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Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
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Big Business29 Votes - [45.31%]
Big Government35 Votes - [54.69%]

2010-04-30 8:44 AM
in reply to: #2827860

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?

TriRSquared - 2010-04-30 9:03 AM
jdwright56 - 2010-04-30 8:58 AM

This is a fundamentally myopic view of business.  The business is looking out for you that is exactly what they do.  If they do not look out for you, you and your friends do not buy products from them.  If they do not take care of you and their other customers they go out of business so it is wholly in their best interest to care for you. 

Ummm . . . sure, business is my friend . . . right.  I think I'm going to go out for a pack of smokes and a Big Mac.


I love this one...... Business is evil becasue they proivide you with unhealthy options - you see , that's why we use the word options, cause you can choose.  If people didn't want the choice provided, they wouldn't be here. 
OK - resume with the silliness that is thi??s poll.??????? 


I was just getting ready to respond in kind.  Life is full of choices.  Don't want to smoke.  Don't.  No one is forcing you.  Want to eat healthier food.  Reward those who make healthier food with your dollars.

Redonkulous . . . Where did I say business was evil?

Here's a simplified version of the argument:

Point 1: Business is looking out for you

Counter Point: No they're not (always) - see examples of narcotics and fast food.  Profit motive does not always make for ethical decision-making.

You guys are countering an argument I didn't make. Nice tactic.



2010-04-30 8:55 AM
in reply to: #2827095

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
Capitalism - Big business... i decide how and where I will spend the money I earn from them.

Any Collectivism - Big government... they decide how and where they will spend the money they take from me.


One more vote from the "neither" button but I know which scenario I prefer.  Why do people feel they need someone to look out for them?  Are folks really this weak and dependent?
2010-04-30 10:05 AM
in reply to: #2827978

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
roch1009 - 2010-04-30 9:44 AM

TriRSquared - 2010-04-30 9:03 AM
jdwright56 - 2010-04-30 8:58 AM

This is a fundamentally myopic view of business.  The business is looking out for you that is exactly what they do.  If they do not look out for you, you and your friends do not buy products from them.  If they do not take care of you and their other customers they go out of business so it is wholly in their best interest to care for you. 

Ummm . . . sure, business is my friend . . . right.  I think I'm going to go out for a pack of smokes and a Big Mac.


I love this one...... Business is evil becasue they proivide you with unhealthy options - you see , that's why we use the word options, cause you can choose.  If people didn't want the choice provided, they wouldn't be here. 
OK - resume with the silliness that is thi??s poll.??????? 


I was just getting ready to respond in kind.  Life is full of choices.  Don't want to smoke.  Don't.  No one is forcing you.  Want to eat healthier food.  Reward those who make healthier food with your dollars.

Redonkulous . . . Where did I say business was evil?

Here's a simplified version of the argument:

Point 1: Business Government is looking out for you

Counter Point: No they're not (always) - see examples of narcotics and fast food (insert one's own beef w/ gov't eg Iraq war, taxes etc).  Profit  Power motive does not always make for ethical decision-making.

You guys are countering an argument I didn't make. Nice tactic.



Fixed that for you

Businesses do not force their product on you government does.

As for your point earlier about unfettered business and supermonopolies I agree with you to a certain extent. The way I see it you have a triangle.  Businesses and individuals engage in commerce.  This includes not only individuals buying products from businesses but individuals selling products in the form of labor to businesses as well.  Governments function is to be the set the basic ground rules in an impartial manner and be an impartial arbiter in disputes.  ***an aside when government runs the insurance agency you no longer have recourse to an impartial arbiter that is why I oppose a public option.***

If your definition of looking out for you is having someone tell you what to do then you are right business are not going to look out for you.  If on the other hand you see looking out for you as allowing you to determine for yourself what you require then busieness will be there to supply what you choose .  There are business that will sell you a smoke and a big mac if that is what you choose.  There are also businesses that will sell you organically grown nuts and twigs if that is what you feel is right for you.  The government on the other hand is all about telling you what you may or may not and can or cannot do it is a fundamental part of their function. 

