BT Development Mentor Program Archives » Fred D Mentor Group Part III Rss Feed  
Moderators: alicefoeller Reply
 
 
of 115
 
 
2012-11-09 12:07 PM
in reply to: #4491798

User image

Veteran
337
10010010025
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
bzgl40 - 2012-11-09 12:50 PM 

I think for me using TR for virtual power is all about a consistent repeatable effort based training while on the trainer.  I wear my HR monitor and I know my effort level so I think I can then turn around and transfer that to racing.  I just know how hard it is to use HR for short intervals on the trainer so I just wanted to try a different way to measure it and never have a plan to get on the trainer and just spin

Interesting. I haven't trained/raced with HR, but that is an interesting idea.

Definitely with you on a plan for the trainer. My wife and I have our workouts taped to the wall for now =)



2012-11-09 4:57 PM
in reply to: #4491757

User image

Extreme Veteran
5722
5000500100100
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
bdesotell - 2012-11-09 11:34 AM

This. Thread. Moves. Fast.

Missed a few days and a whole lot of pages.

Question for the group (and I apologize if it has been addressed already):  

For those training with virtual power like TrainerRoad, how do you incorporate that into racing without a powermeter? How do you pace without power if you have been training with virtual power?

Or, are you simply using virtual power as a training tool to become a better/stronger biker, but then pacing your race effort via another metric (RPE/speed/cadence/heart rate)?

 

Here is what I would do.

Train with virtual power all winter. Know your FTP, do your intervals, improve your FTP.

Then in April, test your FTP. Let's say it gives 200 watts

Then a few days later do a 60 min ride at 80% of that, so 160watts. Look at your HR. That is your target HR for HIM.

That is the high level view of it. There are details such as the fact your HR will be elevated coming out of the water....

 

Edit : in theory this could also be used by people with a computrainer that got rid of their powermeter to buy a bad tri bike.....if such a thing existed of course...



Edited by marcag 2012-11-09 5:16 PM
2012-11-09 5:18 PM
in reply to: #4491798

User image

Extreme Veteran
5722
5000500100100
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
bzgl40 - 2012-11-09 11:50 AM
bdesotell - 2012-11-09 9:34 AM

Or, are you simply using virtual power as a training tool to become a better/stronger biker, but then pacing your race effort via another metric (RPE/speed/cadence/heart rate)?

I think for me using TR for virtual power is all about a consistent repeatable effort based training while on the trainer.  I wear my HR monitor and I know my effort level so I think I can then turn around and transfer that to racing.  I just know how hard it is to use HR for short intervals on the trainer so I just wanted to try a different way to measure it and never have a plan to get on the trainer and just spin

By the way, you can do virtual power on Golden Cheetah for free. The number of trainers is more limited however. They only support a handful. Kurt and Cycleops fluid are supported.

2012-11-09 7:05 PM
in reply to: #4433790

User image

Elite
3779
20001000500100100252525
Ontario
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Another 910 question.  When you hit lap, do you notice that Lap NP doesn't reset?  It just slowly drops or increases based on the next lap effort level.  I just thought it would reset and immediately pickup the new effort level, rather than taking time and adjusting from the previous lap.
2012-11-09 7:17 PM
in reply to: #4492471

User image

Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

GoFaster - 2012-11-09 3:05 PM Another 910 question.  When you hit lap, do you notice that Lap NP doesn't reset?  It just slowly drops or increases based on the next lap effort level.  I just thought it would reset and immediately pickup the new effort level, rather than taking time and adjusting from the previous lap.

I never noticed that...I usually only look at NP for the entire ride.

2012-11-09 7:19 PM
in reply to: #4491299

User image

Champion
7595
50002000500252525
Columbia, South Carolina
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
marcag - 2012-11-09 8:50 AM
axteraa - 2012-11-09 6:53 AM
acumenjay - 2012-11-09 8:48 AM

I'm hoping to ride both days as well.  Have to get in what we can before it gets crazy cold.

So, I downloaded Sufferfest: Angels.  Looks really cool.  Question though.  I have Golden Cheetah but the latest version on the website when I download says 2.1.  I think it was mentioned that version 3 is required.  Where can I get that for a mac?

