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2014-03-23 1:11 PM
in reply to: ImSore

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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by ImSore

Head up in picture on the left, and down in picture on the right. It looks like the arms are pushed forward too, judging by the angle of the upper to lower arm, and position of the wrist watch relative to the bars. I am guessing moving the arms forward helps get the head down?

My guess is 20 watts. (Edit: gained going from position on left to position on right, if it wasn't obvious)


All correct.
Except the gains that were slighly over 30w.


2014-03-23 4:08 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Subject: RE: Week 10

I'm behind 2 weeks in training, was on vacation for 10 days, and I can't remember now how I missed another week, but I did.  I've been super busy, but trying to get back into the swing of things.  I am really behind on posts - say 3 weeks behind, and not sure how long it will take to catch up (perhaps 3 more weeks).

Anyway, still alive and kicking, just behind.  Another race this weekend - 4 hour Adventure Race. Hoping for nice weather.  Last year it was doing a sleet/snow thing during the entire race and my bike rear derailleur froze in place while riding up a hill.  I was stuck in that pitiful gear for the next 2 hours.  I must have been pedaling 120 rpm and only able to get up to 12 mph.  So, better weather this year would be a blessing.

Kudos to everyone who has managed to stay on track with this training plan!!

2014-03-23 6:43 PM
in reply to: crissy_jo


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Subject: RE: Week 10

Tough training day. I will say, that I am finding it very challenging to fit in key workouts (particularly runs), while following this program. I did a 12 mile tempo run today, with 7 miles ending up just below HM pace (6:41 was my average for those miles, and that's fast for me). And that was this morning, knowing I wanted to get the week 11 sweet spot workout in.

I can say I was pleasantly surprised. Hit my targets for my run, and for the bike. Not sure how I would have managed a threshold workout, but the sweet spot had just enough suffering without the foot all the way on the gas (though the 10 minutes at FTP at the end was tough!!)

Its only 7:30 pm or so, but I am ready for bed!





(SSwk11.png)



Attachments
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SSwk11.png (47KB - 2 downloads)
activity_466657930.tcx (810KB - 1 downloads)
2014-03-23 6:50 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Maine
Subject: RE: Week 9
Hate to be the one to break the news... but there was nothing sweet about Week 11 SWE-1!

I tried doing that in place of the 1:30 ride that was in my plan and started coming apart during the second interval. Overall I still feel the weekend was successful with the two rides I did but I know i didn't get as much as I should have out of SWE-1. I've been trying to merge the BT group workouts with the EN plan where I can since there are only a few weeks of overlap. Planning Week 12 THR-1 for Tuesday since that's the closest workout to what the plan calls for. The nice thing is FTP testing in the plan lines up with our planned testing week as well, just need to make sure I don't cook my legs before then.

Files for the week:




Attachments
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cdkayak-2014-03-22-en_wk2_long_ftp_2x10_150-848948.tcx (4232KB - 1 downloads)
cdkayak-2014-03-19-bt-power-week-11-thr-1-842140.tcx (2137KB - 1 downloads)
cdkayak-2014-03-23-bt-power-week-11-swe-1-851016.tcx (2974KB - 1 downloads)
2014-03-23 10:22 PM
in reply to: cdkayak

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Oakville
Subject: RE: Week 11

Hello all.  Back from a week down south with the family.  The weather was fantastic - highs in the low 30s and lows in the 20s.

I managed to get in a few ocean swims and a few short runs, but still put on about 5 extra pounds.

Was hoping that the weather would improve back home, but no luck.  High of -5 today.

Back to reality and catching up on the workouts.

I did Week 11 Threshold 1 tonight.  Just under the targets - 97% for the 15 minutes intervals and 98% for the last 10 minute interval.

Some good discussions on aero positions while I was away. 

I think I need to make a few adjustments to mine.  Power seems to drop too much when I'm in aero. 

