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2008-07-31 11:50 AM

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Subject: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?

So I've been thinking of what strategy I'm going to take during the run portion of IMWI this year.  I've only done one Iron-distance race and the marathon was not pretty.  I came off of the bike tired and fatigued, but running felt good....for a while.  I went into the race with the idea that I would just keep running as long as my legs would allow then walk from there if I needed to.  This came at around mile 7.  I ran non-stop out of T-2 to the 7 mile point without any "walk" breaks.  After mile 7 or so everything went to schit and I ended up shuffle/walking the rest of the marathon and ended with a 6-hour run.  This year I want to approach the marathon with a plan.

I've heard of a method (Galloway) where it's suggested you should run 6-minutes & walk 2 throughout the entire marathon.  This sounds OK to me.  I've even heard of a 4-2 r/w combo.

So to my question:  Who has used this approach, how did it work, how did you keep track of the timing, and what R/W split did you use?

I've also thought that an easier plan would be to run to the first water stop, walk two minutes, then continue running to the next w/s, then walk 2, etc, etc.  Thoughts?



Edited by oipolloi 2008-07-31 11:51 AM


2008-07-31 11:58 AM
in reply to: #1572928

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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
This is all my wife Kelly uses for running.  Like me she is not  a gifted runner but try's real hard.  She used this method at an extremely hot and humid Grandmas marathon last year to finish in under her goal time of 5 hours.  I use it in my long runs and it really does help me through.  I go with a 10 and 1 approach.  For IM I am simply planning on walking through every aid station.  If (when) the time comes and I am not getting to each aid station every 11 minutes I will start adding in more walking.  My problems have come when I have decided not to walk in the beginning.  Chisago comes to mind
2008-07-31 12:00 PM
in reply to: #1572928

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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?

Don't over complicate this.

Just run between aid stations, allow yourself to walk thru the aid station to eat and drink - might be a minute, might be 2 minutes.    This alone should improve your run from 6 hours to about 5 hours, maybe a little faster.

2008-07-31 12:02 PM
in reply to: #1572928

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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?

I've run 3 marathons using the Galloway method and it workd fine for me.  I'm planning on using for IMKY.

My ratios during 2 of the marathons were 8:1 run/walking.  For my third mary I was injured and my longest run prior to the race had been 14 miles.  I started off with 3:1 run/walk, did that for about the first half of the race and then was feeling good, switched to 4:1.  Still felt good at mile 18 and went to 5:1, wound with a PR by 10 minutes!  Lots of runners say if you walk it's not running, but we had plenty of people from my running club use the Galloway method and qualify for Boston!

I tracked the timing with a Nike Triax watch, there are 2 timers built into them.  My IM timex watch also has 2 timers. Good luck! 

2008-07-31 12:10 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
Blueraider_Mike - 2008-07-31 12:00 PM

Don't over complicate this.

Just run between aid stations, allow yourself to walk thru the aid station to eat and drink - might be a minute, might be 2 minutes.    This alone should improve your run from 6 hours to about 5 hours, maybe a little faster.

And I don't want to complicate it anymore than it already is.  Trying to keep track of minutes seems like an awful lot when you've got other fish to fry.  I could barely remember my name during my first IM.  Having to keep track of numbers wouldn't work.

I'd still like to hear from others who've stuck to the R/W method the entire marathon and how it worked for them.

I run a 8:40 - 8:50 LSD pace.  If I can stick to around a 10:00 overall pace at IMWI then I'd guess my strategy would be to run roughly 8 to the stop, walk 2 minutes while drinking/eating...then repeat.  I do plan to experiment with this on my last long run, which will be around 3-hours total. 

2008-07-31 12:17 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
I used this method for my IM mary & came in at 5:20ish. I think that would have been better had I had better bike fitness - we will see in a few weeks.
I second the idea - DON"T OVERCOMPLICATE! I ran between aid stations (o-k, sometimes it was a very, very slow run - but in my IM hazy mind I was running like a rock star) and walked each and every aid station. Again, in my crazy IM mind I though it was a great reward to give myself a cliff shot blox at each aid station as a reward. Worked like a charm! This method also helps mentally break up the race. Focus on - I'm only running to the next aid station, not I have 20 miles to go.