I didn't try the video yet.  I ended up running 10 miles with the group this AM.  I'm glad I did.  Ended up being a good group.

The v3 development builds are available here.  I think they are way behind with their Mac builds though....

 

While I realize we are not all computer geeks, I do not understand the fascination with trainerRoad and the lack of excitement about GC.

It's an amazing tool for training. The ability to drop in Erg files and it will direct your power levels is the same as trainerroad. The ability to take Jorge's plan and make erg files is trivial. Erg files for all the Sufferfest videos are on the web

GC even has a tool to download workouts.

It uploads to Strava, to training Peaks, it does ride analysis, it has a performance manager, it even does friggin aero analysis. It's crazy people don't use this thing.

Granted the early releases of 3.0 were rough but they are getting pretty smooth.

 

Totally agree (but then again I'm also a computer geek).  I really love GC. 

And speaking to the `what to do with virtual power' question, I'd say that (for me, before I had a PM) the main benefit was being able to set up reliable targets for intervals on the trainer.  I'm less confident of translating indoor results of a HR test to outdoors -- my HR is quite different indoors from outdoors.  Once I took the training outdoors, I'd be inclined to do a LT test (outdoors) and determine race targets from there (as Marc said, also taking into account the various factors that can mess with HR).



2012-11-10 6:01 AM
in reply to: #4492471

User image

Extreme Veteran
5722
5000500100100
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

GoFaster - 2012-11-09 7:05 PM Another 910 question.  When you hit lap, do you notice that Lap NP doesn't reset?  It just slowly drops or increases based on the next lap effort level.  I just thought it would reset and immediately pickup the new effort level, rather than taking time and adjusting from the previous lap.

If I am not mistaken NP is based on a 30sec rolling average, so it would have to either not display-wait 30 secs-start, or use the previous 30sec rolling average.

When you start your watch I think it takes 30 sec for NP to appear.

 

doing this by memory, so I may be wrong

2012-11-10 6:09 AM
in reply to: #4492721

Subject: ...
This user's post has been ignored.
2012-11-10 6:11 AM
in reply to: #4433790

Subject: ...
This user's post has been ignored.
2012-11-10 6:30 AM
in reply to: #4433790

Payson, AZ
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Funny Fred, I just took a blood test for my insurance but I did a home kit thing.  Much easier, glad my company offers it as an option.

I have a trainer ride this morning and a run hopefully this afternoon.  I think I might need to break out not just the cold weather clothes (maybe even tights) but the rain cloths as well.  2C here right now (figured I would practice my Canadian in case I move back)

2012-11-10 6:38 AM
in reply to: #4433790

Elite
3779
20001000500100100252525
Ontario
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Going for a wet 2hr ride in a few minutes - it's the only chance I'll get!  Get to try out the 910 on the bike.


2012-11-10 7:11 AM
in reply to: #4492728

Champion
7595
50002000500252525
Columbia, South Carolina
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Fred D - 2012-11-10 7:11 AM I have to do an insurance physical this am. No coffee or eating until 9am. Grrrrr. I really like my coffee. Then I will ride and run today at some point. What's on tap for the group today?

So this would be a bad tie to mention that I got a new 'super-automatic' coffee machine.  Press a button, and 30s later there's a cup of coffee.  Mmmmm.   (And dangerous...)

2012-11-10 7:32 AM
in reply to: #4492751

Subject: ...
This user's post has been ignored.
2012-11-10 7:34 AM
in reply to: #4492737

Subject: ...
This user's post has been ignored.
2012-11-10 8:05 AM
in reply to: #4433790

Pro
4482
20002000100100100100252525
NJ
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Ahhhhh. Coffee. I downloaded the Starbucks app on my phone, so it is all free now. Hahaha. I think my diet the last few weeks has been fueled primarily by coffee and pop tarts. Not good. I still don't have power but it's supposed to get warm here this weekend so I'm going to try and ride outside. I just need to think through the route a bit as there are still alot of downed poles and crap on the roads.
2012-11-10 8:51 AM
in reply to: #4492728

Master
2912
2000500100100100100
...at home in The ATL
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Fred D - 2012-11-10 7:11 AMI have to do an insurance physical this am. No coffee or eating until 9am. Grrrrr. I really like my coffee. Then I will ride and run today at some point. What's on tap for the group today?