Scott





Attachments
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WK11THR1.tcx (3053KB - 1 downloads)
2014-03-23 10:47 PM
in reply to: Scott71

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Master
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Overland Park, KS
Subject: RE: Week 9
Still lagging a few weeks behind. Week 9 TH1 done.

Good info on aerodynamics, hopefully I can grab a few watts here and there.





(Wk9 TH1 Ride.JPG)



Attachments
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wk9th1.csv (178KB - 1 downloads)
Wk9 TH1 Ride.JPG (53KB - 3 downloads)


2014-03-23 11:30 PM
in reply to: reecealan


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Subject: RE: Week 11
There must have been a disturbance in the force this last week because my workouts just did not happen after the 17th. I tried to do Week 10 Sweet spot yesterday and I bailed after 30 min. The heart rate strap battery was dying and giving me bad readings, plus nothing felt right. So today I hit Week 11 threshold 1 and killed it. Hit goals+, especially on the last 10 min when I shifted another gear and punished myself for the bad week. Honestly it was not that bad and felt good to shake off the bad karma. Oh, and I'm probably parachute on the road bike in a road position. Like one of those parachutes that they stopped the space shuttle with. LOL Hope everyone had a great weekend.

Week 11 Threshold 1 - TSS=110 NP=220

Ron



Attachments
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Ron-2014-03-23-bt-power-week-11-thr-1-851962.tcx (2133KB - 1 downloads)
2014-03-24 6:49 AM
in reply to: ImSore

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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by ImSore

So, my understanding is that I want to flatten my torso, but not close my hip angle. So my goal is then, to rotate my body forward by lowering the front a bit, and moving forward a bit.




this is part 4 of a 4 part article
Lots of really good info in there and links to the previous 3 parts

http://www.endurancecorner.com/Alan_Couzens/bike_fit_4


Also, some interesting pictures from IM Melbourne last weekend
http://firstoffthebike.com/gallery/ironman-melbourne-pro-bike-racin...
2014-03-24 8:06 AM
in reply to: marcag

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Subject: RE: Week 11
Marc/Shane:

Background - I woke up on saturday with some sort of Nerve issue or strained muscle in my left groin area. Legs feels funny - like its sore. I host a run club for my 11 year old daughter an dher friends so I had a 3 miler on the docket Sat afternoon. I ran the 3 and felt fine and then tacked on another 5 for myself at the end. Sunday morning I was too fatigued and leg was still bothering me so I planned to do Week 11 Sweet Spot this morning. Leg bothered me most of the night, not pain, just uncomfortable. So no workout this morning. Depending how it feels I plan to cycle tomorrow morning.

Question - Should I just skip the Sweet Spot workout and jump to Week 12 threshold? My gut says it doesn't really matter, but thought I'd ask anyway.
2014-03-24 8:07 AM
in reply to: trisuppo

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Subject: Bike calculator
I stumbled on this website (also has a link for iOS app) during a discussion with my Brother-In-Law on watts/speed, etc. Pretty fun. You can change a bunch of variable to see how fast you can go at various power levels:

http://bikecalculator.com/

(I apologize if this has been posted before)
2014-03-24 8:20 AM
in reply to: trisuppo

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Subject: RE: Bike calculator
Originally posted by trisuppo

I stumbled on this website (also has a link for iOS app) during a discussion with my Brother-In-Law on watts/speed, etc. Pretty fun. You can change a bunch of variable to see how fast you can go at various power levels:

http://bikecalculator.com/

(I apologize if this has been posted before)


That is a great site

If you go to this specific one
http://bikecalculator.com/veloMetricNum.html

You can actually enter cda and crr which are the same parameters used by Aerolab. You can really fine tune the estimates.