2008-07-31 12:29 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
One of my training partners and I had this debate before IMLP. I decided I was going to run aid station to aid station, walk the aid station (about 1 min), he was going to do a 7/1 plan. He did his 7/1 plan until he couldnt, I did my aid station thing until I couldnt. I came in with a 4:50 marathon, he came in with I believe a 4:40 or 4:45. He felt good, I only felt ok. But miles 10-16 I had to walk alot because of a bad nutrition mistake earlier in the run that had my stomach in some knots! After 16-18 I felt a bit better and went back to aid station-aid station. His walk breaks just got longer. So, its kind of all chance. You just never know how it will go in a IM marathon. But I think aid station to aid station with a walk break at the aid station is the best way to go, then you dont have two breaks, one for your walk break, one for getting things down at the aid stations.
2008-07-31 12:33 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
oipolloi - 2008-07-31 12:50 PM

So I've been thinking of what strategy I'm going to take during the run portion of IMWI this year.

If your walking, it's not a "run portion". Frankly, I don't get why people plan on walking. More people should train to run, and walk only if they  have to. I was amazed at how many people were walking at LP.

Rememeber, your slowest jog is faster than your fastest walk.

2008-07-31 12:36 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
oipolloi - 2008-07-31 12:50 PM

I came off of the bike tired and fatigued, but running felt good....for a while. 

I also recall you spent a lot of energy on the swim.  You don't need a better marathon strategy.

2008-07-31 12:37 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
I walked the aid stations, but ran between them, at Lake Placid and came it at 4:28:18. I committed to not start walking until I got to the first volunteer, and to resume running at the last garbage can at the end of each aid station.

I stuck to the plan and PR'd the marathon by ~12 minutes. 4:28 is by no means a fast marathon, but it was still in the top 20% of the field at LP.

In my past IM's I went out too fast at the start, and would inevitably find myself walking more and more as the race went on.

scott
2008-07-31 12:40 PM
in reply to: #1573120

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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
rollinbones - 2008-07-31 10:33 AM
oipolloi - 2008-07-31 12:50 PM

So I've been thinking of what strategy I'm going to take during the run portion of IMWI this year.

If your walking, it's not a "run portion". Frankly, I don't get why people plan on walking. More people should train to run, and walk only if they  have to. I was amazed at how many people were walking at LP.

Rememeber, your slowest jog is faster than your fastest walk.

yeah, triathlon is swim, bike, RUN not swim bike walk.  Hope you don't plan on wearing that finisher's shirt

FWIW, I don't train run/walk but I fully intend on walking the aid stations at IMAZ. 



2008-07-31 12:48 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
I've done three IM marathons.......4:15, 4:20 and 4:25.......and in each I ran aid station to aid station at my predetermined LSD HR......walked in the aid areas only long enough to get nutrition, assess and move on......if you allow too much walking you will, IMHO, loose momentum towards getting back into the "correct" run tempo......don't let your HR get too low....if you drop more than 12-20 bpm...get back to running sooner......at least I've found that if you get too low a HR before you resume, rather than your HR getting back to that LSD rate and staying there, your HR tends to rebound and go up a bit each time with the same perceived effort......again, my .02 YMMV!
2008-07-31 12:53 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
ChrisM - 2008-07-31 1:40 PM

FWIW, I don't train run/walk but I fully intend on walking the aid stations at IMAZ.

Yup me niether and I didn't intend to walk them eitherr but the last 13 miles changed my intentions

2008-07-31 12:58 PM
in reply to: #1573199

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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?