Do you really believe Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid have roch1009's best interest at heart when they craft legislation?  Do you really think they know what is best for you?  Governments just like business are made up of people with their own interests to look out for.
2010-04-30 10:06 AM
in reply to: #2827847

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
jdwright56 - 2010-04-30 6:58 AM
roch1009 - 2010-04-30 7:38 AM

trinnas - 2010-04-29 10:39 PM
drewb8 - 2010-04-29 10:25 PM I know what you're getting at with the question, but the problem with it is that 0% of a businesses reason for being is to look out for you (the times when my interests and a businesses are in synch are gravy, but they have no responsibility at all to look out for me) while that is a core function (to a varying degree depending on your viewpoint) of goverments reason for existence.  That said, I don't trust the government a whole lot to look out for me since I think it's largely controlled by big business anyway, but overall I trust that my congressman is looking out for my interests more than GE is.


This is a fundamentally myopic view of business.  The business is looking out for you that is exactly what they do.  If they do not look out for you, you and your friends do not buy products from them.  If they do not take care of you and their other customers they go out of business so it is wholly in their best interest to care for you. 

Ummm . . . sure, business is my friend . . . right.  I think I'm going to go out for a pack of smokes and a Big Mac.

 


I love this one...... Business is evil becasue they proivide you with unhealthy options - you see , that's why we use the word options, cause you can choose.  If people didn't want the choice provided, they wouldn't be here. 
OK - resume with the silliness that is thi??s poll.??????? 

But that's not big busniess looking out for my interests, that's ME looking out for my interests.  Doesn't make corporations evil, it makes them... corporations whose sole goal is to make a profit.  If Phillip-Morris cared about my well being they wouldn't sell cigarettes at all and I wouldn't have to worry about making a choice between healthy/unhealthy options because the companies who care so deeply for me would remove products that are bad for me from the marketplace on their own.  We could walk into a store and safely buy any product knowing that  Syndec Inc has removed any harmful substances and ensured it's safe function irregardless of how much profit it cost them.

Big business isn't supposed to look out for you, the government is but doesn't (or does too much) so I can say without hyperbole that I trust myself to look out for my interests a hundred billion more times than big business OR government.
2010-04-30 10:11 AM
in reply to: #2827815

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
neither.  Both have their best interests in mind.  If it happens to meet my interests then they chalk that up as another person they helped along the way and will pump statistics to prove that.  Frown
2010-04-30 10:13 AM
in reply to: #2828231

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
drewb8 - 2010-04-30 10:06 AM

jdwright56 - 2010-04-30 6:58 AM
roch1009 - 2010-04-30 7:38 AM

trinnas - 2010-04-29 10:39 PM
drewb8 - 2010-04-29 10:25 PM I know what you're getting at with the question, but the problem with it is that 0% of a businesses reason for being is to look out for you (the times when my interests and a businesses are in synch are gravy, but they have no responsibility at all to look out for me) while that is a core function (to a varying degree depending on your viewpoint) of goverments reason for existence.  That said, I don't trust the government a whole lot to look out for me since I think it's largely controlled by big business anyway, but overall I trust that my congressman is looking out for my interests more than GE is.


This is a fundamentally myopic view of business.  The business is looking out for you that is exactly what they do.  If they do not look out for you, you and your friends do not buy products from them.  If they do not take care of you and their other customers they go out of business so it is wholly in their best interest to care for you. 

Ummm . . . sure, business is my friend . . . right.  I think I'm going to go out for a pack of smokes and a Big Mac.

 


I love this one...... Business is evil becasue they proivide you with unhealthy options - you see , that's why we use the word options, cause you can choose.  If people didn't want the choice provided, they wouldn't be here. 
OK - resume with the silliness that is thi??s poll.??????? 

But that's not big busniess looking out for my interests, that's ME looking out for my interests.  Doesn't make corporations evil, it makes them... corporations whose sole goal is to make a profit.  If Phillip-Morris cared about my well being they wouldn't sell cigarettes at all and I wouldn't have to worry about making a choice between healthy/unhealthy options because the companies who care so deeply for me would remove products that are bad for me from the marketplace on their own.  We could walk into a store and safely buy any product knowing that  Syndec Inc has removed any harmful substances and ensured it's safe function irregardless of how much profit it cost them.