Things like tires and tubes improve your crr
You aero profile improves your cda


2014-03-24 8:25 AM
in reply to: trisuppo

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Subject: RE: Week 11
Originally posted by trisuppo

Marc/Shane:

Background - I woke up on saturday with some sort of Nerve issue or strained muscle in my left groin area. Legs feels funny - like its sore. I host a run club for my 11 year old daughter an dher friends so I had a 3 miler on the docket Sat afternoon. I ran the 3 and felt fine and then tacked on another 5 for myself at the end. Sunday morning I was too fatigued and leg was still bothering me so I planned to do Week 11 Sweet Spot this morning. Leg bothered me most of the night, not pain, just uncomfortable. So no workout this morning. Depending how it feels I plan to cycle tomorrow morning.

Question - Should I just skip the Sweet Spot workout and jump to Week 12 threshold? My gut says it doesn't really matter, but thought I'd ask anyway.



The right answer would be by Shane.

But my opinion, I would do which ever you prefer.
I feel I am benefiting more from the SS workouts right now, but that's me.
2014-03-24 8:50 AM
in reply to: marcag


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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by ImSore

So, my understanding is that I want to flatten my torso, but not close my hip angle. So my goal is then, to rotate my body forward by lowering the front a bit, and moving forward a bit.




this is part 4 of a 4 part article
Lots of really good info in there and links to the previous 3 parts

http://www.endurancecorner.com/Alan_Couzens/bike_fit_4


Also, some interesting pictures from IM Melbourne last weekend
http://firstoffthebike.com/gallery/ironman-melbourne-pro-bike-racin...



Great pictures at IM Melbourne.

A few of the things that stood out:

Third picture, "Paul Matthews snacking," doesn't the jersey look loose, and the straw!!
I want Chris Kemp's bike. But again doesn't the jersey look a bit loose? (And another straw!!)
With my untrained eye, Luke McKenzie looks really good. Nice flat torso, head down, arms in, bottle between arms. If I were to want to emulate a position in that gallery, his looks like a good one!!
Jimmy Johnsen, very loose jersey!!
And maybe its just the picture, but Crowie looks pretty jammed up, his knee looks close enough to knock his elbow of the pads. Compare how different his position looks with Jimmy Johnsen.

Interesting stuff.
2014-03-24 9:16 AM
in reply to: ImSore

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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by ImSore

Great pictures at IM Melbourne.

A few of the things that stood out:

Third picture, "Paul Matthews snacking," doesn't the jersey look loose, and the straw!!
I want Chris Kemp's bike. But again doesn't the jersey look a bit loose? (And another straw!!)
With my untrained eye, Luke McKenzie looks really good. Nice flat torso, head down, arms in, bottle between arms. If I were to want to emulate a position in that gallery, his looks like a good one!!
Jimmy Johnsen, very loose jersey!!
And maybe its just the picture, but Crowie looks pretty jammed up, his knee looks close enough to knock his elbow of the pads. Compare how different his position looks with Jimmy Johnsen.

Interesting stuff.



When I saw the pictures, and all the straws, I thought of you.
Those guys have to dance between hydration, aeroness and sponsorship. And sometimes they just don't know. Many (probably most) have never been in a wind tunnel and the technology to do it on a velodrome is relatively new. A guy like Jordan Rapp is one of the few that pay a lot of attention to detail.

I have spent a ton of time trying a ton of things and for me, the most bang for the buck is head position. Like I suggest, take a front pic and look where big gains can be made.

I think you are leaving quite a bit on the table and you should look at if for IMMT which benefits greatly for a good aero position. But not at the cost of comfort.

2014-03-24 9:36 AM
in reply to: marcag

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Montague Gold Mines, Nova Scotia
Subject: RE: Week 11
Originally posted by marcag

The right answer would be by Shane.

But my opinion, I would do which ever you prefer.
I feel I am benefiting more from the SS workouts right now, but that's me.


I would agree that whatever you prefer, especially if you have the time to s a little longer with the SS workout.

Shane
2014-03-24 10:42 AM
in reply to: ImSore


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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by ImSore

Great pictures at IM Melbourne.