Tri-Wog StL - 2008-07-31 1:48 PM walked in the aid areas only long enough to get nutrition, assess and move on!

warrants repeating. well said (and done

2008-07-31 1:00 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
I don't consider walking through aid stations walking the race. I would only walk as long as it took me to take in my water. It also got me drinking more (at Lou which was a hot, hot, day) my deal was that I could only walk if I was drinking. I walked fast, watched my h.r. and then dropped the cup and ran. For fop folks that are good runners I can see the no walk breaks but I have trained a lot of marathon runners that pr'd by taking short walk breaks, and even though they took walk breaks I give them credit for running 26.2 miles. Just my 2 cents.
2008-07-31 1:11 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
For my IMWI training, I have been doing all of my long runs (over 2 hour in length) using a run 10min/walk 1 min. This should somewhat simulate what race day will be like as I plan to run from aid station to aid station and walk in order to get nutrition, ice, etc. During the race, I likely won't time my 1 min walk break but set goals similar to Yaqui above -- start walking at water table, run to last trash can. I use the 10min/1 min plan in training since no one has been nice enough to set aid stations up around my neighborhood. Maybe one day....

Since I started the run/walk, I have notice my runs are easier and I tend to go further in the same amount of time than if I was just running.


2008-07-31 1:13 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?

For that it's worth, I've read up a bit on the Galloway method and truly believe that it can help you maintain a consistent pace throughout a race.  I used it for my first marathon, but that was many moons ago and I was not a very strong runner.

I do remember, though, that for every minute you walk per mile, only :20 is added to your overall per mile pace. So if you run at an 8 min pace, and walk one minute, then it will take you about 8:20 to run that mile.

Not a bad deal, in my opinion. I'd rather do that than to watch my run degrade into a 13 min pace. And no, I don't plan on my run degrading into that. But I've never run a marathon after a 114.4 mile warm up.

I plan to run aid station to aid station and walk the aid stations for as long as I can maintain it. I want to finish and enjoy my first im, so I'm looking to finish (in under 17) with the best time that I can while I am still feeling ok enough to enjoy the experience.

That being said, I won't quit if I don't feel good.

Edited to add: in training, I'm only walking if I'm taking in water or nutrition.



Edited by SuzanneS 2008-07-31 1:15 PM
2008-07-31 1:30 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
At IM FL I ran the entire marathon and only walked aid stations.  For me (with all my runs- not just the IM run) it's too hard to get my legs back moving after walking (especially with longer distances).  I I tried to walk the aid stations as quickly as possible.  I took it easy on the bike so I think that enabled me to run the marathon.  Had I gone harder on the bike Im sure I would have had to walk more.
2008-07-31 1:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
I did my first IM this June. The run segment was my first long run over 18 miles.

Personally, I found the run/walk intervals to be the ticket. I used an 8/1 run-walk interval, with the goal of running the entire marathon, aid station to aid station.

I setup an interval timer on my HR monitor and kept an eye on my HR. I walked the aid stations to get nutrition, and walked a minute when my watched told me to do so, even if I was between aid stations.

In training, my target zone was 147-155. I knew that if i kept my exertion in check and stayed hydrated and fed, I could go all day at that pace.

My nutrition was a cup of water in a cup of coke, a gel ~ 30 minutes, and endurolytes every hour.
I felt great the entire run.
good luck -





2008-07-31 2:23 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
Some thoughts...

Have a plan, and stick to it. I tried Gallowalking "many moons ago", trained that way, then came the race and I abandoned the plan since I felt good, and just totally bonked.

I agree - don't overcomplicate things.

If you stick with something like 10/1 plan, that 1 minute will seem like forever initially, then seem like nothing by the end.

9/1 seems a ton easier to comprehend when your mind is fogged up - just walk a minute every time it hits a zero - :10, :20, :30 etc.

Sucks though when your walk break doesn't coincide with the aid stations. I ended doing my normal breaks, but then the aid station was a couple minutes later, and it was just too tempting to walk again.

I too was amazed at how slow the marathon times up in Lake Placid were. Looking at the results, I'm convinced the secret to a satisfying IM is at least a somewhat-decent marathon.

Yeah, it is Swim, Bike, RUN, but if everyone who walked was DQ'd, you'd end up with about 1% finishing rate.
2008-07-31 3:09 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?