Planes, trains and automobiles for me today, so no workout scheduled. Done with the planes and trains bit though, so now just some driving left. Hopefully will be home tomorrow in time for a run... Safe training to everyone that can out to do it!



2012-11-10 12:18 PM
in reply to: #4433790

Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Got in a very easy 8.5 mile run.  Going to watch our pathetic UH football team get smashed by Boise.  Will ride long tomorrow.
2012-11-10 1:04 PM
in reply to: #4492947

Elite
7783
50002000500100100252525
PEI, Canada
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

tri808 - 2012-11-10 2:18 PM Got in a very easy 8.5 mile run.  Going to watch our pathetic UH football team get smashed by Boise.  Will ride long tomorrow.

How did swimming with the band go Jason?

2012-11-10 1:22 PM
in reply to: #4492726

Elite
3779
20001000500100100252525
Ontario
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Fred D - 2012-11-10 7:09 AM
marcag - 2012-11-10 7:01 AM

GoFaster - 2012-11-09 7:05 PM Another 910 question.  When you hit lap, do you notice that Lap NP doesn't reset?  It just slowly drops or increases based on the next lap effort level.  I just thought it would reset and immediately pickup the new effort level, rather than taking time and adjusting from the previous lap.

If I am not mistaken NP is based on a 30sec rolling average, so it would have to either not display-wait 30 secs-start, or use the previous 30sec rolling average.

When you start your watch I think it takes 30 sec for NP to appear.

 

doing this by memory, so I may be wrong

. Correct. For the first 30s there is usually no reading. I never found a good use for NP laps when training with power.

Thanks guys.  I like the NP lap info, since it seems to be a better indicator of actual power output vs average power.  The Garmin is set to lap every 5km, which I think is a good distance to make sure power is staying in line with expectations.

2012-11-10 1:44 PM
in reply to: #4433790

Elite
7783
50002000500100100252525
PEI, Canada
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Headed to the trainer shortly to do a 2x20 session.  Haven't done that one in a while.
2012-11-10 1:47 PM
in reply to: #4433790

Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Threatened rain never materialized. Nice but cold ride (cold for us, 50 degrees) with 2 good climbs. 3 hours then ez 3 mile run off the bike


2012-11-10 1:57 PM
in reply to: #4492947

Master
2912
2000500100100100100
...at home in The ATL
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
tri808 - 2012-11-10 1:18 PMGot in a very easy 8.5 mile run.  Going to watch our pathetic UH football team get smashed by Boise.  Will ride long tomorrow.

Jason - it could be worse, just imagine if you were an Auburn fan like me... Nice job on the run though!

2012-11-10 2:19 PM
in reply to: #4433790

Extreme Veteran
5722
5000500100100
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

Ih04 doing Sufferfest Angels. 242watts NP. HR abnormally high. 2 liters of water on the floor

Off to see James Bond.

2012-11-10 2:20 PM
in reply to: #4492794

Melon Presser
52116
50005000500050005000500050005000500050002000100
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III

kcarroll - 2012-11-10 9:05 PM Ahhhhh. Coffee. I downloaded the Starbucks app on my phone, so it is all free now. Hahaha. I think my diet the last few weeks has been fueled primarily by coffee and pop tarts. Not good. I still don't have power but it's supposed to get warm here this weekend so I'm going to try and ride outside. I just need to think through the route a bit as there are still alot of downed poles and crap on the roads.

Sealed

Innocent

Uh ... I simply AM primarily fuelled by coffee and Pop Tarts.

For long training sessions, anyway

2012-11-10 3:10 PM
in reply to: #4433790

Payson, AZ
Subject: RE: Fred D Mentor Group Part III
Very unmotivated to run...so I am making granola instead.  Still getting into the two-a-day routine, and I am only doing that twice a week.  Frown  I am sure the cloudy, windy, chilly temps are not helping my motivation.  Got the trainer ride in though.  I give my tire until the end of the year max.  I thought it was the trainer but I think it is just a horrible tire.  Since I switch out wheels with Tina's bike despite different gearing, and since she never rides her bike, I might just get an actual trainer tire. 
New Thread
BT Development Mentor Program Archives » Fred D Mentor Group Part III Rss Feed  
 
 
of 115