Big business isn't supposed to look out for you, the government is but doesn't (or does too much) so I can say without hyperbole that I trust myself to look out for my interests a hundred billion more times than big business OR government.



What he said. The only one really looking out for me is me and maybe my family to a certain extent.


2010-04-30 10:13 AM
in reply to: #2828009

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
Pector55 - 2010-04-30 8:55 AM Capitalism - Big business... i decide how and where I will spend the money I earn from them.

Any Collectivism - Big government... they decide how and where they will spend the money they take from me.


One more vote from the "neither" button but I know which scenario I prefer.  Why do people feel they need someone to look out for them?  Are folks really this weak and dependent?


Some people in our society are not as well off as the subset of the population that posts here. Some people are dealt a raw hand over and over in life. It's not about being weak and dependent. Everyone can't be successful. Sometimes people fail for a number of reasons and need support and a safety net.

Should we be like 3rd world and let people fend for themselves? Would a safety net come from the goodness of the collective heart of big business? I'm doubtful of that. Before someone points to the fact that big business gives money to numerous charities let me point out the fact that they get a tax break and positive publicity from doing that. It's not out of the goodness of their heart.
2010-04-30 10:22 AM
in reply to: #2828254

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
crazyquick23 - 2010-04-30 11:13 AM

Pector55 - 2010-04-30 8:55 AM Capitalism - Big business... i decide how and where I will spend the money I earn from them.

Any Collectivism - Big government... they decide how and where they will spend the money they take from me.


One more vote from the "neither" button but I know which scenario I prefer.  Why do people feel they need someone to look out for them?  Are folks really this weak and dependent?


Some people in our society are not as well off as the subset of the population that posts here. Some people are dealt a raw hand over and over in life. It's not about being weak and dependent. Everyone can't be successful. Sometimes people fail for a number of reasons and need support and a safety net.

Should we be like 3rd world and let people fend for themselves? Would a safety net come from the goodness of the collective heart of big business? I'm doubtful of that. Before someone points to the fact that big business gives money to numerous charities let me point out the fact that they get a tax break and positive publicity from doing that. It's not out of the goodness of their heart.


Define: "successful".
2010-04-30 10:23 AM
in reply to: #2827095

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
I voted big government but only because to me it's the lesser of 2-evils.  I'm fed up with big government and would like to vote every single career politician out of there (including POTUS) and start over.  But at least I do see the government doing some good things.  If it wasn't for the government the big corporations would rape all the land for oil, gas, mining, etc.  Pollute our environment (moreso than they do already), and pretty much not look much past what will increase their profit at just about any costs.  I have not trust is greedy corporations! 
2010-04-30 10:29 AM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
drewb8 - 2010-04-30 11:06 AM
jdwright56 - 2010-04-30 6:58 AM
roch1009 - 2010-04-30 7:38 AM

trinnas - 2010-04-29 10:39 PM
drewb8 - 2010-04-29 10:25 PM I know what you're getting at with the question, but the problem with it is that 0% of a businesses reason for being is to look out for you (the times when my interests and a businesses are in synch are gravy, but they have no responsibility at all to look out for me) while that is a core function (to a varying degree depending on your viewpoint) of goverments reason for existence.  That said, I don't trust the government a whole lot to look out for me since I think it's largely controlled by big business anyway, but overall I trust that my congressman is looking out for my interests more than GE is.


This is a fundamentally myopic view of business.  The business is looking out for you that is exactly what they do.  If they do not look out for you, you and your friends do not buy products from them.  If they do not take care of you and their other customers they go out of business so it is wholly in their best interest to care for you. 

Ummm . . . sure, business is my friend . . . right.  I think I'm going to go out for a pack of smokes and a Big Mac.

 


I love this one...... Business is evil becasue they proivide you with unhealthy options - you see , that's why we use the word options, cause you can choose.  If people didn't want the choice provided, they wouldn't be here. 
OK - resume with the silliness that is thi??s poll.??????? 