A few of the things that stood out:

Third picture, "Paul Matthews snacking," doesn't the jersey look loose, and the straw!!
I want Chris Kemp's bike. But again doesn't the jersey look a bit loose? (And another straw!!)
With my untrained eye, Luke McKenzie looks really good. Nice flat torso, head down, arms in, bottle between arms. If I were to want to emulate a position in that gallery, his looks like a good one!!
Jimmy Johnsen, very loose jersey!!
And maybe its just the picture, but Crowie looks pretty jammed up, his knee looks close enough to knock his elbow of the pads. Compare how different his position looks with Jimmy Johnsen.

Interesting stuff.



There's an old New Yorker cartoon of a golfer complaining about his stroke. "I don't get it," says the duffer. "My backswing is crooked like Snead, my right arm is cocked like Nicklaus, my knees are knocked like Player, I lift my head early like Palmer, my follow-through is short like Trevino, and I still can't hit the ball worth a damn."


2014-03-24 12:32 PM
in reply to: marcag

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Oakville
Subject: RE: Week 9

For the aero discussions, I stumbled across this site a few years ago:

http://triracebook.com

You need to be a member (which was free a few years ago) and there is an application in the "My TRB" section called "Bike Position Inspector" where you can upload a photograph of your aero position and move several markers to various positions on your body (hip, shoulder, knee etc) and it will generate the various angles. 

Here's a youtube video that shows how it works:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA1bb-G7KI0

The difficulty I found is moving the markers to the precise spot, particularly for the hip and the shoulder, but for a free app its a good start to see what range your angles are.

 

 

2014-03-24 12:48 PM
in reply to: Scott71

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Subject: RE: Week 9

I did most of last week's long ride outside on Saturday....didn't end up getting through all of the third interval as I ran out of road!  We were riding the Galveston 70.3 course....man, if I could ride that fast in a race (and run well off it), I would be pumped!

Followed it up with a 4 mile run, building pace by 15s/mile each mile.  I realize that I tend to go out way too fast and end up completely gassing myself, so I'm really working on taking it easy at the start.  My run fitness still isn't where I'd like for it to be, but it's unlikely that I'll make big gains in the next six weeks, so I'll continue to be consistent and build up to what I can with minimal risk for injury.

Question for Marc and Shane: at what point before a race (if ever) do you go out and do a completely steady power race simulation type ride?  I've been doing intervals out there, but I'm starting to think it might be time to go out and just do a race simulation ride, rather than worrying about accumulating TSS points or whatever.

2014-03-24 1:16 PM
in reply to: ligersandtions

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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by ligersandtions

I did most of last week's long ride outside on Saturday....didn't end up getting through all of the third interval as I ran out of road!  We were riding the Galveston 70.3 course....man, if I could ride that fast in a race (and run well off it), I would be pumped!

Followed it up with a 4 mile run, building pace by 15s/mile each mile.  I realize that I tend to go out way too fast and end up completely gassing myself, so I'm really working on taking it easy at the start.  My run fitness still isn't where I'd like for it to be, but it's unlikely that I'll make big gains in the next six weeks, so I'll continue to be consistent and build up to what I can with minimal risk for injury.

Question for Marc and Shane: at what point before a race (if ever) do you go out and do a completely steady power race simulation type ride?  I've been doing intervals out there, but I'm starting to think it might be time to go out and just do a race simulation ride, rather than worrying about accumulating TSS points or whatever.




For race rehearsals, in 2012 I did nothing but steady 3hr even power rides. In 2013, I did 4 hour rides with a mix of intervals in them. Both worked.

This year, If I were racing something like Miami, I would probably do the 3hr steady. If I was doing St-George, I would mix it up because that is what you are going to do come race day.