Tri-Wog StL - 2008-07-31 12:48 PM I've done three IM marathons.......4:15, 4:20 and 4:25.......and in each I ran aid station to aid station at my predetermined LSD HR......walked in the aid areas only long enough to get nutrition, assess and move on......if you allow too much walking you will, IMHO, loose momentum towards getting back into the "correct" run tempo......don't let your HR get too low....if you drop more than 12-20 bpm...get back to running sooner......at least I've found that if you get too low a HR before you resume, rather than your HR getting back to that LSD rate and staying there, your HR tends to rebound and go up a bit each time with the same perceived effort......again, my .02 YMMV!

X2.
Very good advice.



2008-07-31 3:26 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
I incorporated a 17/3 plan right from the start of the marathon. I wasn't going to kid myself on thinking I could run the WHOLE marathon after swimming and biking. I stuck to the plan right out of the gates and my marathon time was only 20 min slower (4:29) than my stand alone marathon time. (Which I tried to run the whole thing).

I only walked during my 3 minutes and if it happened to come during an aid station, then it was a bonus. I ran the aid stations otherwise. I liked having more time running to get into a rythm, and the 3 min did not affect me with trying to run again.

I think the run/walk plan works especially for IM distance races. I will definitely do it again for my next one.
2008-07-31 3:28 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?

There has to be a few Slowtwitch-style replies to keep the forum warm.

Rollinbones: "If your walking, it's not a "run portion". Frankly, I don't get why people plan on walking. More people should train to run, and walk only if they have to."

Maybe I misworded something in my original thread.  I do train to Run.  I'm not training to "walk" the marathon.  I'm looking for advice on how to avoid the inevitable "walk" that I was forced to do in my first iron-distance race.  During my first IM training year I ran all of my "run" training all the way up to 3-hrs.  I've ran two full stand alone marathons, so running is nothing new to me.  I believe I would have had a much better IM-Run had I incorporated a R/W interval like many have suggested.  Again....I'm not a 12-hour finisher, nor do I want to be.  I want to do the best Ironman that "I" am capable of.

JohnnyKay: "I also recall you spent a lot of energy on the swim.  You don't need a better marathon strategy."

Zing!  
If you recall I swam for the first time in my life just 18 months prior to my first IM....nose plugs and all.  I couldn't swim 10 yards with my head under water. To come from nothing to an ironman finisher in less than two years shows that I can at least move forward in the water.  That being said...I hope to shave at least a full hour or more off of my IM marathon time.  All of the swim training in the world wouldn't take an hour off of my swim time.  But thanks for the advice.   

2008-07-31 4:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
oipolloi - 2008-07-31 3:28 PM

There has to be a few Slowtwitch-style replies to keep the forum warm.  

Funny, I was thinking that myself ... although on ST, usually at least one or two folks provide some solid data.

If you decide to do run-walk, you might want to invest in a sports watch that has a 2-interval timer ... that way, no matter what ratio you decide is appropriate, you don't have to think about it, just run when it beeps, then walk when it beeps.

All the best!

2008-07-31 4:49 PM
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Subject: RE: Ironman Run: The Galloway method?
I PLAN on WALKING most of the marathon portion of my IM.

I have trained on longer distances for 5 minute walk/2 minute run combo. I know I can do that for 15 miles. After that, it might be a walk.

I have trained to run, for years. And you know what? I suck at it.

Last year on 10-12 miles of ALL RUNNING I was doing a 12 minute mile. Now, I can go up to 15 miles with 5/2 walk/run and keep a 11:20 minute mile.

Now, let me ask you, WHY WOULD I RUN when I can walk most of it and go faster? HHHUUUMMMMM.

Sure I would love to be a fast runner, but I'm not. I get injured. My body doesn't hold up under the stress of it. Those are the facts. Now, I could either embrace it and learn to walk fast (which I have done) or I could just give up and not compete anymore. I'm going to race. Thanks.

In closing, don't look down on walkers. I can tell you, I sure as heck beat people RUNNING on courses with my WALKING.


rollinbones - 2008-07-31 12:33 PM

oipolloi - 2008-07-31 12:50 PM

So I've been thinking of what strategy I'm going to take during the run portion of IMWI this year.

If your walking, it's not a "run portion". Frankly, I don't get why people plan on walking. More people should train to run, and walk only if they  have to. I was amazed at how many people were walking at LP.

Rememeber, your slowest jog is faster than your fastest walk.

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