But that's not big busniess looking out for my interests, that's ME looking out for my interests.  Doesn't make corporations evil, it makes them... corporations whose sole goal is to make a profit.  If Phillip-Morris cared about my well being they wouldn't sell cigarettes at all and I wouldn't have to worry about making a choice between healthy/unhealthy options because the companies who care so deeply for me would remove products that are bad for me from the marketplace on their own.  We could walk into a store and safely buy any product knowing that  Syndec Inc has removed any harmful substances and ensured it's safe function irregardless of how much profit it cost them.

Big business isn't supposed to look out for you, the government is but doesn't (or does too much) so I can say without hyperbole that I trust myself to look out for my interests a hundred billion more times than big business OR government.


Agreed wholeheartedly.
2010-04-30 12:15 PM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
crazyquick23 - 2010-04-30 11:13 AM
Pector55 - 2010-04-30 8:55 AM Capitalism - Big business... i decide how and where I will spend the money I earn from them.

Any Collectivism - Big government... they decide how and where they will spend the money they take from me.


One more vote from the "neither" button but I know which scenario I prefer.  Why do people feel they need someone to look out for them?  Are folks really this weak and dependent?


Some people in our society are not as well off as the subset of the population that posts here. Some people are dealt a raw hand over and over in life. It's not about being weak and dependent. Everyone can't be successful. Sometimes people fail for a number of reasons and need support and a safety net.

Should we be like 3rd world and let people fend for themselves? Would a safety net come from the goodness of the collective heart of big business? I'm doubtful of that. Before someone points to the fact that big business gives money to numerous charities let me point out the fact that they get a tax break and positive publicity from doing that. It's not out of the goodness of their heart.


BS.  Everyone has the exact same potential when they are born.  Some people do have more obstacles to overcome than others but saying that "I can't be successful" is a cop-out.

If you try your hardest and fail then I'm willing to help you.  If you do not try EVERYTHING then you are just being lazy and you can look elsewhere for a handout.  Too bad our government doesn't see it this way.



I find it ironic that those who are blasting big business probably own large TVs, cars, expensive tri bikes, buy from WalMart or Target etc.., fly on airplanes, go on cruises and stay in hotels, have investments with mutual funds and 401(k)s in large banks; giving money to all of these "evil" corporations.  Want those "evil" corps to take notice?  Stop spending money with them.

Edited by TriRSquared 2010-04-30 12:19 PM


2010-04-30 5:29 PM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
Neither.  Folks should trust themselves.
2010-04-30 7:17 PM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?

I didn't read all of the posts, so I may be repeating...

Since when are big business and big government two separate entities?

2010-05-01 8:56 PM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
Opus - 2010-04-30 8:17 PM

I didn't read all of the posts, so I may be repeating...

Since when are big business and big government two separate entities?



They have not been since the government was in the pocket of the railroads back when it was first formed. 

The only thing worse than these two groups (by name) is big bankers.  Control the currency and you control everything.
2010-05-02 7:21 AM
in reply to: #2827095

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
I say neither and both at the same time.  I agree with many others here that it is up to the individual to look out for themselves and not have to trust some entity to do it for them.  

Both function on a balancing act:
Businesses have the interest of the stakeholders and the customers at heart.  If people stopped buying cigarettes, companies would stop selling them, but as it is, there is a market for such things.

Governments has the interest of the masses and the lobbyists (businesses generically) at heart.  Sometimes these mesh, sometimes they dont.

Both are required though, you cant have one or the other:  

Free market is needed to keep technology growing, the economy booming, and/or prices going down (think HD TVs, Ipods, cars, etc.).  

In general, I think the governments (fed, state, and local) role is purely the public realm.  Creating, interpreting and upholding the law, schools, roads, essential utilities, parks, jails, courts, zoning regs/land use, etc.  Things that everyone mutually benefits from as a society... and/or what would turn into a total cluster f*ck if it wasn't government regulated.  There is no room for them in the private realm.  They shouldn't control what goods I purchase, where/who I purchase them from, how often, how much I pay, or what I do with them.  The government does not belong in my living room.


Edited by BurghGuy 2010-05-02 7:31 AM
2010-05-03 7:22 AM
in reply to: #2827095

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
Acesfull, I believe you are in business. You don't trust yourself to look out for your best interest?

The entire purpose of business, individuals assembling for the purpose of making a profit, is to look out for your best interest in obtaining happiness.