If it were me, I would take bestbike split, spit out a race plan and do that and then run. I would be doing it multiple weeks, practicing my nutrition. I would probably do some intervals of 'higher power'/"lower cadence" to simulate the climbs.
2014-03-24 1:21 PM
in reply to: Scott71

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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by Scott71

For the aero discussions, I stumbled across this site a few years ago:

http://triracebook.com

You need to be a member (which was free a few years ago) and there is an application in the "My TRB" section called "Bike Position Inspector" where you can upload a photograph of your aero position and move several markers to various positions on your body (hip, shoulder, knee etc) and it will generate the various angles. 

Here's a youtube video that shows how it works:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA1bb-G7KI0

The difficulty I found is moving the markers to the precise spot, particularly for the hip and the shoulder, but for a free app its a good start to see what range your angles are.

 

 




Another great app, not specifically for fitting is Kinovea. Shoot a video from the side and then you can measure all the angles.



2014-03-24 2:03 PM
in reply to: marcag


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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by marcag

Originally posted by Scott71

For the aero discussions, I stumbled across this site a few years ago:

http://triracebook.com

You need to be a member (which was free a few years ago) and there is an application in the "My TRB" section called "Bike Position Inspector" where you can upload a photograph of your aero position and move several markers to various positions on your body (hip, shoulder, knee etc) and it will generate the various angles. 

Here's a youtube video that shows how it works:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA1bb-G7KI0

The difficulty I found is moving the markers to the precise spot, particularly for the hip and the shoulder, but for a free app its a good start to see what range your angles are.

 

 




Another great app, not specifically for fitting is Kinovea. Shoot a video from the side and then you can measure all the angles.



Take a couple of those otherwise useless little dot band-aids that no one ever uses and stick them to the outside of your shorts or jersey at your greater trochanter and the greater tuberosity of your humerus so you can spot them in your photos or videos. In my household I guess I could also use Disney Princess stickers but a man has to draw the line somewhere and I'm reluctant to draw that line with Disney Princesses.


2014-03-24 9:24 PM
in reply to: RChung

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Subject: RE: Week 9




Take a couple of those otherwise useless little dot band-aids that no one ever uses and stick them to the outside of your shorts or jersey at your greater trochanter and the greater tuberosity of your humerus so you can spot them in your photos or videos. In my household I guess I could also use Disney Princess stickers but a man has to draw the line somewhere and I'm reluctant to draw that line with Disney Princesses.


LMAO!
2014-03-25 9:47 PM
in reply to: 0

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Oakville
Subject: RE: Week 9

Just was not my night tonight.  I should be refreshed after a week off, but Week 11 VO2-1 was rough.

I managed to hit 108% for the first 4 minute interval but it was downhill from there - 107%, 106%, 106% and 105% with 86 TSS.

My legs were feeling so beat up that I did the last 10 minute interval at only 90%.  Definitely would not have been able to sustain 98%.

I think I'll take a few days off the bike and do Sweetspot on Friday instead of Threshold 2.

Hopefully everyone else is holding up better.

Scott



Edited by Scott71 2014-03-25 9:49 PM




Attachments
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WK11V02A.tcx (2820KB - 1 downloads)
2014-03-26 4:45 AM
in reply to: Scott71

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Subject: RE: Week 9
Originally posted by Scott71

Just was not my night tonight.  I should be refreshed after a week off, but Week 11 VO2-1 was rough.

I managed to hit 108% for the first 4 minute interval but it was downhill from there - 107%, 106%, 106% and 105% with 86 TSS.

My legs were feeling so beat up that I did the last 10 minute interval at only 90%.  Definitely would not have been able to sustain 98%.

I think I'll take a few days off the bike and do Sweetspot on Friday instead of Threshold 2.

Hopefully everyone else is holding up better.

Scott




After a long time off I always try and break into it a little slower.
Your body is still at the side of the pool, a drink in hand, with a little umbrella in it

2014-03-26 4:45 AM
in reply to: marcag

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Subject: RE: Week 9

Chris is racing Oceanside this weekend

Best of luck !!!
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