa - 2012-08-09 12:47 PM 

Controlling pace and effort on the bike will be key for me as well.  I'll be getting out of the water near the front (assuming things work out) and I'm going to have to not get sucked into the train of uber bikers that is sure to go flying by me.  That means you Fred.  If (when) you pass me and see me sticking around, tell me to smarten the eff up!  Tongue out

Huh??? - What is all this "bike pacing" nonsense you guys are talking about??? This is the wrong group for that. Haven't you been listening to ANY of the advice Rudy has given you???? Laughing

OK - have you gotten bib numbers yet? All of the sudden I am getting excited...

Yep - i am bib 2023. 

And I definitely won't be anywhere near Arend or Fred on the swim start. This is what is giving me the most nerves.  It will be fine but i'll be at the back trying to stay out of the way.

The only nutritional challenges I've had is sensitive teeth which sounds dumb but the sugars in some of the on-course nutrition make it nearly impossible to eat after a few hours. Even the gels which you think could be sucked down - those Honey Stingers are too much for me.  Perform has been fine - no problem, plan to alternate between water and perform. And I am loving the Bonk Breaker bars but they are annoyingly hard to find around here.

 

2012-08-09 12:22 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
Bib # 538 for me.
2012-08-09 12:24 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
Fred D - 2012-08-09 12:59 PM

I'm riding the first 30' easy and then going to put it into higher gear thereafter. What swim time are you thinking, I'm hoping 1:10ish myself.

AND LET THE SANDBAGGING BEGIN!

2012-08-09 12:25 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
axteraa - 2012-08-09 1:08 PM

Fred D - 2012-08-09 1:59 PM  I'm riding the first 30' easy and then going to put it into higher gear thereafter. What swim time are you thinking, I'm hoping 1:10ish myself.

55-57 mins.  My dream is that I find a pack of 6-8 swimmers that can swim 55 mins and I will tag along for the ride.  

Now THAT'S more like it!



2012-08-09 12:34 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II

TSimone - 2012-08-09 11:22 AM Fred - Another thought on the run nutrition is to think back to a previous plan that worked for you and duplicate it.

 

This is QUEBEC. You should be eating poutine on the bike. Ask for Poutine !!!

2012-08-09 12:37 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II
marcag - 2012-08-09 1:34 PM

TSimone - 2012-08-09 11:22 AM Fred - Another thought on the run nutrition is to think back to a previous plan that worked for you and duplicate it.

 

This is QUEBEC. You should be eating poutine on the bike. Ask for Poutine !!!

We do pass by at least a couple of casse-croute on the bike. It would be easy to make a new 'aid station'

2012-08-09 12:37 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II

Jen - Great News!!!

Neil - The only thing consistant about my tapers for an important race is that I go easy 2 days before.  I try not to do any high intensity stuff.  Maybe a 30 minute steady swim and a 30 minute easy run, or a 60 minute Z2-3 spin?  I always try to do something the day before the race too.  Sometimes as long as a 2 hour ride with short 1-2 minute hard efforts sprinkled in there.  But that's just what works for me. 

Fred - good to see you've got your fit pretty close.  As far as nutrition, I used more than 300 cal/hr during my first HIM and was fine.  I was also fine with 200 cal/hr in my last HIM, so what that tells me is that nutrition isn't that "exact".  The main thing is to be "in the ball park" and also be flexible.  If I were you, I would have a back up plan on the bike besides perform and waffles.  Maybe a flask of gel in your SN bag?  Cliff bar, shot bloks, banana, or something else just in case you figure out perform and/or waffles aren't working for you that day.  Then on the run, just do as you said...eat whatever you feel like.  Most WTC IMs have run aid stations that are well stocked.

 

2012-08-09 12:42 PM
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Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group - Part II

Wasn't planning on riding yesterday, but I did anyway.  Decided to stick to a flat loop, but the winds were kicking today.  So much so that when I had a straight tailwind, I was able to get up to 38.7 mph...on the flats!!!

20 minute test today...uggghhh

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