The purpose of government is to tax the benefits you received from business to redistribute to others who are only looking at there self interest and have no interest in compensating you for the taxes you paid.



   

Edited by Jackemy 2010-05-03 7:23 AM


2010-05-03 10:27 AM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?

Jackemy - 2010-05-03 7:22 AM Acesfull, I believe you are in business. You don't trust yourself to look out for your best interest?

The entire purpose of business, individuals assembling for the purpose of making a profit, is to look out for your best interest in obtaining happiness. Business has no interest in looking out for the individual, it is only concerned with profit which allows it to self-perpetuate.

The purpose of government is to tax the benefits you received from business to redistribute to others who are only looking at there self interest and have no interest in compensating you for the taxes you paid. Government exists to ensure an orderly society, it is also not concerned with the welfare of a particular individual .



   

2010-05-03 3:01 PM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
I vote for business, not because they are out for my best interest... but because...1. They don't pretend that profit-making is not their #1 priority, unless you are stupid enough to listen to PR ads.2. They are more predictable and efficient in their propensity to do what will meet their bottom line needs.3. If I can align my needs with their business plan, we can have symbiosis.With government, there is overlap (but a distinction in my mind) between symbiosis and parasitism.
2010-05-03 4:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
ride_like_u_stole_it - 2010-05-03 10:27 AM

Jackemy - 2010-05-03 7:22 AM Acesfull, I believe you are in business. You don't trust yourself to look out for your best interest?

The entire purpose of business, individuals assembling for the purpose of making a profit, is to look out for your best interest in obtaining happiness. Business has no interest in looking out for the individual, it is only concerned with profit which allows it to self-perpetuate.

The purpose of government is to tax the benefits you received from business to redistribute to others who are only looking at there self interest and have no interest in compensating you for the taxes you paid. Government exists to ensure an orderly society, it is also not concerned with the welfare of a particular individual .



   



Really, I wonder how you as an individual is going to drive that big business car to use that big business technology to help you make money to use to buy things you need to buy "in you best interest" without that big business gas.

By serving our self interest as individual and entering the market place as a consumer or a collective business we are creating a mutual benefit. For example, I am self interested in buying an apple computer to help me be more productive at work and make my life better than it would be if I just either bought something else or saved it. The thousands of people who work at apple are self interested in making a product at a profit. 

By getting together in the market place we created a benefit for each of us greater than the resources put in to get that benefit.

By it's very nature, government can never create a benefit greater than the resources put into it. The gross amount of taxes from the individual (lost benefit) sent to government is always less than the the redistribution out. Therefore big business always creates most general welfare for the individual and therefore is always in better for individual's self interest than government.  
2010-05-03 5:22 PM
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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
Jackemy - 2010-05-03 3:44 PM
ride_like_u_stole_it - 2010-05-03 10:27 AM

Jackemy - 2010-05-03 7:22 AM Acesfull, I believe you are in business. You don't trust yourself to look out for your best interest?

The entire purpose of business, individuals assembling for the purpose of making a profit, is to look out for your best interest in obtaining happiness. Business has no interest in looking out for the individual, it is only concerned with profit which allows it to self-perpetuate.

The purpose of government is to tax the benefits you received from business to redistribute to others who are only looking at there self interest and have no interest in compensating you for the taxes you paid. Government exists to ensure an orderly society, it is also not concerned with the welfare of a particular individual .



   



Really, I wonder how you as an individual is going to drive that big business car to use that big business technology to help you make money to use to buy things you need to buy "in you best interest" without that big business gas.

By serving our self interest as individual and entering the market place as a consumer or a collective business we are creating a mutual benefit. For example, I am self interested in buying an apple computer to help me be more productive at work and make my life better than it would be if I just either bought something else or saved it. The thousands of people who work at apple are self interested in making a product at a profit. 

By getting together in the market place we created a benefit for each of us greater than the resources put in to get that benefit.

By it's very nature, government can never create a benefit greater than the resources put into it. The gross amount of taxes from the individual (lost benefit) sent to government is always less than the the redistribution out. Therefore big business always creates most general welfare for the individual and therefore is always in better for individual's self interest than government.  


Big business also decides that it is in my best interest for them to dump pollution into a river. Without regulation stopping them this is what they do. So I am skeptical saying that they are working in my best interest.
2010-05-03 7:39 PM
in reply to: #2834386

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?
JoshR - 2010-05-03 5:22 PM
Jackemy - 2010-05-03 3:44 PM
ride_like_u_stole_it - 2010-05-03 10:27 AM

Jackemy - 2010-05-03 7:22 AM Acesfull, I believe you are in business. You don't trust yourself to look out for your best interest?

The entire purpose of business, individuals assembling for the purpose of making a profit, is to look out for your best interest in obtaining happiness. Business has no interest in looking out for the individual, it is only concerned with profit which allows it to self-perpetuate.

The purpose of government is to tax the benefits you received from business to redistribute to others who are only looking at there self interest and have no interest in compensating you for the taxes you paid. Government exists to ensure an orderly society, it is also not concerned with the welfare of a particular individual .



   



Really, I wonder how you as an individual is going to drive that big business car to use that big business technology to help you make money to use to buy things you need to buy "in you best interest" without that big business gas.

By serving our self interest as individual and entering the market place as a consumer or a collective business we are creating a mutual benefit. For example, I am self interested in buying an apple computer to help me be more productive at work and make my life better than it would be if I just either bought something else or saved it. The thousands of people who work at apple are self interested in making a product at a profit. 

By getting together in the market place we created a benefit for each of us greater than the resources put in to get that benefit.

By it's very nature, government can never create a benefit greater than the resources put into it. The gross amount of taxes from the individual (lost benefit) sent to government is always less than the the redistribution out. Therefore big business always creates most general welfare for the individual and therefore is always in better for individual's self interest than government.  


Big business also decides that it is in my best interest for them to dump pollution into a river. Without regulation stopping them this is what they do. So I am skeptical saying that they are working in my best interest.


By government treating the enviornment as a public good in reality it has developed it's policy to benefit the government at the expense of the individual. In other words, government enviormental policy is set to bring in the largest amount of tax dollars regardless of benefit to the taxpayers (which include business).

The environment should be treated like any private good. People should be free, to the greatest extent possible, to set their own risk tolerance regardless of scientific or public opinion. Taking the power and control big government has in environmental policy and giving that control to local communities makes sense at it allows communites to self deterime their choices and create the largest benefit for themselves. Heck some people want to live in an economically booming manufacturing town and some want to live in a green zone retirement community where the local pottery is considered big business.

In other words with only market neutrality in preferences in the quality of the environment by the government will the government be able to look out for your best interest. Any other way and your interests are ignored. That is, of course, unless you are politically connected.  

Edited by Jackemy 2010-05-03 7:51 PM


2010-05-03 10:31 PM
in reply to: #2828254

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Subject: RE: Business vs. Government, who do you trust to look out for you best?

crazyquick23 - 2010-04-30 10:13 AM
Pector55 - 2010-04-30 8:55 AM Capitalism - Big business... i decide how and where I will spend the money I earn from them.

Any Collectivism - Big government... they decide how and where they will spend the money they take from me.


One more vote from the "neither" button but I know which scenario I prefer.  Why do people feel they need someone to look out for them?  Are folks really this weak and dependent?


Some people in our society are not as well off as the subset of the population that posts here. Some people are dealt a raw hand over and over in life. It's not about being weak and dependent. Everyone can't be successful. Sometimes people fail for a number of reasons and need support and a safety net.

Should we be like 3rd world and let people fend for themselves? Would a safety net come from the goodness of the collective heart of big business? I'm doubtful of that. Before someone points to the fact that big business gives money to numerous charities let me point out the fact that they get a tax break and positive publicity from doing that. It's not out of the goodness of their heart.

There are very few people that are dealt a raw hand over and over.  Most of those who are "dealt" a raw hand have made plenty of decisions to get them to that point.  No body has a problem helping those that have major health crises such as cancer or heart disease or a sudden job loss, etc - that is the definition of charity.  However I personally believe these sort of issues are best left to private charity as there is no compassion that comes with government charity - just a harsh bureaucracy with inflexible rules...

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